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Neo-doves Part II

Frozone said:
I'd appreciate the info :)

I have no current idea what MMCAT is :) But I do get the impression that the 'awakeness' of the ND range may interfere with the MDMA subtlety. Hopefully it may just be a case of timing/spacing but with the duration of the NDs I am unsure.



The chemical compounds in the ND range have been suggestively interpreted in this thread at about page 5/6 through the fine efforts of Phase Dancer and friends via GC/MS testing.

Try not to take this the wrong way as I am not having a go and I do appreciate the warning, but I am looking for real world user experiences from those that have mixed the compounds.



There have also been a fair amount of users who have commented vaugely positive and negative on the issue, but again nothing was made clear in what I have read back over in terms of interactions with specific users (apart from Spatts crazy adventures)

We have always kept the Neo range separate from other illegals, but exclusive ND use on a night out leads to a lot in a session due to lack of duration.



Again, thanks for the words of wisdom :) I know that excessive alcohol + MDMA (that we seem to require to disassociate control over our mindset) seems to lead us to memory lapses over the night (even with piracetam use) and alcohol also seems to interact badly with the Neo range, at least from our experiences.

We have a rather unique situation with our mindset that has existed from our 3rd MDXX experience onwards (occasional users now for 4 years).

As an example: last w.e. I took 6 quality white hearts from earlier in the year (known to be from a good batch - suspect decent strength MDXX) and felt no empathy at all until I was back in the car passenger seat on the way home, relaxed, and BAM! Trail of empathy, pupil dilation and tactile sensations (2 more were consumed in a home environment -> perfect for my relaxed mindset). I have no doubt that MDMA alone is the better alternative, it is just that the NDs and Spirits seems to initiate a MDMA receptive mindset that I think could really help us re-learn to let go.

One thing that I do agree with you entirely on however, is that it is sure not to be too good for us :-)
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I have mixed them with pretty much everything from opiates to meth to mdma to LSD.
I recon over my time i have had over 1000 caps
i once snort 3 mixed at once
done over 30 easy in a night

[EDIT: That's fine, don't ask people to PM you and if you'd like, elaborate a bit on what the side-effects have been from taking so many of these. hoptis]
 
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Frozone said:
Just to re-rail the thread for a bit..

Has anyone had any experiences with any Neodove / Spirit (original range) & MDMA combination in a single night?
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i've mixed on a number of occasions.. seem to mix well....

my best experience was snorting a ND on the downside of the MDMA.. brought my right back up and everything had a blue halo visual effect.. very satisfying.
 
tadfish said:
I have mixed them with pretty much everything from opiates to meth to mdma to LSD.
I recon over my time i have had over 1000 caps
i once snort 3 mixed at once
done over 30 easy in a night

[EDIT: That's fine, don't ask people to PM you and if you'd like, elaborate a bit on what the side-effects have been from taking so many of these. hoptis]
Click to expand...

I've experienced no particular short term physical problems - usually spread across a few days (until they run out, bit moreish).

However, I've found that there is a real tendancy for some strange paranoid behaviours / thoughts especially after many hours / caps / pills. I've observed this with multiple people / doses / occassions and it seems a common effect. I also suspect that this behaviour becomes more pronounced with regular use.

I stopped because they are just too easy to munch, leading to wigged out companions, usually leading to a messy end to the fun.:\
 
Was that ND1 or ND2.
found ND2 more of a body high though i have not had an neo in ages... went too hard to early. i thinks
 
elaborate of side effects: well i have changed colour: like gone green, grey, and other wack colours: umm sick spinning head feelings. alot got or get sick after having them for first times; u get imune to sickness side effects: its not the pure drug either (i have a had some of the pure drugs not all.....yet) umm yeah some get nausea and flu like sickness days after. Let me see contortion after snorting about 3-4 grams in one line once body went like spastic turn in on itself and i turned grey i believe or was it green some bad colour. another time i snort about 2 caps at once a was really in a bad way (might have had many that day but thats not the point) was really shaking tremors like seizures passed in about 30mins
hoptis more side effects i'll do more of a right up. umm u know its cut with creatine and caffeine; so wonder if creatine cause some side effects when snorted. but i think its the fact the the drugs don't like being in a salt form. have u seen what happens to them over time or when exposed to water.

Well i haven't had in well seems like years so memory not the best. They used to have methylone in them years ago. But then cathinones then cathinone devivates now who knows. has anyone had them lately. think they are just in street pills these days as street presser punch them out into a more sellerable form since those big MDMA pill busts. Lucky mdma long since stop working on me and i stop taking street pills years ago. unlucky for this new generation of street freaks eating what ever comes by
 
From the BBC

Concern at new 'legal high' drugs
By Gaetan Portal
BBC News

A new family of drugs offering users a "legal high" has been found by researchers in London.

They are based on cathinone, the active ingredient in the plant khat, commonly used as a stimulant in East Africa.

Although cathinone is a controlled substance, scientists say these new compounds have been deliberately modified to circumvent the law.

Expert John Ramsey told the BBC: "Presumably [users] think they're safe, and they're probably not."

The new breed of drugs are being sold for between £3 and £6 a pill.

Dance scene

Mr Ramsey is director of TIC TAC Communications based at St George's Hospital in south London.

He analyses the contents of legal high pills and other substances found in nightclub "drug amnesty" bins.

"The very latest ones we have seen are cathinones," he said.

"They are being sold as a safer alternative to ecstasy and I guess that there are a group of people who really want to engage with the dance scene and engage with their friends and don't want to break the law.

"Presumably they think they're safe, and they're probably not."

There is a booming market for "legal high" drugs in the UK. They are sold in so-called "head shops" that deal in drug paraphernalia, as well as at music festivals and over the internet.

It is not known how many of the pills are sold in the UK, but one recently disbanded website supplying them told drug researchers they were shipping more than 3,500 doses into the country every day.

Most legal high pills are based on a group of drugs called piperazines, of which BZP is the most common.

These will be designated as controlled substances in the UK early next year under a European directive, but there is evidence that those who market them are already trying to avoid the attention of the law.

Pills analysed at the TIC TAC laboratory, which were purchased from a UK-based website, were marked "BZP and piperazine-free", but in fact when the contents were examined they were found to contain both substances.

And the latest discovery of cathinone-based pills suggests that manufacturers are aware of the coming changes to the law and are trying to find ways around it.

Seizures

Doctors at Guy's and St Thomas' Poisons Unit have seen the effects that legal highs can have on some users.

Dr Paul Dargan told the BBC: "These are individuals who present with clinical features that are very similar to established recreational drugs such as ecstasy, amphetamine, cocaine and ketamine."

Those clinical features can include rapid heart rate, raised blood pressure, high temperatures and seizures.

Ahead of the classification of BZP, the Medicines and Healthcare Products Regulatory Agency said it was pursuing 12 cases involving piperazine-based pills
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BBC
 
look at that thread hen u might be worried WE may all have cancer or some DNA modifications!
WTF
am i looping out i have alreaday contacted doron the sly scared dickhead i will .... if i get cancer
i will go to israel and find him.....
Click to expand...

Settle down ol' boy. Displaying your anger in such a manner is neither constructive nor advisable. How do you really know that's his name anyway?

All you can do is learn from this. It shouldn't come as any surprise, but things are not always as they seem, particularly in the world of commercialised products of this nature. If you really want to do something constructive, then post on some of the many forums around that have discussed these products. Get the word out, but remember, anything said so far on this and other BL threads at this stage is only speculation.

My advice would be to study the mechanisms involved with thalidomide toxicity, and attempt to rationalise how or why phthalimidopropiophenone could be teratogenic. However, it's also very important to present an unbiased message. Shouting that the neo's will give you cancer will only get you shot down and in all likelihood you won't reach those like yourself who've taken large amounts of these things.
 
I knew I should have stuck with the spirits :P

Don't panic Tadfish, as PD said it's speculation at this stage. Could you really say these products are say, more dangerous than cigarettes?

Edit - Might it be beneficial to immediately advise anyone who is pregnant to give these products a wide miss? You'd assume they'd be cautious enough not to take them anyway but hey, the semi-"legal" nature of them has surely misled many people into believing they're safe.
 
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phase_dancer said:
Settle down ol' boy. Displaying your anger in such a manner is neither constructive nor advisable. How do you really know that's his name anyway?

All you can do is learn from this. It shouldn't come as any surprise, but things are not always as they seem, particularly in the world of commercialised products of this nature. If you really want to do something constructive, then post on some of the many forums around that have discussed these products. Get the word out, but remember, anything said so far on this and other BL threads at this stage is only speculation.

My advice would be to study the mechanisms involved with thalidomide toxicity, and attempt to rationalise how or why phthalimidopropiophenone could be teratogenic. However, it's also very important to present an unbiased message. Shouting that the neo's will give you cancer will only get you shot down and in all likelihood you won't reach those like yourself who've taken large amounts of these things.
Click to expand...

Yeah but it wa sok to make such crazy speculations at the start before results were out many such as your self, and claims of heart damage etc. one person saying Bk-PMMA and all sorts of other bullshit was in these. i think many things that have not been know by consumers have gone into these products that have not been shown on your test results. i mean some ones that came out had more sidde effeects, did different effects, colours of caps were changed alot, yes i know who doron is the man behind neo organics i ordered got stuff off them way back in the legal day before test results were out and they were banned. Also i recall the same ND1 and SC1 and spirits or so he said changed what the powders looked like inside alot over the time, and so did the effects.

Well it was ok for people to send out panic bullshit claims way back when woul like me to quote so of those stupid posts: maybe even you made such claims, along with that double sided sword Dr platapus and co.

One would panic when i seen that thread if you had alot of neo's in your time, even though it was long ago; who knows whats in those latest ones.
 
I'm afraid I'm not quite getting your point. No one said it wasn't ok to speculate. It's quite possible one or more of these compounds are toxic, even long term. No one is denying that, or the right to indicate such concerns, as has been done on the Advanced DD thread. I too have had an uneasy feelings about the phthalimido moiety, and have previously expressed those concerns.

As you are quite rightly concerned about your health, I can only suggest not taking the products if you haven't already stopped, and to consult a GP. Explain your past use, your reasons for concern, and ask what is the appropriate course of action.
 
shot down

phase_dancer said:
Settle down ol' boy. Displaying your anger in such a manner is neither constructive nor advisable. How do you really know that's his name anyway?

All you can do is learn from this. It shouldn't come as any surprise, but things are not always as they seem, particularly in the world of commercialised products of this nature. If you really want to do something constructive, then post on some of the many forums around that have discussed these products. Get the word out, but remember, anything said so far on this and other BL threads at this stage is only speculation.

My advice would be to study the mechanisms involved with thalidomide toxicity, and attempt to rationalise how or why phthalimidopropiophenone could be teratogenic. However, it's also very important to present an unbiased message. Shouting that the neo's will give you cancer will only get you shot down and in all likelihood you won't reach those like yourself who've taken large amounts of these things.
Click to expand...
shot down by who some terrorist
well i got about 20 bank accounts in USA with his name on it.
when my friends used to deal with him all that time ago.

well he goes by doron why don't u check the last post all referring to his name as doron so what if it a nick do u know my real name no. tadfish will do. so does that matter?
Yeah could be sorry i panic without some benzos feeding my hungry GABA receptors.
study thalidomide toxicity well sounds like something pregnant womens kids get or something. not have the time. but why don't the people who brough up there scare campaign back up what they said why should i?
shooting things like that wokred for you to get them banned along with those other test results were the key and instrumental in getting neo organics first range banned.

what makes you think i care so much to spend time going to other forums i happy here. I mean this place has changed alot to some foolish thinkin that it will get government sponsored but still better than saying a freind of a friend stuff i mean that was cool on the HIVE but i mean on some forums its just plan a pain in the arse and the strict anal nature of there forums and lack of people with brains. I more concerned about getting the fact for myself first before i spread further posssible scare like some people who started this whole neo test results would like yeah sure we want our pills and drugs to be tested with out punishment and harm reduction is all good and i all for it. but some time at a cost of what. i mean when street pills and meth purity testers are there i think such test have got alot of good drugs banned. I mean i miss the days before operation tryp when in used to be able go up to my local uni and get all sorts of RC's then things changed..
 
So i going to see my GP well a pharmacology award winning drug doc. we will call him Dr House due to many similarities.
What do i tell him what just print out a BL thread
i might and some wiki info. any info you guys give me could help others cause a doctor will then give me tests and shit i going to get an MRI.
i mean i never met anyone thats had more of the neo range than me and my mates so i am worried.
Ah drugs are bad..."drugs have untold powers and that we, as a society, are ignorant of these powers--like early man who shied away from fire"
 
tadfish said:
shooting things like that wokred for you to get them banned along with those other test results were the key and instrumental in getting neo organics first range banned.
Click to expand...

I don't know if I'm following you tadfish. If the first range of neo - products (sub coca and neo doves at least) contained phthalimido compounds isn't it a good thing this information came to light so that we could make an informed decision not to take them?

Personally I did notice a huge variety in the contents of the capsules over a 6 month period. I can only suppose that at the earliest stages they were a means of offloading freshly-banned hagigat. The formulae used then possibly evolved and has probably changed again numerous times since I last took any of the products about a year ago.

I don't know if you can place the blame for any of what Doron has done on the likes of PD's asociates who made the contents at the time available to the public. The Israeli government has no doubtedly been a larger concern of his...
 
tadfish said:
...maybe even you made such claims, along with that double sided sword Dr platapus and co.
Click to expand...

I don't understand the hostility towards PD and Dr Platypus.. they have helped in a huge way to minimise the harm associated with these products.. as a result of their efforts and this site I stopped taking the Neorganics range a long time ago. I'm fucking glad I did too given what's supposedly in them. If any information was passed onto authorities I'm confident it was done in the best interests of everyone considering using this range.
 
tadfish said:
http://www.bluelight.ru/vb/showthread.php?p=6492669&posted=1#post6492669
look at that thread hen u might be worried WE may all have cancer or some DNA modifications!
WTF
am i looping out i have alreaday contacted doron the sly scared dickhead i will kill him if i get cancer
i will go to israel and find him and his wife and kill them
Click to expand...

Tadfish, the way you abused these things, not just the number but the manner - to the point of making yourself ill, suggests that you probably seriously damage yourself whenever you touch substances. If you suffer damage from these then I suspect you'll also be suffering damage from your many other - untold - adventures!:)
 
well doc says all good i trying to get MRI but after showing him all the data and pages from BL and test results. he played down any bad effects.
i have at times done the scare face thing and put my face into about 40 emtpy capsules and snorted.

now after much research i have found that it only is a risk to one trying to have children or pregnant. i seen a doctor as well.
doesn't seem worries said it had some good effects also... can't recall those seems i over reacted
sorry to all those these substances seem safe once again. i ahven't used in ages either but did use for over a year and did notice the caps contents change many people i know ordered them in sometimes large amounts. note those people have been busted by ACC.
I say sorry to doron for any threats but... yeah all good just that prodrug could still be bad but it has some good things about it clearing something from stomach.
and yes i went stupid on them, what can i say it was a cheap drug that ages ago was round in large amounts. i did enjoy it 99% of the time; but had it alot.
i wonder whats in new range i haven't tried as no one orders them anymore.
 
The paranoia induced from any of the neo organics range (i have tried all of them) was enough to make it easy for me to stay away... From now on.. It's become increasingly difficult to deal with since i started taking them, a year ago, and when i weigh up the negatives with the positives, it's just not worth it.

Not every one gets these effects from them but personally, i've had my fair share of them and the love affair has worn off. I loved the "no come down" to begin with but the paranoia effects now are something i can live without and have made me see, they are just not worth it.

I am very interested to hear if there are more studies being done on the substances contained in the neo organics range, and their short term/long term effects.
 
Tadfish: Who are you!

Can't tell from your posts if you're an experienced psychonaut or an oblivious teenager. You should work on your writing technique if you ever wish for anyone to take you seriously. Your thinking patterns seem quite disturbed to me, i.e. bothered about the risk of tetarogenicity but not willing to take the preventative measures to protect yourself from neurotoxic damage? It sounds like you need help to me man. Peace :)
 
i do.
i going through alot of different meds.
i am experienced trust me i give new most psychonaut a run for there money. i brain dead as write now damn seriquel and benzo withdrawals. teenager hardly i like a decade past that.
yep i really should type better but my hands are shaky and all over the place.
 
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