On oxy and pregnant, PLEASE HELP!!

[mike.vick]

^^^ I only read the title.

 

[buttershots21]

I just want to point out an option that hasn't been brought up yet, but I think should be. How about the chance for this baby to not be born addicted to any opiate at all? Depending on the state of the mother's addiction and the time she has left in the pregnancy, it is completely possible that she can do a slow and steady taper off of the oxy itself and not have to switch to methadone or subutex, both are meds that are many times more potent and longer acting, which means weeks or even months of weaning that newborn off of a drug that full grown adult addicts say is harder to come off of than even heroin or morphin. So I guess what mom needs to ask herself is does she have the will power to taper off using her drug of choice, and then staying off of it until the baby is born?? After that baby is born clean and not dependant on any drugs at all, then mom can choose which route she would like to go to stay clean herself, whether it be methadone, or subs, or maybe just drug free period. If the taper is slow enough, and she's under a doctors care, I think that would be the safest of all the options for her baby. Lets not also forget that in certain states, if a baby is born with drugs in it's system for any reason, CPS or whatever your version of child welfare will be called, mandatory by law. In my state, addicts are giving birth at home to drug addicted babies rather than lose them to the state by having them in hospital. Just another 10 steps backwards for womens prenatal care thanks to the wonderful war on drugs!

And for all the judgey judgers out there, just the fact that she is on here asking questions and seeking help should show you she does care about her baby.

 

[Lildevil428]

Buttershots21! Thank u for your taper advice! In the start of my post I had asked if tapering oxy slowly would be the best way to be completely clean before the baby comes! Right now I'm only dosing about 30-60 mg coming off of a 60-120 mg oxy habit and since I found out a week ago I was pregnant.

I don't want to put my baby in any more harm or distress then it needs to be. I have been taking the lowest amount as I can to maintain.

Tomorrow morning I will be consulting with different doctors to see what's best for the baby. My obgyn said it was better for me to switch to subutex or methadone as it's less harmful for the fetus.

My whole plan ISNT to switch from one drug to another my plan is to quit everything as safe and healthy as possible for my baby. As I have quit with suboxone on a 3-4 day detox from oxy before with minimal to no withdrawal symptoms so I know it can be done. I just want it to be done in a safe way.

 

[tacodude]

The suboxone doctor just wants you to try methadone as unlimited people can get into that program yet only a limited number of people can be on subs per doctor. I'd say try suboxone before methadone if you want to try it, but if you could get methadone dosed 2x daily rather than one time it would probably be the best answer. When your baby is born they will ween them off with morphine under intense observation so as long as you stay stable until you give birth your baby should be fine so really it doesn't matter if you use sub or methadone as long as it works to keep you stable.

 

[Lildevil428]

Just an update for anyone that's going through what I'm going through...

Went to the suboxone hospital Monday morning my intake took roughly about 3-4 hours to get my checked in.. The doctor refused to put me on subutex after being there all that time filling out paperwork and did all their lab work! They wanted me to get on methadone ( again if u read my threads I DONT I REPEAT DONT want to switch from one addicting drug to another I want to do a taper)

For those of you who don't know, by law pregnant women are NOT ALLOWED to be tapered off methadone and needs to be on it through their whole pregnancy.

I finally got an appointment with a doctor tomorrow that's wiling to do a taper method before the baby comes and is going to correspond with my Obgyn. After I start subs tomorrow I have an ultrasound on Friday to make sure everything is going ok and my switching to subutex isn't putting the baby in distress.

My plan is to only use the subutex for the oxycodone withdrawal, after the 4-5 days of the worst withdrawals I will not take the subutex depending on how my body feels . I WILL NOT allow my body to get addicted to these drugs.

 

[Prescottdave]

Keep us updated. I would be interested to know what your MAT doc suggests as far as a taper schedule using the buprenorphine during your pregnancy. Slow and steady if your worried about the wellbeing of your child. Wow thats crazy about the regulations not allowing pregnant moms to taper while on methadone. The clinics must really be adamant about not putting individuals through WD's during pregnancy. Looks like the Sub doc will be more willing to do a taper for your specific situation. If your only taking 40 mg of oxy I would imagine 8 mg of bupe could be way overkill and would be harder to stop. Just something to keep in mind. The idea of precipitated WD's while pregnant is straight up scary to think about. How long did the sub doc tell you to wait from your last oxy dose before being inducted onto bupe? In my opinion I would wait no less then 24 hours from your last dose of oxy before taking the bupe. Thankfully your doses are low so the transition should be smooth.

 

[BigG]

Just an update for anyone that's going through what I'm going through...

Went to the suboxone hospital Monday morning my intake took roughly about 3-4 hours to get my checked in.. The doctor refused to put me on subutex after being there all that time filling out paperwork and did all their lab work! They wanted me to get on methadone ( again if u read my threads I DONT I REPEAT DONT want to switch from one addicting drug to another I want to do a taper)

For those of you who don't know, by law pregnant women are NOT ALLOWED to be tapered off methadone and needs to be on it through their whole pregnancy.

I finally got an appointment with a doctor tomorrow that's wiling to do a taper method before the baby comes and is going to correspond with my Obgyn. After I start subs tomorrow I have an ultrasound on Friday to make sure everything is going ok and my switching to subutex isn't putting the baby in distress.

My plan is to only use the subutex for the oxycodone withdrawal, after the 4-5 days of the worst withdrawals I will not take the subutex depending on how my body feels . I WILL NOT allow my body to get addicted to these drugs.

Sweetheart take a breath...All will be good

Not sure if this has been said but if you were still on opiates when the baby was born then he /she would be born dependent and would need doses of oral morphine to taper him. This is usually titrated to the amount /frequency and type of the baby's crying. However since you plan to be off by the birth date this shouldn't be an issue.

All the best of British luck to you hun.....I'm rooting for you from the otherside of the pond.

 

[DeeDeeDrug]

Good for you lildevil! Being a responsible mom is first and foremost and you are doing just that!
Congratulations on your soon to be new addition and good luck!

 

[crzydiamond]

Just an update for anyone that's going through what I'm going through...

Went to the suboxone hospital Monday morning my intake took roughly about 3-4 hours to get my checked in.. The doctor refused to put me on subutex after being there all that time filling out paperwork and did all their lab work! They wanted me to get on methadone ( again if u read my threads I DONT I REPEAT DONT want to switch from one addicting drug to another I want to do a taper)

For those of you who don't know, by law pregnant women are NOT ALLOWED to be tapered off methadone and needs to be on it through their whole pregnancy.

I finally got an appointment with a doctor tomorrow that's wiling to do a taper method before the baby comes and is going to correspond with my Obgyn. After I start subs tomorrow I have an ultrasound on Friday to make sure everything is going ok and my switching to subutex isn't putting the baby in distress.

My plan is to only use the subutex for the oxycodone withdrawal, after the 4-5 days of the worst withdrawals I will not take the subutex depending on how my body feels . I WILL NOT allow my body to get addicted to these drugs.

There is a reason they don't allow tapers while pregnant (methadone clinic). It is FAR safer to taper a baby than a fetus. Tapering a baby can be done while monitored and done in a way to be painless to the child. With a fetus--not able to monitor as well, and not developed enough to where miscarriage isn't an option

Your intentions are good. But please--don't think of it as "getting on another addicting drug". Your body is already on one. Your opiate receptors don't know the difference between oxy and methadone. All they know is when they are empty they cry out (your wd) to be filled. So, hon, if it's safer for the baby to be maintained until birth then even though in your mind it would be better to taper when baby is in utero, I would go with the majority of doctors opinions here.

A "painless quick taper" while fine for you and done in past, may not be safe for your developing baby. Believe me I underStand your wish to have an opiate free child at birth. But the main concern is to have the child. Not to lose the child due to miscarriage from distress. So it kind of worries me to hear you say you only want to take subutex for the "worst 4-5 days of wd". Just because YOU can deal with the more mild wd days following doesn't mean it's safe for baby. I mean, doesn't it kind of set an alarm off in your mind that the standard is to NOT allow pregnant women to taper

(And yes I have read your posts, unlike the idiot who admits "uh I only read the title". To such idiots--silence is golden....I don't know what help they can possibly think they are providing. I try to give benefit of doubt and assume they are just f*cked up). But don't listen to these uneducated morons who tell you that you are doing something wrong and you have to taper immediately blah blah blah. That is not harm reduction.

I hope it goes well for you, just don't let your good intentions turn to harmful actions. Follow what the doctors say, even if you think you can be off sooner or don't need another week or whatever. Those doctors have dealt with many many cases of opiate dependent births. I have a friend (really) who went thru the methadone route. Child was healthy and perfect and easily painlessly weaned. So there are lots of ways to get there. What's encouraging is your spirit. And one other thing---don't forget to treat YOU and deal with what led you to your 2 yr addiction. It'll make a much healthier mommy

 

[Prescottdave]

There is a reason they don't allow tapers while pregnant (methadone clinic). It is FAR safer to taper a baby than a fetus. Tapering a baby can be done while monitored and done in a way to be painless to the child. With a fetus--not able to monitor as well, and not developed enough to where miscarriage isn't an option

Your intentions are good. But please--don't think of it as "getting on another addicting drug". Your body is already on one. Your opiate receptors don't know the difference between oxy and methadone. All they know is when they are empty they cry out (your wd) to be filled. So, hon, if it's safer for the baby to be maintained until birth then even though in your mind it would be better to taper when baby is in utero, I would go with the majority of doctors opinions here.

A "painless quick taper" while fine for you and done in past, may not be safe for your developing baby. Believe me I underStand your wish to have an opiate free child at birth. But the main concern is to have the child. Not to lose the child due to miscarriage from distress. So it kind of worries me to hear you say you only want to take subutex for the "worst 4-5 days of wd". Just because YOU can deal with the more mild wd days following doesn't mean it's safe for baby. I mean, doesn't it kind of set an alarm off in your mind that the standard is to NOT allow pregnant women to taper

(And yes I have read your posts, unlike the idiot who admits "uh I only read the title". To such idiots--silence is golden....I don't know what help they can possibly think they are providing. I try to give benefit of doubt and assume they are just f*cked up). But don't listen to these uneducated morons who tell you that you are doing something wrong and you have to taper immediately blah blah blah. That is not harm reduction.

I hope it goes well for you, just don't let your good intentions turn to harmful actions. Follow what the doctors say, even if you think you can be off sooner or don't need another week or whatever. Those doctors have dealt with many many cases of opiate dependent births. I have a friend (really) who went thru the methadone route. Child was healthy and perfect and easily painlessly weaned. So there are lots of ways to get there. What's encouraging is your spirit. And one other thing---don't forget to treat YOU and deal with what led you to your 2 yr addiction. It'll make a much healthier mommy

Exactly what I was thinking. I will second the above. A "quick taper" or even a slower taper is dangerous while pregnant.

 

[abadab]

my cousin is pregnant right now, she has been on methadone for pain for the last 15 years, she is still on it per doctor's orders. they will help the baby after he is born (it's a boy).

good luck.

 

[mazda01]

Just an update for anyone that's going through what I'm going through...

Went to the suboxone hospital Monday morning my intake took roughly about 3-4 hours to get my checked in.. The doctor refused to put me on subutex after being there all that time filling out paperwork and did all their lab work! They wanted me to get on methadone ( again if u read my threads I DONT I REPEAT DONT want to switch from one addicting drug to another I want to do a taper)

For those of you who don't know, by law pregnant women are NOT ALLOWED to be tapered off methadone and needs to be on it through their whole pregnancy.

I finally got an appointment with a doctor tomorrow that's wiling to do a taper method before the baby comes and is going to correspond with my Obgyn. After I start subs tomorrow I have an ultrasound on Friday to make sure everything is going ok and my switching to subutex isn't putting the baby in distress.

My plan is to only use the subutex for the oxycodone withdrawal, after the 4-5 days of the worst withdrawals I will not take the subutex depending on how my body feels . I WILL NOT allow my body to get addicted to these drugs.

im sort of confused, you first said that the doctor refused to put you on sub's but then later you say that you are going to get subs. Whatever you choose i'm glad you're working so closely with the doctors. Good luck

 

[My3sons]

I was thinking the same thing about the "I am not going to let my body get addicted." Comment. Too late for that, it already is. It doesn't matter what the opiate is the fact of the matter is your body is addicted to opiates. As long as those receptors are filled with an opiate you are fine. So it's already too late about not getting addicted. At this point choose the safest option for the baby. Stop getting hung up on the stigma of a baby addicted to opiates at birth thing. Understand that it has already happened and now all you can do is follow the advice of the specialist. Don't weed out all these Drs that say the same thing just to find one who says something different. If they all agree don't you believe that there's a reason why? You are going to do what you want my point is don't make a decision based on stigmas and worry about what everyone must think if you. Make the decision based on what's actually best for baby and not your pride. I am not judging you, I am on mmt and understand how people view us I just want you to understand that it's too late to avoid addiction bc its already happened.

 

[crzydiamond]

^ yes . This is what I was trying to say. The OP's (and in fact the baby's) opiate receptors are already dependent on a opiate. The brain doesn't discriminate based on "oh it's 'only' oxy" or "oh no it's methadone". It just needs the receptors filled. "Switching" doesn't make you any more or any less addicted if you stay at a comparable dose. And in fact, as the baby grows he takes up more of the opiate which usually means the doctor INCREASES the dose (temporarily til birth) not decreases it.

And I too encourage you not to get hung up on the stigma that opiate maintenance has, and do what's best for the child. If as the above poster says, most doctors tell you to follow one protocol, searching for the outlier who "is willing" to detox you may not be the best idea


I'm not sure if you're against methadone thinking the baby will have a long wd--but just for your knowledge , the baby is switched to morphine at biRth then weaned off the short acting opiate. Even more impressively, some babies show no signs of wd! (I always likened that to when you first use, sometimes it takes many months before you ever go through wd)


I know you have the baby's best interests at heart, I'm just trying to make sure you're looking at your situation objectively, not with preconceived ideas of what you think is best. Be open to what the doctors say, rather than so adamant about "getting addicted" to methadone or suboxone. As stated previously--and not being mean or judge mental--you already are physically addicted. Opiates have cross tolerance. It doesn't matter if you're addicted to oxy, heroin, or methadone. So please try not to think of "I don't want to get addicted to another drug". That's not how it works. You're not dependent on oxy and naive to other drugs like methadone. You are OPIATE dependent and you should really be on the opiate that is safest for the baby and can be monitored. Doctors prefer long lasting opiates like methadone as it keeps yours (and the baby's) levels consistent, not so up and down as it would be with oxy (which is so short acting)


Anyway, it's good that you are only using what you actually need as opposed to getting high, and it's great that you're right on making and getting yourself to all your appointments. I simply encourage you to have a bit more of an open mind.....and relax--your baby will be fine. Take care of YOU, baby is going to need you

 

[Lildevil428]

Prescottdave- and For those of you wondering! I've talked to several doctors and as long as I wait at least 12 hours from my last oxy dose or reach a score point of 24-26 on a COWS spread I should be able to take the subs without problem.

I've taken subs before (not being pregnant) and always been fine without problems. I'm not planning on taking 8mg (even if the sub doctors "suggest" I do) as I said before I've taken subs before and know how much I need to not go into withdrawals. Probably start off with a .05-1mg to start and see how I feel and then dose up from there.

 

[Lildevil428]

Thank u bigg! Everyone's prayers and blessings do really mean a lot.

 

[Lildevil428]

Crazydiamond thank u for being honest and ACTUALLY READING my posts! Lol I've talked to probably 5 doctors from the time of me being pregnant til now about my plan and taper most of them agree with the fact if I go a slow taper and is supervision through it all then I will have NO PROMBLEMS being sober and clean before the baby comes.

Doctor said whatever I feel the baby will feel so if everything goes well and my plan works as it should then my baby will NO WAY BE IN ANY DISTRESS from this . I have scheduled ultrasounds through out this whole taper with my obgyn to keep an eye on things and make sure the baby isn't in distress.

If ANY SIGNS of distress I will stay on the subutex dose as it until my body/mind is stable enough for me to reduce dosage at 25% every 4-5 days instead.

The hospital I go to says people don't recommend this is because of our brain receptors and it not being completely healed from taking drugs and the chances of relapsing is much much greater and that's why they keep people on subs or methadone. But she said it can be done! So my hopes are still there!

 

[Lildevil428]

For no me I really appreciate everyone's concerns and input it has really really helped me view a lot! I went to 4 doctors about this and all willing to do a tapering method for me and the baby! (Except for one who was strictly about me being on methadone through the whole pregnancy) I will be offline for a while to focuse on my recovery and my baby's health!


I don't care about people's judgement or perception on what I am and what I've done the past 2 years all I care about is my health and the well being of my unborn baby. I don't want my baby's first days to be "withdrawing" because of MY desicions. It unfair to it and it deserves so much more then that it's first breathe out of my womb.


I'll be back once in awhile to keep an update for everyone! Thank u for those who listened and care so much to write back and actually have an input of the situation!

 

[Lildevil428]

Update:

Just got back from the suboxone doctor/ psychiatrist! He wrote me a script for 30- 2mg of subutex. He answered a lot of my questions in case anyone is reading this and is in the same situation as I am.

Told me that as long as the baby isn't going to go into withdrawals I have NOTHING to worry about. Even if it was minor discomfort or little bit of withdrawals is ok.

Also told me if I took the subutex to detox from oxy and felt like I didn't need it anymore then it's great for the baby! Only reason it's not recommended is cause of my brain receptors for cravings and such but he said I have nothing to worry about as long as I don't go into withdrawals.

This doctor has been doing it for 35 years and I trust him very much! Hope this helps everyone who may be in the same situation as I am in!

 

[crzydiamond]

Good. I'm happy to hear you are under medical supervision for a subutex use/taper. I'm so glad you went and researched and didn't go and do your own suboxone taper like you talked about in the OP

It sounds like everything is working out for you. I wish you and your little one all the best. And remember --you have to keep yourself healthy. I know while this baby is inside you the temptation to use won't be as great. But make sure you get help to deal with whatever had you on your original habit so that you don't relapse down the road. You sound like you're in a good space, and you sound even through your posts like a weight is off your shoulders

People have a right to their opinions--but just remember you're being responsible and doing what you need to do for your child. I was so happy to see you got your subutex and you're headed in the right direction.

Do come back and post when you have your child!