On the Demonisation of Methamphetamine on Bluelight

[Kaden_Nite]

Some of these posts are quite long, I'll try to summarise;

If you don't like meth, don't use it.

If you're using Bluelight as a place to bully or judge people because of their choice of drug, then you can fuck off.

This isn't the place for that.

 

[Xorkoth]

Well summarized, Kaden, thank you. I think that pretty much is the gist of the point. We can criticize drugs based on our opinions til the cows come home, but when it comes to attacking or belittling people, that's not what we're about.

Let's try to keep this thread on topic.

 

[deficiT]

I guess my next questions would be, do we have a confirmed case of someone feeling so belittled about their meth use on here that they don't feel comfortable sharing? If yes, then I think we definitely have some work to do in cultivated a more accepting atmosphere. But to me it seems any thread on here will have a multitude of viewpoints from every possible angle, and everyone's ideas seem to be represented equally for the most part.

Are we making a problem where there is none? Are people just taking it personally that their DOC gets criticized? Honest questions I think we should be asking ourselves as we talk about this topic.

 

[AlphaMethylPhenyl]

No, not usually, QED. I typically have to defend myself against assholish comments like the one above seeking to put me down in a sophomoric, unintelligent way, calling me “sweetie” for God knows what reason like a misogynist prick weirdo. What's your implication there when you call me "sweetie" and how is it okay for that to be a pejorative term? That was an idiotic thing to say there, Pumpkin, and I think you should read more before you spin out knee-jerk reactions.

1. No, you're projecting arbitrary rules here on the rest of the world. 2. And btw, this site is called a discussion forum. That was a particularly dishonest argument you attempted to make there. How lame.

Ah, but they do. I initially was responding a little more harshly, but I opted to just urge you to be patient instead of pointing out the hypocrisy of telling someone else to keep up when in fact you failed to keep up with the discussion, it seems, misinterpreting the point being made. I've read your posts before and had some admiration for your opinions, but, like many on here, you overreacted to my comments and spoke like absolute shit to me for no good reason. WTF is up with everyone's terrible attitude and hostile goddamn approach?

I think you should try your own advice there instead. Take a deep breath and you try focusing on yourself. I'm fine, and certainly don't need your reassurances, but I recognize your weird attempts to put me down out of misplaced fear.

No I was referring to the faulty logic presented in the referenced gun violence article; it wasn't a comment on your own logic, but I guess I wasn't clear enough there, so my bad you misinterpreted the message. Apologies if so on that point, but also if so, it should be obvious you're taking exception to the wrong shit.

Goddamn, people. Who else, huh? Who else wants to attempt to rain down their best tough guy shit talk on me? I will stand my ground and eviscerate every single weak-ass, sad, ignorant, and prejudiced argument every time.

@AlphaMethylPhenyl and btw, like I said, I already apologized to @mr peabody and I can show you the post: https://www.bluelight.org/xf/threads/on-the-demonisation-of-methamphetamine-on-bluelight.907071/page-3#post-15275821 I admit when I'm wrong. Can the rest of you say the same thing or are even site moderators guilty of having their heads so far up their asses they can't humble themselves one bit?

Struck a cord.

Someone so desperate to prove something. Maybe instead of attacking anyone at random, you should accept that you're not reliable anymore because of the grave that you yourself dug.

So you're here upset at everyone else because everyone else is wrong and you're right. Seen that before. How mature.

You can still bow out with some dignity. No one is making you into something that you haven't already assured.

If you're having issues, here's a tissue. Seriously, just bow out. We've had enough.

 

[unodelacosa]

I guess my next questions would be, do we have a confirmed case of someone feeling so belittled about their meth use on here that they don't feel comfortable sharing?

Yeah right here. I'm sorry to say it, but it's absolutely true. Honestly, in this thread alone I felt attacked, many times by site moderators and a couple of times by seemingly bigoted terminology, unless I missed something back there, but everyone got all quiet all of a sudden on the topic.

If yes, then I think we definitely have some work to do in cultivated a more accepting atmosphere.

Yes, no question.

But to me it seems any thread on here will have a multitude of viewpoints from every possible angle, and everyone's ideas seem to be represented equally for the most part.

Okay sooooooo, scrap the working on a more accepting atmosphere then? What are you saying?

Are we making a problem where there is none?

No, in my opinion there is a problem when I'm being attacked by two mods in a thread where I consistently contribute valuable content as evidenced by my posts-to-reactions ratio.

Are people just taking it personally that their DOC gets criticized?

No it's more like a really judgy, nasty, snarky attitude coming from people who either have little, or no, experience with a particular drug, or they really sucked at using that drug properly, typically.

Honest questions I think we should be asking ourselves as we talk about this topic.

Indeed.

 

[unodelacosa]

Struck a cord.

Someone so desperate to prove something. Maybe instead of attacking anyone at random,

It's not random. You and others are taking pot shots at me and I'm left to defend myself while site moderators gang up on me and say ignorant shit like these quotes I'm responding to in this very post.

you should accept that you're not reliable anymore because of the grave that you yourself dug.

Oh please, I'm not in any grave, don't be so dramatic. I'm verbally laying the smack down on all these crap arguments including the lame ones you're barfing out here in desperation.

So you're here upset at everyone else because everyone else is wrong and you're right.

It isn't "everyone"; just a select few like yourself who are site moderators and can't stand being proven wrong by a common Bluelighter. Try taking the chip off your shoulder next time and you'll see that I'm not upset at everyone, just the people who think they can talk to me like garbage and I won't respond to anything.

Seen that before. How mature.

What are you fucking rapping or something? And I just settled that issue above.

You can still bow out with some dignity.

Oh really? Gee thanks. Why don't you bow out and admit that I'm right and you are wrong? Go ahead while you can still do so with some dignity there, moderator.

No one is making you into something that you haven't already assured.

You don't speak for everyone.

If you're having issues, here's a tissue.

Are you seriously quoting Austin Powers to me? Weren't you just saying something about maturity back there?

Seriously, just bow out. We've had enough.

HowTF are you even a moderator? You are being an absolute asshole to me, and I've done nothing to offend you and nothing to deserve this shitty treatment. This is exactly what I was talking about, @deficiT. Do you see why I don't feel comfortable sharing on this site when I'm being talked to by site admins like this for no goddamn good reason? Is this kind of hostility what this site is all about, b/c that's the message I'm getting. You're WAY offbase and WAY outta line, @AlphaMethylPhenyl. Apologize, bow out, and you should honestly step down from being a site moderator for being so unprofessional and rude to a regular site contributor. Shame on you, bro. Shame on you.

 

[unodelacosa]

Goddamn I'm just destroying shit arguments right and left. It's gotta be getting embarrassing for some of you who just cannot seem to grasp what a logical argument is because you're too caught up on trying to talk shit to me. If you don't have anything nice to say, just don't say anything at all. But someone just keeps on coming at me with more struggling, dull-witted insults, knee-jerk reactions, and just pure outright goddamn brickwork. I'd laugh but the display is more pathetic than humorous.

Is it any wonder people are demonising drugs on a forum where such terrible displays from moderators are apparently quite common and of no offense to most people unless you're the one being talked down to? How disgraceful.

 

[Shady's Fox]

Well summarized, Kaden, thank you. I think that pretty much is the gist of the point. We can criticize drugs based on our opinions til the cows come home, but when it comes to attacking or belittling people, that's not what we're about.

Let's try to keep this thread on topic.

Indeed, kaden should learn the difference between bullying and constructive criticism.

 

[Xorkoth]

We do have a couple of moderators who are rather haughty against drug users. This is because of their own experiences in life. AlphaMethylPhenyl is not a site admin, he's a moderator of one of the recovery forums. I don't agree with his attitude but I urge you to not take it personally, that's his struggle, not yours. I don't see any other site staff attacking you. As for other users, I mean some people are going to think meth is terrible and some people are gonna be assholes. A lot of people know people who got their lives ruined by meth, or had their own lives ruined by meth, so it's understandable. It's a lot worse in real life, most people look down on meth users in real life. There's no need to get this upset about it. Just ignore them. If you use meth and you're good, then you know you're good and it doesn't matter what a few people say.

The way some people have responded in this thread does point to at least some attitudes of a few against users of particular drugs that I don't like on a drug harm reduction forum, and I'd ask for those people to stop trying to make other people feel bad about their drug of choice, since we're supposed to be a place for support. But is it a systemic problem on Bluelight? I'm not so sure about that. Most threads in BDD and OD are about meth these days and the vast majority of the time there is nothing going on in these threads besides answering questions and talking about meth. At least that's my perception, but I don't use meth (though I have), so maybe I'm just not sensitive to it. I'd be interested in a collection of links to recent attacks against posters for being meth users (besides in this thread because this thread has gone off the rails at this point).

 

[Shady's Fox]

Is it any wonder people are demonising drugs on a forum where such terrible displays from moderators are apparently quite common and of no offense to most people unless you're the one being talked down to? How disgraceful.

Welcome to the dystopia we live in, it's called hierarchy, the yin yang. The cancel culture it's actually a lot worse in multiplayer gaming industry, you would be surprised for e.g how admins behave on Counter:Strike servers, or how the managment of gaming platforms such as ''Origin, Ubisoft, Epic Games, Sony's Playstation Now and so on'' response to bug abusers or people who lost their accounts and maybe 1 outta 10 is someone who lost his account and he's only trying to gain back the control, but even with the right informations he might be in a wrong spot because one of the managment lost their doggie that day

 

[nznity]

I think all of that is very true and I often cringe at what over-amped and sleep-deprived stimulant users say and do on Bluelight. But I think you are painting all of them with the same brush based on the over-animated antics of a few. Not everyone makes a big to-do about what drug they are on and lots of amped people post politely and constructively on BL. As for the few who repeatedly lose the plot in public, the ones I can think of are actually poly-drug addicts with underlying psychiatric issues. We also have no shortage of assholes and fuckwits who post prolifically but have never tried meth and likely never will.

Which brings up the point that BL is not just for the tea and cucumber sandwiches twin set and pearls type of self-controlled drug abuser or recovered/ing addict. It’s not a site about sobriety, although it incorporates a lot of helpful stuff for people wanting to achieve or maintain sobriety. It’s supposed to be one of the few places people in the depths of addiction can find non-judgemental acceptance and, if asked for, advice on getting out of the trouble they are in. Personally, I found a great deal of value in my recovery by being able to be my authentic self here when I was high without needing to try and self-censor what I was going through. The support of other stimulant users, some of whom frequently manifest as being batshit crazy, ultimately enabled my own recovery.

I think it is serving the tweaked out, the despairing, and the temporarily insane where BL potentially makes a far greater contribution to the problems caused by drugs. We know there are negligible resources available to help stimulant abusers use safely and to recover or become sober even in the most developed and benevolent countries. You can find solutions to opiate constipation, discuss the impact of terroir on your buds, or go into battle with whatever ideological axe you have to grind in any number of places.

There has been a lot of discussion about the need for a dedicated stimulant forum to contain the kind of tweaky weirdness you find distasteful but the view seems to be that there is not enough of it or it is not worthy enough to warrant its own sub forum.

What a post mannn! So fing true much of the stuff you're pointing out. Reminds me of a guy in Paris on a binge shooting up blow an made an account with the first word he saw out of his window "workshop"=atelier hahahaha

 

[unodelacosa]

I don't see any other site staff attacking you.

There’s another moderator who had the good sense to fold up his argument like the cheap metal chair it always was once I pointed it out, to his credit.

Idk, I’m not into casting my proverbial pearls before swine. Lotta swine around here. You’re probably right that I shouldn’t take it personally, but I also don’t associate with swine just on GP. I have a lot of respect for a lot of the users on here, but when I get attacked by two separate mods on the same thread, it’s just not a cool feeling.

I’ll see you around, @Xorkoth

 

[Kaden_Nite]

Indeed, kaden should learn the difference between bullying and constructive criticism.

I'm going to have to direct you back to the aforementioned sentiment Shady

Fuck off

 

[deficiT]

Okay sooooooo, scrap the working on a more accepting atmosphere then? What are you saying?

Nooooo...

I'm merely saying that most threads have a wide variety of views represented and we're able to see most people share if they want.

I'm not trying to attack you, and I'm sorry if it feels that way. You said something I considered objectionable and I told you as much, I would think we've moved past it by now and I'm only speaking to the points.

I have extensive experience both using and recovering from methamphetamine. I consider myself qualified enough to speak on it, I've seen the damage the needle does and I speak to my experience. But my identity isn't so tied up into one substance that I take things said about it personally.

If you want an environment more conducive to discourse then you can't be combative and call people swine. I get it, you feel attacked and you're just responding, but it's a two way street ya know. It's something I think everyone could do a little work on.

 

[The Shadow Self]

As I have said before...if doing Fentanyl is like dancing with the devil, then smoking meth is like slaughtering a goat in the middle of a pentagram...metaphorically speaking, of course...

 

[negrogesic]

Seems like this is getting a bit out of hand. I think we've exhausted the issue really, and now its sort of devolving into personal attacks and bickering. Let's keep it clean and not personal.

 

[simstim]

As I have said before...if doing Fentanyl is like dancing with the devil, then smoking meth is like slaughtering a goat in the middle of a pentagram...metaphorically speaking, of course...

Me personally, I've been wanting to slaughter a lamb to celebrate passover for a couple of years now. I had this crazy idea about inviting my Jewish friends from school over and slaughtering a lamb for passover. I would really like to experience a legitimate Seder. I don't know how down my old friends would be for slaughtering a lamb at home though, lol. I suspect they buy lamb from the store at passover.

 

[unodelacosa]

Nooooo...

I'm merely saying that most threads have a wide variety of views represented and we're able to see most people share if they want.

I'm not trying to attack you, and I'm sorry if it feels that way. You said something I considered objectionable and I told you as much, I would think we've moved past it by now and I'm only speaking to the points.

No, I have no problems with you @deficiT. You spoke your mind; I considered it and deemed you were right, and I apologized to @mr peabody back on page 3 of this thread. That issue has been resolved already, yet two mods with shit attitudes, @AlphaMethylPhenyl and another I'm not going to name since he finally saw my point and backed the fuck up, were not so communicable and level-headed, instead they were ill-mannered sock puppets reacting in an unbecomingly aggro manner.

I have extensive experience both using and recovering from methamphetamine. I consider myself qualified enough to speak on it, I've seen the damage the needle does and I speak to my experience.

Yeah I just snort, vaporize, and dissolve my crystal meth in orange juice before downing it. I will occasionally IM something like Ketamine, but rarely have I ever IV'd a drug, which, to me, just isn't worth the risk generally when there are safer ways to attain a high, and I don't care for cheap, short rushes.

But my identity isn't so tied up into one substance that I take things said about it personally.

Nor do I and I really hope that's not what you think this is about for me. You see, I take personal insults personally when they come from a site's unprofessional mods, as in for instance when one of them called me "sweetie" and then meanwhile I've got @Mr. Krinkle with his homophobic slurs, and @Perforated, who I'm cool with, still says shit like:

I’ve taken a bite out of @unodelacosa before in another thread on another topic once before

Oddly put, but I will say that you were fair and polite about it and it encouraged me to feel a sense of respect from you, which is a hell of a lot more than I can say for others here.

for unnecessarily and insensitively hitting an obviously soft target between the eyes with both barrels in an argument. (Or maybe I wanted to but just reported him, forget)

You took the adult approach of directly addressing your problem with me in a mature manner. I respect that and am very glad you did that as opposed to simply “reporting me” without even speaking with me.

If you want an environment more conducive to discourse then you can't be combative and call people swine. I get it, you feel attacked and you're just responding, but it's a two way street ya know. It's something I think everyone could do a little work on.

I'm sorry, did I say swine? I meant pork byproduct, my bad.

And you're goddamn right I feel attacked when at least two members of the site mod staff are ganging up against me. I'm only human, and I stand by my words. I didn't say everyone here was swine. Most are not. But the ones who are—and you know who you are, they dramatically drag down the credibility of the site, the site's appeal to users old and new, and the fact that some of these punks are being made mods speaks quite poorly of the whole operation.

As I have said before...if doing Fentanyl is like dancing with the devil, then smoking meth is like slaughtering a goat in the middle of a pentagram...metaphorically speaking, of course...

EDIT: @The Shadow Self it occurs to me you might've been saying this tongue-in-cheek, in which case, I apologize for coming at you like that. I see it like: if fentanyl is dancing with the devil, meth is like being stereotyped by fallen angels, lost souls, and fugitive Hades escapees.

 

[negrogesic]

C'mon guys lets stay on topic or we're going to have to shut this thread down.

 

[Mr. Krinkle]

as in for instance when one of them called me "sweetie" and then meanwhile I've got @Mr. Krinkle with his homophobic slurs, and...