Radionics (drugs)

[Ninae]

This is a little known subject I know little about, maybe something others might be more familiar with, but I thought it would be of interest to people here.

"Radionics" or "Radionic Medicine" is apparantly a controversional healing form which has been mostly outlawed (presumably for financial reasons as it's supposed to be very effective and would make many other forms of healing obsolete). I think it might be employed more in the East, though, but mostly only made available to especially priviliged individuals (very rich or high-ranking).

I've read records of military officials describing how it was employed on them in connection with surgery, etc. to deliver the needed drugs. They say it feels just like getting the real drug, but without the side-effects, and harmful metabolites that come with it.

This is obviously very controversial, and makes me think about Tesla, who is famous for inventing a form of free energy which was quickly outlawed (for obvious reasons). All you needed was a simple generator and you would have all the free energy you wanted for the rest of your life.

I'm sure there's a lot of misinformation about this out there too. But imagine a scenario like this with drugs, though, that you only needed to buy a piece of equipment and you would be supplied for life (obviously 1/3 of the world economy would come crashing down so this will never happen).

Just imagine what people would do, if they had the access. I'm guessing pretty much everyone would make use of it, to keep themselves emotionally balanced on a daily level, and most would probably set it on the opiate-switch.

Sounds very ideal, but the value and ethics of it is a bit questionable. It would still be like being on a drug, after all, even if it was distributed differently. Also imagine it could do damage to the human energy-system, which might athrophy as it wouldn't need to work to keep itself in balance, or just burn it out.

Just guessing, but in the end it would be no substitute for keeping yourself psychologically balanced, raising your consciousness, and accessing high spiritual energies which would make you feel just as good. It would still be a way of cheating and relying on something outside yourself to do the job for you.

Certainly seems like an incredible concept - but what would you do?

 

[sekio]

"Radionics" or "Radionic Medicine" is apparantly a controversional healing form which has been mostly outlawed because it doesn't work.

Fixed that for ya.

The concept behind radionics originated in the early 1900s with Albert Abrams (1864–1924), who became a millionaire by leasing radionic machines which he designed himself. Radionics contradicts some principles of physics and biology and so is commonly considered pseudoscience. The United States Food and Drug Administration does not recognize any legitimate medical uses for such devices. [...]

No scientifically verifiable mechanisms of function are posited. In this sense, they can be described as magical in operation. No plausible biophysical basis for the "putative energy fields" has been proposed, and neither the fields themselves nor their purported therapeutic effects have been convincingly demonstrated.

No radionic device has been found efficacious in the diagnosis or treatment of any disease, and the U.S. Food and Drug Administration does not recognize any legitimate medical uses of any such device. According to David Helwig in The Gale Encyclopedia of Alternative Medicine, "most physicians dismiss radionics as quackery."

Internally, a radionic device is very simple, and may not even form a functional electrical circuit. The wiring in the analysis device is simply used as a mystical conduit. A radionic device does not use or need electric power, though a power cord may be provided, ostensibly to determine a "base rate" on which the device operates to attempt to heal a subject. Typically, little attempt is made to define or describe what, if anything, is flowing along the wires and being measured. Energy in the physical sense, i.e., energy that can be sensed and measured, is viewed as subordinate to intent and "creative action".

Human tissue makes for a really poor radio absorber, being non-ferrous and poorly conductive. What little radio energy is absorbed is converted to heat. This is the same fact that allows us to stand next to FM/AM radio towers and not have all the water in our body boil instantaneously from the kilowatts of emitted energy.

Back to reality though: There's stuff like gamma knives which would better meet the definition of radiosurgery - using radiation to alter biological processes, but somehow I don't think that's what you're describing here. A MRI machine works with radio waves, allowing doctors to peer inside your body and figure out what's going on, too. fMRI and PET allow us to also see how much activity various tissues in your body are experiencing. That's magic if I ever saw it, and more importantly, we can actually describe exactly why it works the way it does. At best, radionics is little more than cargo cult "medicine".

 

[Ninae]

This is from Wikipedia and written like a text-book negative misinformation piece.

And it's very similar to how Eastern medicine like kinesiology, acupuncture, and reiki healing is presented in the West. i.e. worthless superstition. While the very intelligent and wise Asians won't touch much of our medicine and find it harmful and inferior.

I really don't think we can rely on Western propaganda for this. After all it threatens:

1) The medical industry
2) The medicine production companies
3) The illegal drug trade

Imagine how much money's in that - it has the potential to turn the world upside-down.

P.S. "Which has been mostly outlawed because it doesn't work".

That's a good laugh. No one seems to have any problem capitalising on all the other things in this world "that doesn't work" and it's never been a reason for out-lawing anything.

Why not might as well ban Aromatherapy in case some might get the idea to use it to treat cancer?

No, there's something else going on here.

 

[sekio]

Ninae, you da best.

Imagine how much money's in that - it has the potential to turn the world upside-down.

Well, yeah, if it worked, which it doesn't. The moral dilemma you run into is, do you feel comfrotable encouraging people to take something that is no better than placebo? Kind of like most "all-natural" cures for cancer. Or "dietary alkalization". I'm not saying they won't produce effects of some sort. The problem is that people respond to the mere act of trying to treat their conditions, and we have better treatments out there in many cases. People want to feel better, especially if they undergo a treatment ritual.

Don't get me wrong, there's plenty of science that goes unheard because Big Pharma wants to promote their own agenda. Unfortunately there are no panaceas out there being held from the public. If there were, people wouldn't be dying of cancer and the like. If you think literally every person in government or western medicine would put their own paycheck as more important than curing previously uncurable diseases, you're wrong. Lots of people go into medicine because they want to find some way they can help beyond making people feel better.

For instance, the effects of aromatherapy can be reproduced fairly consistently and certain aromas show a greater effect than "placebo aromas". Lavender and hops are established as pretty potent sedatives and anxiolytics when inhaled, and we can prove that in studies.
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/22867633
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/23436179

The problem most critically thinking Westerners have is that under controlled conditions it is hard to see any differences between real and fake, e.g. acupuncture technique. At the same time, you would likely see no difference between "real" and "fake" radionics inasmuch they both would do nothing at all.

That's a good laugh. No one seems to have any problem capitalising on all the other things in this world "that doesn't work"

At least we give believable excuses. For instance, SSRIs , even though they don't work in 70% of cases, still have some reasoning behind their usage, and have been proven to be moderately better than placebo in severe depression. The reasoning goes, serotonin is a chemical your brain releases that controls mood, SSRIs change the levels of it in your brain, which should change your mood. We can measure this effect (altered serotonin levels) in humans by, e.g., radioactively labeled serotonin precursors being used to map the levels of serotonin in the brain. We can show that SSRIs bind to the protien that removes serotonin from the synapse. We can prove that this stops cells from re-uptaking serotonin from their environment.

I'll even believe for a minute that stimulation of nerve endings in the skin can change blood flow and that acupuncture is better than no treatment. For that matter, stimulating the body through movement is also grounded in some sort of verifiable fact, so even stuff like dance therapy, kinesiology, and the like, is worthwhile. COuld it bring you out of a long depression? Maybe. Would it make you feel much happier on a daily basis than if you'd sat around all day? Absolutely. Do I believe that you can 'dance our cancer away'? Nope, not for a minute.

We can't come up with any sort of reasoning for how a "radionic" device with no components known to emit any sort of electromagnetic radiation could interact with its environment. We can't see these energy fields, we have no devices which interact with these fields in a meaningful way, and we can't come up with any actual sort of explanation that involves physics that we know. Like the dowsing rods someone sold the Iraqi border patrol, it's not going to do a wink of good when you really need it most - unless you're selling the machines.

If you do believe in the efficacy of these machines, recommending them as a replacement for, y'know, actual medicine, makes you no better than the radical Christians who won't give their children vaccines or antibiotics and then they complain that their baby died of whooping cough.

 

[Ninae]

Ahh - you had to go the predictable route.

But let's see if we can see this from a different perspective. Have you ever tried it or anything like it so you can speak from personal experience at all? Because the reports are quite good, in the same way as Reiki, hands-on-healing, and other forms of energy-healing can be.

Let's try a little experiment instead. One day you're feeling particularly weak or shitty, instead of taking some drug of choice to get some marginal relief (not that I know anything about your drug-habits, just speaking for the average person) go out and lie down in the sun for one and a half hours, if it's comfortably warm, and see how you feel afterwards.

If you're anything like me, you should feel dramatically better. Purified, healed, warm, energised, even high from all the sun-exposure (in fact much higher than many drugs would take you). It feels like something has been repaired and put in order inside of you (Human beings weren't designed to live without sun after all).

Because what is the greatest, most beneficial, "radionic" source on Earth? Which gives life to nature, makes the plants blossom, and give them all they need so all the necessary chemical reactions like vitamin and hormone production can take place until they reach their prime. And human beings as biological organisms are much the same. Anyone who doesn't believe me, give it a try. In fact, spend some time soaking up the sun's rays every day and see how much better you feel.

It makes you feel warm and alive in the sense that sitting inside doing drugs all day can make you feel cold and dead. In fact, I know many addicted to sun-bathing.

You can also get a similar experience by spending time out in nature among plants and near pure water, too, soaking up Prana, or the pure, health-giving life-force nature is so full of. I've experienced ecstacy many a time after lying for hours in a pristine, mountain and fjord landscape, devoid of any pollution or human interference. It's almost like a form of enlightenment and most definitely health-giving.

In fact, if there's anything I think Bluelighters need (aside from good nutrition and exercise) it's this - sun-light, prana, and any kind of effective energy-healing that can restore balance, whether it's Radionics or not.

 

[-=SS=-]

I don't know about the validity of Albert Abrams and his work but I do believe in the work of Tesla, and he supposedly created technology in the health field utilizing his form of electricity.

Internally, a radionic device is very simple, and may not even form a functional electrical circuit.

I can't speak about Abrams but Tesla was working with a form of electricity that is not what we use today. Alternating current was secondary to Tesla's discoveries later on in his career, and whilst I can not prove my belief in this I find no difficulty in believing his claims. The guy was a fucking genius on a level most people can't comprehend. I think it is entirely possible to manipulate the body, brain, weather, the mood of nations, using electrical apparatus.. because all systems are based on "electricity", however conventional electrical theory and cosmological theory is not complete and therefore it is easy to say this is all fantasy, which I understand. As an addition to this the time will come when our cosmological theory will finally accept the role of electricity in space to be far more dominant than gravity is currently assumed to be.

"The day when we shall know exactly what electricity is will chronicle an event probably greater, more important than any other recorded in the history of the human race" - Nikola Tesla

 

[Ninae]

Not bad, someone to recognise the genius of Tesla - one of the greatest the world has seen.

I didn't start this thread to have a big discussion about Radionics. It's far too controversial, too little is known about it, and what official information about it is out there seems very suspect and paranoid. Better to have a look at the writings of some of the actual practioners of it to see what results they have seen.

But I really just wanted to know what most would do if they were in the possession of such a device, where they could pump themselves full of their drug of choice at will. Though seeing how most here are willing to spend fortunes for the unhealthy, chemical version, it's not so hard to imagine what the outcome would be. But constantly using, or abusing, this form of drug-delivery would probably also be unhealthy in the long run. Like, you would lose the ability to produce your own chemicals, in the same way.

Still a fascinating idea, though, and I bet the Princess of Sweden has one to keep her healthy and happy. Radionics is quite respected in exclusive circles, apparantly, and has been used for healing in the military since the 60s.

I was just doing some naked Yoga - love naked Yoga - great way to take in prana and get your chemical system balanced. Imagine doing naked Yoga in the sun...that would be something. But hard to execute

Anyway, as I was doing it I had the notion I will write a book about healing. True healing, the ancient form, without the use of medication or anything. Just giving the body all it needs, making use of the energies of nature and the cosmos, plus the higher spiritual dimensions and all the powerful healers there.

That would be something worth doing, if I could get myself organised.

 

[herbavore]

Ninae would you consider plant medicines (like cannabis, cactus, peyote etc) to have a place in the kind of healing you are talking about?

 

[Bagseed]

Have you ever tried it or anything like it so you can speak from personal experience at all?

something as unreliable as "personal experience" is usually disregarded when approaching a something scientifically, and for good reason.

 

[mostly-human]

While the very intelligent and wise Asians won't touch much of our medicine and find it harmful and inferior.

That is total bullshit. Asians, generally, practice REAL medicine just like everyone else. This so called 'eastern' medicine is actually 'eastern alternative medicine'. And it's called 'alternative', as opposed to just 'medicine', because it doesn't actually work.


What is more - going around saying it does is NOT harmless behaviour. It is fucking irresponsible and dangerous. People like you sicken me.

 

[Ninae]

While I feel sorry for people who go through all their life knowing no other means of healing than traditional Western school medicine.

 

[mindseye888]

But I really just wanted to know what most would do if they were in the possession of such a device, where they could pump themselves full of their drug of choice at will. Though seeing how most here are willing to spend fortunes for the unhealthy, chemical version, it's not so hard to imagine what the outcome would be. But constantly using, or abusing, this form of drug-delivery would probably also be unhealthy in the long run. Like, you would lose the ability to produce your own chemicals, in the same way.

I've read some weird shit on bluelight, but this is definitely breaking new boundaries.
Don't wanna gang up and get you Ninae, but that's just not making sense.

 

[Ninae]

I meant in the same way that getting dependent on chemical drugs eventually makes you lose the ability to produce them indigenously. Hence brutal withdrawals for a while. I don't know how it works exactly, that's why I wanted to converse about it.

So I take it you can tell me then???

 

[mindseye888]

Again, not making sense to me.
chemical drugs produced indigenously...totally lost now.
Sorry Ninae.

 

[Ninae]

You mean to say you're not familiar with the concept of chemical neuro-transmitters produced naturally in the body...like Endorphins to decrease your pain and give you a sense of well-being...or Dopamine or Serotonin?

And when the body becomes accustomed to receiving them from an outside source over time it will eventually slow down production. Leaving you with close to Nil if you stop overnight. This has been the source of many sorrows.

I think this would be more appropriate for the Basic Drugs board, though.

 

[mindseye888]

So your talking about using drugs and the depletion of biochemicals causing withdrawal
So this radionics machine can replicate the effects of drugs in our system is what your getting at, bit of a leap from healing diseases which is what most of the thread deals with.
Any good references to radionics being used as an alternative to psychoactive substances would be an interesting read.

 

[Ninae]

Well, practically no sources are considered credible, anyway, so there's not so much point in giving any specific ones.

But for instance, I read about a high-ranking military officer who started getting his drugs - sedatives, painkillers - etc. administered that way instead. He said it felt just the same, just without the side-effects or harmful metabolites.

This was a few decades ago, but bear in mind military technology is far ahead of what the common masses have access too. Could be like 50 years or more. John F. Kennedy already had the internet, or made use of it for political and military communication, weather forecasts, etc. Anyway, now we're getting into a controversial subject that of course can't be proven, and I'm not really up for discussing that.

 

[phosphene_glow]

i think it more likely clothes will incorporate energy generation and some sort of amperage as well as biofeedback such that one can control their emotional state, which will probably work with ear and eye devices which altogether establish brain entrainment towards certain states. it will be good for productivity. stay loose in battle and think more clearly soldier.

 

[rickolasnice]

Prime example of what me and others are talking about in the "Are we due for the landings" thread.

This kind of thinking is harmful to humanity. It doesn't work. Leading people to think it does is potentially stopping them from receiving actual treatment.

 

[Ninae]

i think it more likely clothes will incorporate energy generation and some sort of amperage as well as biofeedback such that one can control their emotional state, which will probably work with ear and eye devices which altogether establish brain entrainment towards certain states. it will be good for productivity. stay loose in battle and think more clearly soldier.

I think clothes like these, that can measure the state of the physical organs and even repair them, already exist or have been developed. I've read about it. Not that it's anything for the normal person or anything we'll hear about for a very long time.

It still ties in with the same subject though.