Methysergide- Use with CAUTION

[fastandbulbous]

^ Taking fuck off doses is not going to do you any good & from what I've read, the dose of methylsergide required for psychedelic effects is well beyond the clinical dosage (although yes to get rally worrysome effects generally requires multiple administrations); besides which, taking excessive doses of vasoconstrictors isn't what I'd consider a fun thing to do)

 

[permastoned]

^ Taking fuck off doses is not going to do you any good & from what I've read, the dose of methylsergide required for psychedelic effects is well beyond the clinical dosage (although yes to get rally worrysome effects generally requires multiple administrations); besides which, taking excessive doses of vasoconstrictors isn't what I'd consider a fun thing to do)

Then you obviously haven't tried it. (Hint, I have). It's not just multiple administrations, its constant administration for around 6 months that causes the fibrosis. In fact, some people on fenfluramine didn't even get the fibrosis after long term treatment. MDMA itself is a potent 5ht2b agonist. So you're suggesting that no one ever does MDMA. Hmm 8)

"we have discovered that the amphetamine derivative 3,4-methylenedioxymethamphetamine (MDMA, "Ecstasy") and its N-demethylated metabolite 3,4-methylenedioxyamphetamine (MDA) each preferentially bind to and activate human recombinant 5-HT2B receptors."

http://www.mdma.net/toxicity/xfenheart.html

 

[fastandbulbous]

^ No it's on my list of 'not worth the potential risk'. The vasoconstricor activity is something that concerns me (as does any possible cumulative effects re: cardiac fibrosis) and yes, I don't take MDMA any more because the side/after effects are just too horrible in my case. I know not everybody taking fenfluramine goes on to develop cardiac fibrosis, but because of the nature of what it is I don't want to take the risk of something like that (others in that category are AET - only tried that once, not to be repeated because of potentially fatal side effects (agranulocytosis), fenfluramine - see aboveas well as a few others)

I'm not suggesting that no-one ever does MDMA (I think you're taking what I'm saying to make over the top statements), nor have I in the past, but I think that people should be informed of any potential risks from the drug they chose to take - after all, methylsergide is only available from hospitals in the UK & they don't implement such measures if there's no dangers associated with the drug

From the BNF

Methylsergide, a semi synthetic ergot alkaloid, has dangerous side effects (retroperitoneal fibrosis and fibrosis of the heart valves and pleura); important: it should only be administered under hospital supervision

also, from side effects under entry for methylsergide

... arterial spasm (including coronary artery spasm with angina and possible myocardial infarction).... Side effects are listed in order of how common they are and the above is found in the first half, so they are not uncommon

And those are for clinical doses, not fucking huge doses well in excess of that used clinically


Are you telling me that the BNF is just being a scaremonger? The warnings concerning methylsergide are much greater than for just about any other psychoactive drug I can find entries for (and it doesn't matter whether or not I've taken it - I wouldn't as I've stated - the BNF is the first ref source for doctors in the UK and the side effects are listed from clinical observations, not theorising what might happen. As such, I'd say that people would be well advised not to consider this a drug suitable for use as a psychedelic, because of all the potential cardiovascular problems)

 

[Jabberwocky]

does not sound worth it when there's good ole lucy to be had

 

[permastoned]

I agree, but when there's none to be had it makes for a cheap, easily accessible alternative.

With regards to the primary risk, cardiac fibrosis, it's important to compare the dosing. Sure, it's a risk for chronic usage of 3mg per day for more than a few months (from the Australian Medicines Handbook: "Do not use for >4-6 months without a break of 1-2 months because of the risk of fibrosis"). The risk is not directly related to the total amount you've consumed, it is due to the duration of time which your body has been consistently exposed to the drug (ie taking 3mg/day for 3 weeks =/= taking 63mg at once). Fibrosis is a chronic process, and as such taking a large dose at once will not result in pathological fibrosis.

I'm not saying there are no risks associated with taking more than prescribed, just not fibrosis. Taking 63mg would potentially have some nasty side-effects.



Wtf is that supposed to mean? You think a psychedelic trip is worthless? Good for you - I happen to quite enjoy it. Either that or you meant it literally, in which case I would like to know which drugs you take recreationally that are actually good for you.

I have tried methysergide (19mg) and it was very enjoyable. I found the psychedelic effects were indistinguishable from LSD. :D

A very well thought out and quantified scientific post. The only other risk is the possible side effect of excess vasoconstriction, and no one can really say much about that because no scientific studies have been done measuring the effects of taking a large dose. However, it is evident in TiHKAL that it has been tested on several subjects at high doses without detrimental effects.

 

[B-Side]

so... could you snort it?

 

[Okami]

Walls swelling and patterns in the carpet? That seems more than a threshold dose or at least for me it would. I just about get things of that nature if I smoke loads of weed with one weak blotter (you never know with these things and I don't have much experience but at a guess 100mcg). I also remember reading on shroomery someone saying something about alcohol reducing visuals of psychedlics, I've never mixed the two but if thats the case then surely then it could have been even more visual had you not drunk anything.

 

[red22]

The only other risk is the possible side effect of excess vasoconstriction, and no one can really say much about that because no scientific studies have been done measuring the effects of taking a large dose. However, it is evident in TiHKAL that it has been tested on several subjects at high doses without detrimental effects.

Someone recently said this on reddit:

"The feeling was very, very similar to LSA minus the bodily discomfort and anxiety."

SlothLightSpeed, 2024-09-22, reddit.com/r/ObscureDrugs

Jonathan Ott said "The effects of methylergonovine were nearly identical to the effects of ergonovine,[1] and Albert Hofmann said that ergonovine is "nearly identical to LSD in effect."[2]


1. Ott, J., Neely, P. 1980. Entheogenic (hallucinogenic) effects of methylergonovine. Journal of psychedelic drugs, 12(2), 165–166. doi:10.1080/02791072.1980.10471568

2. "No, that’s not true. Ergot contains many natural, highly psychedelic alkaloids. [Isoergine] is one of them; hydroxy-methyl-lysergamide is another one, and in fact, is considered nearly identical to LSD in effect. Albert Hofmann told me so himself. They believe that it was this derivative contained in extracts of [C. paspali] that was used in the [Eleusinian] Mysteries."

Interview with an Alchemist: Bear Owsley Interview. Bruce Eisner's Writings. Jan 10, 2004. https://archive.vn/RAUXH

"hydroxy-methyl-lysergamide" is a reference to ergonovine, i.e., one of ergonovine's synonyms is N-(α-(Hydroxymethyl)ethyl)-D-lysergamide.[7] Furthermore, Owsley references The Road to Eleusis and ergonovine is the focus of chapter 2 in that book. Also, the "many, highly psychedelic alkaloids" comment is a huge exaggeration.