Vader
Bluelight Crew
- Joined
- Aug 31, 2009
- Messages
- 8,421
In the light of recent events, it seems likely that some will be searching the web for information about a new legal high, "roflcoptr" or methoxetamine. I feel a duty to help disseminate knowledge to potential first-time users about this drug. My hope is that this thread can be a first port of call for those who want to learn about this substance. I will briefly outline my main points below, then expand in detail.
Firstly, it ought to be made clear that methoxetamine is not really a club drug. If you are looking for a replacement for mephedrone or MDMA, this is not it. Methoxetamine is a dissociative drug, meaning that has an action similar to ketamine and PCP (it is also structurally related to both these drugs). It will not produce rushes of euphoria- it is a strange, powerful, confusing experience, and it can be very scary. If you are not experienced with using mind-altering drugs, this stuff is not for you. It is highly potent, requiring doses as low as ten or fifteen milligrams (that means that a gram could have up to 100 doses in it). You cannot just pour a line out of a bag, snort it, and hope for the best. I am going to relate some experiences of mine to illustrate this.
I have been using methoxetamine for about a year, and I have extensive experience of using drugs such as LSD, the 2C family, mushrooms, DMT, ketamine, nitrous oxide, various PCP analogues... you get the picture. I am into hallucinogens in a big way. None of this prevented what was one of the most terrifying experiences of my life. After a night of using Ecstasy, 2C-B, 2C-C, cannabis, and alcohol, I returned home, and took some methoxetamine. I made myself a large line, of unknown dose, and snorted it over a short period of time. What followed was an unmitigated nightmare. Logic and identity imploded. I was lost, petrified, at times fearing that my consciousness was broken and that I would lose my mind. I have had difficult drug experiences before, and have acquired the ability to manage them to some extent with techniques such as breathing exercises- even so, there were times when it seemed impossible that I could ever emerge from the swirling vortex of insanity in one piece. This went on for hours- I slept, after using Valium to knock myself out, only to re-emerge into the maelstrom on awakening. I took the dose in the wee hours of Saturday morning, and it was a full 24 hours before some semblance of normality returned. I was shaken. If you use methoxetamine, this might happen to you. If this does not sound like the sort of thing you are ready for, then do not use it. A friend of mine, also experienced with psychedelics and dissociatives, had a panic attack after just 15mg of methoxetamine (he had drunk a significant quantity of alcohol beforehand). On that same occasion, and with the same dose, another friend spent 3 or 4 hours rolling around on the floor half-naked and semi-conscious, and later had no memory of the experience (luckily, he was in his own home). I have given this drug to quite a few of my friends, all of them experienced drug users, and fewer than 50% of them have found the experience enjoyable or worthwhile. This is no joke- do not think that you are too strong, too clever for this to happen to you. Methoxetamine is not a forgiving drug, and you will pay for your bravado. As I say, I have used powerful hallucinogens for about a decade, and I found myself out of my depth. If you do not know what you are doing, then stay away. My behaviour was irresponsible, and I paid the price. Do not make the same mistake I did.
If you do decide to try this drug, please be responsible. Buy a scale that is accurate to the milligram (one with three places after the decimal point). Start low- 10 or 15mg is an appropriate starting point. Do not just pour an amount out of the bag and snort or eat it, and if you must, use an EXTREMELY small dose (think something the size of the head of a match). Do not use it for the first time in a club, do it in a safe place that you feel comfortable in, like your home or the home of a friend. Do not use this drug irresponsibly- do not let your friends do so. You might hear that this drug is similar to ketamine. That is true to some extent, but most find that methoxetamine is more manic and confusing, and it is certainly more potent by weight and longer lasting. Ketamine leaves the user immobilised- methoxetamine does not, and if you overdo it, you will still be active and mobile, and capable of hurting yourself or others.
It is difficult to explain what dissociatives feel like, but I will try. One becomes detached from the world, insulated from external stimuli, and the mind fills the void. Hallucinations and confusion are keynotes of the experience. You will be vulnerable, and if you are with other people, you are likely to make a fool of yourself. You will have strange and potentially dangerous thoughts. The experience can be dark, introspective, and yield false revelations. It can be compulsive and addictive. It can make you think you are going insane.
If you are having a difficult experience, try these exercises to help manage it. They are what I do if I find myself anxious or scared during a trip. I cannot guarantee that they will work for anyone else:
Please, please, be careful, do your research, and make sure you keep yourself and others safe.
Below are some resources for you to find out more, so that if you use, you can at least be well informed:
Erowid Methoxetamine Vault
Bluelight Bid and Dandy Methoxetamine thread (this is the seventh thread, the others will be in the archive).
Methoxetamine was developed for distribution on the grey market. Pharmaceutical drugs, like ketamine, undergo extensive studies in both animals and humans to ensure that they are safe enough to be widely used. Illicit drugs with a long history, like cannabis and LSD, have known safety profiles, and the fact that they have been used for a long time by many people means that we have some idea of the long-term consequences of taking these drugs. Methoxetamine is new. For all we know, it could cause horrible problems for users in the long term. The chances are that it's probably OK, but we just don't know for sure.
---
My hope is that this thread can serve as resource for the potential first time users that might be looking into this drug as a result of the recent greedy actions of a few selfish individuals. You know who you are, and if you are reading this, go fuck yourselves. This thread might draw negative attention to this drug, maybe even contribute to it being banned However, if it makes one person who is not ready for this drug reconsider, and help them avoid an unpleasant experience, then it is worthwhile. Remember, this site is about harm reduction. I welcome comments and criticism, and I do not feel I own this thread, I am happy to see it edited/otherwise fucked around with by the mods so that it might best serve its purpose. If anyone has anything they think should be added or subtracted, any ideas about how to make the format easier to read, or any other comments, please share. I will try to answer any questions as best I can.
- Methoxetamine is not for everyone. It is not euphoric or stimulating. It can be weird, intense, and terrifying. Most people will not really enjoy the experience. Think carefully about why you want to try this drug, and if you have doubts, stay clear.
- If you want to use this drug, you should know that it is very potent. You will probably need less than you think you do. Remember, you can always use more, never less. Buy some accurate scales, or if you must judge doses by eye, start VERY small. 10mg or 15mg (a mg or milligram is 1/1000 of a gram) is an appropriate dose.
- Methoxetamine is a dissociative, a type of hallucinogen. It will not get you "buzzing", it will warp your mind.
- Should you really want to try methoxetamine, do it in a safe place with people you trust. Look after them and yourself. If you know someone who has used it, ask if you can try it in their company.
- Do not use methoxetamine for the first time if you are using any other drugs, including cannabis, alcohol, or psychiatric medications.
- Methoxetamine is a research chemical. It has not undergone toxicity studies in animals or humans. The effects of this drug on your health are not known. The fact that it is legal does not make it safe.
Firstly, it ought to be made clear that methoxetamine is not really a club drug. If you are looking for a replacement for mephedrone or MDMA, this is not it. Methoxetamine is a dissociative drug, meaning that has an action similar to ketamine and PCP (it is also structurally related to both these drugs). It will not produce rushes of euphoria- it is a strange, powerful, confusing experience, and it can be very scary. If you are not experienced with using mind-altering drugs, this stuff is not for you. It is highly potent, requiring doses as low as ten or fifteen milligrams (that means that a gram could have up to 100 doses in it). You cannot just pour a line out of a bag, snort it, and hope for the best. I am going to relate some experiences of mine to illustrate this.
I have been using methoxetamine for about a year, and I have extensive experience of using drugs such as LSD, the 2C family, mushrooms, DMT, ketamine, nitrous oxide, various PCP analogues... you get the picture. I am into hallucinogens in a big way. None of this prevented what was one of the most terrifying experiences of my life. After a night of using Ecstasy, 2C-B, 2C-C, cannabis, and alcohol, I returned home, and took some methoxetamine. I made myself a large line, of unknown dose, and snorted it over a short period of time. What followed was an unmitigated nightmare. Logic and identity imploded. I was lost, petrified, at times fearing that my consciousness was broken and that I would lose my mind. I have had difficult drug experiences before, and have acquired the ability to manage them to some extent with techniques such as breathing exercises- even so, there were times when it seemed impossible that I could ever emerge from the swirling vortex of insanity in one piece. This went on for hours- I slept, after using Valium to knock myself out, only to re-emerge into the maelstrom on awakening. I took the dose in the wee hours of Saturday morning, and it was a full 24 hours before some semblance of normality returned. I was shaken. If you use methoxetamine, this might happen to you. If this does not sound like the sort of thing you are ready for, then do not use it. A friend of mine, also experienced with psychedelics and dissociatives, had a panic attack after just 15mg of methoxetamine (he had drunk a significant quantity of alcohol beforehand). On that same occasion, and with the same dose, another friend spent 3 or 4 hours rolling around on the floor half-naked and semi-conscious, and later had no memory of the experience (luckily, he was in his own home). I have given this drug to quite a few of my friends, all of them experienced drug users, and fewer than 50% of them have found the experience enjoyable or worthwhile. This is no joke- do not think that you are too strong, too clever for this to happen to you. Methoxetamine is not a forgiving drug, and you will pay for your bravado. As I say, I have used powerful hallucinogens for about a decade, and I found myself out of my depth. If you do not know what you are doing, then stay away. My behaviour was irresponsible, and I paid the price. Do not make the same mistake I did.
If you do decide to try this drug, please be responsible. Buy a scale that is accurate to the milligram (one with three places after the decimal point). Start low- 10 or 15mg is an appropriate starting point. Do not just pour an amount out of the bag and snort or eat it, and if you must, use an EXTREMELY small dose (think something the size of the head of a match). Do not use it for the first time in a club, do it in a safe place that you feel comfortable in, like your home or the home of a friend. Do not use this drug irresponsibly- do not let your friends do so. You might hear that this drug is similar to ketamine. That is true to some extent, but most find that methoxetamine is more manic and confusing, and it is certainly more potent by weight and longer lasting. Ketamine leaves the user immobilised- methoxetamine does not, and if you overdo it, you will still be active and mobile, and capable of hurting yourself or others.
It is difficult to explain what dissociatives feel like, but I will try. One becomes detached from the world, insulated from external stimuli, and the mind fills the void. Hallucinations and confusion are keynotes of the experience. You will be vulnerable, and if you are with other people, you are likely to make a fool of yourself. You will have strange and potentially dangerous thoughts. The experience can be dark, introspective, and yield false revelations. It can be compulsive and addictive. It can make you think you are going insane.
If you are having a difficult experience, try these exercises to help manage it. They are what I do if I find myself anxious or scared during a trip. I cannot guarantee that they will work for anyone else:
- Breathe deeply and slowly. Breathe in through your nose, out through your mouth, in a calm, controlled manner. Keep doing this. If you are with others, have them join you. Panting/hyperventilating will only exacerbate the problem.
- Take any shoes and socks off and get your feet touching the floor. It helps me to feel more grounded.
- Turn the lights on. I have had more than one tough trip that was turned around by not being in the dark. Light makes the trip less intense/egocentric and more positive, in my experience.
- Remember that you have taken some drugs, and that this experience will end. You are not going insane, you have not lost the plot, and everything will eventually be alright. If you have someone else with you, get them to remind you of this.
- Be very careful if you use cannabis to try to chill yourself out. In my experience, this tends to backfire, and to make the trip more powerful and anxiogenic.
Please, please, be careful, do your research, and make sure you keep yourself and others safe.
Below are some resources for you to find out more, so that if you use, you can at least be well informed:Erowid Methoxetamine Vault
Bluelight Bid and Dandy Methoxetamine thread (this is the seventh thread, the others will be in the archive).
Methoxetamine was developed for distribution on the grey market. Pharmaceutical drugs, like ketamine, undergo extensive studies in both animals and humans to ensure that they are safe enough to be widely used. Illicit drugs with a long history, like cannabis and LSD, have known safety profiles, and the fact that they have been used for a long time by many people means that we have some idea of the long-term consequences of taking these drugs. Methoxetamine is new. For all we know, it could cause horrible problems for users in the long term. The chances are that it's probably OK, but we just don't know for sure.
---
My hope is that this thread can serve as resource for the potential first time users that might be looking into this drug as a result of the recent greedy actions of a few selfish individuals. You know who you are, and if you are reading this, go fuck yourselves. This thread might draw negative attention to this drug, maybe even contribute to it being banned However, if it makes one person who is not ready for this drug reconsider, and help them avoid an unpleasant experience, then it is worthwhile. Remember, this site is about harm reduction. I welcome comments and criticism, and I do not feel I own this thread, I am happy to see it edited/otherwise fucked around with by the mods so that it might best serve its purpose. If anyone has anything they think should be added or subtracted, any ideas about how to make the format easier to read, or any other comments, please share. I will try to answer any questions as best I can.
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