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Bupe need advice plz about suboxone and sleep

C

curlygurl1980

Bluelighter
Joined
Jul 13, 2010
Messages
185
Location
California
hello i am new to this site and was told it was a great one i am in desperate need of some advice i have been on suboxone for two months now and it has absolutley changed my life. i havent touched anything since starting it. i am having one huge major problem though i CAN NOT SLEEP!! i wake up every hour on the hour i have tried tresedone it gives me night mares and i can not take it all tried everything over the counter melotonin nyqeul u name it i have tried it i have just been prescribed remeron for sleep and seems to work okay but not great i have read alot about people on suboxone taking seroquel for sleep and that it works great prob is my doc wont give it too me and suggestions on how to talk him into giving it to me or any thing else anyone knows of for sleep i have also tried lunesta that didnt work either ambien also gives me nightmares. any suggestions at all would be GREATLY appreciated!! thanx
 
Bupe is manufactured from thebaine which has stimulant properties associated with it. Bupe can in fact be very stimulating, energizing even though it's classified as a narc(depressant).

What is your daily dose? How often do you dose? What route of admin do you take your bupe?

When I first started bupe I had issues with good deep sleep until I adjusted my dose and became tolerant to it's effects.

You might want to read as much as you can on bupe because of the wide array of effects this opiod can have in relation to the users level of dependency.

Also for a doc to be able to offer sub treatment all they have to do is a 8 hour course and they are certified to be able to prescribe suboxone but that does not mean that he/she(doc) fully understand how bupe works.
 
i am on 16 mg a day i take 1 in the morning and 1 in the evening my doctor is a psychiatrist specialising in addiction he is a great doctor and seems to know his stuff i have read and read and read about suboxone and have no side effects at all other than the sleep issue. i have read that 16 mg is a high dose but it seems to be working great for me. my doc just seems to be really apprehensive about giving me anything for sleep because i am an addict but honestly i just want to sleep u know do u take anything for sleep? thank u
 
Nope, I take nothing for sleep. I just became tolerant to it's effects. Trying tinkering around with your dose and see if it helps.

Also, please take the time and read up on bupe(suboxone) and how it behaves. You can not take this medicine orally, you will waste your medicine if you swallow it.

Suboxone is derived from thebaine which as stimulant properties even though it's a depressant. Suboxone can be perceived as full agonist in some people, other notice it's partial agonism, suboxone can also be a antagonist. Suboxone has a very very mode of action(half life) different from most opiods/opiates. It has a ceiling once you get to a certain dose increasing more sub after that will do nothing but wAste medicine and possible start making you feel worse.

With suboxone(bupe) less is actually more.
 
well thanku i think i am going to try to go to just one a day half in the morning and half in the evening and see if that helps. do u think i am taking to much?
 
I can not say if you are taking to much. You have to feel your own body out and listen to what it teels you. Maybe try taking your last dose of the day earlier?

Remember to due to the average half life being around 37 hrs if you take 8 mg 37 hrs later you still have around 4 mg left inside you. So if you take another 8 mg at the 37 hr mark you could be around the 12 mg level.

As you get further along in treatment you will become more comfortable with how it behaves. For your own good and development spend sometime learning about it so you understand it and it's effects as you adjust your dose.

Welcome to BL!
 
Suboxone really f**ked up my sleep as well. I was only on it for 2 weeks but those were two long ass weeks. I agree...it' helped dramatically with the w/d's & cravings...but the lack of sleep got really old. I was getting maybe 2-3 hours a night (combined...not all at once) but still forced myself to live an active life including 2 hours a day in the gym (or some other kind of heavy exercise).

My doc prescribed me ambien and even that didn't work (at least at 5mg doses). I would fall asleep okay when taking the ambien but would then wake up after 3-4 hours. I could have upped my dosage to 10mgs or 5mg at bedtime and then 5mg when I woke up (doctors suggestions) but I was very wary of taking the ambien cause I really didn't/don't want another addiction to battle. I've been off the subs for a week now and have gotten decent sleep for the last 4 days.

I wish I had more advice for you or some kind of magic answer. All I can say is continue trying different things and hopefully something will work. Either that or just be patient till your body adjusts to the medication. Also, once you get to a small enough dose (whether you're doing a long, gradual taper or a rapid taper) you should be able to get some normal sleep again.

Good luck with both the subs and your opiate addiction in general. It's been a rough ride for me but I still think I'm a stone's throw away from success.

Take care,
T
 
hhhmmm...i cant say i've ever had that problem. im not prescribed subs, but i do take them quite regularly, and in pretty big doses. im sorry to hear about that, i think suboxone is great and im glad to hear its help with ur addictions. i'd also agree with tweaking ur dosage, and maybe taking ur night dose a few hrs earlier. hell i've had days when i've taken 32-40mg and slept like a rock. well i hope you find a way to get some z's man good luck.
 
I have been on suboxone maintenance for quite some time yet I have never had any issues with sleeping. This could be because I do not take my prescribed dose of 12 mg's and instead only take 0.5 mg doses. I find the drug MUCH more effective at this low dose and it also gives me euphorical buzzes to make my days even more enjoyable. It also has anti-dpressant properties(probably because of the low dose euphoria). I am also prescribed temazepam for insomnia which I had before I got on the suboxone. This could easily be the reason I have yet to have sleeping troubles with the sub.

My doctor originaly prescribed me mirtazepine(remeron) like you to try to help me sleep but it did not work well. And after trying a couple of other medications I ended up with temazepam which has greatly improved the problem. It is a hypnotic benzodiazepine therefore it is no suprise it worked well for my sleep, its just doctors sometimes dont like to prescribe benzos for long periods of time because of the dependance/addiction/tolerance potential. And this is something to take into consideration. Thats probably why my doc tried several other meds before trying a benzo.

You might want to ask your doctor about temazepam or triazolam(another hypnotic benzo) to help your sleeping troubles. But there is a good chance he will be hesitant to prescribe these meds, not only because of the issues I allready described but also because mixing suboxone with benzos is generally something doctors try to avoid as it increases the risk of complications like overdosing greatly.

But as long as your taking them as prescribed and are not on massive doses of either med(which shouldnt be necessary in this instance) the chance of having complications is slim. I know that I personally have not noticed any problems mixing the two medications( i.e....respiratory depression, lowered heart rate...etc...). And im also prescribed clonazepam as well(1.5 mg's a day for anxiety).

It has alot to do with your relationship with your doctor and how he/she feels about prescribing a benzodiazepine along with your suboxone. Try talking to your doc about it and hopefully you will eventually find the right combo of meds for you.
 
thanx so much i am going to ask about temazepam for sure. so u only take.5 is that pretty close to a half of a pill a day? also i am on 15 millegrams of remeron and wondering if i should double it how much did u take? thanx
 
No I take 0.5 mg's......which is 1/16th of a pill. It is 1/24th(im talkin about the 8mg suboxone orange pills) of my precribed dose. And actually, lots of times I take even less....like 0.2 mg's or 0.3 mg's. At these low doses it allows for bupernorphines metabolite norbupernorphine(which is a full agonist like heroin or oxy) to bind to the lefotver opiod receptors in your brain(because at higher doses the bupe binds to ALL of the receptors leaving no room for norbupe(which has a lesser binding affinity than bupe, meaning that bupe will ALWAYS outcompete norbupe for the receptors)). SO when you take tiny doses of suboxone, all the bupe binds to all the receptors it can until no more bupe is left, but since its such a small dose, there are plenty of receptors left open for the norbupe to bind to, which gets you high because its a full agonist, as compared to bupe which is only a partial agonist.

Honestly I dont remember exactly how much mirtazepine(remeron) I took(sry i just never heard it called remeron cuz I always got the generic) but im pretty sure it was more than 15 mg's....anyway...it didnt do anything to help my sleeping troubles. And if your anything like me(and probably most people) the temazepam or triazolam will be much more effective. I couldnt believe how well it worked the first time I used it, I could barely keep my eyes open if I tried.

Allthough I was luckily given a 30 mg nightly dose of temazepam which is pretty much the most they will prescribe you for sleep. most of the time they give you 15 mg capsules. But 15 mg's should still take care of your problem anyway. Atleast until you develope a tolerance to it and then you might get bumped up to 30 mg's. but for me, the 30 mg's has definitely lowered its effectiveness over time because my body got use to it, but it still helps me sleep big time so I have no intention of switching to another med. Temazepam works great.

Also, ive read that some doctors only prescribe temazepam(and most other benzos) for only short periods of time to prevent dependancy or addiction...which is reasonable...and it might happen to you. But luckily my doc has shown no intention of stopping my prescription.

Feel free to ask any more questions.
 
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