• MDMA &
    Empathogenic
    Drugs

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MDMA.. Not as safe as we think?

Cheers! Dude I know how u feel, Ive had the same attack on my post and ive noticed people dont read what u say they make their own version and take things out of context and hear what they want to and try an manipulate the situation to suit them and u find ureself repeating the same thing over and over thinking that u can clarify or reason with them but its useless.

Most come here just to argue pointlessly, due to boredom or perhaps some sort of aggrivation brought on buy their drug use..I dunno but...I hope everything works out for you.

peace
 
I disagree I think this has a lot to do with this thread.Is crack responsible for the addict, he knew it was addictive but did it anyways making it his fault.

Unlucky said:
perhaps some sort of aggrivation brought on buy their drug use
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If that was a well known side effect of the drug and I took it anyways I would in fact be responsible.;)
 
Unlucky said:
Cheers! Dude I know how u feel, Ive had the same attack on my post and ive noticed people dont read what u say they make their own version and take things out of context and hear what they want to and try an manipulate the situation to suit them and u find ureself repeating the same thing over and over thinking that u can clarify or reason with them but its useless. Most come her just to argue pointlessly, perhaps some sort of aggrivation brought on buy their drug use..I dunno but...I hope everything works out for you.

peace
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hehe but hey.. they should take responsibility for their actions right hahaha 8( you sir have brains! I am off now take care.
 
trip.more said:
I disagree I think this has a lot to do with this thread.Is crack responsible for the addict, he knew it was addictive but did it anyways making it his fault.
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NO MY CAR IS FASTER THAN YOUR BIKE!
 
Unlucky said:
Why do people immedeately assume that individuals who've suffered drug harm do not take responsibilty? Why keep saying that? Im yet to come across anyone whos had negative problems with drugs denying that they were irresponsible. Some of you's are serious trippers for thinking otherwise!!!

No ones said, it wa purely the drugs fault im just an innocent lil angel. Im glad that ure a responsible drug user but i beleive ure a minority particularly in the rave scene, any of the drug users out there have the potential to develop negative effects, some may come here seeking for advice, unfortunately I feel for those people cause they are bound to be confronted with scepticism and a negative attitude by the majority here.

Majority of people who experience bad raeactions own up to it, just as i did in my pots when people were atacking me to take responsibiltyt even thou i never said I didn't. I admitted it was my fault just as the OP here has, but people still kept going on about taking ownership, dam! It must be all part of that denial response I mentioned earlier!

The point of this thread isnt debating responsibilty, his just simply raising awareness as thre have been a lot of people denying this could happen. If iI could be stuffed I'd go back an quote each one..

Just as people come on BL and talk about their positive drug experience his talking about his negative one. You dont hear people whinging to those who discuss positive experiences then why attack his negative views.

The points is drugs can have unexpected consequences,your saying that the bad effects are already discussed and mentioned in the BL forums, well guess what... u go tell that to the people who have been denying the OP's concerns. Cause it sounds to me like they sure dont know of thses consequences are let alone accept them.
Bl wa sdesigned to raise harm awareness rite? well thats exactly what this Op's doing, he should be getting more support rather than comments from people who can't practice what they preach!
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I personally think that you are not giving credit where credit is due. There are more people on this board who tend to agree with the OP than not agree with him. If you have spent any amount of time reading posts on this board you would know that. Not everyone here thinks that drugs are harmless.

I also have to disagree with your statement about everyone being treated with skeptisim on this board. I think the majority of the posters in this forum are extremely helpful and knowledgeable individuals and I think that they do a GREAT job helping other people.

I am also (as anyone can tell you) an extremely strong advocate of harm reduction and I'm far from being the only one. Again, if you spent any amount of time on this board you would know that.

As far as "practicing what you preach", no one can ever accuse me of not following my own advice, I NEVER hand out advice to people that I wouldn't take myself.
 
Purplefirefly I appoligise if I offended you because I have also seen a lot of positive support and advice form you on BL, I may have not posted a lot but ive read a lot of your comments on BL which I think to be good advice and suggestions, but i still think u were wrong to say ""No, your CHOICE to ingest that drug landed you where you are"Take responsibility." beacuse there was never an issue for us about taking responsibilty.

I have read this post from the start to the end which is why I decided to add my opinion, otherwise i wouldn't dare jump in on the last page for the sake of arguing. And yes there is great advice, knowledge on BL in general but most of the responses regarding people's negative experiences to drugs seem to be met with scepticism imo, other than that everything else is sweet here.

I can also undertand where this scepticism generates from, before i came here I din;t even know what trolling meant, but ive seen a lot of it and I think those that troll and bullshit lead to undermining the credibilty of others who are genuine as ive experienced first hand.
 
keyholder said:
Hey everyone.. When i first joined this board i was astonished by all the information on MDMA/ecstasy.. Its awesome and soon as i saw the bits proving that if you have MDMA in moderation there is minimal harm done to the body.. Well i actually disagree with this now.. I have never abused ecstasy i did it once a month for a year then took a 4month break then started again for once a month and i have to say i have noticed a problem with my memory.. i find it harder to study, remember things etc compared to before i had taken ecstasy.. I don't smoke weed, never even tried it.. I've used speed, base and ritalin too (in the break from ecstasy that i had for 4months) and i have healthy lifestyle i exercise pretty much everyday and drink occasionally some weekends. 90% of the times i rolled i preloaded/postloaded with antioxidants and 5-htp too.

Anyway i just thought i would share this with people, i love mdma and i have educated others who talk crap about all the myths about MDMA but it feels like it has come back and kicked me in the ass even though i have been careful :P

Keyholder.

EDIT: hehe my posts are 123 hahaha :P
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Keyholder...........you are trying to suggest that mdma caused you to have short term memory problems.

Now while this is quite possible, its also impossible to say this for sure.

By your own admittance you have used other drugs as well including speed and ritalin.

You also admit that you dont believe your pills are just mdma.

Hence for you to be blaming the mdma solely is just not possible.

This is the exact same thing that unlucky tried to do.

The fact is that there is no basis at all to your decision making process and that is the reason why various posters are arking up.........exactly the same as they did for unlucky.


I have allowed this thread to stay open in the hope it would bring some quality interaction and also that maybe you and others can see that what you are saying makes no scientific sense whatsoever.

I am going to now allow you the final word, provided you can keep it within the guidelines and then this is being closed up as its never going to go any futrther than what it has already.

Cheers.
 
MazDan said:
Keyholder...........you are trying to suggest that mdma caused you to have short term memory problems.

Now while this is quite possible, its also impossible to say this for sure.

By your own admittance you have used other drugs as well including speed and ritalin.

You also admit that you dont believe your pills are just mdma.

Hence for you to be blaming the mdma solely is just not possible.

This is the exact same thing that unlucky tried to do.

The fact is that there is no basis at all to your decision making process and that is the reason why various posters are arking up.........exactly the same as they did for unlucky.


I have allowed this thread to stay open in the hope it would bring some quality interaction and also that maybe you and others can see that what you are saying makes no scientific sense whatsoever.

I am going to now allow you the final word, provided you can keep it within the guidelines and then this is being closed up as its never going to go any futrther than what it has already.

Cheers.
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First of all yes i am suggesting that mdma had something to do with my short term memory problems because of the following: The number of times i have used mdma compared to ritalin (used maybe 3-4 times) and speed (2 times). Compared to ecstasy use over a year once a month (maxing 2 pills each time) it seems more likely that it has something to do with MDMA. Ritalin doesn't have a short term memory effect on people and speed i am not sure of but i would be surprised if it was anything near the cases of people with short term memory issues from MDMA.

And yeah we can go on about how the pills i have gotten might or might not of been JUST MDMA but guess what.. most people don't get only MDMA so as a general population it doesnt matter because its ecstasy use in general i'm talking about.. OK well considering that maybe i shouldn't of put "MDMA not as safe as we think?" maybe ecstasy or pills but we can always just change the title.

Theres no scientific evidence? If i had a lab and the degrees to do scientific testing you know what i would but fact is i don't, this is the best i can contribute to this harm reduction forum without going and finding rats and feeding them ecstasy then buying thousands of dollars worth of equipment to study different regions of their brains.

Its a shame you need to close this thread because i don't see the need to, something that disappoints me is that if i had made this thread saying kind of the opposite of what i said at the start.. something along the lines of "MDMA! Best drug ever! Safe as hell!" then with no scientific evidence at all i stated "that I have been using MDMA with moderation once a month preloading etc and i feel great! the same or better then i did before i started taking ecstasy!" i would be praised and this thread would probably not get closed either.

A quick search and browsing a thread brought me to this thread "x is safe" http://www.bluelight.ru/vb/showthread.php?t=299186&highlight=safe
Still open as wide as a whores cunt :)
 
Mate, the main reason for closing the thread is because of your flames. If you are happy to keep it civil and accepting of others ideas then Im happy to keep it open.

Had you, or anyone else for that matter, started a thread stating that mdma was totally safe then that would also be treated exactly the same way this will be and has been..........with no scientific proof it is simply opinions.

In this case.........who is to say that it wasnt the speed or the mdma or some crap that was in just one of those pills you took or maybe even that its all just in your head.........there is no means of quantifying what your saying..........its only your belief and it is quite possible that it is all just simply the power of suggestion, hell for all we know it may just be that your itching for an argument.........lol, you see the problem?

Nobody can be 100% certain of anything until further research is done and for all we know it may never be done.

Annecdotally many people have reported having short term memory problems and claimed it was mdma related...........quite possibly there is some truth to it.

Nobody can suggest for a second that mdma is totally safe until it is proven to be.



I will allow it to stay open for the time being however just one more flame and its closed without any further discussion.
 
Alright well the flames will stop

Ha i would laugh though if someone did open a thread like this just for argument sake. But in all honesty i am certain its not "in my head' i am having some issues with short term memory and its not because of i am getting older lol if you guys knew how old i was then you would understand (but you don't so i don't blame any assumptions that were made because you thought it was just an aging thing).
 
I just wanted to post quickly to say that myself and keyholder have talked outside the initial heat of the thread etc, and we've come to a good, friendly outcome, and I honestly believe that some useful and interesting debate may come out of this topic if we can all bring our points of view out calmly without being offended when someone voices a different one.

I'm all in favour of reasoned debate and logic, but as I was rather harshly reminded by my conscience earlier, it's far too easy to start attacking each other rather than the point in discussion. Personally, I'm very glad that no hard feelings have been created between myself and keyholder as, after having exchanged a couple of pms, seems to be a good person who's looking for some solid answers to stuff and, if he'll indulge my interpretation of his post here, I think it's also a post made out of a very genuine concern for something he's experiencing.

It's too late for us to go on debating responsibility, as I did and merely came off escalating an argument, what we need to do now is debate the actual overall question. Policitians spend years shifting "responsibility" between each other to avoid having to address the real issues, and they're pro's at laying blame, and I really don't think we can better them at it.

So lets stick to the actual issue of the effects and try and generate some genuinely useful posts that will be of help, not just to keyholder, but to future BLers who may come here searching in the future.

Best wishes to all
 
keyholder said:
A quick search and browsing a thread brought me to this thread "x is safe" http://www.bluelight.ru/vb/showthread.php?t=299186&highlight=safe
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You'll also notice that I debated the original poster in that thread, pointing out that I thought his arguments were flawed.

The reason that thread is still open is that it didn't turn into a flame war. We're not going to censor anyone for their opinions, but we aren't going to let people throw around insults, either.

I'm glad to read the post above mine, kudos to you both for talking, now let's get back to the topic :)
 
then what is the point of your thread ???

it seems you have already decided that mdma is the main reason behind your memory loss and not the other crap you have taken.

you mentioned u have taken ritalin (used maybe 3-4 times) and speed (2 times).
so thats about 6 six times yeah ?

then you mentioned too that u have only used ecstasy once a month for a year. am i right to say you have used ecstasy for about 12 times and speed for about 6 ?

hell you prob know you have had even more speed/meth in your system than you wanted to - they're heaps in aussie pills.

the point im trying to make is -
if you go to a doctor now and tell him your problems, how would you think he could diagnose and pinpoint the problem ???

E because u used it more often ??? (and you think so)
why would the doctor take the rest of the stuff outta the equation ???
you also say u drink occasionally on the weekends- alcohol is not a drug too, no ?
 
alcohol is a drug lol but how many people do you know that get memory issues from drinking alcohol every now and then on weekends? And yes that is 6 times.. Whats your point? Memory loss isn't a symptom of ritalin last time i checked and as for speed i'am not sure is it? I don't understand what you mean with the part about the doctor.. I havent "taken the rest of the stuff outta the equation" i have ruled them out for specific reasons.. alcohol being no characteristics or symptoms to cause memory issues and ritalin/speed the same or atleast with that little use.

Once AGAIN on the topic that there could be other stuff in my pills yeah ok i know this.. but what.. you think iam the only person in the world who doesnt have PURE MDMA pills? LOL. If you average it out over a population most people won't get mdma clean pills so what difference does it make.. MDMA/Ecstasy either way we are talking about "pills" in general. AND before u tell me i should of put that in the thread title yeah i already know oh well shit happens hehe
 
Yeah I do experience weaker short term memory (which I half chalk up to smoking weed 5 days a week) and slurred speech directly following any night I drop for about a week coming (as mentioned by user Le Junk)... but these are all things that one accepts in the grand scheme of things.

If the experiences are worth some mild deficencies than so be it. It's your body and you exercise your best judgement to find a comfortable baseline or standard. :)
 
keyholder said:
alcohol is a drug lol but how many people do you know that get memory issues from drinking alcohol every now and then on weekends? And yes that is 6 times.. Whats your point? Memory loss isn't a symptom of ritalin last time i checked and as for speed i'am not sure is it? I don't understand what you mean with the part about the doctor.. I havent "taken the rest of the stuff outta the equation" i have ruled them out for specific reasons.. alcohol being no characteristics or symptoms to cause memory issues and ritalin/speed the same or atleast with that little use.

Once AGAIN on the topic that there could be other stuff in my pills yeah ok i know this.. but what.. you think iam the only person in the world who doesnt have PURE MDMA pills? LOL. If you average it out over a population most people won't get mdma clean pills so what difference does it make.. MDMA/Ecstasy either way we are talking about "pills" in general. AND before u tell me i should of put that in the thread title yeah i already know oh well shit happens hehe
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alcohol, speed, ritalin have all been linked to memory losses. and no im too lazy to link you the articles go read them yourself.

and yes there is a difference between mdma and 'pills'. even if u take all the adulterants out of the picture, the pill that you have taken might have been mda/mdea/mdma etc. that is why most pills on pillreports are labelled mdxx.
unless you have lab tested your pills, you wont know what the exact contents are.

Lastly, i dont we need to continue this discussion. you have already made up your mind that mdma/'pills' are the reason behind your memory loss.
You seem angry and dejected by being misled by bl and therefore my suggestion is for you to have a chat with your doctor as i think you are sufferring from some sort of mild depression.

ps: again im not saying mdma might not be causing your memory loss. im saying alot of other things might too.
 
i stopped E for a few weeks ( weekly user here) and did speed, base and meth for a change.

E all i got was a bit moody sometimes and maybe some anxiety. but the memory problems only came into play when i started with the amphetamines.
 
EnergizerBunny said:
alcohol, speed, ritalin have all been linked to memory losses. and no im too lazy to link you the articles go read them yourself.

and yes there is a difference between mdma and 'pills'. even if u take all the adulterants out of the picture, the pill that you have taken might have been mda/mdea/mdma etc. that is why most pills on pillreports are labelled mdxx.
unless you have lab tested your pills, you wont know what the exact contents are.

Lastly, i dont we need to continue this discussion. you have already made up your mind that mdma/'pills' are the reason behind your memory loss.
You seem angry and dejected by being misled by bl and therefore my suggestion is for you to have a chat with your doctor as i think you are sufferring from some sort of mild depression.

ps: again im not saying mdma might not be causing your memory loss. im saying alot of other things might too.
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HAHAHA mild depression? angry and dejected by being mislead by bl? hehehe ok EnergizerBunny =D =D thanks for your input anyway %)
 
Wanderer said:
i stopped E for a few weeks ( weekly user here) and did speed, base and meth for a change.

E all i got was a bit moody sometimes and maybe some anxiety. but the memory problems only came into play when i started with the amphetamines.
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Interesting.. I have a few friends who only use amphetamines and they use them pretty much every few weeks but never have issues with memory only insomnia but yeah everyones different i guess.. actually thinking about it now one of them does have problems with memory but his a heavy marijuana user and is convinced its due to that.. maybe its a combination of both who knows.
 
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