☮ Social ☮ PD Social Distancing Tripping Thread: Viruses Can't Penetrate Hyperspace

[Kaleida]

I'd pick coffee, then LSD. Coffee isn't nearly as interesting as LSD, but it sure is a good chronic drug. But then again, being stuck on a desert island isn't like being in NYC, maybe it wouldn't be much good.

Then LSD. I'd like to say ETH-LAD because I think I like it more, but LSD is so much more tried tested and true, so it would be a safer bet if I had to pack up for the desert island tomorrow.

Or maybe 5-MeO-DMT. Imagine stuck on a desert island for years with nothing but fish, coconuts and 5-MeO-DMT?

That was something that came to mind for me too, that caffeine might be a nice drug in typical life, but I'm not sure that would really be enough to make it the one drug I would take to a desert island lol. Part of what makes taking a hallucinogen seem like a good choice to me is that they can both be comfortably extreme and are capable of continuously generating novel experiences. Even cannabis I think would fall short for me for this reason, since it'd just be the same relaxing but not exciting buzz and no new content, day after day after day.... Of course, I wasn't the one who added that island qualifier though, I initially just said if I could only ever have one drug again. If coffee helps you get through life and that's the one you'd want to choose then more power to you!

Man, I really need to take ETH-LAD again. I'm seeing more and more people say they prefer it to LSD it seems like almost every day now, and though I've only taken one small dose so far I definitely felt like it had some potential to be great like that too. The fact that I already got an annoying body load from that dose would give me some pause about taking it to an island even if it was guaranteed safe in the long-term though, if I really was in that situation I imagine I might limit myself to only drugs with basically no chance of causing significant physical discomfort like LSD and psilocin. In just regular life though, I might pick ETH-LAD still if I turn out liking it better.

Hmm, I've not tried 5-MeO-DMT, but based on what I've heard about it I'd be tempted to ask again: wouldn't you rather have a trip with some novel content? I was under the impression that 5-MeO-DMT was primarily an ego dissolver / void-producing substance, which I could get just as easily from other substances that also come with extreme hallucinations.

Same here. If you think about it, you get 30 seconds on average for every minute to talk, whereas in a group of six, you only get 10! :D Maybe that's why we prefer it?

Then again, sometimes it's nice to just be a listener, not a talker...

That's an interesting perspective, I could see it lol. I do like to hear myself talk. :S But I agree with that too, I also enjoy being a wallflower. I just find it harder to actually jump into conversations in large groups when really high, especially if the people know each other a good deal better than I know them.

Don't even get me started on how much I love green tea. Maybe my adenosine system is weird or something, but I really get an impressive amount of euphoria from it. Of course, a cup of tea is not nearly as dramatic an occasion as an LSD trip. But I get to drink tea virtually every single day of my life, multiple times, with zero apparent downside, other than maybe a mild caffeine dependency (although I don't even drink any until I get home from work, which isn't a problem). And theoretically I'm receiving some health benefits.

That's quite possible. For example, we know that the presence of L-theanine in tea modulates the effect, acting as an anxiolytic. I can attest that matcha, which I believe tends to contain more L-theanine than sencha, gives me a smoother and more transparent effect, despite both being Japanese green teas. Sencha is definitely my favorite, and is the most overtly recreational IME. I'd almost describe the come-up as a "rush", whereas I wouldn't say that about black tea.

The effect of tea is divided into two phases for me. The first effect is that it instantly melts away all negativity, leaving me in a deeply relaxed state, perfectly content to simply sit, breathe, watch, and think. That renewed optimism gives me a calm little inner space, which enables me to think about issues in my life more clearly sometimes. Or, to enjoy the simple pleasures of life without being pressured by the larger problems. That phase lasts for maybe up to an hour, and then it transitions into a more neutral stimulant effect, at which point I become more inclined to start busying myself with work or chores. This lasts a few hours, and gradually tapers off, without any perceptible crash.

That's an interesting thread, I can definitely say that I've never gotten that much stimulation from chocolate, haha. The first time I chugged a few energy drinks I did get a high that was stronger than any amphetamine high I've ever had though. A friend and I both had to chug them as we were going to bowl with friends and they wouldn't let us bring the pack in, and once we got in we were shaking so much we were falling out of our seats and laughing and jabbering so much we didn't care. It never got that strong again though, no matter how much I chugged.

I actually have taken L-theanine before as a supplement and that was pretty nice, I thought that it was mild but felt a bit more intoxicating and trippy still than most mild sedatives, for instance much more so than something like a benzo despite those causing more amnesia and disinhibition. That could help me, as part of the reason that I eventually ended up quitting caffeine is just that I feel that stimulants aren't really for me. As mentioned before, I just already have quite a lot of energy normally, and I think that may by why most stimulants these days either just give me anxiety or make me start getting mild psychotic hallucinations after a few hours, caffeine falling into the former category. I think this might also be part of why I like psychedelics so much though on the other hand, since I do tend to find them a good deal more stimulating and hedonistic than most people I trip with too.

What you describe does sound quite a bit nicer than what I'd normally expect from a caffeinated drinks. I'll have to give it a shot some time. Thanks for the guidance too, as I wasn't even really aware that there are different kinds of green tea lol.

On a desert island an unlimited supply of heroin would be my choice. Followed by dry socks.

Socks? On an island?

 

[perpetualdawn]

Hmm, I've not tried 5-MeO-DMT, but based on what I've heard about it I'd be tempted to ask again: wouldn't you rather have a trip with some novel content? I was under the impression that 5-MeO-DMT was primarily an ego dissolver / void-producing substance, which I could get just as easily from other substances that also come with extreme hallucinations.

I think you have the correct impression of what 5-MeO-DMT is all about. Something like LSD would be more entertaining on a desert island. But 5-MeO-DMT is unparalleled IMO/IME in it's ability to deliver the essential psychedelic/mystical experience, and interestingly basically *without* any hallucinations/distortions, fractals etc. It's kind of the ultimate psychedelic - ultimate more in the sense of "final" moreso than "best" - but it's also quite different from all of the other psychedelics. It's the sharpest lens for looking directly at what the mystical traditions point towards.

 

[xammy]

Someone once told me that 5-MeO-DMT is not worth trying but I have no idea myself. Is it popular? What are the major differences compared to N,N-DMT?

 

[perpetualdawn]

Fuck yes it's totally worth doing.

I've never done N,N-DMT, but from what I can tell 5-MeO-DMT is a completely different animal, probably more different from DMT than magic mushrooms are from DMT. It does have some things in common with N,N-DMT tho: short timeframe, transcendent experience, and is used by shamans etc in S.America.

Initially I wrote 5-MeO-DMT off, before having tried it, partially scared off by the reports of terrorizing experiences, partially thinking DPT (which was already in my collection), more-or-less covers the territory of 5-MeO-DMT. Turns out it's nothing at all like DPT, nor do I find it terrifying, rather it's ecstatic.

Now I see that it's sort of the be-all-end-all of psychedelics. Or at least it delivers 100% on the direct mystical experience. You could call it a niche chemical that way, but that niche is infinite.

Do you want to directly experience the thing that zen buddhism points to? It won't make you enlightened, that's for sure, but it allows pretty normal people to experience the sublime infinite groundstate of consciousness in a way that I don't think any other drug does so specifically.

 

[Solipsis]

This is quite a sensible position. However, I think the experience of ego loss is the temporary side-effect of losing something which does deserve to be permanently obliterated; and that is, a false idea about who you really are.

While this does seem agreeable, the funny thing is that I think I got this effect more from milder ego softening than ego loss/death simply because of the differences in how this is integrated. The more ruthless form of this experience has so many more side effects of disintegrating the coherent parts that it can create problems with functioning as a whole. The mystical experience is very spiritual but already so far beyond... if the aim as so often is what Xorkoth calls the middle of the road, I think you learn more from swerving over this road than to see what it is to pioneer on the far other side of where the ego's domain is.

Someone once told me that 5-MeO-DMT is not worth trying but I have no idea myself. Is it popular? What are the major differences compared to N,N-DMT?

If you'd like to know my opinion from experience, it is described here in this thread if you scroll a bit down towards the end: http://www.bluelight.org/vb/threads/817439-What-is-the-best-drug-to-use-to-attempt-this

More as a response to your post than to the question about the differences:
I think saying 'not worth trying' has never deserved more of an explanation when referring to a drug than here, because it is a very ultimate sort of experience and certainly far from ineffective... so it would always be important to know what part of it made all of what it does un-worthwhile! Is it the white-knuckled anxiety / overwhelming intensity? I get that from DMT too even if it is a little less. Is it the relative lack of visual effects? If so: I think this is a misunderstanding of what kinds of power an experience like this can have. Sure it is more abstract to try and imagine a severely altered state of experience mostly without the allegorical visual theatre leading you up and down, but that doesn't mean it can't be in ways even more powerful and awesome.

I also agree pretty much fully with perpetualdawn aka the derpetrator.

 

[perpetualdawn]

perpetualdawn aka the derpetrator.

derp derp! I love it

Just noticed that N,N-MALT is now available, haven't seen that get discussed yet. Anyone else noticed that, or tried it out?

 

[Xorkoth]

Nice... I hear 5-MeO-MALT is a totally different beast than 5-MeO-DALT. Makes sense since the former is a methyl and allyl and the latter is 2 allyls. Pretty exciting.

 

[xammy]

If you'd like to know my opinion from experience, it is described here in this thread if you scroll a bit down towards the end: http://www.bluelight.org/vb/threads/817439-What-is-the-best-drug-to-use-to-attempt-this

More as a response to your post than to the question about the differences:
I think saying 'not worth trying' has never deserved more of an explanation when referring to a drug than here, because it is a very ultimate sort of experience and certainly far from ineffective... so it would always be important to know what part of it made all of what it does un-worthwhile! Is it the white-knuckled anxiety / overwhelming intensity? I get that from DMT too even if it is a little less. Is it the relative lack of visual effects? If so: I think this is a misunderstanding of what kinds of power an experience like this can have. Sure it is more abstract to try and imagine a severely altered state of experience mostly without the allegorical visual theatre leading you up and down, but that doesn't mean it can't be in ways even more powerful and awesome.

I also agree pretty much fully with perpetualdawn aka the derpetrator.

ah if I had to guess it's because of the lack of visuals or something because he didn't recommend it. As a dissociative lover I've never been a fan of visuals really.

 

[Kaleida]

I think you have the correct impression of what 5-MeO-DMT is all about. Something like LSD would be more entertaining on a desert island. But 5-MeO-DMT is unparalleled IMO/IME in it's ability to deliver the essential psychedelic/mystical experience, and interestingly basically *without* any hallucinations/distortions, fractals etc. It's kind of the ultimate psychedelic - ultimate more in the sense of "final" moreso than "best" - but it's also quite different from all of the other psychedelics. It's the sharpest lens for looking directly at what the mystical traditions point towards.

....

Initially I wrote 5-MeO-DMT off, before having tried it, partially scared off by the reports of terrorizing experiences, partially thinking DPT (which was already in my collection), more-or-less covers the territory of 5-MeO-DMT. Turns out it's nothing at all like DPT, nor do I find it terrifying, rather it's ecstatic.

Now I see that it's sort of the be-all-end-all of psychedelics. Or at least it delivers 100% on the direct mystical experience. You could call it a niche chemical that way, but that niche is infinite.

I merged these together because they were much more meaningful to me when considered together....

You've got me particularly interested now because I've also assumed, partially from hearing a few select people say so, that DPT should overlap with 5-MeO-DMT. I also haven't tried DPT yet so I can barely have any opinion on that myself, but it did always seem like there were certain similarities from the description. For that reason I just carried that comparison around in the back of my mind, and have felt that for example 4-HO-EPT compares to 5-MeO-DMT based on what I've heard. Nonetheless, though I wouldn't rule anything out, it does seem likely to me that 4-HO-EPT is probably more alike DPT in many ways than it is 5-MeO-DMT, and I think I largely thought they were alike in the same way I thought 5-MeO-DMT and DPT might be alike, so perhaps I don't have so much of a grasp on it after all.

I realize that these things are hard enough to put into words as it is, but do you think you could try to articulate just some of what it is that you thought would be similar about the two that then turned out to be quite different?

Just noticed that N,N-MALT is now available, haven't seen that get discussed yet. Anyone else noticed that, or tried it out?

I noticed that when it first showed up recently, but I haven't tried it. I'm afraid that I may not ever.... I've honestly been reaching a point lately where I think I'm pretty much ready to retire from collecting psychedelics for now, even my beloved indoles, since I've already gotten so many and found some many lifelong allies in them that to keep searching now before I go through what I have just seems a little indulgent, and not to mention straining on my wallet. Nonetheless, I am going to put out there right now that I think MALT has the potential to be fantastic... given that it's the closest thing structurally to MPT. That one still seems to be only budding so far too, but I still have high hopes for it based on its relationship to 4-HO-MPT. So, I'm definitely very interested in what people will think of MALT at least once some reports start coming in!

 

[swilow]

Really nothing is too comparable to 5-MeO-DMT. Its its own self. Really terrifying, much more predictable unnerving than DMT, similar in onset and duration though, and nomenclature so people assume the two are akin.

DPT and DMT are much more similar to each other than either are to 5-MeO-DMT. Both the former are highly visual and can involve sense of communication or contact (DMT being much more likely to create the sensation of contact in me though), the latter is sort of sensually dissociative but psychologically psychedelic. I get ridiculously nervouse before consuming either but it wears of for DMT as the effects kick in (to an extent, at least) but doesn't with 5-MeO-DMT. Its hard to determine why I ever did that drug, or why I used to 'enjoy' it. Its been a while since I took it, can't besure how long, and I have some but these days little interest in ingesting.

The Sacred Dimethyl Tryptaminsect still calls my name/s.

 

[cj187]

Nonetheless, I am going to put out there right now that I think MALT has the potential to be fantastic... given that it's the closest thing structurally to MPT. That one still seems to be only budding so far too, but I still have high hopes for it based on its relationship to 4-HO-MPT. So, I'm definitely very interested in what people will think of MALT at least once some reports start coming in!

I'm pretty curious about MALT too. I had some extra bitcoins I was planning to spend on some MALT, but I ended up ordering some 2C-D instead, just a few days before MALT came out. I'll probably wait for some trip reports before I decide to get some.

I've tried MPT a few times and more recently tried MET for the first time. My experiences with them seem to match your comparisons of the 4-HO versions. MPT has a mystical quality and feels every bit as natural as DMT. MET, while similar to MPT, feels a bit hollow and synthetic in comparison. MPT has a rich, complex color palate and produces paisley patterns and grids and fractals. MET seems to emphasize primary colors, and the patterns I got from it were just squiggles. I really need to try a higher dose of MET before I can form an opinion of it, but my first impression of it is that it isn't as complex or deep as MPT. I like them both though.

 

[Kaleida]

Really nothing is too comparable to 5-MeO-DMT. Its its own self. Really terrifying, much more predictable unnerving than DMT, similar in onset and duration though, and nomenclature so people assume the two are akin.

DPT and DMT are much more similar to each other than either are to 5-MeO-DMT. Both the former are highly visual and can involve sense of communication or contact (DMT being much more likely to create the sensation of contact in me though), the latter is sort of sensually dissociative but psychologically psychedelic. I get ridiculously nervouse before consuming either but it wears of for DMT as the effects kick in (to an extent, at least) but doesn't with 5-MeO-DMT. Its hard to determine why I ever did that drug, or why I used to 'enjoy' it. Its been a while since I took it, can't besure how long, and I have some but these days little interest in ingesting.

The Sacred Dimethyl Tryptaminsect still calls my name/s.

Thanks for the input, that's very insightful. It's interesting that you find it terrifying, whereas perpetualdawn specifically describes it as not being that. Once again, we are all so different!

Well, the way you describe 5-MeO-DMT - as "sort of sensually dissociative but psychologically psychedelic" - actually is very much how 4-HO-EPT has been for me so far as well, whereas how you describe DPT and DMT - as "highly visual and can involve sense of communication or contact" - really isn't other than fleeting hints, so maybe there is some connection there after all. I really wish I could just try the 5-MeO-DMT to see for myself!

I really wish I had some DMT too, it's been way too long and I'm itching to go back.

I'm pretty curious about MALT too. I had some extra bitcoins I was planning to spend on some MALT, but I ended up ordering some 2C-D instead, just a few days before MALT came out. I'll probably wait for some trip reports before I decide to get some.

I've tried MPT a few times and more recently tried MET for the first time. My experiences with them seem to match your comparisons of the 4-HO versions. MPT has a mystical quality and feels every bit as natural as DMT. MET, while similar to MPT, feels a bit hollow and synthetic in comparison. MPT has a rich, complex color palate and produces paisley patterns and grids and fractals. MET seems to emphasize primary colors, and the patterns I got from it were just squiggles. I really need to try a higher dose of MET before I can form an opinion of it, but my first impression of it is that it isn't as complex or deep as MPT. I like them both though.

That's really cool to hear, thanks for sharing that. :D That is indeed very much how I feel about 4-HO-MPT and 4-HO-MET, and based on my and a family member's experiences on MET so far I was thinking that it does seem to have some qualities in common with 4-HO-MET, so I really have been hoping the same would apply to MPT as well.

I'm really curious how these different structure-activity relationships will mesh with the different functional qualities generally shared by base and 4-substitued tryptamines each for me too. For instance, while I enjoy all of these tryptamines very much so far, when it comes to the 4-substitued ones I feel that I get the most of 4-HO-DMT and 4-HO-MPT because I enjoy that way the more mystical feeling of the dimethyl and methylpropyl structures mixes with the generally more disorienting but also grounded and hedonistic nature this substitution group has compared to the base ones, whereas of the base ones so far my one experience with MET made me feel like I might end up liking it even more than DMT due to the fact that it seems to have just as much breakthrough potential but feels potentially even more lucid and easygoing, the same qualities that I find to make 4-HO-MET feel a little too light in its own class for me. If I was going for a deeper-feeling trip I would definitely still take DMT so far though, but just for my own recreational preferences.... It really is fascinating seeing how all the functional relationships blend together, causing all psychedelics to exist on countless spectrums with one another and yet still being each totally unique at the same time.

If you try MALT, or MPT or MET more, I would definitely love to hear about those too!

 

[TheAppleCore]

Hey TAC, what did you use to master that track? Was pretty tight. I like mastering shit.

MSpectralDynamics was my secret weapon for that track. The mixdown had a glaring problem which couldn't really be addressed any other way. Awesome plug-in. Other than that, FabFilter Pro-Q 2 and Pro-L.

I'd pick coffee, then LSD.

Now I don't feel so weird. :D I haven't gotten into coffee much; I wonder how the effect differs from tea?

 

[perpetualdawn]

I realize that these things are hard enough to put into words as it is, but do you think you could try to articulate just some of what it is that you thought would be similar about the two that then turned out to be quite different?

Yeah, it's hard, and I've only had around 4-5 experiences with each max, so I still feel my understanding is forming. Also, my experience is pretty much limited to insuff. roa.

DPT is longer lasting, and a bit more classic psychedelic effect to it, but with a bit of a spooky feel to it. No surprise people report entity contacts experiences on it. Stronger music enhancement than 5meodmt. I find it to be visionary (mind movies) rather than visual (geometry fractals) although it has the classic psychedelic fractals to some extent. It can make time grind to a halt, look at your own mortality straight in the eyes.

5-MeO-DMT is so neutral, its almost like it isn't there. No visual or audio distortions. More than most psychedics, it has the feel of something to work with, rather than sitting back and letting it take you for a ride. Or rather, it might take some practice/effort/awareness to not meddle with it and let it take you for the ride. Unlike most psychedelics it's really not a sensual enhancer. It just does that one thing. Get out of your own way, cessation of normal mind, experience the whole-oneness, and then the cosmic joke of existence that divides out from that unity.Then massive ecstatic bliss, with cosmic creative energy pouring through your entire being, and then an hour later your back to checking your email and washing the dishes.

 

[Img_9999]

Then massive ecstatic bliss, with cosmic creative energy pouring through your entire being, and then an hour later your back to checking your email and washing the dishes.

Before enlightenment,
Check mail, wash dishes.
After enlightenment,
Check mail, wash dishes.



An updated zen proverb.

Now I don't feel so weird. :D I haven't gotten into coffee much; I wonder how the effect differs from tea?

If you really get a "rush" from green-tea, then a strong coffee will get you stimmed out. I've felt pretty euphoric myself from a good cup of coffee before. .

 

[Xorkoth]

Back in the day before I had barraged my brain for years, coffee was my favorite. I used to drink tons of it, I'd make a whole french press and slam it pretty quickly, and it would make me feel quite euphoric. These days, coffee is the roughest form of caffeine for me. I prefer pure caffeine because I find it a lot smoother. Coffee can easily push me into "too much" territory, which is quite unpleasant.

The first drug I ever did was No-Doz (caffeine pills). My high school friend, I think we were 16, picked up a bottle one day and was like, let's take 3 of these (600mg) before we go bike riding. We did, and I thought it was fucking awesome. We had so much energy, we were laughing hysterically at everything. I picked up my own bottle and we'd do No-Doz periodically when also doing other activities. My mom found it one day and was really scared, she had a serious talk with me about it and threw them away. So I bought another. I worked at a grocery store for fuck's sake.

 

[Xorkoth]

I'm pretty curious about MALT too. I had some extra bitcoins I was planning to spend on some MALT, but I ended up ordering some 2C-D instead, just a few days before MALT came out. I'll probably wait for some trip reports before I decide to get some.

I've tried MPT a few times and more recently tried MET for the first time. My experiences with them seem to match your comparisons of the 4-HO versions. MPT has a mystical quality and feels every bit as natural as DMT. MET, while similar to MPT, feels a bit hollow and synthetic in comparison. MPT has a rich, complex color palate and produces paisley patterns and grids and fractals. MET seems to emphasize primary colors, and the patterns I got from it were just squiggles. I really need to try a higher dose of MET before I can form an opinion of it, but my first impression of it is that it isn't as complex or deep as MPT. I like them both though.

What was your ROA and dose for MPT? I have some, but for some reason most of the reports of it seem pretty underwhelming.

 

[perpetualdawn]

Now I don't feel so weird. :D I haven't gotten into coffee much; I wonder how the effect differs from tea?

I find that the effects of green tea differs from black tea differs from coffee differs from mate differs from guarana, but can never figure out how that makes any sense since it's all supposed to be basically just caffeine (well mate and guarana have slightly different molecules maybe?). No wonder people find differences between LSD, ALD-52 and 1P-LSD.

I like coffee because it tastes good, makes me feel good, and is a highly functional stimulant with little to no negative consequences to the addiction. Same thing with tea of course, but milder, although many cups of tea can add up to something less than mild.

I used to be a purely tea drinker, then switched to coffee and haven't really looked back.

Before enlightenment,
Check mail, wash dishes.
After enlightenment,
Check mail, wash dishes.



An updated zen proverb.

lol Good one!

-derpetualpawn

 

[Solipsis]

Before enlightenment,
Check mail, wash dishes.
After enlightenment,
Check mail, wash dishes.



An updated zen proverb.
.

lol Good one!

-derpetualpawn

xD i lolled

 

[Img_9999]

-derpetualpawn

LOL, Loved the spoonerism (An English word I learned on the other social thread haha. Bluelight is so educative.).