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[MEGA] JWH-018 Thread

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Sorry, I don't have the link. I could be mistaken. I remember reading a pretty in-depth article about JWH-018. I took it to mean that it was carcinogenic, just unknown to what degree. One cig? A pack? I don't know, or care much because I don't smoke JWH anymore. If I get the time, I'll try to dig up that article
 
Coolio said:
The feeling you are experiencing in your "heart" is what people refer to as "anxiety". A physical pain in the chest is anxiety/nervousness. It's manifested by your psyche.
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this makes alota sence to me which is why in my first post i pointed out, is this just me freaking out with the typical anxiety... or is this shit poison...to me. i cant pretend to be a chemist but i fully understand that the SAME drugs CAN have different effects on different people. BUT i gota say im still just in a WTF mode over the fact that this specific heart issue\pain i'm talking about, once again, started on the first day i smoked 018 and now lingers weeks later. A feeling i can only compare to former cocaine use, and if you wanna know about the frequency of my cocaine use, not once this year maybe 3-4 time last year which is a totally typical rate for me. i obviously need a checkup and am gunna get it asap, hmmmm...idk i just saw a few really deep posts by ppl like murphy and have been left wondering. can anyone tell me with such depth why or why not this could even possibly be affecting my heart so much time after consumption.
 
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if you were feeling actual pain in your heart for this long, you'd probably be dead by now. the pain is either in your lungs (caused by cigarettes) or in your head (caused by anxiety). either way, try quitting the cigs and it WILL get better.

how is your overall health? can you climb two flights of stairs without stopping to wheeze like a ninety-year-old? how much water do you drink daily? caffeine? how much sleep do you get?

i'm convinced that this issue was already present in your body, it just took a panic attack for you to notice it.
 
i also have gotten a pain in my heart area, left center side of the chest, and am pretty sure that jwh-018 is at the very best making the pain worse. smoked it for months without any bad side effects. then i started to notice a mild pain, which eventually got stronger, and appeared periodically when i was not high, and even several days after getting high, it seems to be pretty much permanent now, although i smoke very little jwh-018 now because of this. no more than once a week. comes and goes.

i do not smoke other than cannibinoid blends, or cannibis. am in good shape, excersise & running seemed to make it feel better usually, so i came to the conclusion it is not in fact my heart or lungs, but what is it exactly i have no clue.

i can't say for sure that is was jwh-018 even, only that smoking blends made the pain much worse, and cutting way back on the smoking blends made it much more mild, although it has not disappeared completely.
 
greenmeanies said:
if you were feeling actual pain in your heart for this long, you'd probably be dead by now. the pain is either in your lungs (caused by cigarettes) or in your head (caused by anxiety). either way, try quitting the cigs and it WILL get better.

how is your overall health? can you climb two flights of stairs without stopping to wheeze like a ninety-year-old? how much water do you drink daily? caffeine? how much sleep do you get?

i'm convinced that this issue was already present in your body, it just took a panic attack for you to notice it.
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it must of just been the anxiety for me then, i dont smoke anything, no cigs or bud...nada this was the first time smoking anything in like 2 years. Im in great shape and exercise frequently. Is there anything i can do about the heart racing extreme anxiety that i experienced when i smoked this? Or am i just SOL and out some $$ ahah :|
 
there should be a thread where knowledgeable experimenters post which active ingredients they suspect are in which legal blends, i dunno if thats crossing any forum lines? seems like it would be in the interest of harm reduction. maybe this is the thread for that?
the reason i am suggesting is i cant find any resource like that after scouring the internet, and recently acquired a packet of SPIKE "Gold" in a gas station, smoked 1 bowl in 3 hits and shit was seriously intense, like coming up on mushrooms and doin a bump of bad blow, was way too high a dose of whatever was in that... if i smoke extremely small amounts mixed up in a bowl of reggies its comparable to numerous bowls of headyyy bud.. really fuckin weird though. not sure if its giving me a headache the next day or not yet, if others start saying the same will def cut the shit out.
 
xivixive said:
there should be a thread where knowledgeable experimenters post which active ingredients they suspect are in which legal blends, i dunno if thats crossing any forum lines? seems like it would be in the interest of harm reduction.
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NOOOOOO! What makes you think THAT?

Speculation? That's not harm reduction, that's retarded.

Until there are some GC/MS results, you should not be speculating what's in these random blends. You especially shouldn't be telling other people about your stupid speculations.

You cannot possibly determine what's in these from subjective experience results. You need analytical laboratory results documented.
 
I did a TON of research on this stuff before trying it and have read pretty much everything available on the internet pertaining to JWH but I see a lot of what looks like typical cannabis type freak outs.

People describing cannabis panic to the T sometimes very extreme which is understandable as anything with dosage in the mg range is gonna cause problems in an uncontrolled situation like these smoking blends.

I have a blend that I take 1 hit- no joke- just 1 regular hit and am BLOWN like the equivalent of smoking an entire bowl of strong pot- and I have a pretty solid tolerance to Cannabis. I can't imagine someone with less tolerance taking even 3 or 4 hits of this stuff it would be a sure recipe for trouble.

What little evidence there is out there seems to point to JWH having no effect on the heart whatsoever so your heart problems are probably anxiety which is super common. There is nothing about this drug which would cause chest pain the biggest risk right now appears to be long term, or at least semi long term cancer risk of some sort. This has nothing to do with the heart.
 
I think almost everyone who has ever tried jwh-018 ended up doing too much at some point, and had similar symptoms. I mean, if you could smoke five blunts in one hit, chances are you'd have a panic attack (or at the least an unpleasant experience.) If overdosing were dangerous you'd be seeing a fentanyl-esque epidemic by now. People are getting way too high, yes, but um....I think that's it.
 
^ For now. There isn't much information about long-term effects, or really much about effects in general. These are relatively new RCs and are just now gaining more popularity through boards such as this.

As use goes up, so will accusations. Some will be true, some won't. Simply not much research done on these for human consumption.
 
Personally, I wouldn't smoke something long term that has the potential to be carcinogenic. I know very little about pharmacology but the discussion of its potentially carcinogenic metabolites are enough to make me avoid smoking these chemicals. Especially when I have good cannabis that is readily available.

I have tried it and it is good (particularly 018 ) but I would never use it as a full on replacement for cannabis until these persistent rumors of its toxicity are cleared up.

Even if it is just speculation with no hard evidence to support it's still enough to make me avoid it until I know more. It is just really hard to justify smoking it IMO. I'm not just gonna smoke it and hope that the rumors about cancerous metabolites aren't true. It just doesn't seem worth it at all.

For those of you who smoke this a lot: is it really worth it? I know you probably rationalize that it hasn't been PROVEN to cause cancer but that just doesn't seem like the best reasoning. Why not just wait till more study has been done? The fact that all these blends (particularly K2) are getting so much media attention will hopefully spur some more research into its toxicity.

I have enough things to worry about already. I don't need to be wondering whether what I am smoking will cause me to develop lung cancer in 15 years.

Even the guy who created the drug says it's a bad idea.

Also, on a side note. In one interview Huffman said that JWH is supposed to be an amber gel and that the powder form is the result of a botched synth. Is this true or is he just wrong? Perhaps chemists are making it into that form purposefully so that it can be easily distributed and smoked.
 
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I find it more likely that the anti-cancer effects of generic CB1/CB2 agonism would prevail. All cannabinoids seem to have an anti-tumor effect, even if they were simultaneously creating DNA interlocuters.
 
Delta-9-THC said:
Also, on a side note. In one interview Huffman said that JWH is supposed to be an amber gel and that the powder form is the result of a botched synth. Is this true or is he just wrong? Perhaps chemists are making it into that form purposefully so that it can be easily distributed and smoked.
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Huffman doesn't know what he's talking about. Just because he invented it doesn't mean he knew how to purify it.

The amber color comes from an impurity which a certain BLer has separated out using acetone or IPA before. Pure JWH-018 is an amorphous white substance, and it goes yellow->red->brown as you add more of this unidentified impurity.
 
I figured that something like that would be the case. It wouldn't make sense that all the JWH on the market is a botched synth.

I still find the whole potentially cancerous metabolites thing pretty sketchy. I don't know enough about pharmacology to ease my mind on this so I kind of have to just take other people's word for it. I have no way of knowing whether you're right (about the DNA mutation effects being cancelled out) or whether the other people are. I don't think it's something worth taking a risk on considering cannabis is known to be pretty safe and has the same effects (not to mention tastes better).

I've had a couple grams of JWH sitting around that I haven't touched since the first few times because of this. It's not worth the paranoia of worrying about whether I'm causing serious damage to my DNA.

Even if the whole thing is being exaggerated I'd rather be safe than sorry in this case. Especially considering that there is a much safer alternative that does basically the same thing. The extra legal protection and the novelty of having pure cannabinoids isn't worth while for me. Hopefully some more research is done soon.
 
Not that the DNA mutation effects are cancelled out... more like the speculation that JWH-018 would have as strong an anti-tumor effect as JWH-015, CP 55940, or THC is more realistic to me than any speculation about carcinogenic epoxide intermediates. Without evidence I'm not going around saying either one is true. But based on speculation alone you could also think that JWH-018 is THE CURE FOR CANCER, period.
 
Coolio said:
I find it more likely that the anti-cancer effects of generic CB1/CB2 agonism would prevail. All cannabinoids seem to have an anti-tumor effect, even if they were simultaneously creating DNA interlocuters.
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OK. From this statement I thought you were saying that even if it did produce DNA damaging metabolites that it wouldn't matter because of the simultaneous cancer fighting properties it could have.

That is still a big assumption and not enough to make me feel safe smoking this stuff. I know it is all just speculation but it is still worrying. Doesn't seem worth the risk when we have something readily available that produces the same general effect that is known to be pretty benign physically (i.e. cannabis).
 
greenmeanies said:
if you were feeling actual pain in your heart for this long, you'd probably be dead by now. the pain is either in your lungs (caused by cigarettes) or in your head (caused by anxiety). either way, try quitting the cigs and it WILL get better.

how is your overall health? can you climb two flights of stairs without stopping to wheeze like a ninety-year-old? how much water do you drink daily? caffeine? how much sleep do you get?

i'm convinced that this issue was already present in your body, it just took a panic attack for you to notice it.
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I'm tryin to stay as unbiased and scientific as possible, and the symptom lingering as long as it did\is just seems like a bit more than I want to ignore. Although I almost exclusively feel it when I cough now, still only on the upper left portion of my chest.

As far as my health goes, if i hit 7-10 flights of stairs id be breathing heavy, not nearly enough water and way too much soda, sure. I get as much sleep as I can, when I can. Not that I wake up much (in the middle of the night) but it's always been hard for me to fall asleep.
 
Delta-9-THC said:
Personally, I wouldn't smoke something long term that has the potential to be carcinogenic. I know very little about pharmacology but the discussion of its potentially carcinogenic metabolites are enough to make me avoid smoking these chemicals. Especially when I have good cannabis that is readily available.
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This drug has been out in K2 and spice like blends since at least 2002. There are no official human trials but seriously in all that time how is it that there aren't more reports of issues\ods\hospitalizations? Well I looked for such reports up and down anyway, I couldn't find any that involved just 018. imo it was instantly like 50% less scary.
 
Coolio said:
Because he's talking about cancer, not overdoses.
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meh what doesn't give you cancer nowadays...we get hit with radiation 24\7 =x. my uncle just survived a tift with cancer in his lymph nodes, he never drank or smoked, probably ate too much red meat. I don't live in fear that shit is everywhere and there's always a chance of cancer from a lot of random ass stuff.
even really healthy drug free people get it. I mean I'm not gunna go roll around in asbestos or chug benzene but fuck all if I'm giving up my red meats or car for fear of cancer potential or emissions. ::ahem:: pardon the french. like i said i smoke cigarettes though lol...

anyway http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/12093064/fpart/7/vc/1 i found this, more ppl complaining about their heart. now i'm gettin worried a bit.
 
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