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Mushrooms: Poison??

deroxor

deroxor

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A remake of this thread
Shroom Theory: Psilocybin a Poison?
Do you think that Psilocybin is a poison??? I know its not realy poisonous to humans, but in nature it does work as a pesticide. Also, sometimes, on mushrooms I feel like ive been poisoned. Not like im dying or anything, just the chemical in my body. Oh and the leg pains too. Soo anyone els think this??
 
It is highly hypothesized that THC and other cannabinoids are produced by the cannabis genus as protective measures, so that once they are eaten by animals, they are puked back up and a taste aversion classical conditioning occurs. However, mushrooms are psychoactively potent in doses which do not induce vomiting. If one eats several pounds of mushrooms, they are very likely to puke and have a very strong taste aversion.

It is a big debate, but whatever the case, poison or gift, the genus has become very proliferated throughout the world.
 
when i'm on shrooms my stomach feels upset and nauseas but the rest of my body does not feel poisoned. i feel more poisoned on alcohol than shrooms.
 
I think it's reasonable to assume it evolved as a defense mechanism so that other animals would not eat it. One of my favorite analogous situations is that of capsiacin in peppers. Probably evolved as a defense mechanism, humans appreciate it as an addition to their foodstuffs.

Poison is kind of a strong word. Deterrent is more appropriate, I think.
 
I like the line about peppers above, well noted :)

I think people are used to classyfying non-traditional mushrooms as a poisen, and when you start tripping really hard, a thought that comes to most peoples minds are "I've been poisened" or "I took the wrong mushroom". In an already powerful psychedelic mindstate, it is easy for one to interpret all the emotions, thoughts, feelings and physical symtpoms of the drug as a poisen.

Although I must agree that I can feel "dirty" on mushrooms when compared to the high of LSD, or especially the phenethylamine chemicals.

Maybe it is protection from small animals that eat the mushroom. Animals probably appreciate the taste of dirty mushrooms covered in feces a lot better than most humans, so it is a deligh to them. They bite a few, run home to tell the family "I found food!" then the leader takes them down a rabbit hole..... Maybe it is a memory / mind state thing so the attacker won't be able to find the mushroom again to dig them all up and destroy their careful network. Then again is the question, do psychedelics make an animal "trip" since it does not have as much known emotions/perceptions/thought processes as human brains do.
 
i've noticed when people eat too many mushies they think they are getting poisoned. i've seen it happen to a couple people who didn't know what they were getting into, or ate too much. i think it's from trippin out hard. same thing with "bad"acid. some people might trip so hard they feel sick.
 
deroxor said:
^ i get exact opposite from you dev (accept for the alcohol bit)
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you mean your stomach feels ok but the rest of your body feels poisoned? i get a body high which i find pleasant but i could see how it could be interpreted as poisoning. my limbs feel heavy and talking seems like quite an effort.
 
isn't it also possible that psilocybin developed as a poison to ward off non-animal organisms?
 
i think it's possible the psilocybin serves as a deterant because most species of animals are only concerned with bodily survival. most animals probably don't have complex enough brains to appreciate tripping. so when an animal eats the mushrooms and trips it percieves it as bad because tripping temporarily hinders its ability to survive.
 
well as far as most narcotics are concerned, youre damned if you do and youre damned if ya dont... ist prob because it is an active neuro toxin that it has developed its psychoactive properties.. personally I like my coffee strong and my shrooms trippy.. none of that low fat decaf crappola.. I just raise my paw in honour of those that randomly ate any sort of new flora that they encountered.... the brave bastards...
 
Humans no longer have voluntary control of vomiting. It is much more common in other animals. Cat, after they eat something which doesnt agree with them, or a hairball, will just sit there and voluntarily pump up their stomach and dump everything. Most humans dont enjoy vomiting, or consider it normal. Of we eat something and then puke, its serious business, in the animal world, its an every day thing. Animals are more likely to eat poisons in the wild then non poisons. Its just interesting how terrified we are of the nausea, even though its more or less normal in animals- not healthy too often, but normal ocassionally.
 
yeah i noticed that with my dog, especially when he was a puppy. he would all sorts of things that weren't really edible and then vommit them back up.
 
My dog likes to eat clay, rocks/pebbles, and the occasional DVD.

She also ate a morning glory seed PBJ left in the trash by my roommate. Her eyes were very dilated and she had some motor problems, and also kind of stared at nothing. It hasn't detered her from eating trash, but maybe she wouldn't eat morning glory seeds again if she found them. I kind of doubt it, though.

Either way, what other hypothesis is there to account for the effects of the mushrooms? It has to help the mushroom either by preventing it from getting killed, or by helping it reproduce, or else it's just a coincidence that this chemical makes people/animals trip.

Fruiting plants *want* animals to eat the fruit because it helps spread the seeds, so there's a possibility. I mean, these mushrooms do grow out of cow poop....
 
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shrooms are not a poison - y? - well for a start psilocin is vertually non toxic - the fact that som1 has felt posioned is not the same as being poisoned anymor than if som1 on shrooms thinks they can fly means they can. Where is any evidence of psilocybin as a insectacide? Fly agaric magic mushrooms have been used 2 stupify fly perhaps ur thinkin of that. It is quite common to find insect larvi living in the gills of psilocybe shrooms even - so I think ur barking up the wrong there there.
what about grazing herbivores? cows & horse would become tolerant & be able to consume grassland shrooms without effect, seing as flushes may start slowly even initial effects may be avoided. Tolerancw of this sort hardly makes it a effective detterant & anyway MANURE is a useful wanted byproduct for the shroom
It is clearly that psilocybin is totally uneffective as a poison to deter mammals going by how much effort humans make 2 find them & even GROW THEM. How abot psilocin being mad 2 attract & aid dispersal just a fruit attracts animals to be eaten.
 
FYI, the shroomery says that spores fed to cows will make mushrooms grow from the dung. It's probably part of the mushrooms' regular growth cycle to be eaten by animals. Does that mean cows like to trip? *shrug*
 
SOME grow on shit like cubensis others like semilanceta grow on manured grass land & others grow on hay, wood etc
 
I can't remember if I read it some where or saw it on tv but there are meant to be bears in America or Canada will seek out hallucigenic mushrooms and eat them and also some kind of deer does it too. :)

No ref's, sorry. :\
 
Im still convinced that Psilocybin is some kind of poison. That doesnt mean im saying that shrooms are poisonous, harmfull or toxic. I think its more of a pesticide, to keep bugs from eating them. Its not poisonous to humans because of our bodymass. And also our minds are complex enough to appreciate tripping, and maybe other animals do too.

FYI, the shroomery says that spores fed to cows will make mushrooms grow from the dung. It's probably part of the mushrooms' regular growth cycle to be eaten by animals. Does that mean cows like to trip? *shrug*
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It probably means, that while cows are eating grass, they are eating the spores/mushrooms in the grass.....

If a small dog, or a cat were to end up eating 10-20 grams of fresh mushrooms, how do you think it would react???
 
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