DexterMeth
Bluelighter
^It's easier for a girl to wear a wire IMO.
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DPMC Moderators: tryptakid
Rachel Hoffman: A Drug War Tragedy
- Thread starter 8ft-Sativa
- Start date
23536
Bluelight Crew
City settles informant death suit for $2.6 million
TALLAHASSEE, Fla. -- Tallahassee city commissioners approved a $2.6 million settlement Friday in the wrongful-death suit of a police informant who was fatally shot during a 2008 drug sting.
The parents of Rachel Hoffman, 23, sued after her death, claiming police were negligent in setting up the Florida State graduate as an undercover informant after she was caught with marijuana and pills without a prescription.
Jury selection for the lawsuit began this week and the trial was scheduled to begin Monday.
After a closed door session with attorneys Friday, commissioners voted 3-2 to approve the settlement, the first $200,000 of which will be paid by the city in the next few weeks, City Attorney Jim English said.
The rest will be paid after the Florida Legislature passes what is known as a "claims bill," which could take years.
Nonetheless, Irv Hoffman, Rachel's father, said he was "just grateful for this part of it to be over."
Rachel Hoffman was shot five times after police lost track of her during a purported drug deal in a rural area north of Tallahassee. Her body was found 36 hours later in a roadside ditch in Taylor County, roughly 50 miles away.
Deneilo Bradshaw, 26, from St. Croix in the U.S. Virgin Islands, and his stepbrother-in-law Andrea Green, 29, are serving life sentences for Hoffman's murder.
Hoffman, of Safety Harbor, was working for police in a "buy-bust" operation and had been sent alone with $13,000 in marked bills to buy Ecstasy, cocaine and a gun, according to records. Instead, the men killed her and stole her car, a credit card and the marked money.
Prosecutors said Bradshaw drove Hoffman's Volvo with her body in it to Taylor County, where he dumped it in the ditch. He later cleaned the inside of the car with bleach and went with Green to Orlando, where they bought jewelry and clothes with some of the marked money.
After her death, the Florida Legislature passed "Rachel's Law," requiring police to adopt policies to protect informants. The measure also requires special training for investigators who work with informants, makes police tell informants they cannot be promised reduced sentences and allows them to talk with a lawyer before doing anything.
Tallahassee police had fired the investigator who was supervising Hoffman, though they later reinstated him. A Tallahassee grand jury that had investigated Hoffman's death found police negligent in sending her out by herself and letting her out of their sight.
http://www.miamiherald.com/2012/01/06/2577405/city-settles-informant-death-suit.html
TALLAHASSEE, Fla. -- Tallahassee city commissioners approved a $2.6 million settlement Friday in the wrongful-death suit of a police informant who was fatally shot during a 2008 drug sting.
The parents of Rachel Hoffman, 23, sued after her death, claiming police were negligent in setting up the Florida State graduate as an undercover informant after she was caught with marijuana and pills without a prescription.
Jury selection for the lawsuit began this week and the trial was scheduled to begin Monday.
After a closed door session with attorneys Friday, commissioners voted 3-2 to approve the settlement, the first $200,000 of which will be paid by the city in the next few weeks, City Attorney Jim English said.
The rest will be paid after the Florida Legislature passes what is known as a "claims bill," which could take years.
Nonetheless, Irv Hoffman, Rachel's father, said he was "just grateful for this part of it to be over."
Rachel Hoffman was shot five times after police lost track of her during a purported drug deal in a rural area north of Tallahassee. Her body was found 36 hours later in a roadside ditch in Taylor County, roughly 50 miles away.
Deneilo Bradshaw, 26, from St. Croix in the U.S. Virgin Islands, and his stepbrother-in-law Andrea Green, 29, are serving life sentences for Hoffman's murder.
Hoffman, of Safety Harbor, was working for police in a "buy-bust" operation and had been sent alone with $13,000 in marked bills to buy Ecstasy, cocaine and a gun, according to records. Instead, the men killed her and stole her car, a credit card and the marked money.
Prosecutors said Bradshaw drove Hoffman's Volvo with her body in it to Taylor County, where he dumped it in the ditch. He later cleaned the inside of the car with bleach and went with Green to Orlando, where they bought jewelry and clothes with some of the marked money.
After her death, the Florida Legislature passed "Rachel's Law," requiring police to adopt policies to protect informants. The measure also requires special training for investigators who work with informants, makes police tell informants they cannot be promised reduced sentences and allows them to talk with a lawyer before doing anything.
Tallahassee police had fired the investigator who was supervising Hoffman, though they later reinstated him. A Tallahassee grand jury that had investigated Hoffman's death found police negligent in sending her out by herself and letting her out of their sight.
http://www.miamiherald.com/2012/01/06/2577405/city-settles-informant-death-suit.html
i hope the cops (that did not follow any kind of police protocol and took advantage of this young girl) die. literally i hope they somehow get caught up in some sting operation and get kidnapped and tortured to death. they fucking deserve it. how could anyone possibly live with this kind of shit on their conscience?
they should be jailed and left to fucking rot.
they should be jailed and left to fucking rot.
Biovail
Bluelighter
The cops were just doing what they were told. Blame the government for this disgusting incident.
TheLostBoys
Bluelighter
I dont buy this.........as a cop, you gotta use your better judgement to put a young lady in a position where she could get killed. Who sends out a young girl to buy all those drugs & a gun to top it off.......Yes the government is to blame for this entire war on drugs but the police are accountable for stupid decisions.
cj
Bluelight Crew
I was thinking about this case the other day so sad. I still have so many questions like how did they know she was a snitch and how did she know the guys who killed her. I kinda feel like the girl got what was coming to her but on the other hand the whole thing is just so fucked up that I feel really sorry for her.
Mariposa
Bluelight Crew
Agreed. In full. As Rachel's original charges did not involve weapons, she should never have been placed in a situation where she were to be duped by the cops into buying one from two "hardened criminals" who are now serving life sentences for homicide. The cops that did this to her ought to be as well, especially creepy "Pooh Bear" who had the audacity to ask her to go for a drink and White, who had been totally asleep at the wheel and under 5 internal affairs examinations. What happened to the cops?
slimvictor
Bluelight Crew
I normally try to look beyond the immediate and see the drug war as the ultimate cause of most wrongs we discuss here, but in this case I have to agree with you. The cops were the ones that made "stupid decisions" - actually very evil, disrespecting of human life - so they do deserve to be punished. Maybe manslaughter or second-degree murder? I would like to see them spend a decade in jail. They didn't purposely kill her, but they did not respect her life.
However, let's not forget the role of the government, even in the cops' evil decisions.
If Obama, or anyone else, had called off the drug war, this would never have happened.
psychomimetic
Bluelighter
I totally agree man, I don't care if you're scared, everyone's scared when the pigs are interrogating you, you don't snitch. She was facing 3-5 so she was scared? That doesn't begin to justify setting up two other people to do 5-10 times as much time.
Snitching is fucking unacceptable, and everyone in the drug community should know that. They try and give you time you should take it and not rat, don't throw away another person's life. Not that it justifies murder, but she was going to put two people away in hell for most of the rest of their lives just cause she couldn't handle the consequences of her own actions. That's bullshit, I can't sympathize with snakes that will just fuck someone else over to save their own skin from doing a little time.
The cops are the ones who really fucked up here, but she shouldn't have ever snitched in the first place. You try and set someone up on a buy like that, you gotta be stupid to not expect a violent reaction.
It's sad when anyone is murdered, but she must have known the risks involved in what she was doing, which was a hugely unethical thing to begin with.
Shameful
Bluelighter
Lol at you guys talking about "the game" and how "rats should die". You guys sound really hardcore....
Actually, that was sarcasm. What you really sound like is a couple of thirteen-year-old kids. Or maybe I should take that back. I don't want you to get one of your "gatz" so you can "pop a cap in my ass."
She was just a fucking kid and the cops probably did everything they possibly could to scare the living shit out of her. Not everyone knows how to deal with that. All she was doing was selling some pot, the same as a million other kids are doing across America, most of which I doubt would have been able to handle this situation either.
And the two guys who got set up sound like some first class fucking good samaritans. Heaven forbid those innocent little angels go to jail. Anyway, didn't they know that when selling, there's always a risk that someone might snitch on you? I've sold in the past and I knew that risk. And I certainly wasn't about to fucking murder somebody if it happened.
Actually, that was sarcasm. What you really sound like is a couple of thirteen-year-old kids. Or maybe I should take that back. I don't want you to get one of your "gatz" so you can "pop a cap in my ass."
She was just a fucking kid and the cops probably did everything they possibly could to scare the living shit out of her. Not everyone knows how to deal with that. All she was doing was selling some pot, the same as a million other kids are doing across America, most of which I doubt would have been able to handle this situation either.
And the two guys who got set up sound like some first class fucking good samaritans. Heaven forbid those innocent little angels go to jail. Anyway, didn't they know that when selling, there's always a risk that someone might snitch on you? I've sold in the past and I knew that risk. And I certainly wasn't about to fucking murder somebody if it happened.
psychomimetic
Bluelighter
Assuming that was directed at me, I did say that I don't think they should have killed her, and I also said that it's sad when anyone is killed. But snitching is incredibly unethical, she was trying to put two people in prison for a lifetime of years to save herself a few. She had to know the danger of wearing a wire to buy a gun, 1500 e tabs and 2 ozs of coke. I find it hard to sympathize with someone who would snitch, it's a deplorable thing to do and I don't care how scared you are, you should have the human decency to not rat out your fellow man to the pigs.
I notice that the responses to this thread are largely different then the responses to the thread a few days ago about the teen snitch that got killed.
I notice that the responses to this thread are largely different then the responses to the thread a few days ago about the teen snitch that got killed.
Shameful
Bluelighter
Those guys had to know the dangers of selling guns, 1500 e tabs and 2 ounces of coke.
EDIT: And I'm saying this as someone who has sold drugs before. You better believe I knew there was always a risk someone might snitch on me. But if you're the kind of person that would take another person's life to save yourself any amount of prison time, you deserve to be there in the first place.
EDIT: And I'm saying this as someone who has sold drugs before. You better believe I knew there was always a risk someone might snitch on me. But if you're the kind of person that would take another person's life to save yourself any amount of prison time, you deserve to be there in the first place.
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psychomimetic
Bluelighter
They clearly knew the dangers, and they did exactly what most people who sell weight like that would have done. They didn't kill her to stay out of jail, they killed her because she was a snitch. There is a code among those that live outside the law, and this code is like the law. Everyone knows what happens to snitches. The men that killed her did so as a matter of principal, not to avoid jail time. They'll probably both get either life or death sentences. I'm not saying that it was right for them to murder her, but there is a code that many follow. They knew the risks of business and they followed their code.
Someone in the other thread about a dead snitch said that snitching is like treason, which I totally understand. The police are the collective enemy of all criminals. To throw another person into the belly of the beast because you're scared of the police is an act of extreme cowardice and is deplorable on many levels. I personally don't believe in the death penalty, for treason or for snitching, but I can understand why other people think that traitors deserve it. Still, as I said before, I can't sympathize with a snitch. Working with the pigs is wrong.
Someone in the other thread about a dead snitch said that snitching is like treason, which I totally understand. The police are the collective enemy of all criminals. To throw another person into the belly of the beast because you're scared of the police is an act of extreme cowardice and is deplorable on many levels. I personally don't believe in the death penalty, for treason or for snitching, but I can understand why other people think that traitors deserve it. Still, as I said before, I can't sympathize with a snitch. Working with the pigs is wrong.
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23536
Bluelight Crew
Shameless, I'd like to know how you managed to be a non-violent drug dealer.
Shameful
Bluelighter
Seriously dude... how old are you?
I'm not sure what's so hard to understand about that.
EDIT: I certainly wasn't a "drug dealer" in the way that most people think of when they hear the words "drug dealer". Never meant to give that impression. Was still highly fucking illegal.
23536
Bluelight Crew
It's hard for me to understand. I stopped dealing when violence became inevitable.
I always tried to exude the illusion of danger. I even bought guns, even one submachine gun, and went target shooting with customers and associates. It worked well for a few months. But eventually I got robbed, and when I looked into who robbed me, everything pointed to a kid that worked for me. And it wasn't just me who noticed. My reputation was at stake and the vultures were beginning to circle.
I just couldn't bring myself to shoot anyone, or hell even to severely beat anyone. But I couldn't continue dealing unless I took care of the kid. So I just stopped dealing.
Shameful
Bluelighter
I'm the same way. But that's exactly the point I was trying to make. A non-violent person can sell drugs. In your situation things got to the point where you were required to act violently. So you stopped.
It's just something that never came up for me (I also never intentionally tried to give the impression that I might be "dangerous"). I also had a relatively short run. I kept caution as my highest priority rather than dollars. My associates were very few in number and our customers were kept to a minimum, and in a lot of cases not dealt with more than once. Not the best make-lots-of-money-really-quick strategy but the way we looked at it, it was pretty good stay-out-of-jail-and-also-don't-wind-up-dead strategy. Especially when we were our own source of product (and it wasn't weed).
Anyway, things went on hiatus and, for several different reasons (most of them my fault), stayed that way indefinitely.
Really, it all comes down to semantics. We sold wholesale but we weren't the "dealers" per say.
Heh.
Seriously though, this kind of thing infuriates me.
End the drug war. End the drug war. End the drug war.
psychomimetic
Bluelighter
Smart rebuttal there. Look, as both you and the numbers fella have said, non-violent people don't last that long in the drug game. In order to survive and keep selling, violence is necessary when dealing weight of most drugs (LSD and stuff probably not so much, but if you're selling coke and guns...) When someone snitches and sets you up, if you just let them go then you will either go to jail or your rep will be fucked to the point that people won't trust you or want to deal with you, not to mention that people will think they can walk all over you with no consequences. When problems arise, problems have to get dealt with. If you aren't willing to act violently you will get fucked over. I am passing no moral judgements on that, but that is how it is and how it always has been.
Violence is absolutely the norm when people moving weight get snitched on, she had to expect that they'd shoot her if they found out. You can't fuck with people's livelihoods and expect them to just go home and say "aw man it's getting hot, I better quit dealing [i.e. feeding your family] before I have to hurt someone." Not everyone has the option to just stop selling drugs and have a safety net to fall into. Violence has always been part of drug dealing (not to mention selling weapons), for over a hundred years, and it will continue to be a part of drug dealing until drugs are legal.
The bottom line is that drugs shouldn't be illegal and the police shouldn't use anyone except other cops for busts. She shouldn't have gotten in trouble for drugs in the first place, and they shouldn't be able to coerce civilians into wearing wires and entering dangerous situations. The police treat everyone like a means to an end and have no respect, they are really the problem. But snitches are as bad as the police. They are willing to put someone away just to save their own skin, they are traitors. Snakes and pigs.
TheLostBoys
Bluelighter
It boggles my mind how people act in this instance about when people snitch...........yes there is an unwritten law of not snitching on people when you get caught but try telling that to the 1,000's of mobsters that have snitched on their counterparts for decades & we are talking about murders, heroin dealers, racketeering, gambling & what else you can think of that comes with the mob.......everyone snitches now a days to get a lesser sentence, "its part of the game" & if you dont like the rules, dont get involved............
You gotta be stupid to deal drugs now a days thinking no one will snitch on your ass...........like who are you suppose to be that makes you more important than someone elses freedom? Whether its the mob world, your friendly local dealer, or whatever shady thing you are into like stealing millions of dollars commiting white collar crime, once you get caught, you have the right to snitch & get a lesser sentence...........the snitching rule is in small print at the bottom where people dont understand or they are hoping they never have to snitch...............
You better hope you are never in that situation where you are looking at 5 years hard labor, you might think twice about the unwritten rule of snitching. Like I said before, you get in the game, you gotta look over both shoulders because it could come from 5 different directions..................
How do you think the cops get a high percentage of their arrests? Snitches & information from snitches...............& thats how they make their cases.............
I certainly dont agree with snitching but what I am trying to get across is "its part of the game" so if you're gonna play the game, you should know some of the unwritten rules...............