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Psychedelics and Social Alienation

Has any experienced tripper not gone through this? Is there a specific reason for not doing so? Did you surround yourself with open-minded people? Had you gone through a period of alienation earlier in your life?

I am just at the beginning of my experience with psychedelics and have not felt much alienation from them (yet). I have never tripped alone. The day after my trip, I remember wanting to talk about it with someone who understood and would care. Fortunately, I have friends that do.
Ionno if this is relevant, but I went through a period of alienation from ages 10 or 11 until age 14. I was perfectly content staying alone in my room all the time and only interacting with people who I would never meet in person over the Internet, but I just got bored with it eventually (probably due to puberty).
 
I don't know that I can offer advice, per se, but I can definitely state that what you are going through is very normal. I'll make a couple points you can apply/disregard as you will.

1) If what you are really after is a return to the old normalcy, it will happen. The effects dull with time and without a conscious reinforcement from yourself this is not only possible but will sometimes happen without your knowing.

2) Do you really want to go back to being blind, in a sense? This is IMO the more important question. The world of possibilities opened up and the understanding of the mechanical nature of many is alienating, no doubt, but this definitely does not make it wrong and there is a still a lot to be gained.

3) I have done the "mask" routine. Assuming an imitation of my formal self for work display purposes. However, the mask can easily become reality, which if you want to remain on more metaphysical endeavors can become counter-productive.

4) I think it comes down to the choice of thyself and the direction for thou wilt. As you ponder this question, the rest will become clearer and easier as you move from there.
 
uniter said:
Headspace, You've just started a long, difficult, uplifting, liberating journey, and once you start it's not so easy to go back. I had my first trip 5 years ago, and over time my friendships just slowly melted away, I am alienated but I am just starting to re-construct my social identity like Xorkoth's experience.

There were times where I thought "If i stop tripping I can go back" and i would try, I would try to be normal, but once you've seen the light you can't ignore it. I would get a profound drive to trip again that I decided I wouldn't and couldn't suppress anymore. So congrats you've embarked on what will likely be the most beneficial path of you're life. The first phase was bliss, feeling free from the previous state of bondage. The second stage was alienation, realizing that i didn't connect with anyone anymore, i lost my friends, it's lonely. The third stage is discovering your new social self. Becoming comfortable with the "new you". This seems to come only with time, you can't try to speed this one up, just ride it out, you'll make it. I'm just at the transition between 2 and 3, and it's a great lift off the shoulders, but it took 5 years of heavy social anxiety/social disconnection. These are the challenges that will make you a better person, the "hero's test".

The timeframes are different for every person, I'm just communicating my journey. You're in for a one hell of an adventure and in the end you wouldn't have it any other way :)
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I'm surprised this little message did not evolve any further...I'm much more interested in the psych side of psychs vs. the 'how many times did the guy I bought this from say it was dipped...'

This was me 15 yrs. ago, tripped every weekend for 2 yrs. and it really took that long to discover the 'new me'. Ups/Downs, Neveragains, good ones/bad ones - which happen to be the ones I remember/respect the most.

Anyhow let me fast forward..after those first 2 years I was officially in my new shell and since then, it has been nothing more than educating myself in various flavors....I still trip to this day and after that inital 2 yr stretch, I can say that every trip has been pure beauty and I live each day looking forward to my next.

In the real world, I carry a family/job and it all just seams to come to me...stick with it , evolve, and embrace every moment.
 
Sephirah said:
3) I have done the "mask" routine. Assuming an imitation of my formal self for work display purposes. However, the mask can easily become reality, which if you want to remain on more metaphysical endeavors can become counter-productive.
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'be careful what you pretend to be, because you are what you pretend to be.'
~vonnegut...

just live your truth, you'll find others living similarly -- some of whom have never touched a psychedelic drug in their lives. keep your mind open, and remember that an open mind listens to everyone. everyone.

blahblhablhah.
 
With this new unveiling that seemingly broke all recognizable connections with general society, you need to find love for general society. A common trait in "psychedelic awakenings" is recognizing, and becoming hateful of how much control "egos" have over people around you. Trust me, I've been there. It can make you sick, it can demolish your whole social circle when you see that they're all just massaging their own egos.

Well what is an ego? Why is it bad? All the ego is, is the separation between "self" and "not self". That's the most basic, basic basic basic definition. When someone has a big "ego", they separate themselves from the pack- usually above them. You may not share the idea that "all is one" with me, but I'm sure we can agree that as humans, we're all the same. So one could agree that the ego, is an illusion. It's easily broken, and completely subjective. Nobody shares egos, when two people really fall in love- they drop their egos around each other- "become one"? :).

So the ego itself isn't bad, don't get me wrong, it is completely necessary to maintain sanity. It becomes a negative thing when it isn't recognized for what it is, an illusion. Then the ego inhibits love, which I can call the dissolution of the ego.

So you've got this feeling that everything is just SO fucked up and disgusting around you, change it! Tear down your ego, dive right in. You will get a lot of "what the fuck?", "god damn hippie!", and "haha queer!" comments when you start loving everyone around you. Don't stop, they will see something in you. When you make new friends approaching them with this attitude, they see a light in you that inspires them to love. Then you get a love-chain-reaction.

You might be wondering "why should I love all these ego centric assholes?". Because, they don't KNOW! How can they ever change if they don't see an alternative. Living in the light is a DRASTIC change in behavior, it needs to be taught by peers, to peers. A friend named Lucy showed it to me, though. ;)

So yeah I rambled pretty well there. I hope I got something of a point across.
 
I was going to put a question - something like 'what kind of people gravitate toward psychedelic drugs ?' I think I've seen a lot of answers though in this thread.

The question is framed around alienation- what to do if you feel alienated after taking psychs ?

The drugs I think are useful to establish the difference between the facade of everyday life and reality, if you believe that under the influence of psych drugs the filters are removed and we experience reality more clearly.

Once we see the difference (the bigger picture) we can decide how to better balance the facade, the reality and where we fit in.

Recently, I've had to stop taking any alcohol. It will be more or less permanent. It has most definitely changed my social life. I could read it as alienating, because some of the people in my social set drink often and we no longer share an alcohol high. Actually though, it's caused me to think again about booze. Very early in life I realized how important it was to have a few drinks in me in order to get anywhere with women. Now that the alcohol is gone, I struggle. But there is no going back. I DO feel alienated, but I know at the same time the only way through is to be myself and to get more comfortable with that.

My work has improved because I'm sharper without alcohol and I've cut back smoking hash. I was never one for 'going along' and now that's even less so without alcohol to smooth off the rough edges and help me 'fit in.' I do need original ideas for what I do, and like anyone who creates, I need an audience, so there's no chance I'll get fully cut off from society anytime soon because I need to deal with a lot of people.

I'm really only returning to psychs after many years away. Actually, I expect to have some powerful experiences with psychs soon...ones I didn't really have when I was younger because I didn't take them very often.

To sum up, the alienation has always been there. I think I made it worse though by denying who I was and perhaps trying to fit in, when what I should have been doing was acknowledging that I was on a specific journey that only I alone (so far anyway) could take. And the more I think of things that way, the less alienated I feel. And I can think of all sorts of people who never get anywhere near drugs who understand very well what it is in life they are meant to be doing...and don't consider themselves alienated.
 
I like this thread

Percussion_is_Free said:
Headspace, I can sympathize plenty with what you're going through. I'm a law student--I'm constantly surrounded people who are assholes in training--all head no heart. It would be so easy to write them off as pompous, arrogant pricks with their heads up their asses. And I've gone that road....seeing them strung along by their urges, seeing their hormones lead them blindly around to conquest and oneupmanship, while I, the detached observer, watch, not wanting to play their game...

Here's a really simple idea that has helped me find the tiller for my psychedelicized mind. The key to life is a feeling of gratitude. Every molecule in your body was once dirt. Think about that! And think about the millions of years of evolution, of trial and error, of struggle, that got you from a ball of gas in space to a planet to a precambrian self-replicating ooze to a rudamentary amphibian, and so on. Be grateful for the eons of struggle that have gone into creating your body.

Or think about the bliss of taking a deep breath. Take a deep breath! Be grateful that you've got this system for turning this ocean of oxygen into life energy.

So that's gratitude. Whatever helps you cultivate gratitude, focus on that. Being in a state of gratitude is to function at your best.

The second part of the equation is forgiveness. A state of grace is gratitude projected onto the outer world, with forgiveness projected inward. Gratitude, forgiveness. With every person you meet, as they approach, look past their clothes and their vibe, and be grateful for their existence. See their pain and their ecstasy. Gratitude. Then, as you interact with them, forgive yourself. Don't judge your performance. Forgive yourself.

Gratitude, forgiveness.
Gratitude, forgiveness.

That's helped out a lot in my life. If you want to know more, gurusingh.com.
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I like this response
 
^yeah me too very well written

i experienced the alienation from society at work, i'm a restaurant waiter and during my apprenticeship i worked in an upper class restaurant, after a few months of using psychedelics regualarly (once a month) i felt sorry for many of our guests whose only concern was it to either maximize their profit or "compare their financial dicks", also the whole exaggerated masculinity thing as mentioned before is something i can't comprehend
 
In the period that I did acid really (too) often I was kind of non-stop thinking about the plodding world and the lack of consciousness and the abundance of fear and ego-games especially in the cities. It made me sad and feeling like I couldn't participate with it all and it seemed that I was the only one awake, together with only some other people who could really relate to that were willing to delve as deep into stuff as I would.
Even though I know I had some valid points it was pretty unhealthy psychologically and the resulting detachment from people was actually creating the same social chasm I had come to deplore! I reduced my psychedelics intake and made sure there's a balance between keeping conscientious and maintaining contact with the rest of the world.
Desintegration is dangerous and destabilizing and it can make you unaware of your isolation and what's wrong with that. Positive desintegration, however, is the key and it completes the development of the individual that many of start to see as the right path. It means that you revolve in cycles of deconditioning and detachment from preconceptions / prejudice followed by reintegration and picking up your place or function again while interacting dynamically. Dabrowski wrote a brilliant book on it (it's actually more like a biography explaining his theory of positive desintegration) and it totally explains the right way to deal with what starts out as a conflict. If you succeed with this you don't have to choose between rejection or playing along with everyone's game, you can become your own self. It also involves overexcitable people who often start experiencing this issues spontaneously in their struggle of personal development and revolution.
 
Percussion_is_Free said:
Headspace, I can sympathize plenty with what you're going through. I'm a law student--I'm constantly surrounded people who are assholes in training--all head no heart. It would be so easy to write them off as pompous, arrogant pricks with their heads up their asses. And I've gone that road....seeing them strung along by their urges, seeing their hormones lead them blindly around to conquest and oneupmanship, while I, the detached observer, watch, not wanting to play their game...

Here's a really simple idea that has helped me find the tiller for my psychedelicized mind. The key to life is a feeling of gratitude. Every molecule in your body was once dirt. Think about that! And think about the millions of years of evolution, of trial and error, of struggle, that got you from a ball of gas in space to a planet to a precambrian self-replicating ooze to a rudamentary amphibian, and so on. Be grateful for the eons of struggle that have gone into creating your body.

Or think about the bliss of taking a deep breath. Take a deep breath! Be grateful that you've got this system for turning this ocean of oxygen into life energy.

So that's gratitude. Whatever helps you cultivate gratitude, focus on that. Being in a state of gratitude is to function at your best.

The second part of the equation is forgiveness. A state of grace is gratitude projected onto the outer world, with forgiveness projected inward. Gratitude, forgiveness. With every person you meet, as they approach, look past their clothes and their vibe, and be grateful for their existence. See their pain and their ecstasy. Gratitude. Then, as you interact with them, forgive yourself. Don't judge your performance. Forgive yourself.

Gratitude, forgiveness.
Gratitude, forgiveness.

That's helped out a lot in my life. If you want to know more, gurusingh.com.
Click to expand...

omg Guru Singh is my uncle, i did not ever think to see what he is all about, thank you for enlightening me!

EDIT: also this thread relly is something important to me, i have been going through this process you all have been talking about, thanks for all your insight.
 
I have never had this kind of sensation before as I was alienated a long time before I took drugs. I embrace the belief that there is no god, no afterlife, nobody watching the world. Eventually, the people of this planet will die out, and then it will be just like we had never existed at all.

I have made my peace with this, and I live a life unfettered with whether the actions that I take are moral or not in the traditional sense, but whether or not I find it (the action in question) objectionable.

Anyway, while I have felt introspective on trips before, I have never been deeply effected by them, because, in the end, all it is is a series of biochemical reactions firing in the brain, and none of it really means anything anyway.

This has nothing to do with your post, but it took me long enough to write it concisely that I will not delete it.
 
Not really, Most people think that its bleak, but really I find joy in the knowledge that I have no obligations to any force besides myself. I can do anything that makes me happy.
 
Spooky_D said:
Not really, Most people think that its bleak, but really I find joy in the knowledge that I have no obligations to any force besides myself. I can do anything that makes me happy.
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I believe it's chemical reactions that are causing my perception to change drastically on LSD, but it's my mind that's the force behind the creative and magical experience that's happening to me on it.
 
this thread has grown into one of the most beautiful i've seen. i don't feel like i have much to add to what has already been said here.

perhaps a pinch of Sartre:
"we are doomed to be free."
"Freedom is what you do with what's been done to you"
"God is absence. God is the solitude of man"

oh and

gratitude, forgiveness.
compassion

"A state of grace is gratitude projected onto the outer world, with forgiveness projected inward." Compassion is the 'relay' through which the outer and the inner have communion.

what a little gem this thread is
 
Propyl Power said:
Congratulations, you are alienated from an egocentric, infantile, delusional society with a deathwish for both itself and the planet on which it spreads like a cancer. Why is this a problem for you again?

No, you're not the same person you were before. That's what makes psychedelics useful, they are catalysts for personal growth and evolution.

You're feeling some shock because the veil has been (partially) removed from your eyes, and likely want things to go back to being safe, comfortable, and orderly like they used to be. Well they aren't. The world is infinitely complex, subtle, bizarre, and groundless. And that's wonderful, because now you can get down to the business of actually living your life instead of suppressing your soul for an industrialized police state for which you are nothing more than grist for the mill.

Maybe you need to find some better goals, that are more fulfilling and true to yourself.

Also if you can find some other psychedelically illuminated people, maybe you won't feel so alienated :)
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Well said.


I know exactly where your coming from, having been down that same road. I suggest meditating, yoga, martial arts, and many of the other sixty-four arts. Focus on your health, overall well-being, and live day by day doing the best you can.
 
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