• 🇳🇿 🇲🇲 🇯🇵 🇨🇳 🇦🇺 🇦🇶 🇮🇳
    Australian & Asian
    Drug Discussion


    Welcome Guest!
    Posting Rules Bluelight Rules
  • AADD Moderators: andyturbo

NEWS: The Age 15 Sep 03: Random driver drug tests are on the way (Latest guess Dec 1)

If you weighed up the accidents of people drivin' on speed or cannabis against those driving on .05, which you think'd be higher?
I agree that there should be a more common sense way to establish whether someone is fit to drive. But after your quote above, I just want to reiterate my point that it's not the people on 0.05% BAC who are the problem - 0.2% BAC on the other hand is a very different story. That's why 0.05% BAC is a legal level of impairment and 0.2% BAC ain't.

Consider for a moment though, how much of the drug effects of alcohol you can actually feel at 0.05%. Would you take alcohol as a recreational drug if that's all you got from it (obviously some people more than others)? Now compare that to being nicely recreationally liquored up... it's a world of difference between a legal limit for driving and a recreational DOSE. Flip this to speed or cannabis, and imagine what a similar weak-effect feeling a 'legal limit dose' would equate to... a bump of speed maybe or a few puffs on a joint. Definitely below a recreational dose, and probably just above 'threshold'.

BigTrancer :)
 
so basically the only things this reader cant pick up are non - amphetamine drugs and weed - leaving GHB and ketamine open for use?

and does anyone know when the enforcements will start. Ive heard the Feb 01 2004, ive heard there using them and ive heard they're pre-using them. Im goin to a bushdoof or two in the near future and its a big concern :(
 
Drivers to face drug tests

By Andrew Gregory



DRUG-affected drivers will be subjected to roadside tests and face tough penalties under a major change to road safety laws announced by the State Government yesterday.

Police will conduct vision tests for signs of prescription and illegal drugs when a new offence - driving while impaired by a drug - is introduced next year.

Officers are being trained to test for nystagmus - an involuntary movement of the eye which can indicate recent drug use.

The legislation is yet to be drafted but penalties for drug-driving will be the same as for drink driving.

Penalties for driving under the influence of alcohol range from a minimum $250 fine and possible three-month licence suspension to 18 months jail, a $5000 fine and lifetime driving ban for serious repeat offenders.

Police Minister Michelle Roberts said research had shown that almost 10 per cent of deaths on WA roads involved prescription or illegal drugs.

Mrs Roberts said Cabinet had approved the drafting of amendments to the WA Road Safety Act, which will be introduced to Parliament next year.

The legislation will make it easier for police to test for drugs using saliva-testing machines like those on trial in Victoria.

The State Government also released its five-year road safety strategy called Arriving Safely.

Road Safety Council chairman Grant Dorrington said reducing WA's road toll would depend on the whole community.

The strategy canvasses ways to combat the four main causes of accidents - excessive speed, alcohol, not wearing seat-belts and fatigue.

It said the effect of drug use on a driver's performance was hard to measure.

The strategy also warned that as the number of older people rose, the problem of road trauma involving them also would rise.

From today’s West Australian. WA Drivers as of next year will face a simple eye test to determine being under the influence or not. 8)
 
As far as i am concerned, I think its a great idea............I know that i would be more than pissed off to find my best mate or a family member had been killed by some irresponsible brat who was out for a good time.


If the powers to be however are using this as a method to try and curb drug use............which is all it will be if they do not have a safe level of intoxication, then I am completely against it.

Of course the problem is how do you distinguish between them?

To be fair dinkum they need to do some testing on levels of presence of the various drugs in a persons saliva ie......parts per million and do a graph on it over a period of hours..........finally determining what is an acceptable level.

Now this is obviously going to take a hell of a lot of testing and involve a subject having to take many thousands of doses etc etc.

So I have decided to put my hand up and do the right thing by our great nation..............I will be the person they can do all there testing on......Its time to take one for the team.
 
^^ LOL, i think that i will join you MazDan and help them with the testing process. ;)

The strategy canvasses ways to combat the four main causes of accidents - excessive speed, alcohol, not wearing seat-belts and fatigue.

How does not wearing seat-belts cause accidents?
 
Paca: I think we could safely interpret "accidents" = "fatalities" in the above context. Three of those four factors increase the probability of having an accident, but all of them are implicated in increasing the probability of the accident being fatal.

BigTrancer :)
 
i asked this before in another threat but i cant remember which 1 but do these spit tester pick up on ecstacy?
 
^^ Ecstasy is a type of amphetamine, 3,4-methylenedioxy-n-methylamphetamine. So the answer is yes, i would think it would be deteted. In the proposal to Victorian parliment it only mentions methamphetamine and THC, however I don't see why they would test for methamphetamine and not MDxx also.
 
I would think you are correct Cowboy Mac, although from looking at commonly available immunolabeling antibodies, the ones which will pickup MDMA seem to require storage at -20 degC.

While it's quite possible other proprietary compounds may be employed in the test, it's also possible that the -20 deg compounds may be stabalised in a formulation applied to the swabs. When I can get a complete picture, full details will be posted.

By contrast, a considerable variety of immuno based compounds/ mixtures are offered as sensitive meth/amphetamine indicators. Most of these are claimed to be stable at room temps, some up to 40 degC or more.
 
The compounds may degrade slowly over time, so although a rating may state store @ < 25degC, the actual antibody may in fact be relatively stable at 40degC for several hours. Of course several other factors may come into play, particularly pH of the environment. Phosphate buffers are generally used with saliva based immuno tests.

From Saliva Screen

STORAGE
ulti med SalivaScreen must be kept in a refrigerator or stored at room temperature (2 – 30 oC / 36 – 86 oF) in its
protective foil wrapper. The maximum shelf life is indicated by the use-by date printed on the wrapper.

I would imagine the inconvenience of having to employ even normal refrigeration would deter police from using such a system, but perhaps not.

This update from MAPS (2002) indicates the effectiveness and otherwise of Drug Wipe when used with Drugread (photometer) for the detection of MDMA in saliva. Drug wipe uses a formed gold/antibody/drug or metabolite complex to indicate presence of MDMA (as an amphetamine).


From
Technical Briefs



On-Site Testing of 3,4-Methylenedioxymethamphetamine
(Ecstasy) in Saliva with Drugwipe and Drugread:
A Controlled Study in Recreational Users, Simona Pichini,1,2
Mo`nica Navarro,2 Magý´ Farre´,2,3 Jordi Ortun˜o,2 Pere Nolasc
Roset,2 Roberta Pacifici,1 Piergiorgio Zuccaro,1 Jordi Segura,2,4
and Rafael de la Torre2,4* 1 Clinical Biochemistry Department,
Istituto Superiore di Sanita`, 00161 Rome, Italy;

Saliva is an alternative biologic specimen for drugs-ofabuse testing with several advantages over conventional matrices such as blood and urine (1, 2), e.g., weak bases tend to concentrate in saliva because its pH is usually more acidic than the pH of plasma. The most important advantage of saliva is the ease of sample collection. Specimens can be obtained in a matter of minutes under direct observation and without embarrassment to the donor. Special devices have recently been introduced that allow analysis of saliva at the site of specimen collection for on-site screening tests. Commercially available on-site devices include two multitest electronic readers, the Cozart Rapidscan® (Abingdon) and the Avitar OralScreen® (Avitar Inc.), and one single-test visual device, the Drugwipe® (Securetec). Drugwipe is the only on-site test on saliva for which results of clinical studies have been published (3, 4). Briefly, Drugwipe is an immunochromatographic test strip, based on the Frontline urine test strip from Boehringer Mannheim (F. Hoffmann- La Roche) (5 ). A pink color in the test window indicates the presence of the analyte to which the test is specifically addressed, and different devices are needed for detection of each class of drugs of abuse. Although Drugwipe was designed to be read visually, evaluation of color intensity may be highly subjective, and easy readout of the resulting coloration may be hindered by poor light conditions. For this reason, a Drugread® hand photometer has recently been developed. Drugread measures, in a reflectometric mode through a photodiode, the absorbance of the monochromatic light produced by gold antibody conjugates in the read-out area of the Drugwipe. Drugread translates the color intensity in the read-out window into a numeric value (arbitrary units) in the range of 300-2500. To date, no definitive threshold has been established for differentiating samples containing an analyte under investigation from samples not containing the substance....

Several cases of acute intoxication leading to death have been reported, and law enforcement agencies are increasingly interested in roadside on site testing of potentially intoxicated drivers (4 ). We evaluated the suitability of saliva testing of MDMA with the Drugwipe “amphetamines” and Drugread in individuals administered a single oral dose of 100 mg of MDMA....



...On the basis of observations made in the present study, we recommend that direct wiping be avoided, preferring application of an established volume of saliva that could allow delivery of a sufficient quantity to the test pad, which can be easily done “on site” by collecting saliva and applying it to the test pad. In the future, manufacturers of Drugwipe may want to standardize batch-to-batch devices to preselected concentrations for amphetamine-related drugs, taking into account the differences in doses and routes of administration currently in use as well as the time window to be covered by the analytic device in relation to peak effects of the drug. In fact, although a limited number of individuals participated in this study,the present results show that the Drugwipe in combination with the Drugread adequately detected MDMA in saliva in the first 6 h after administration.

On the other hand, the analytic device gives a negative response in a range of salivary concentrations down to 450 g/L (0.9 ng of MDMA in 2 L of saliva applied to the test pad). These concentrations can be found in individuals 6–10 h after the administration of 100 mg of MDMA, corresponding to a mean range of 80–120 g/L in plasma and 3–12 mg/L in urine (10, 11). Conversely, the 0–6 h time window is the period of maximal pharmacologic effects of MDMA. In this time interval, an individual is at highest risk of psychomotor impairment that may have consequences in some demanding tasks, such as driving. Six hours after MDMA ingestion, although the drug is still present in several biologic fluids, most subjective and physiologic effects (i.e., cardiovascular function) return to basal conditions (10 ). Hence, if the objective of on-site saliva testing is not only to detect the consumption of a given drug but also to determine whether an individual is under the effects of the drug, on-site saliva testing with the Drugwipe coupled with the Drugread fits that purpose. Ultimately, appropriate confirmation with a reference chromatographic method for saliva samples should be performed.

There could well be some updates since this report, as the above differs considerably from conclusions drawn in the report of 2000-2001 from the same research team. For your comparison

Usefulness of Saliva for Measurement of 3,4-Methylenedioxymethamphetamine and Its Metabolites: Correlation with Plasma Drug Concentrations and Effect of Salivary pH
 
Hey everyone, this is all from memory, but since I trust my memory... well, it's all out there in the scientific literature if you want to hunt for it!

Firstly, the tests are generally fairly accurate and sensitive, being able to detect low concentrations up to days after use. Generally they're about 99% accurate, although for certain opiates it can be 85-95%, and for some benzos/barbiturates it can be as low as 75% (depending on which test kit you use).

The test kits are generally good for 5 classes of drugs - amphetamines, benzos/barbiturates, opiates, cocaine and ecstasy (yes, I know that ecstasy is an amphetamine, but they class it separately because it sounds better if they say they can detect the evil and disgusting drug ecstasy!). They have problems using this method to detect THC, as it isn't water soluble - thus all they can detect is residue from smoking it, which will only be around for a short time (and I'm fairly sure the only thing that would be acheived by testing this way would be to increase sales of mouthwash!).

The little testing machine costs about $1,500, while the reagents for each test are around $21-28. This makes it reasonably expensive. In addition, there are a range of tests out there, but it seems that accuracy and ease of use have to be traded off against one another... thus the more accurate tests are more likely to give ambiguous results, but the ones that give easy-to-read results are less accurate (go figure). In addition, most of the tests DO detect OTC and prescription medicines, including (of course) codeine, methadone and morphine, but also pseudoephedrine (cold tablets), ritalin, and you can even test positive for opiates if you (wait for it...) ate a bread roll with poppy seeds on it for lunch!! Shows how sensitive the tests are, but also points out some issues (lol - is that red nose caused by a cold, or have you really been snorting drugs?!)

The thing with the figures that "X% of drivers involved in an accident are on drugs other than alcohol" is that, if memory serves, a high percentage of that percentage (you may have to think about that for a moment...) were also under the influence of alcohol - so it is, yet again, the fallacy of blaming the effects of a combination on one of the components.

One thing I was wondering if someone could tell me, is it Australian law that once you consume it, the drug is no longer in your posession, and so you can't be arrested for it? I know some places introduced this law so that users could seek medical help in the case of an overdose without being prosecuted, but I'm not sure if Australia was one of those places... if so, then at least they couldn't nab you for the use itself, and it would also be a precedent for setting "non-criminal" limits, if you will (since "legal" limits would, as has been said, implicitly condone use). And if it isn't law, then it bloody well should be!!

Anyway, I think that's covered everything I wanted to say... cya!
 
In the Ravesafe newsletter I just got in my email, it said that these tests will detect marijuana for up to three hours and amphetamine for up to eight hours after consumption.

Anyone (including Ravesafe) know where these numbers come from?

From the newsletter:
Under the legislation, drivers will have to provide a saliva sample by sucking or chewing on a disposable test cartridge. People who have used cannabis in the past three hours and people who have used amphetamines in the previous eight hours are expected to fail the test.
 
Just a thought, but as these immuno based tests rely on the secretion of glycoproteins & non-protein bound amines, by salivary glands via vesicle transport in merocrine cells (exocytosis), then it should be a fairly easy thing to both reduce secretion in the mouth while destroying any prevailing metabolites.

Any thoughts anyone? What about a suitably buffered alkali / benzyl alcohol mouth rinse with a high pH stable, short acting alpha agonist to cause vascular constriction in the saliva ducts?. The ganglions affecting saliva glands - I think the submandibular is mainly involved - could be targeted with drugs that currently exist, as could many areas involved in secretion. Perhaps such a mixture will be packaged as a personal breath freshener spray?

Besides banning such products instantly, I wonder if authorities would be quite so ready to install the current devices if their "failsafe" level was put to the test. Whether its done by the punters or the professionals, someone will discover an exploitable way round them I'm sure....

...which will effectively place the tests (when used in roadside saliva testing applications) in the same potentially fallible category as Ecstasy test kits in their current applications.

Perhaps I'm wrong but considering the quoted 8 or even 24-48 hour windows, there seems like enormous room for reducing amphetamine metabolites (occasional use) in saliva to quite a reasonable time-frame. Acidifying urine will aid in hastening elimination, but the practice will no doubt also pose health risks for those who push it.

In accordance with the compartmental model of drug distribution and elimination, acidifying urine causes a markedly sharp drop in metabolites in saliva/plasma, as more goes "out the door" when passing through the kidneys. Uncharged primary, secondary, and some tertiary amines represent much of the amphetamine MDMA etc while it's in-vivo. Uncharged compounds get reabsorbed through the convoluted tubules of the kidney back into the blood stream (and saliva). So there's nothing like a bit of protonation to charge up and "piss off" any neutral (slightly basic) amines and their conjugates.
 
Last edited:
I haven't heard any further news on driver tests, but caught a report the other day about plans to launch a driver education campaign about the dangers of driving under the influence of drugs.

Missed the start of the report so not sure whos running it, or the timeframe, but sounds like a good idea to me.

Anyone heard anything more on the testing?!?
 
World-first saliva tests aim to lick drug-driving
By Michael Davis
May 28, 2004

IN a world first, Victorian police will start using saliva swabs to randomly test drivers for drugs.

Inspector Martin Boorman, head of Victoria Police's traffic and alcohol section, said the random drug testing would begin in a matter of weeks "as soon as possible after the tender for the technology to test drivers is finalised".

Police will test drivers for traces of cannabis and methamphetamine, known as "speed" and used by long-haul road transport drivers to stop them falling asleep at the wheel.

Methamphetamine is also sold in crudely cut street mixes of party drugs such as ecstasy. It stays in the system for up to eight hours.

The saliva swabs will also detect THC - the active metabolite in cannabis - which stays in the system for up to three hours after use.

The Victoria Police policy will be zero tolerance on both drugs.

"Research has shown both these drugs significantly reduce a driver's psycho-motor skills," Inspector Boorman said.

He said other police forces around the nation would be "watching pretty closely" to see how the Victorian initiative worked.

"It's also a world first in that it's a random test. That's the significant difference," he said.

Other countries already drug-test drivers but can only do so if they have come under "reasonable suspicion", Inspector Boorman said. The saliva test will take a little longer than the breath test drivers undergo for alcohol. It may be done at the same time or independently of breath testing.

Police have for some time sought powers to randomly drug-test drivers. The Bracks Government passed the legislation last December, to be enacted from July 1.

A 10-year study by professor Olaf Drummer, head of the Victorian Institute of Forensic Medicine, has shown 20 to 26 per cent of drivers who died in accidents on roads in NSW, Victoria and Western Australia were affected by drugs.

"In the last three years there has been a significant climb in the (drug- affected) total in Victoria," Inspector Boorman said.

VIFM figures for 2001 show 22 per cent of Victorian fatalities were caused by drivers being under the influence of alcohol compared to 29 per cent who were drug-affected. Last year the figures rose to 27 per cent and 31 per cent respectively.

"Drugs and driving are becoming a real problem on the road, reflecting the increased use of drugs over the last 10 years," he said. "We're seeing more and more drug-related road trauma."

Police say there will be no need for blood samples to be taken from drivers affected by drugs unless - as is the case with alcohol breath testing - there is some reason a saliva swab cannot be provided.

The Bracks Government has fully funded the random drug tests on a 12-month trial basis.

From The Australian

They say zero tolerance but at the same time say; eight hours for meth and three hours for THC... huh?

This is on the front page/news section of BL if you haven't seen it. Wonder why it's only in The Australian and not Age and Herald-Sun too... maybe tomorrow.

Looks like July the 1st it will be upon us.

:(
 
Top