My nanna can't tell an amphetamine from a methamphetamine!
- Thread starter D&AWg
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EXACTLY!!
People need to understand that just because a drug has different effects does not mean it is a different chemical. Speed, methamphetamine etc is the most variable drug you will come across in terms of purity, physical form, types of impurities present and types of cutting agents incorporated. Even pharmaceutically sourced drugs like ketamine, morphine and dexamphetamine via dexies can effect a user differently from time to time depending on the individuals physiological or emotional state when it is taken.
You CANNOT be sure you have had amphetamine unless you have done an extreme test. Even then you cannot be 100% sure. You cannot be sure you have methamphetamine either. However if you are sold "speed" or "rock" or "ice" and it has stimulant effects, statistics tell you its methamphetamine. Of course methamphetamine may be the main ingredient - theres is a whole host of other chemicals in the sample, all but the cutting agent (if any) unintentionally present.
I recommend of course ALWAYS testing powders with a tester just as you would test your pills. The contents are just as unknown, if not moreso. And if you are like me and tend to have pills only after they have become established and others have already tested them many times (that is not to say I dont test them anyway to make sure), you may find your tester beginning to have far more application for "powdered stimulants" than for pills. I have found fresh marquis is excellent at determining roughly how strong your methamphetamine is. (NOTE: if you have crystalline material ensure it is crushed well before performing my "speed" test - pardon the pun)
Mr. Horse
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I agree, from the same batch of meth:
One time: Up, up and away... No sleep, lots of energy, intensly animalistic and sexual. Bad ass crash.
Another Time: Annoyed, edgy frustrated, fell straight asleep.
100mg over the night both times.
Set/Setting/Tolerance/Current body chemistry all play a massive role in guiding your neurochemical process, thus altering the subjective experience.
The second time, it felt like i had internally/mentally built a block to the experience, as if my own body had already filled the places the meth-amphetamine was to excite... Hard to say really.
I am not a big fan of it anymore.
One time: Up, up and away... No sleep, lots of energy, intensly animalistic and sexual. Bad ass crash.
Another Time: Annoyed, edgy frustrated, fell straight asleep.
100mg over the night both times.
Set/Setting/Tolerance/Current body chemistry all play a massive role in guiding your neurochemical process, thus altering the subjective experience.
The second time, it felt like i had internally/mentally built a block to the experience, as if my own body had already filled the places the meth-amphetamine was to excite... Hard to say really.
I am not a big fan of it anymore.
RyanM
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oh OH um does the whole Baking Soda thing really help amphetamines like would mixing baking soda in water and then taking adderall help adderall work better or is that just a myth? Hm what about After you took adderall then had baking soda would that still work?
mongman
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I know someone who swore that basifing stomach contents realy helped but I have never noticed a difference myself. Some doctors I have talked to who were researching MDMA/amphetamine affects on people just laughed when I asked them about it. They didnt think it worked.
ayjay
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Hmmm - I was just reading something that said weak bases "redistribute catecholamines from synaptic vesicles to the cytosol by collapsing the vesicle proton gradient that provides free energy for catechol accumulation. Even non-stimulant weak bases work in this model" (http://www.acnp.org/g4/GN401000166/Default.htm)
So maybe if you had bicarb in the brain it would help
MY question is does amphetamine or methamphetamine have any effect on serotonin levels. I always thought the answer to this was no, but I keep finding secondary texts that use methamphetamine and serotonin in the same sentence. Anyone got a definitive answer?
So maybe if you had bicarb in the brain it would help
MY question is does amphetamine or methamphetamine have any effect on serotonin levels. I always thought the answer to this was no, but I keep finding secondary texts that use methamphetamine and serotonin in the same sentence. Anyone got a definitive answer?
ayjay said:Hmmm - I was just reading something that said weak bases "redistribute catecholamines from synaptic vesicles to the cytosol by collapsing the vesicle proton gradient that provides free energy for catechol accumulation. Even non-stimulant weak bases work in this model" (http://www.acnp.org/g4/GN401000166/Default.htm)
So maybe if you had bicarb in the brain it would help
MY question is does amphetamine or methamphetamine have any effect on serotonin levels. I always thought the answer to this was no, but I keep finding secondary texts that use methamphetamine and serotonin in the same sentence. Anyone got a definitive answer?
I have read a few times that methamphetamine is a good releaser of seratonin, but that amphetamine is a weak releaser of seratonin. I read in one place that MDMA releases 3 times more seratonin than MA. But people usually take more MDMA in a night than MA. 100mg of MDMA is only 1 good pill, where as 100mg of MA is much stronger in effects on most people.
ayjay said:Hmmm - I was just reading something that said weak bases "redistribute catecholamines from synaptic vesicles to the cytosol by collapsing the vesicle proton gradient that provides free energy for catechol accumulation. Even non-stimulant weak bases work in this model" (http://www.acnp.org/g4/GN401000166/Default.htm)
So maybe if you had bicarb in the brain it would help
MY question is does amphetamine or methamphetamine have any effect on serotonin levels. I always thought the answer to this was no, but I keep finding secondary texts that use methamphetamine and serotonin in the same sentence. Anyone got a definitive answer?
I have read a few times that methamphetamine is a good releaser of seratonin, but that amphetamine is a weak releaser of seratonin. I read in one place that MDMA releases 3 times more seratonin than MA. But people usually take more MDMA in a night than MA. 100mg of MDMA is only 1 good pill, where as 100mg of MA is much stronger in effects on most people.
BilZ0r
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Lets see... YES, the alkalizing effects of baking soda do work. See here.
The amphetamine 'weak base model' is in regards to chemicals which are substrates for a monoamine transporter.. i.e. they accumulate in the synaptic vesicle. Not just urinary and plasma alkalizers.
When comparing methamphetamine to amphetamine to MDMA and their releasing properties.. the concentration (nM) of the amphetamine which release 50% of maximum (EC50) is:
For Noradrenaline: (+)Meth:12 (+)Amp:7 (+/-)MDMA:77
For Dopamine: (+)Meth:24 (+)Amp:24 (+/-)MDMA:376
For Serotonin: (+)Meth:736 (+)Amp:1765 (+/-)MDMA:56
The smaller the number means more potent. This is of course in vitro. In a whole animal, meth is more potent because it permiates the brain faster and it also is more 'resistant' to metabolism.
You can see that meth release more serotonin, and less noradrenaline, in comparison to amphetamine.
The amphetamine 'weak base model' is in regards to chemicals which are substrates for a monoamine transporter.. i.e. they accumulate in the synaptic vesicle. Not just urinary and plasma alkalizers.
When comparing methamphetamine to amphetamine to MDMA and their releasing properties.. the concentration (nM) of the amphetamine which release 50% of maximum (EC50) is:
For Noradrenaline: (+)Meth:12 (+)Amp:7 (+/-)MDMA:77
For Dopamine: (+)Meth:24 (+)Amp:24 (+/-)MDMA:376
For Serotonin: (+)Meth:736 (+)Amp:1765 (+/-)MDMA:56
The smaller the number means more potent. This is of course in vitro. In a whole animal, meth is more potent because it permiates the brain faster and it also is more 'resistant' to metabolism.
You can see that meth release more serotonin, and less noradrenaline, in comparison to amphetamine.
Amphetmine -v- Methamphetamine....
So well, I'v been following the discussion going on here, and i just need to clarify a few things for my own knowledge base....
-------------
I was under the impression that AMPHETAMINE was the name of the drug family
and that
METHAMPHETAMINE is the name given to one of the chemicals within that family.......
-----------------
but... given by the information that you guys have been sharing, i think i may have been under the wrong impression.
anyways on another note regarding the above discussion, I live in Australia, and am a regular (and i admit, heavy) meth user. I have lived in a few different cities in Australia, and most of the dealers that I came into contact with sold was (as far as I am aware) Meth (and Ice aswell.......).
And yes, in responce to a question I read on the msg board, you can definitely smoke meth in a crack/ice pipe. (I don't generally ingest it in this way... but alot of my mates do.....)
From what I have observed from my mates when they smoke it, when you heat it in the pipe, the residue that remains in your throat and the taste left on your tongue is pretty disgusting (its a laught to see their faces after a toke on their pipe.... but i guess they laugh their asses off at me when i rack up and snort a line!)
Not only the taste is gross, but it also stinks to high heaven!
The quality of meth that is available in Australia ranges from quality that could be confused with icing sugar, to meth that completely blows your brains outta the back of your skull. I guess it all depends on whether or not your source is reliable and, of course whether you just want to have a bit of a buzz for the evening, or dance your ass off till dawn three days down the track *chuckles*.....
anyways... that was just my 2c worth.......
play it safe guys!
So well, I'v been following the discussion going on here, and i just need to clarify a few things for my own knowledge base....
-------------
I was under the impression that AMPHETAMINE was the name of the drug family
and that
METHAMPHETAMINE is the name given to one of the chemicals within that family.......
-----------------
but... given by the information that you guys have been sharing, i think i may have been under the wrong impression.
anyways on another note regarding the above discussion, I live in Australia, and am a regular (and i admit, heavy) meth user. I have lived in a few different cities in Australia, and most of the dealers that I came into contact with sold was (as far as I am aware) Meth (and Ice aswell.......).
And yes, in responce to a question I read on the msg board, you can definitely smoke meth in a crack/ice pipe. (I don't generally ingest it in this way... but alot of my mates do.....)
From what I have observed from my mates when they smoke it, when you heat it in the pipe, the residue that remains in your throat and the taste left on your tongue is pretty disgusting (its a laught to see their faces after a toke on their pipe.... but i guess they laugh their asses off at me when i rack up and snort a line!)
Not only the taste is gross, but it also stinks to high heaven!
The quality of meth that is available in Australia ranges from quality that could be confused with icing sugar, to meth that completely blows your brains outta the back of your skull. I guess it all depends on whether or not your source is reliable and, of course whether you just want to have a bit of a buzz for the evening, or dance your ass off till dawn three days down the track *chuckles*.....
anyways... that was just my 2c worth.......
play it safe guys!
Re: Amphetmine -v- Methamphetamine....
I believe your correct in saying this, ampetamine is the name of a class but it also the name of a specific drug, a bad analogy would be coke (in soft drink terms not cocaine), coke can refer specifically to coca cola but is also often used to refer to all colas like pepsi, rc cola e.t.c.
I used to only buy speed when out and had looked hard for ice with no success, but the last 3 lots of speed i got from 3 different sources have all been well and truely in the icing sugar category. These are not dodgy sources rather sources whom have the best quality stuff at good prices when comes to other drugs like pills. They sell a hell of alot of this speed without anyone complaining, iv seen people blow .3 gram of the stuff then retire to the car to take a nap a few hours later and they think the speed they took was decent while im there still wired for hours to come thanks to ice.
I deadset never plan to buy speed again if im out and cant get base/ice im just gunna go home and sleep rather than wasting my money to end up disappointed and pissed off.
Doomgurl said:
I believe your correct in saying this, ampetamine is the name of a class but it also the name of a specific drug, a bad analogy would be coke (in soft drink terms not cocaine), coke can refer specifically to coca cola but is also often used to refer to all colas like pepsi, rc cola e.t.c.
Doomgurl said:
I used to only buy speed when out and had looked hard for ice with no success, but the last 3 lots of speed i got from 3 different sources have all been well and truely in the icing sugar category. These are not dodgy sources rather sources whom have the best quality stuff at good prices when comes to other drugs like pills. They sell a hell of alot of this speed without anyone complaining, iv seen people blow .3 gram of the stuff then retire to the car to take a nap a few hours later and they think the speed they took was decent while im there still wired for hours to come thanks to ice.
I deadset never plan to buy speed again if im out and cant get base/ice im just gunna go home and sleep rather than wasting my money to end up disappointed and pissed off.
phase_dancer
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This is correct. The amine or Nitrogen containing group is what differs between amphetamine and methamphetamine
Amphetamine is a PRIMARY amine - (2 x Hydrogen + 1 x alkyl group**)
Methamphetamine is a SECONDARY amine (1 x H + 2 x alkyl groups**)
Fig 1: The term Amphetamine as applied to the Phenyl-isopropyl-amine group of drugs
**Alkyl group = CH3-, Ch3-CH2-, etc.
The amphetamine alkyl chain (known as isopropyl) -CH2-CH2-CH3 , is conneted to the N in all structures shown above)
NOTE: The term methylated amphetamine , or N-methyl amphetamine can be used in place of methylamphetamine
Last edited:
aunty establishment
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Just to clarify, when people say amphetamine in reference to a specific drug, they're usually talking about amphetamine sulfate
BigTrancer
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N-methyl means the methyl (CH3) group is attached to the Nitrogen.
BigTrancer
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Sllip
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Just a quick question can amphet be smoked?
The reason I ask is becasue I got some beige coloured crystals recently and when I burnt some to test it's purity it turned to black very quickly. But it's wasn't a black goo, it's was a crispy charcol black. It was definately small cyrstal and not jsut a cut powder.
The reason I ask is becasue I got some beige coloured crystals recently and when I burnt some to test it's purity it turned to black very quickly. But it's wasn't a black goo, it's was a crispy charcol black. It was definately small cyrstal and not jsut a cut powder.