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Opiate addiction - self-managed tapering

NJ2NYC2NJ

Bluelighter
Joined
Oct 18, 2008
Messages
235
I was a regular heroin smoker for about 5 years, up until about 6 months ago. Initially, I was using it only "recreationally," perhaps once a week or so. Slowly, however, the drug and I developed a pathologically intense relationship, and I eventually worked my way up to a bundle-a-day habit, which I maintained for the last two years of my habit. I could only juggle the duties and responsibilities as a friend, boyfriend and $100/day drug addict for so long, before I started to drop the ball.
Eventually, my drug use started to seriously interfere with virtually every aspect of my life and I decided that a radical reappraisal of my day-to-day routine was in order. Over the course of 2 months, I quit my job, broke up with my girlfriend, and started going to a methadone clinic. The methadone treatment worked well for me from the outset (60mg/day peak), and when the healthcare providers at the clinic asked me if I'd be interested in either a 6-month taper-down-to-nothing treatment (6MT) or the more indefinite open-ended maintenance treatment (MMT), I figured 6 months should give me enough time to reassemble my life and opted for the 6MT plan.
Fast-forward 6 months. The last two weeks of treatment were becoming increasingly difficult, having dipped from 10mg to 5mg and from 5mg down to 0mg... And I found myself suffering from anxiety and mild withdrawal, virtually around the clock. I eventually cracked and dug through various storage boxes in my closet before stumbling across the Jackpot box --- the box in which I kept all of the bundles I had bought and used over the last couple years, all wrapped up in rubber bands and stuffed in a plastic bag. I grabbed the box and took it back to my desk for a closer inspection. At my desk I opened up the box, a Converse sneaker box, and inside was the white shopping bag, filled with approximately 100 used bundles.
Open opening the bag I was greeted with a familiar smell that could only be created by thousands of invisibly miniscule specks of heroin dust floating up in my nose. This was formerly my bundle graveyard... While I was using, I would smoke my way through a bundle, then, re-stack and band it, and relegate it to the graveyard bag, to be kept for nostalgia or posterity (ha!) or whatever.... I never really thought of re-using the bags, I figured I had split them and "squeezed" every significant bit of powder out of each bag and that this was more or less about as much as one could do with these bags. However, in my current weakened state, and with no more methadone from the clinic, my temptations and anxieties were kicking in... And short of going out and trying to score a bundle (which was now impossible, as I had intentionally deleted the phone numbers of all of my former connects upon entering the methadone clinic), this was pretty much the "best" I could do towards alleviating the creeping panic and pain.
I started to un-band a bundle, and proceeded to re-open a bag... Analyzing the exceptionally thin layer of residue which lined each interior surface of the bag, trying to figure out what my best option would be for harvesting the remaining dust residue. Eventually I decided on using a straight razor blade to scrape the bag at an angle, thereby collecting the dust on the razor, which could then be transferred to a sheet of aluminum foil for it's ultimate date with my lungs. I repeated this process for the rest of the first bundle, and then again with 4 or 5 more bundles, before I had a relatively decent hit amassed atop the foil. I found a pen (pipe) and Bic lighter... And then, with virgin-like giddy apprehension, I took a hit.... And held it for over a minute before exhaling.
Within a few minutes, the anxiety and discomfort slowly washed away, with a slowly radiating warmth and fuzziness taking their place. It wasn't a monster high, but it was enough to completely satisfy whatever urge I'd been feeling leading up to the hit. Despite my satisfactory experience, I figured it could only get better with more and more bundles scraped... So, naturally, I continued scraping, piling and smoking... Until I had made my way through about 30 of the bundles, at which point I decided that I had had enough for the time being, and retired for the evening. The following day it was more of the same... Another 25 or 30 bundles scraped and piled and smoked, and another day passed by with a comfortable, warm veil of opiates mediating the paths between my neurons.
This lasted, of course, only 3 or 4 days before I had gone through each bundle, and I found myself again trying to come up with a new engineering solution to my high/sober dilemma. I soon figured out that instead of my usual "pen scrape," I would try using the steam escaping from a boiling tea kettle to "steam clean" the inside of my pen pipe, so as to collect the dark drops that emerged from the pen and boil them down over a foil sheet. I tried it, and it worked... The brown liquid soon boiled down to a brown layer of oils which would then burn off into the familiar dragon I had been chasing for so many years. But, naturally, this was something that could only be done once... And I soon thereafter found myself seemingly out of salvageable gear, and creative ideas.
Fast-forward 5 days. I've been going through a low-grade withdrawal for the last few days... And it's honestly been a lot better than some of my previous attempts at quitting heroin cold-turkey, albeit from much higher dosages. I don't have much of an appetite and have only eaten twice in the last 4 days. I can't sleep at night, and my days are usually spent in states that vacillate from anxious to short-tempered to downright despondent... But yet, I'm still here, and I think I've seen the worst of the withdrawal. It's now been over two weeks since my last methadone dose, and I'm pretty sure I'm over that withdrawal too, for the most part.
Opiate withdrawal can be harrowing ordeal... And I'm not sure there's any easy way around it. I'm considering going on suboxone in the near future, with the hope that I can continue with my slow taper schedule, slowly working my way down to the point at which I can cease taking opiates (and their kin) altogether. For some people, maintenance treatment is a great idea and works well for them. For me, however, I have a nagging suspicion that unless I can work this addiction through, and completely work my way through the taper-down schedule, I won't really have much of a chance at avoiding these sorts of drugs altogether.

(OK, this is where you offer you own personal experience... Or offer clever ideas as to how I might go about squeezing the invisible remaining dust from my bags... Or tell me I'm a self-indulgent asshole for developing such an addiction in the first place and then going on an internet forum to post about the whole experience to a bunch of people who've probably already heard a multitude of variations of the same story and don't care to hear about my own particular experiences.... Or whatever else)
 
(BTW... I was terribly tempted to post photos of some of the stamps... Just figured there'd be someone out there who might find it interesting to see what's been floating around NYC for the last year or two. Is that sort of thing generally frowned upon on this board?)
 
It seems to me like its make or break time for you. You need to weather the next several days of w/d (without heroin, mind you) and work on yourself psychologically to avoid relapsing into your addiction. Your train of thought shouldn't be framed around how to get more heroin residue off of your bundles, it should be how you can get and stay free from your addiction and move on with your life.
 
You're totally right, in every sense.

I'm just playing that ol' junkie game of "How Far Can I Stretch 'Logic' in an Attempt to Justify Succumbing to Temptations."

It's a cruel game... And yet I continue to string myself along.

"Make or break time" indeed.

I'll soon be making the money I was making before everything fell apart... And that'll be the big test for me, I think.... Whether or not I'll be able to resist it when I'm flush with cash and commuting in and out of Manhattan every day.

(In the meantime, however, I'm literally watching the seconds tick by on my deskclock as I struggle to maintain some semblence of composure... Digging up old threads relating to the "NYC using scene" and staring at JPEG's of bags. WTF kill me please)
 
well if you're smokin the dope in nyc, youre wasting a lot of it so tthings could be worse for you at least if you were sniffing it or shootin it. you can kick this shit just stay with it and stay away from it. hop on suboxone for a bit or get some for a few days or weeks from your buddies and some benzos and youll be fine.
 
You're right about the smoking.... I'd be IN A WORLD OF SH!T right now if instead of smoking I'd been banging for 5 or 6 years.

I'm thinking that if I really do manage to get my head straightened out, and if I can get on suboxone soon enough, I think I'll at least be able to keep myself off of street drugs for the time being.

I'd say I'd look into getting benzos, but I actually had a nasty spell about a year ago during which time I was mixing klonopin with dope (reeeally fvcking stupid, in retrospect), and I'm not sure I could trust myself with something so easily abused. (Though I'd be lying if I said the thought never crossed my mind)
 
DONT GET ON METHADONE unless you are planning the long term matinance subutex is a lot better imo for short term detox
 
completely agree..........

Methadone is a terrible option IMO. I used the suboxone taper and although it wasnt easy it was very doable if you want to get off the opiates. you can do like a 14 day taper starting with 4-8mg of suboxone dropping incrementally over the course of 2 weeks and you can kick this. have them give you something to help you sleep......remeron worked great for me. methadone is not a good road to travel unless you want to "maintain" your habit. suboxone can work magic if you let it and want it bad enough. you will slip up a couple times, if you are anything like me, but it will give you the chance to make the crucial decision as to whether or not you truly want to kick the opiates. its all up to you. give the suboxone taper a shot. it literally saved my life.
 
Buprenorphine (Subutex/Suboxone) is excellent. It can stabilise you within an hour and you can taper down to nothing in as little as a few weeks, or just stick with it if you choose. As it blocks other opiates, it means your rational mind gets a chance to think- hold on this bundle will be a massive waste of money and do nothing.

It seems certain that Methadone will be replaced by Bupe in the UK in the near future. Methadone just made a social problem worse.
 
I actually have a friend who has access to suboxone, and he has been nice enough to sell me a pill or two during those episodes when I tried to quit heroin cold turkey. The tablets were quite amazing in that they came on very steadily and slowly, and their effect could be felt for as long as 36 hours or so. And suboxone didn't provide any of the "positives" of stuff like heroin or methadone, such as any sort of "high" or "warmth" or whatever, so in my mind it seemed like suboxone would be a terribly difficult drug to abuse.

By the way, I wanted to thank everybody who contributed to this thread... You comments and contributions are very much appreciated. Especially with how I was feeling last night... I was ready to pull the hair out of my head, but this thread somehow made it easier for me to deal with the withdrawal I was experiencing.

Speaking of which, I'm feeling better today... I was able to have some coffee this morning, and the cold chill in my bones and anxiety have somewhat subsided. I think I'm starting to see the light at the end of this tunnel...
 
This anti-Methadone myth spreading is ridiculous.

A 3 week taper with Methadone is considered by medical authorities the world over to be the most effective medical solution to Heroin withdrawal.

Buprenorphine will not 'replace' Methadone anywhere, it is an alternative for those who are not suited for Methadone maintenance or taper. Abuse of Buprenorphine is up the world over, injection of Temgesic and Subutex is replacing Heroin in parts of the UK, Eastern Europe and Asia.

Maintenance, taper and withdrawal from Buprenorphine is not very different from that of Methadone. They are both potent Opioids with very long half-lives that take 2-4 weeks to get through acute withdrawal.

To the op, seek medical advice or assistance.

"No one can hit the skids faster than a self cured junkie"-WS Burroughs.
 
Good point... Even though I've managed to deal with these late-stage withdrawal symptoms fairly well, I think that an honest attempt at cleaning up will require some professional assistance and oversight.

I have yet to come across any Subutex in my area --- only Suboxone... And from what my friends have told me regarding their experiences with being prescribed buprenorphine, the overwhelming majority of doctors in my area will ONLY prescribe the naloxone-containing version of buprenorphine, Suboxone.... Which, for someone with an opioid tolerance, is a very difficult drug to abuse. (Or at least this is what the Wiki article on bupe' states, and it seems logical enough to me)
 
NJ2NYC2NJ said:
Good point... Even though I've managed to deal with these late-stage withdrawal symptoms fairly well, I think that an honest attempt at cleaning up will require some professional assistance and oversight.

I have yet to come across any Subutex in my area --- only Suboxone... And from what my friends have told me regarding their experiences with being prescribed buprenorphine, the overwhelming majority of doctors in my area will ONLY prescribe the naloxone-containing version of buprenorphine, Suboxone.... Which, for someone with an opioid tolerance, is a very difficult drug to abuse. (Or at least this is what the Wiki article on bupe' states, and it seems logical enough to me)

Abuse of Bupe by dependant and non-dependant/addicts and non-addicts is a factor. Combining Bupe with Benzodiazepines is probably the most common method. Injection of Subutex and Suboxone is more common than people think.

If you are almost through the acute withdrawal syndrome, why go on Buprenorphine? You would be better off going to a walk in clinic if you don't have insurance or your primary care doc if you do, and get a prescription for medications to deal with specific withdrawal symptoms that are really hard on you, and also medications to take in case of PAWS. My recommendation for post-acute withdrawal meds would be Clonidine (for pseudo-withdrawal, when you feel physical withdrawal symptoms long after you quit opioids), a Benzodiazepine (for post-WD anxiety and craving attacks whenever they come) and possibly a sleeping pill.
 
That's a pretty good point.... I honestly think I'm over the most serious withdrawal symptoms, and perhaps I might not need buprenorphine at all.

However, I am still experiencing other, more "mild" symptoms, the most troubling being persistent anxiety, restless sleep, lack of appetite and diarrhea. Those first two symptoms are unquestionably the most troubling for me, as one feeds into the other which then feeds back into the other, in a runaway train-like self-reinforcing cycle that makes things worse as time goes on.

I've been on Amytriptyline (generic Elavil), a tricyclic antidepressant, for the last 4 or 5 months, mostly to help me sleep at night and also to help fight depression (though I'm not sure it has had much of an effect on my depression -- but that's another discussion). While on methadone treatment, the Amytriptyline seemed to help me maintain healthy, restorative sleeping patterns, but I'm not sure how much of that effect could be directly attributed to the Amytriptyline because I'm sure the methadone played a large part in calming me down.

Last night, a friend of mine was kind enough to give me a Klonopin (clonazepam), to see if it'd help me fall asleep at a reasonable hour (as I've been having a very tough time falling asleep during the last 5 or 6 nights, and I've been waking up several times a night, which is completely uncharacteristic for me). I took my Amytriptyline at 9:30/21:30, drank a small glass of milk, went to bed and then placed the tablet of Klonopin under my tongue and let it dissolve. I was asleep within 30 minutes, and for the first time in nearly a week, I slept soundly through the night. I slept from about 10:00/22:00 to 04:00... While 6 hours might seem inadequate to most, this was somewhat of a breakthrough for me. I think I might seriously consider some sort of benzodiazepine treatment, just to relieve the general anxiety and restless sleep/insomnia. I'd consider something like Ambien (Zolpidem), but I'm not sure it'd help much with daytime anxiety. (Maybe I need both a benzo and a sleep aid? Or is this sort of mix dangerous?)

Again, a thank you to everyone for your help.
 
My best advice is this...get off this forum, and any other web page or reading material related to drugs. It will become a way for you to live vicariously. That will lead to more craving. That will lead to weakening of your willpower, and eventual collapse. Trust me, even though you may be "seeking advice" here at the moment, it will quickly go beyond that if it hasn't already. I can't express enough how bad this forum is for a recovering addict. Think about it...you don't need advice from these people...you already know exactly what you have to do. Now forget this part of your life as best you can and try to continue with your new one.
 
OverDriven said:
My best advice is this...get off this forum, and any other web page or reading material related to drugs. It will become a way for you to live vicariously. That will lead to more craving. That will lead to weakening of your willpower, and eventual collapse. Trust me, even though you may be "seeking advice" here at the moment, it will quickly go beyond that if it hasn't already. I can't express enough how bad this forum is for a recovering addict. Think about it...you don't need advice from these people...you already know exactly what you have to do. Now forget this part of your life as best you can and try to continue with your new one.
As much as I enjoy Blue Light, if I was trying to stop Heroin, I would avoid this forum. IMO you need to get medical help / advice. You almost have this thing licked -- don't fuck it up now.

I don't mean to sound like an asshole, but you are 6 months into this and a gnat's hair away from success. Pat yourself on the back and whip the monster's ass.

Good luck!
Will
 
My heroin use was a symptom, not a disease... It was the outgrowth of a more fundamental, underlying condition... Which, as far as I could tell, was most likely some sort of combination of chronic anxiety and depression.

Even if I manage to kick my opiate addiction, I'm only going to find myself back at square one, which was a nasty place where I was carrying these anxiety/depression issues and not knowing exactly what to do about it.

I totally understand your position and suggestion that I avoid BL altogether... I know where you're coming from and why this would seem like an obvious thing for me to do. However, this forum allows me to share my experience with others, in an anonymous, safe venue, and to exchange stories and suggestions with others who've been in my situation. Substance abuse/addiction can be an incredibly isolating experience, and the exchange of communication in BL's anonymous forums allows me to connect with others on a subject that isn't exactly the easiest thing to discuss with the other people in my life who may never have experienced anything even remotely similar to what I've been through.

Please don't think I'm trying to dismiss you... I just happen to believe that the cost-to-benefit ratio in this situation is favorable enough to justify continued discussion and solicitation of advice from others who might just have relevant experience/advice to share.

And again, thank you to everyone for your comments and contributions to this discussion.

(UPDATE: I think I'm almost completely free of opioid withdrawal symptoms... And it feels pretty damn good. Now only if I could stomp out this anxiety/depression... But I suppose that's going to be my ongoing battle for the foreseeable future.)
 
Another 4 days... And, strangely, the range of "symptoms" is pretty much the same, and they're pretty much just as severe, too. I was expecting it to be easier, somehow. Not sure why.

I reeeally don't want to go back onto methadone... And I'm not sure I want to spend the money to get on suboxone (though for the wrong reason... [here's the junkie in me trying to take over thinking duties]... It'd cost me $100 for an appointment with a doctor, and then $200 or $300 for the prescription... "And you know what I could do with $400 otherwise? etc").

What a pain in the ass. I suppose it could be much worse... But I just figured it'd be easier than this by now.
 
Go to a walk in clinic, this would be cheaper than a visit with a primary care doctor if you don't have insurance. Medicaid may even foot the bill, look into it.

You could be receiving treatment for the symptoms that remain without an opioid. Clonidine (Catapres tablets are cheap, the patches are very expensive w/o rx insurance), Diazepam (Valium) or Chlordiazepoxide (Librium) for anxiety, Ripinirole (Requip) or Quinine for RLS, Trazodone or Amitryptaline (Elavil) for insomnia, most of these drugs are cheap without insurance (except Requip). This might be a good time to try treating the depression as well with SSRI, SNRI, tricyclic, etc treatment. You have a lot of options besides Methadone or Buprenorphine.
 
It sounds like you want to use an opioid to treat your depression and anxiety. This may be valid but as you know, can cause trouble in the long term. If it's really what you want, maybe methadone maintenance is the answer. However, if you are trying to quit opioids, I would strongly suggest you DON'T go on them again. You've already quit and withdrawn. If you really want to use drugs, look at everything Tchort suggested as those are very good medications for your symptoms.

Some alternatives: inner meditation, vigorous exercise until you can barely pick up your arms, a very very long run, deep stretching, any type of work with the earth.

Most important is positive visualization and thinking. You have to believe with all of your heart that you will soon be a happy, highly functioning individual.
 
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