People That Shaped The Furture Of Music

waht i suggest to you is...get your hands on all the tupac cds you can...from the earliest cd to the stuff that is beign released to this date..listen to as much of it as possible...then i suggest you pay attn to any and every rapper even the old schoolers which you keep mentioning will not deny this man the credit you are denying him

then after you listen to the music...go out ...and i am beign serious...buy you a copy of RESSURRECTION and watch it...watch it and pay attn ...i cannot stress PAY ATTENTION TO EVERYTHING HE SAYS enough...i watched it the first time and was distractred by different things during watching it and i all the sudden missed one sentence and didnt understand what he was saying...i watched it again and listened to every word...word for word beginning to end...if you do not listen to everysingle word...dont be gettind distracted talkin to your buddy or on the phone while watchign this docc. YOU WILL MISS SOMETHING AND YOU WILL TAKE SOMETHIGN THE WRONG WAY...i did it myself...i took things out of context becasue i wasnt paying enough attn.and i am a tupac fan..but i went back and followed it closely...there is so much stuff in thre that you ...me ...no one knew about tupac shakur.PAY CLOSE ATTN TO WHO HIS INSPIRATIONS ARE.AND WHY HE CHOSE THEM AS INSPIRATIONS...this docc. porves the mans pure genious and it will allow those of you who do not understand to see that he inded had a huge impact on rap music as well as society
 
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And had he not died..especially getting shot down like a true “thug”, no one would be doing as such, even though he skills would be just as good, if not better later on in life. Hype.



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that proves that you do not understand...you know not what you speak


do what i am telling you and get this damn dvd and watch it...let him explain to you HIMSELF what thug life really is..as compared to waht media portrays to the uneducated such as yourself..LET HE HIMSELF EXPLAIN TO YOU WHY PEOPLE LIKE YOU SAY THINGS LIKE YOU JUST SAID
 
part of me sits here thinking that even if you did watch and listen like im telling you to do...you would still out of spite continue to have your same opinion...some people just cant see...some people dont want to see
 
^ I don't think your listening to DD. He's pays very close attention to his music. I'm sure he knows a quite bit about tupac.

Frankly, I don't care about what Tupac did for rap. Really, I don't see how he helped bring down gang violence. If anything more people are getting into thug life because of him. He praises violence, and thats not a good thing.
 
You’re obviously a hardcore 2pac fan. That makes you biased as well does it not?


i am a tupac fan i have already said thiat...its obvious...i have always been able to relate to his words

i have not put out any other opinions about tupac other than i think he has helped shape the future of rap music....

i have said i am not going to argue opinions....i have given examples of things for pepople to examine and decide for themselves

i have howerver argued the opinion that you can correctly compare two atrists such as tupack and pink floyd as far as their impact on music is concerned
 
Originally posted by headknocka
i have not put out any other opinions about tupac other than i think he has helped shape the future of rap music....


cool. so, how has he helped shaped the future of rap music?

perhaps give us a basic outline of his influence with a couple of specific examples for those of us who don't know the genre that well but would like to understand it better?

alasdair
 
headknocka said:
i have said i am not going to argue opinions....i have given examples of things for pepople to examine and decide for themselves
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Don't argue a position if you don't have the proof. Don't make poeple examine and decide for themselves because they need the proof to determine if what you are saying is right or wrong. Because you'll just say "Well you weren't reading it correctly".
 
Still waiting for ways in which tupac influenced music, rather than just assertions that he did. This was a fine thread before you came in here running your mouth without any backing for it, headknocka. "Go out and see for yourself" isn't going to cut it, punk. Thats just saying "I've got an opinion, and I can't explain it" or "This really is just my opinion, and there are no facts to support it". Please stop participating in this discussion if all you have to say is:

"Tupac is increadibly influential"
"I don't have to say how"

There are pages and pages of replies from before you pooped all over this thread full of people explaining why they made their choices. They draw connections from their influential artists to modern movements, and modern popular artists. Why don't you? Put up, or shut up, please. Reading your posts, and seeing you derail a perfectly good thread is painfull to watch.
 
Pasilda Nacera said:
^ I don't think your listening to DD. He's pays very close attention to his music. I'm sure he knows a quite bit about tupac.

Frankly, I don't care about what Tupac did for rap. Really, I don't see how he helped bring down gang violence. If anything more people are getting into thug life because of him. He praises violence, and thats not a good thing.
Click to expand...

he didnt praise violence...he took what goes in in REAL LIFE ...what he and other people see in their lives...and made everyone else see it through song...sure the media made sure we seen all the negatives..and ONLY the negatives..there is one thing that stuck out after hearing him talk about how the press only showed the negative aspects...it was a section in the video where he is talking about the sexual assult case brought against him years ago..they flash to a "mtv news clip" where kurt loder identifys pac as "tupac shakur,famous rapper ,member of death row records,SEXUAL ASSULT CONVICT" then he goes on to tell a small story about the situaion...now...there was no reason to introduce him like that other than to cause negativity...more news...more shit for people to feed on...more negative outlook and press

another thing that stuck out to me ..was hoe he talked about the vietnam war....how the media coverage and putting the death in front of american tv viewers as well as all over the wrold ...put a stop to the vietnam war..
from his mouth...his own words...his own prespective as an artist was to do the same thign with rap and put out there the most violent harsh bad shit that goes on in his neighborhood and hope that people would see it the same way ...adn put a stop to it..quickly...that is from his own mouth...early on in his carreer...


just get the docc
 
atlas said:
Still waiting for ways in which tupac influenced music, rather than just assertions that he did. This was a fine thread before you came in here running your mouth without any backing for it, headknocka. "Go out and see for yourself" isn't going to cut it, punk. Thats just saying "I've got an opinion, and I can't explain it" or "This really is just my opinion, and there are no facts to support it". Please stop participating in this discussion if all you have to say is:

"Tupac is increadibly influential"
"I don't have to say how"

There are pages and pages of replies from before you pooped all over this thread full of people explaining why they made their choices. They draw connections from their influential artists to modern movements, and modern popular artists. Why don't you? Put up, or shut up, please. Reading your posts, and seeing you derail a perfectly good thread is painfull to watch.
Click to expand...

how many times am i goign to have to say i am not going to argue opinions by giving you what would be my reasons for him being an influence on music

my opinion is that he did
my opinion is that many of you dont understand the man...at all...


i dotn need to give you some list of MY reasons so we can sit her eand argue them ...becasue therye jsut opinions...but what i can do is give you ways to see for yourself to allow you to form a legit real opinion on something for yourself since there is appropiate material out there for you to do so with


my other problem is that some of you seem to think i am "stupid or ignorant" which i am not...far from either
 
my opinion is that he did
my opinion is that you dont understand the man as well as you think...

^ what's the value in a point like this? none. many people in this thread have made a claim and backed it up with some excellent points.

it's not clear to me why you can't or won't do the same but, without some williingness on your part to make your case, why should anybody listen to your opinion?

namaste

alasdair
 
:::bangs head against brick wall:::

If we don't agree, we don't understand? You won't defend your opinion. Great. That section is over.

Next topic.

What role of influence do you think Sinatra had on music overall ? (to anyone)
 
DigitalDuality said:
:::bangs head against brick wall:::

If we don't agree, we don't understand? You won't defend your opinion. Great. That section is over.

Next topic.
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it will be over when you stop putting shit like that in my mouth
 
alasdairm said:
my opinion is that he did
my opinion is that you dont understand the man as well as you think...

^ what's the value in a point like this? none. many people in this thread have made a claim and backed it up with some excellent points.

it's not clear to me why you can't or won't do the same but, without some williingness on your part to make your case, why should anybody listen to your opinion?

namaste

alasdair
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whats the value in me doing so and you or someone else arguing with me about it...what will that prove....that my opinion or your opinion is better than the other????
 
early in this thread i brougth up the rolling stones...i was questioned about the rolling stones...i didnt sit there and waste time listign all my reasons for the rolling stones either...becasue it is pointless....i have seen names people have listed that i sort of question...but i dotn care to hear their list of reasons why they have THEIR OPINION..i seen this thread heading in the direction of BECASUE I SAID SO...so i said something about it....then tupac came up...i stated an opinion on tupac...i have not listed my specific opinions for tupac being one of my choices either becasue it is also pointless...but what i do KNOW is that many people have a missunderstanding of the artist tupac shakur,..hell even i learned thigns about him in his docc that i didnt and would have never known or even thought until i heard things from his mouth in this docc.know...or quite understand

instead of us arguing opinions i would rather give you information that will help you see things accurately...if you would do so you wouldnt have to have a specific list of reasons from me....instead you all get mad at me for not doing this exactly how you wnat me to do it

i fyou cannot understand that i will not sit here and list specific things. so we can argue about it...i suggest things for you to check out for yourselves...mostly becasue i know that there is such a negative image that surrounds tupac shakur....then i dont know wht to tell you
 
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I watched the documentary, I've read LA-brynth twice (concerning the murders of Biggie and Pac). 2pac did talk about some profound things, he also had some fairly emotional songs. His influence over music, might even be equal or surpasses that of Tool and Pink Floyd.

I was merely stating that hip hop in particular hasn't evolved to fill its potential. That it remains relatively shallow. Yeah it stimulates emotions, yeah it conjures up political thought, but it doesn't really test the boundaries or push the envelope. It pushed the envelope in matters of style and pushed it in matters of shock value.

You came in with Tupac and threw a hissy fit about it. Since you stood so feverently about your opinion, giving reasonings and supporting statements is not pointless.

This thread is not about winning. It is about discussion. Many others within this thread have disagreed about the Rolling Stones, Aerosmith, 311, and even Pink Floyd and it was politely debated. The great thing about debate and discussion is that it may allow another person to see that music or artist in a new light, by shedding new perspective onto it, we may reform our opinions and tastes (for better or worse). Yet you write it off as "pointless". It's not pointless. Art is important. From Van Gogh to Eminem, and understanding what artists are trying to convery, being able to look at them from multiple view points is important in that comprehension. You seem to hold a perspective that i don't. That Blue or aladairm might not, you seem passionate about it. But instead of explaining yourself, you are just stirring up an arguement. YOu're interpreting this as some anger fueled, holier than thou fight. And it is not.

If we agree or disagree with you, who cares? If you don't want to discuss it, don't. If you do, at least be constructive.

Many people hear have listened to a plethora of artists from a plethora of genres. I seriously doubt someone is going to attack your supporting arguements, if you were to provide them, based on minimal exposure to the topic at hand. To do so would be stupid.
 
while we're at it, we may as well say every single artist ever has influenced music because everyone has their own special thing that makes them good, or radio worthy anyway. maybe the debate should not be about the ways they influenced music, but the way they have imacted us and the way WE perceive music.... by the way headknocka, i still think you are very intelligent and do have some very great ideas to offer.... even though you judged my post, people just need to read more than just what they see... sorry for the drama, this was mos def a touchy subject... tupac was great, don't get me wrong peeps....
 
i gave my reasons....every cd he ever made..i dont feel the need to explain them...they exsist...they speak for themselves...that is my opinion

you mention that he some fairly emotional songs...to many people ..every song was felt in some way...everyone that hears tupacs music can relate to in in one way...many people relate to much more of it exactly how it comes out of his mouth,....i know you get the idea of what i am saying here....

i guess now im goign to give more opinion ......


as far as tupac as an influence of rap music...its hard for me to even sit here and believe that i would have to defend that...so much shit runs through my head at once that i cant even begin to think how to get it out ...

i will try it like this i guess

the man himself ...the artist...had a purpose...a vision of a way to portray a certin way of life that he thought he could help change...he lived his life....he had problems in his life...identity crisis whatever you want to call it...but his words were so powerfull they sparked minds everywhere ...rappers ...reg people....everyone...you will never hear another rapper not credit tupac with beign an influence on rap music ...even when the man was alive i never heard too many rappers not mention his name when they are or were asked who are their influences... they all say the name tupac .

now...

the influence he sparked may not have been what he wanted...or what many people wanted...but it was highly influential in the shaping of rap music

that is all i can say right now i keep getting ahead of myself in my head and im confusing myslef
 
Jean-Jacques Perrey
Brian Eno
Vladimir Ussachevsky
Peter Gabriel
Ornette Coleman
Charlie Parker
John Lee Hooker
Damo Suzuki
Ryoji Ikeda (not yet, but wait)
Billy Cobham
Thelonious Monk
Wendy Carlos (with help from Bob Moog)
 
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