police

[undead]

so i havent read through all the responses as of yet, but i have to say, cops are essential to some sort of order in the world. anyone who's said that without them we would have utter chaos is absolutely correct.

besides that, i cant tell you how many times a cop COULD have thrown me in jail or busted my ass for something, but gave me the benefit of the doubt or gave me some leeway based on my cooperation. also... any time i HAVE been arrested or taken into custody, the cops were extremely kind to me because, again, i was cooperative. it really doesnt do you much good to argue, bitch, and raise hell to a cop if you're being arrested because guess what... its only gonna make them angry and in turn treat you less fairly (but USUALLY within legal boundaries). if you can plead your case in a respectful manner, they're going to be a lot more cooperative with you. if you act like a whiny bitching bastard, they're going to treat you like youre their bitch.

though dont get me wrong, some of them WILL make you their bitch just because they're that pricky. HOWEVER, again, some of them are genuinely nice guys (or girls which is crazy cause everyone knows women shouldnt be doing a mans job).

 

[vibr8tor]

HOWEVER, again, some of them are genuinely nice guys (or girls which is crazy cause everyone knows women shouldnt be doing a mans job).

8) <oh no you di'nt!!!!


IMO, if you wanna make a general statement about cops, the field attracts two obvious types. Those that have nobel intentions and want to "do good," and those that are attracted to power and want to be seen above the law. The bad ones stick out more than the good ones, because everyone loves to read about the cop that pulled over the speeding stripper and forced her to give him a hummer and then roll around naked in the snow. It makes for good media. And it's a lot more interesting than reading about the cop that stopped a cat burgler from running off with someone's tv while they were on vacation.

Shit rolls down from the top, and I think that there are some cities that have well run police forces with little tolerance for corrupt bullshit, and then obviously there are ones which fall on the completely opposite end of the spectrum. I'd imagine that unless you live in a really mellow town, it's a job in which most people become jaded very quickly, because the majority of the people you deal with are going to be trying to get away with something they aren't supposed to be doing. Not to mention how irritating it would be to break up domestic disputes on a daily basis. And then there's the whole risking-your-life for fairly shitty pay aspect which also deserves respect. I understand why people who have personal bad experiences might write them all off as evil, but I'm thankful that so far I am not in that category, because I've had to call the cops on many occasions, and when they arrive it's usually a huge relief.

 

[sn0wburt0n]

i think police should only be necessary to prevent people from hurting/killing/raping each other and theft and shit. the only reason i have such angst towards them is because they spend most of their time busting harmless drug users and writing traffic tickets because, well, that's where the money is at. any victimless crime is not a crime at all, IMO.

 

[Coolio]

but honestly, when your being mugged or your house has been broken into the first thing you want to see is a few friendly, ass-kicking police.

Do you realize how ineffective the police are at actually solving these most common crimes, or helping the victims in any way afterwards? Less than 25% of robbery cases are "solved" and very few cases result in the victim receiving their property back in good condition. A victim of a mugging is even less likely to benefit from police intervention.

You might feel safe because the police are ready to come to your rescue at the press of a few buttons, but in reality there are very few situations where only they could solve a problem.

 

[Adolfo]

People should police themselves
(or else they should be arrested? lol)

 

[Titus]

hey man, just had this debate with a friend. he was saying the police were not necessary and were a joke. my arguement was that we need them to complete the everyday jobs that either no one else is trained to complete, or due to bystander apathy, they are not willling to complete. my basic summing up was that if drugs werent involved with the law(which they shouldnt be), the police would be fantastic. what is everyones opinion? are police necessary? or do you think society could function without them? any opnion is welcome.

The police's role should be reserved exclusively to deal with crimes of violence and property crimes. Period. Then we would all love them (exept people who like to steal or hit or stab or shoot)

 

[Amebix]

No, this society couldnt function without police. Not that that makes them a good thing. Police are a repressive force, plain and simple, there to make sure the rulers continue to rule, the rich stay rich and the poor stay poor.

 

[SA]

Police are a repressive force, plain and simple, there to make sure the rulers continue to rule, the rich stay rich and the poor stay poor.

I'm going to have to disagree there, only because your statement was rather absolute. Just like working for different branches of the same company can be a night and day difference, the experience dictated by the resident management, so can police demeanour differ from country to country and town to town. Compared to some other countries where police have authoritarian power, the western world police are really a polite, considerate bunch, for the most part.

Ultimately police are needed, because people can not only not govern their own actions, but are addicted to governing the actions of others.

 

[Amebix]

"Ultimately police are needed, because people can not only not govern their own actions, but are addicted to governing the actions of others."

And police dont fit into that stereotype huh...

at the risk of losing what little credibility i have:
No more law and order that word says it all its just one human being denying another of self-rule. The police aint authority for all they do is serve, the state, they do their dirty work to make the people learn. They interrogate, discriminate, smash demo's and assault, they sort out all the queers keep the wogs locked in the vault. Theyre here for protection but protection for who? They all wear the same badge that says FUCK YOU ALL

Oh yeah, theyre here to maintain rights, theyre here to keep the peace, theyve even got the right to lock up and not release any form of rebel. They even work against theyre own cause they bribe very well and you might also get a home. Protect their priviledge no matter what the cost, now your the piggy in the middle and they couldnt give a toss, they shit back and laugh yes they laugh at you too cause they also wear a badge that says we use you! Its just the same old story of a state gone wrong where possessions matter and people DONT be surprised if we turn against you cause if you side with them its FUCK YOU TOO!

 

[SA]

Amebix, you appear to be generalising all police in the same way that we ourselves don't want to be generalised, for whatever vices. I'm not sure if it's a regional issue in your case, but I assure you that it is not the case in every region and to throw all cops into the same stinky bucket is not fair.

 

[Amebix]

your talking about the ones that investigate murders?

 

[SA]

I'm talking about police in general.

Protests and demonstrations are handled differently in different cities and countries. Similar other offences are handled differently in different cities and different countries. Laws are different. The way those laws are upheld are different. If you don't agree with the way a reinforcement of a rule/law is handled, either 1) work to change the rule/law, 2) accept the way things are and live there, or 3) move to a location where similar laws are handled differently or those laws do not exist at all.

Again, to lump all cops worldwide into the same evil jacket is unfair.

 

[alasdairm]

Again, to lump all cops worldwide into the same evil jacket is unfair.

but not nearly as easy...



alasdair

 

[SA]

^
I disagree, alasdair. To me, lumping all cops into the same corrupted mould is no different than lumping all drug users, all people of a particular ethnicity, all homeless, or all blondes together in a negative manner. Sure, it's not as easy to do, as you say, if you've had a less than desirable experience with police in your neighbourhood, past or present. I can understand if you then make the generalisation about just that police force. But to apply the same mould to all of their counterparts globally?

Failed arguments:

- I got beat up by two black guys, therefore all black people are thugs.
- I got played by a beautiful woman, therefore all beautiful women are conniving leeches.
- I got beat with a stick by a bunch of cops during a peaceful demonstration in Bumfucknowhere, Idaho, therefore all cops in Idaho/U.S./the world are corrupt, useless bastards.

I'm not being argumentative simply for the sake of being argumentative, alasdair. I honestly do find it just as reprehensible to lump any group of people together negatively, be it by race, beliefs, or profession. Therefore, hearing these types of bashing generalisations against all cops resonates with me the same as any of the aforementioned examples. It is prejudice, plain and simple. It's something I find not only easy, but necessary to argue against, mainly because I've seen more than my share of it myself. Including from cops.

 

[Amebix]

yeah but cops arent an ethnic group or the homeless, they're people doing a job. Doesnt matter if you have the nicest cop, hes still going to enforce the law. The law serves to repress.

 

[SA]

Prejudice is blind to reason, Amebix. To shed the prejudice, you must first accept that it doesn't matter what cops do or who they are.

The root of the problem in a corrupt or ineffective organisation is most often its management. One of the jobs I've worked before always elicited the response, "I've heard they're a horrible outfit to work for". True enough, the company as a whole had a terrible image (from an employee's perspective). My particular location, however, had an awesome record, was a joy to work for and the manager of that location was the best manager I've ever come across, period. Similarly, a corrupt or ineffective police force is not beyond repair and should most certainly not be used as an anchor for prejudice.

edited to add to your last, as you edited while I was posting:

Doesnt matter if you have the nicest cop, hes still going to enforce the law. The law serves to repress.

So your problem then is with the law. In that case, please refer to post #32 above.

 

[ChemicalSmiles]

Doesnt matter if you have the nicest cop, hes still going to enforce the law.

Not always... Sometimes they let you off, sometimes they will plant shit on you, sometimes they will just take drugs/cash and leave.

 

[DarthMom]

The law serves to repress.

and what is wrong with that? sometimes you drug users really crack me up. you really need to get out of your poor me attitude and open your eyes and realize that murderers, rapists, and miscellaneous thugs do indeed need to be repressed.

like the above poster said, you don't like it...join it. be the change you wish to seek. not all cops get a boner arresting pot smokers.

i am so anti establishment, it isn't funny, yet i am smart enough to open my eyes and see that a select few in this world decide to join a dangerous occupation to serve their community. yes, we have a severe philisophical difference regarding a certain freedom, but it doesn't make them the "enemy" this isn't a fucking huxley novel, it is reality. it is the real world.

i have been let go by officers when i had weed on me. yes, some of them go overboard, they are human and that career choice could appeal to those who shouldn't be in it, but judging them by their worst is as bad as what you are doing to them.

 

[-Guido-]

I hate cops. I think they are necessary to a degree but they should keep their fucking noses out of drug related shit and do something useful like keeping murders, rapists, and other scum like that off the streets instead of ruining a bunch of peoples lives over being high or having drugs.

 

[SA]

I hate cops. I think they are necessary to a degree but they should keep their fucking noses out of drug related shit and do something useful like keeping murders, rapists, and other scum like that off the streets instead of ruining a bunch of peoples lives over being high or having drugs.

ClubbinGuido, your argument is flawed and anger misplaced in that it is not the police who are "ruining a bunch of peoples lives over being high or having drugs", but the laws of the land. The job of the police is to uphold that law. If you don't agree with the message, shooting the messenger is not the solution.

Last week I watched a man tear a strip off this young lady at the lotto kiosk, all because she asked him to sign his ticket before she could check it (it's a written rule of the game here) and he refused. After listening to him for about half a minute, I had to step in and ask the man if he believed that the young lady wrote that rule herself, or if she was simply following it as it was her job to, and if he would pay her wages if she got reprimanded or let go for not doing her job, especially if the man himself could have been an auditor. Mumble, silence, moved on.

Same here. Taking out your anger on someone who is simply doing their job is wrong. People are okay with police upholding certain laws and not others? How convenient. Work at changing the laws which you don't agree with. It's not impossible, the rich do it all the time. Guess what, there's fewer of them. The problem with us is we never band together enough to make anything happen. We just bitch and carry on.