NEWS : 16/7/10 - Three die of heroin overdoses in Perth

[puckboy]

West Australian police fear a lethal batch of heroin may have hit Perth's streets after three fatal drug overdoses were reported within 24 hours.

Since 4pm (WST) on Thursday, three men have died due to heroin overdoses, including a 54-year-old businessman who was found dead at his West Perth office, police said.

A 40-year-old was found dead on a freeway overpass in the Perth CBD at about 9pm, while a 31-year-old overdosed in his home at about 10am (WST) on Friday in the northeast Perth suburb of Ashfield.

Police are carrying out toxicology tests as part of the post mortems to determine whether the deaths resulted from a bad batch of heroin cut with other substances to bulk up the quantity, Detective Inspector Alan Morton said.

The heroin could also have been of a much higher purity than usual, he said.

Det Insp Morton said the men did not know each other, and each death was a separate case.

Drug users should be cautioned, he said.

"There's nothing significant about the three of these that set it apart from any other heroin users, so if drug users are thinking they can outsmart or use safely, they can think again," he said on Friday.

"They are playing Russian roulette with their lives."

Det Insp Morton said there was nothing to suggest an increase in heroin use or a spike in the amount of the opiate hitting Perth streets.

Last year police attended 30 suspected deaths due to drug overdoses.

So far this year police have attended 15 deaths.

Eric Dillon from the Drug and Alcohol Office said many users had no idea what was in the heroin they were buying, and the deaths overnight highlighted just how deadly the drug was.

"The reality is that people just don't know what they are getting," he said.

"If people do get into difficulty, they should call an ambulance without delay."

http://au.news.yahoo.com/thewest/a/-/national/7596653/three-die-of-heroin-overdoses-in-perth/

Very sad and most likely preventable deaths. Be careful and stay safe.

 

[drug_mentor]

That sucks, always sorry to hear about people dropping.

I wonder if it is just really strong heroin or possibly adulterated with something like fentanyl. Hopefully when they figure it out they will let the public know.

 

[psytaco]

I don't use heroin nor no many users.

but is it common to have another person there to just watch over you if your taking a decent sized hit?

I feel that these deaths could have been avoided if an ambulance was called quickly.

 

[drug_mentor]

^ I think the likelihood of supervision while injecting probably decreases as the user gets more experienced/comfortable with their injecting. IMO it is pretty logical to think that a regular user is more likely to suffer an overdose death because as they use more heroin they increase likelihood of encountering an overly potent or otherwise adulterated batch, so it is sort of a double whammy when they are more likely to encounter strong stuff and less likely to use when supervised. An addict in particular is likely to inject alone frequently, both out of impatience to relieve withdrawals and a likely desire to keep their habit hidden from their peers.

I would guess at the very least the 54 year old business man was an addict, using in his office and all. He probably didn't want to risk asking a co worker to supervise him IV'ing. The guy using on a freeway overpass was also likely an addict imho, obviously the guy at home could go either way. This is clearly nothing but speculation, but I would wager that the first two, if not all of them were addicts or atleast quite regular users.

It is likely that some, if not all, of these deaths could have been avoided if an ambulance was called immediately but unfortunately it appears this was not the case. In my opinion, the only 3 ways to have a significant impact on reducing heroin overdose deaths are supervised injecting rooms like the one in kings cross, making narcan available to the general public so they can reverse overdoses and supplying heroin addicts (or preferably anyone interested in it) with heroin of known purity.

 

[psytaco]

^ I think the likelihood of supervision while injecting probably decreases as the user gets more experienced/comfortable with their injecting. IMO it is pretty logical to think that a regular user is more likely to suffer an overdose death because as they use more heroin they increase likelihood of encountering an overly potent or otherwise adulterated batch, so it is sort of a double whammy when they are more likely to encounter strong stuff and less likely to use when supervised. An addict in particular is likely to inject alone frequently, both out of impatience to relieve withdrawals and a likely desire to keep their habit hidden from their peers.

I would guess at the very least the 54 year old business man was an addict, using in his office and all. He probably didn't want to risk asking a co worker to supervise him IV'ing. The guy using on a freeway overpass was also likely an addict imho, obviously the guy at home could go either way. This is clearly nothing but speculation, but I would wager that the first two, if not all of them were addicts or atleast quite regular users.

It is likely that some, if not all, of these deaths could have been avoided if an ambulance was called immediately but unfortunately it appears this was not the case. In my opinion, the only 3 ways to have a significant impact on reducing heroin overdose deaths are supervised injecting rooms like the one in kings cross, making narcan available to the general public so they can reverse overdoses and supplying heroin addicts (or preferably anyone interested in it) with heroin of known purity.

Good answer

Yeah, supervised injecting facilities could of potentially saved these guys lives (although that is just speculation). The idea of Narcan is interesting. if you do suffer an overdose on heroin, how long does it take before you are unconscious? Or can you generally feel it coming on and react fast enough to administer Narcan.

Out of interest, for those who have experienced an overdose on opiates. Whats it like? Is it painful? or do you just lose consciousness quickly?

Ideally we could get pure heroin on prescription, but I think the first two are much more likely to happen.

 

[Mr Blonde]

^ It was quickly for me... I just closed my eyes and then BANG! Gone.

 

[Crankinit]

^ It was quickly for me... I just closed my eyes and then BANG! Gone.

Likewise. Went from 'hey I'm not feeling mu.... oh shit wait here it is...' and next thing I know I wake up a few hours later with my head on the desk.

Fucking fentanyl :/ Luckily I took the patch out of my mouth first.

 

[puckboy]

^
That must have been a scary experience for you both Mr Blonde and Crankinit. Thankfully you're both still with us.

Regarding the topic, IMO it was just an unusually high purity batch of heroin compared to the norm and/or was laced with another more potent opiate like fentanyl as d_m suggested. All problems that are created through prohibition

A good friend of my dad was actually a close work colleague of the 54 year old lawyer who overdosed in his office. From all accounts no one (at his workplace) was aware of his addiction, his family/wife may have been aware though. But it goes to show, there are functional addicts throughout society and when something like this (completely accidental and avoidable) occurs it is truly tragic.

If you use H in Perth currently, take extreme caution as I'd hazard a guess that this batch would still be in circulation.

 

[L3inad]

If you use H in Perth currently, take extreme caution as I'd hazard a guess that this batch would still be in circulation.

Well I'd like to think that anyone in perth who suspects they may have a potentially contaminated batch would flush it just for peice of mind, but with a fair chunk of its user base rellying on the chemical just to stay healthy, you can bet thats not going to happen.

Very sad and totally avoidable situation, but I'd take a guess and say that said batch would still indeed be around and more people could suffer. There really needs to be some sort of early waring system for this type of thing.

If there was a mailing list that users could add themselves to in order to be notified of any potentially lethal batches (of any drug) as it hits the streets then that could save many lives imho. I'd like to think that anyone with a modicum of self respect would be all for such a system.

I also cant see any ethical implications for something like this, but who would manage it?

 

[drug_mentor]

^ Ofcourse nobodies going to turf their shit out dude, in an ideal world it would be legal and we wouldn't have this problem and if we somehow still ended up with contaminated drugs there would be a recall.

There isn't anything at this stage to suggest this heroin was likely adulterated with more potent opioids as opposed to the more likely scenario the gear was just stronger than the deceased were used to. Even if it was confirmed there was an undetermined amount of heroin which was adulterated with fentanyl or whatever, on what grounds would one be suspicious their product had been contaminated? Obviously discounting the obvious that they knew their source was the same as one of the victims or something like that.

I obviously echo puckboys remarks that heroin users in WA ought to exercise extreme caution when using at the minute, but given the most likely scenario here is the deceased were given better drugs for their money it is hardly logical for people to start flushing their shit. People should always use a tiny amount when testing a new batch to determine purity, but IMO it is nothing short of retarded to pay what we pay for drugs in this country then throw them away because they are BETTER than usual.

The mailing list idea is a good one, however it seems a lot less manageable than just publishing the findings of contaminated drugs on a website or something that people can check at will. I think overall that would be better because many may fear signing up to a Government mailing list about contaminated drugs would have them blacklisted as a drug user.

 

[L3inad]

^ Ofcourse nobodies going to turf their shit out dude, in an ideal world it would be legal and we wouldn't have this problem and if we somehow still ended up with contaminated drugs there would be a recall.

There isn't anything at this stage to suggest this heroin was likely adulterated with more potent opioids as opposed to the more likely scenario the gear was just stronger than the deceased were used to. Even if it was confirmed there was an undetermined amount of heroin which was adulterated with fentanyl or whatever, on what grounds would one be suspicious their product had been contaminated? Obviously discounting the obvious that they knew their source was the same as one of the victims or something like that.

I obviously echo puckboys remarks that heroin users in WA ought to exercise extreme caution when using at the minute, but given the most likely scenario here is the deceased were given better drugs for their money it is hardly logical for people to start flushing their shit. People should always use a tiny amount when testing a new batch to determine purity, but IMO it is nothing short of retarded to pay what we pay for drugs in this country then throw them away because they are BETTER than usual.

The mailing list idea is a good one, however it seems a lot less manageable than just publishing the findings of contaminated drugs on a website or something that people can check at will. I think overall that would be better because many may fear signing up to a Government mailing list about contaminated drugs would have them blacklisted as a drug user.

Your more than likely right about the purity vs contamination. Regardless, people still died when they didnt have to.

Even a potent batch of H hitting the streets, while not necceassarily a bad thing is still cause for notifying the user base of the potential dangers.

While anyone who has the time and interest could check the situation in their part of ther world with relative ease. We know that most never if rarely do.

What I'd like to see, is an independant body running a HR service that could go along the lines of SMS updates in the event of any occurance such as this one. The second a contaminated and/or high purity batch has been identified to be in circulation anyone who cares about their life (ie. those who have subscibed to said hypothetical service) could be quickly and easily notified by an SMS message issued by said hypothetical Independant HR body.

Such a system would be easily implemented IMHO and could make a world of differance and if picked up by a non-government regulated body them im sure users would have nothing against subscribing for a service that could give them real time updates on any potential dangers they could come across in their use. This would ideally be location centric to.

Just my idea, I know fully well that it'd never happen. But its nice to dream

 

[footscrazy]

I really don't think an SMS warning would work, just because a lot of people who this would influence are so disengaged from this sort of thing, and probably aren't interested anyway (and have already pawned their mob to cashies ). The ones that care will come online.

 

[8L4YN3]

This is abit interesting(i mean that not in a fucked up sadist way i do realise three people died in this specific article), I wonder if that PDF the drug_mentor posted a few days ago is onto something reguarding perth having good quality heroin lately.

 

[L3inad]

I really don't think an SMS warning would work, just because a lot of people who this would influence are so disengaged from this sort of thing, and probably aren't interested anyway (and have already pawned their mob to cashies ). The ones that care will come online.

While thats definately true for some of the user base, and going off the lineup out front of the cashies in collingwood every morning I dont doubt your logic for a second lol.

However, for want of a better example. The 54 yo business man who died in relation to this matter, would more than likely own and maintain use of a mobile phone. Im sure someone like that would consider making use of such a service if available.

If something like that did exist, at least some would use it. And I'd bet that guy would have been one of them. Thats one life that could have been saved and thats more than enough to justify such a system IMHO

Cant put a price on life. I'm sure his wis widow and dependant children would agree with me.

If the option is there, people will use it.

I think its safe to say that only a tiny percent of Herion users in Sydney make use of the kings cross injecting room. But you can bet your arse that they've saved some lives. I dont know of anyone on BL that doesnt support the use of supervised injecting rooms, even though virtually no one actually makes use of them. Yet the system is there and it saves lives. Give the users more of these options and at least some will utilise them and of that population surely at least one will benefit. Thats enough for me =)

 

[ayjay]

It's worth noting that , in general, fatal heroin overdoses are due to having other drugs on board. Most commonly, alcohol and/or benzos. It's not much to do with strength/purity.

If you want to look at the profile of the typical person who dies from a heroin overdose, it's: male, 30+, using for 5+ years. In other words - experienced users with a high tolerance.

As for peer naloxone administration - you would be unlikely to be able to self-administer. Heroin overdoses generally happen over some hours - a slow decline into unconsciousness and eventually stopping breathing. On your way down, you aren't necessarily going to recognise that you are overdosing. You need a mate to inject you with the naloxone.

 

[MrIbis]

^Ones i've seen were very fast... within about 5 minutes of injection the user stops breathing, turns blue and life support is required.

It's not over a matter of hours, unless during those hours there is co-administration. I find it worth noting that the mean depressant effects of heroin are over quite quickly.

In scenarios where i've had to call an ambulance for administration of naloxone, there has only been need for one administration to effectively block the depressant effects for long enough - and not cause the user to hang out.

My overdose, for which I was mostly probably semi-concious (i know it sounds funny) - was on a gram of pretty decent gear, administered at once. I was rushed to hospital,, but managed to utter the words to the paramedic "don't give me the naloxone unless i totally lose it". He replied "okay, so long as you take a breath at least every 30 seconds, I won't".

This paramedic pushed me round the hospital, whilst his partner just said give him the narcan already. Occasionally the paramedic would yell at me for not breathing enough, to which i'd breath in turn.

Eventually, maybe 1:30 mins after the initial dose, i told them to administer the narcan and let me go home.

So ayjay, I don't know how correct you are. I think most H OD deaths are probably a case of being alone, not playing it smart, and not having the knowledge of what to do should a worst case scenario occur. Peer Education is vital in this.

I also don't think self administration of Naloxone to be a real option.

 

[Flexistentialist]

^ There's plenty of research around on the topic of fatal opiate overdose, lots of Australian specific research too. Ayjay is correct, the vast majority of fatal heroin overdoses are caused by mixing benzos and or alcohol. The average time between last injection in death is between 1-3 hours in the majority of cases. Changes in tolerance due to a recent period of abstinence is also a risk factor identified in the research.

News stories like this are like a flashback to the late 1990's, where "Strong batch hits suburb x" would result in a stampede to the suburb in the article, because everyone wanted the strong gear.

 

[MrIbis]

^Statistically you guys are right, but I'm talkin of first hand experiences where people could have died - thankfully, not sure if it's due to my actions or your stats - none of the situations i've had to deal with resulted in death.

I'm not about to let someone OD for long enough for them to approach the 'death zone'. As far as I'm concerned, they're dying the minute they cease to be concious or breathing.

 

[Sustanon]

Friends of mine have OD-d on the weekend. Went to hospital but they are ok now. Sydney area. The quality has risen in teh past couple of months.

Thats why i was reducing my usage as it was getting more n more stepped on, or my tolerance was increasing as i was using oxys, codiene n H all the time. Just a reminder to always test ur batch by doing way less than u normally would and then go from there.

 

[drug_mentor]

This is abit interesting(i mean that not in a fucked up sadist way i do realise three people died in this specific article), I wonder if that PDF the drug_mentor posted a few days ago is onto something reguarding perth having good quality heroin lately.

Funny you should say that because the PDF I posted in the 'Gear in Cairns?' or whatever the fuck the thread was called was one of the first things that sprung to mind when I saw this article.

I think the PDF was outdated by a couple years, not certain though, I would dig it up now and check but seroquel is starting to kick my ass, so maybe tommorrow if I remember.