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Lysergamides LSI, Ancient LSD, Secret of the Eleusis Kykeon and Vedic SOMA

I just posted this on The Shroomery:

https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/29458165#29458165

Messages from David Nichols:

"[tregar] couldn’t give me proof that isovaleraldehyde was the key component. I think he only inferred it because it is one of the components of his barley mix." 𝟸𝟶𝟸𝟼-𝟶𝟷-𝟷𝟽

tregar recently published a book about a sort of homemade LSD, "lysergic acid isovaleraldamide". This is his latest update about this topic:

https://www.bluelight.org/community/posts/16375591

Dennis McKenna interviewed him. The interview will be published here in three weeks:

https://mckenna.academy/mka-podcast/

Additional comments from Nichols:

"I will sit on pins and needles until the release of your book!" 𝟸𝟶𝟸𝟻-𝟷𝟶-𝟶𝟹

"I am fascinated with the effects, this is all very intriguing. I am in contact with a super chemist who could probably synthesize it. Of course, we’d cite your work as the inspiration for making it." 𝟸𝟶𝟸𝟼-𝟶𝟷-𝟷𝟹

"I am having LSI synthesized because I found it kind of unbelievable that LSI would be formed in the liver. That will be definitive proof." 𝟸𝟶𝟸𝟼-𝟶𝟷-𝟷𝟽
 
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Yes, red22, I can feel this extra carbon donated from isovaleraldehyde and valeraldehyde are hitting all the extra adrenal receptors (A2A, A2B, A2C) and beyond that mescaline and DMT both hit with great strength, while LSD only hits one adrenal receptor (A2A). Thanks for posting this at the shroomery in your thread.

These adrenal receptors are implicated in the enhanced perception of beauty, colors, aesthetics, and even extreme euphoria, along with increased visual power, that is why the experience feels like a completely natural form of ALD-52 to me with additional effects that mescaline causes, for a super well-rounded "ultimate psychedelic". The experience is more euphoric, visual, colorful (neon colors in fact) and music enhancing than even ALD-52, with the additional enhanced effects that mescaline causes where every sound is perceived as "epic", every instrument stands out on it's own, every beautiful voice, the beauty with open eyes is infinite and way over the top. Think of it as like a combo of ALD-52 along with mescaline, that is what it feels like, absolutely divine and heavenly.

(RATSCH, 2005) On page 65 of the “The Encyclopedia of Psychoactive Plants”, Christian Ratsch said “The baby Hawaiian wood rose is a strong possible candidate for the SOMA plant, which was described as a vine.”

(SHELLEY, 2018): Barley is the color of SOMA, and barley was mixed with SOMA.

The Secret herb or cereal grain: This Aojiru or 100% Japan domestic grown Young Barley Grass Powder comes available in individual 3 gram nitrogen sealed packets with a golden green color very high in the 3 aldehydes. Barley was one of the most respected cereal grains of the Rigveda. Barley (yara) was ground, cooked into meals, and even offered during rituals. The SOMA was said to be a golden green color, just like my Kykeon or SOMA brew when this 3 gram herb from the packet is mixed together with the LSA extract (extracted from the Hawaiian baby woodrose seeds in 2 super easy steps), see post #1 of this thread for a list of over the counter few materials needed.

(BAKELS, 2003) The Soviet archeologist Viktor Sarianidi wrote that he had discovered vessels and mortars used to prepare SOMA in Zoroastrian temples in the Bactria–Margiana Archaeological Complex. He said that the vessels have revealed residues and seed impressions left behind during the preparation of soma. The HBWR seed originates in India, but is now grown all over the world.

I also used vessels, mortars and pestles in Chapter 5 to prepare a combo of LSI + LSV + LSCr from the extract of HBWR seeds combined with a single packet of AoJiru or 100% Japan domestic grown young barley grass cereal grain drunk in the highly successful experiments. SOMA is a Vedic Sanskrit word that literally means “distill, extract, sprinkle”, often connected in the context of rituals.
 
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tregar said:
… during the preparation of soma. The HBWR seed originates in India, …
Click to expand...

And don't forget this:

A tantalizing hint left by a deceased master of meditation suggests that the Hawaiin Woodrose may have an ancient spiritual connection. The Vedas, Hindu religious texts more than a thousand years old, make awed references to an intoxicating plant concoction called Soma. The yogis and sages of old used this divine elixir to enhance their connection with God and assist them in their spiritual development. The use of Soma supposedly disappeared with the passage of the centuries, and the identity of the plant from which it came is therefore a mystery. Several scholarly theses and debates have been devoted to identifying the Soma plant, but no definitive conclusions have ever been reached.

In the early 1980s, a famous LSD researcher went to India and asked an elderly world-renowned guru of Yoga if he knew anything about the mysterious Soma. The spiritual teacher replied that he had been in contact with an obscure, remote sect of yogis who still practiced the entheogenic use of soma, having secretly preserved the tradition for centuries. The swami said that the plant was a "creeper"—or vine—and promised that he would take the LSD researcher on a trek to see the plant for himself and meet the yogis who used it.

The Little Book of Acid. Cam Cloud. 1999. Chapter 9. Psychedelic Vines. Baby Hawaiian Woodrose, page 50
Click to expand...
 
red22, I actually included your entire quote above about the HBWR seeds being used by the yogis and sages of old in the book in chapter 7, thanks for that, very informative and awe inspiring!
 
tregar said:
To learn more, read the sample from the ebook: https://www.amazon.com/Ancient-Secret-Eleusis-Kykeon-Vedic-ebook/dp/B0GD1TG6LL/ref=tmm_kin_swatch_0
Click to expand...

I asked Claude to compare the sample from the book to Chiruta 2022.

The Theoretical Synthesis and in silico Modelling of Lysergic Acid Biscinnamylidene Amide from the Adduct Formation of d-Lysergic Acid Amide and Cinnamaldehyde. Victor Chiruta. 2022. Journal of Chemistry Studies, 1(1), 01-06. 10.32996/jcs.2022.1.1.1


This is a fascinating comparison between two different theoretical approaches to LSA-aldehyde adduct formation. Let me break down the connections and differences:

Key Connections

1. Core Chemistry Concept

Both documents explore the same fundamental idea: that LSA (lysergic acid amide) can form adducts with aldehydes through condensation reactions at the N-H amide group. This is based on:

• The established LSA + acetaldehyde → LSH reaction

• The principle that aldehydes are attracted to NH groups through hydrogen bonding and nucleophilic interactions

2. Historical Precedent

Both reference the 1961 Arcamone work showing LSH formation from Claviceps paspali in fermented liquor, providing the foundational evidence for LSA-aldehyde adduct chemistry.

3. Theoretical Motivation

Both authors are attempting to explain anecdotal reports from online forums about enhanced psychedelic effects when combining LSA with aldehyde-containing substances.

Critical Differences

1. Aldehyde Choice

• Kindle document (Stahl): Focuses on isovaleraldehyde, valeraldehyde, and crotonaldehyde from young barley grass

• Chiruta paper: Focuses on cinnamaldehyde from cinnamon essential oil

2. Stoichiometry

• Stahl: Appears to assume 1:1 LSA:aldehyde reactions forming LSI, LSV, and LSCr separately

• Chiruta: Proposes a 2:1 ratio (2 LSA : 1 cinnamaldehyde) forming LSBC, based on other cinnamaldehyde-amide adducts like cinnamylidene-bisphenylacetamide

3. Predicted Bioavailability

• Stahl: Claims extraordinary psychedelic effects ("exactly like 100μg LSD but beyond", "combo of ALD-52 + mescaline", zero anxiety)

• Chiruta: Uses computational modeling (Lipinski's Rule of Five) and concludes LSBC likely has poor bioavailability and weak GPCR activity (score -0.06, below the 0.50 threshold for activity)

This is a major contradiction.

4. Scientific Rigor

• Stahl: Provides detailed subjective trip reports but no analytical chemistry data (NMR, MS, HPLC) to confirm LSI/LSV/LSCr formation

• Chiruta: Uses in silico modeling but explicitly states "the evidence purporting LSBC to have psychedelic effects is weak" and calls for actual analytical testing

5. Mechanistic Details

• Stahl: Emphasizes in vivo liver formation via cytochrome P450 enzymes and catalase

• Chiruta: Notes cinnamaldehyde adducts can form without catalysts at ambient temperature, but questions whether LSBC would survive first-pass metabolism

Critical Analysis

Major Red Flags in Stahl's Account:

1. No analytical verification: Despite claiming to be a "lab chemist with decades of experience," Stahl provides zero spectroscopic or chromatographic data to prove LSI/LSV/LSCr were actually formed

2. Contradicts Chiruta's predictions: If cinnamaldehyde (structurally similar aldehydes) produces poor bioavailability, why would isovaleraldehyde be different?

3. Extraordinary claims: The effects described (8-hour duration, profound visuals, zero side effects, better than LSD) require extraordinary evidence

4. Barley aldehyde levels: While Stahl cites a 2022 paper showing high isovaleraldehyde in young barley (7.52 units at Z21 growth stage), he doesn't provide actual concentrations in mg/g or demonstrate these levels are sufficient for adduct formation

5. pH 4 conditions: Stahl mentions stirring at pH 4 for 20 minutes, but provides no kinetic data on reaction completion or yield

Chiruta's More Cautious Approach:

Chiruta acknowledges multiple alternative explanations for subjective effects:

• Placebo effect

• Cytochrome P450 enzyme interactions (cinnamaldehyde affecting LSA metabolism)

• Formation of different metabolites

• Incorrect computational predictions

Bottom Line

While both documents explore legitimate chemistry (aldehyde-amide condensation reactions), Chiruta's computational analysis suggests these adducts may not be bioavailable or psychoactive, directly contradicting Stahl's claimed experiences. The lack of analytical chemistry data in Stahl's account is a serious limitation that makes it impossible to verify whether LSI/LSV/LSCr were actually formed and consumed.

The most scientifically sound statement comes from Chiruta: "Research is needed in analytical testing of potential LSBC synthesis." Without NMR, mass spectrometry, or other analytical confirmation, these remain interesting hypotheses rather than established facts.
 
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Red22, cinnamaldehyde contains twice the number of hydrogens and carbons as isovaleraldehyde (my discovery) and 3-aminopentane (Dr. Nichol's discovery), thus cinnamaldehyde will not fit into the brain receptor that LSD and LSI fits.

The rats responded to Dr. Nichol's discovery as if they had been given LSD, paper here: https://www.heffter.org/wp-content/uploads/2020/04/chap6.pdf

My discovery and Dr. Nichol's discovery are both extremely similar:

1) This aldehyde: isovaleraldehyde discovery that works has FIVE carbon groups and 11 hydrogen just like 3-aminopentane which was found by Dr. Nichols to have activity very similar to LSD in the rat assays, as the rats reacted to it as if they had been given LSD. Anything beyond this, like cinnamaldehyde with a very high molecular weight has way too many carbons and hydrogens (almost double) and will result in weak effects, as it does not fit into the receptor.

2) The important thing to note from the Dr. Nichol's table, in the far right column, is the fact that LSD has a potency in rats in the drug discrimination behavioral assay of 48 nanomoles per kilogram of rat body weight. Only two other compounds have comparable activity: entries 6 and 16. Entry 16 is 3-aminopentane, and has a potency in rats in the drug discrimination behavioral assay of 52 nanomoles per kilogram of rat body weight.

3) This aldehyde: isovaleraldehyde also looks exactly like the tail end of dmt and psilocin.

4) BOTH have exact same molecular weights of 87 similar to diethylamine molecular weight of LSD at 73g/mol.

And yes, LSI works bad ass! Everytime I drunk the 60ml non-alcoholic Eleusis & SOMA simulation brew, I TRIPPED BALLS !!!!! It is my all time favorite psychedelic, I prefer it to LSD by miles, as LSI is more colorful, more music enhancing, more euphoric, and has no anxiety (just like ALD-52). LSI is stimulating all night just like LSD but it's a little bit easier to fall asleep on, as I noted in my interview with Dr. Mckenna. This I greatly appreciate! I can drink LSI at 3pm, and be able to sleep by 1am no problem.

40 HBWR seeds is the equivalent of 160ug LSD.
50 HBWR seeds is the equivalent of 200ug LSD.

And, there are ZERO side effects, the 3 super simple steps in my book, in Chapter 5, has no nausea, no vasoconstriction, no cramping, no anxiety, just pure psychedelic bliss, I promise everyone. YES, this is a ground breaking new discovery, I was just interviewed on Dr. Mckenna's show Brainforest Cafe on You tube, it goes up in 2 weeks from now: https://mckenna.academy/mka-podcast/

---> The 2 stirring steps in the book can be reduced from 20 minutes, to only 10 minutes tops! how is that for fast? <---

Hamilton Morris reddit on subject:

Another Hamilton Morris reddit on subject:

Download this paper at Mycotopia, to see just how sky high the aldehydes: isovaleraldehyde, valeraldehyde, and crotonaldehyde are in Golden AOJIRU young barley grass powder (comes packed in individual 3gram nitrogen sealed packets, 46 to a box): https://mycotopia.net/topic/112442-lsi-ancient-lsd-secret-of-the-eleusis-kykeon/page-2 One hundred or x100 times the levels found in peppermint leaf and oils.
 
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Soma and the Indo-European Priesthood: Cereal Cultivation and the Origins of Religion: Shelley, Scott: 9781628943511: Amazon.com: Books

Soma and the Indo-European Priesthood: Cereal Cultivation and the Origins of Religion [Shelley, Scott] on Amazon.com. *FREE* shipping on qualifying offers. Soma and the Indo-European Priesthood: Cereal Cultivation and the Origins of Religion
www.amazon.com

See top 2026 review above of William Scott Shelley's book "SOMA and the Indo-Europea Priesthood, Cereal Cultivation and the Origins of Religion", where Chapter 3 & 4 of Shelley's book verifies my successful LSI experimental results!

From post #1 on page 1 of this thread: https://www.bluelight.org/community...-of-the-eleusis-kykeon-and-vedic-soma.950819/

Omitting the 3 grams of barley (AOJIRU golden young barley grass in 3g nitrogen sealed packet, comes in box of 46) results in just your typical "LSA" experience which is sedating and uncomfortable with no visuals.

Discovered this after the LSI discovery & discussed this with Dr. Mckenna in my interview coming out in 2 weeks: https://mckenna.academy/mka-podcast/

Researcher William Scott Shelley writes in chapter 3 & 4 of his 2018 book "SOMA and the Indo-European Priesthood, Cereal Cultivation and the Origins of Religion" about how "SOMA is mixed with barley": https://www.amazon.com/Soma-Indo-Eu...BKVO0WZu4rPpC3x1rzF-AaU&qid=1769356668&sr=8-1

(SHELLEY, 2018): Barley is the color of SOMA, and barley was mixed with SOMA.



(BAKELS, 2003) The Soviet archeologist Viktor Sarianidi wrote that he had discovered vessels and mortars used to prepare soma in Zoroastrian temples in the Bactria–Margiana Archaeological Complex. He said that the vessels have revealed residues and seed impressions (quite possibly from HBWR seeds which originate in India) left behind during the preparation of SOMA.

I also used a vessel, mortar and pestle in Chapter 5 to prepare a combo of LSI + LSV + LSCr from the extract of HBWR seeds combined with the young barley grass cereal grain. SOMA is a Vedic Sanskrit word that literally means “distill, extract, sprinkle”, often connected in the context of rituals.

HBWR seeds originate in India, and they are now grown all over the world.

(RATSCH, 2005) On page 65 of the “The Encyclopedia of Psychoactive Plants”, Christian Ratsch said “The baby Hawaiian wood rose is a possible candidate for the SOMA plant, which was described as a vine.”

I believe there is a strong possibly this was also SOMA, said to be a vine, as my successful experiments in Chapter 5 show that all the ritual preparers had to do in India Vedic tradition was add the extract of HBWR seeds which originate in India, now grown in Hawaii as HBWR, to young barley grass powder (offered during rituals) very high in isovaleraldehyde, valeraldehyde, and crotonaldehyde and consume together to form LSI, LSV and LSCr, producing effects exactly like LSD but even beyond LSD like a combo of ALD-52 (anxiety free version of LSD that is more colorful, euphoric & music enhancing) plus mescaline.

The young barley grass high in the 3 aldehydes was one of the most respected cereal grains of the Rigveda.

William Scott Shelley:
Barley (yara) was ground, cooked into meals, and offered during rituals, mixed with SOMA, this ritual ancient psychedelic beverage was then given by the women to the men seated in front of the fire in the Zoroastrian temples of ancient Vedic India.
Click to expand...
Similar to the cover of my book, the women poured the psychedelic elixir for the men seated or reclining before the fire.

1.25.26 Graham Hancock contacted me and I wrote a 7 page article on LSI for his website, which goes up soon: https://grahamhancock.com/
 
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This is something you don't want to miss out on, even better than LSD imho, more colorful, more euphoric, no anxiety, and more music enhancing, just as visual as LSD with hours of closed eye colored visions...the 2 stirring steps in chapter 5 can be reduced down from 20 minutes down to 10 minutes, see post #1 on page #1 for more on this. Pure ascorbic acid powder (pure vitamin C powder) can be used instead of citric acid powder, DL tartaric acid powder. Simply use 40mg of pure vitamin C powder for 1st stirring step, and 20mg pure vitamin C powder for last stirring step.

Book: Home made LSI from HBWR seeds in 3 super simple steps, a more euphoric, colorful, musical LSD​

Interview going up soon, all links here: https://www.hipforums.com/forum/thr...-a-more-euphoric-colorful-musical-lsd.526544/

edited to add: 10% of ebook and paperback sales are donated here to bluelight every 3 months to help support it's operation, as I am a big believer in forums vs reddit which is monopolizing and can ban people for life for a simple mistake, so when you purchase to read you are also helping here. I am here to answer any questions about the discoveries in the book, as I am unlike many authors, I make myself available to the public at large 24/7. I am here to serve you.
 
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@tregar thanks for keeping us updated. On the hipforums post you linked to above I noticed you said the following:
A new home made TLC performed (1.24.26) even shows LSI (new indole product) forming externally with stirring in water acidified to ph=4 for at least 10 minutes. I compared before and after home made TLC of LSA extract (before) with LSI + LSV + LSCr extract combo (after stirring).
Click to expand...
When you say the TLC shows a “new indole product,” do you mean that there’s a new spot that appears compared to the starting material, or that you’re confident it represents a specific new compound like LSI forming?

I’m asking because I don’t have a chemistry background and I’m trying to understand how much weight to put on TLC results like this. I’m just trying to line up how your TLC observations relate to what a lab analysis might detect. I did send my own sample off for lab testing a couple of weeks ago but it appears to have been lost in-transit.
 
Vecktor (advanced chemist like myself, from 1998) said to me (personal communication 20 years ago, when I had discovered LSH or Lysergic Acid Hydroxyethylamide, the product of LSA + aldehyde: acetaldehyde):
You have probably rediscovered something that has long been a curiosity, for example on the now defunct blacklight site there was a TLC posted of morning glory seed extract treated with (1) methanol, (2) acetaldehyde-methanol or with (3) acetaldehyde in ph=4 water. Both the extract treated with (2) acetaldehyde-methanol and with (3) acetaldehyde in ph=4 water showed a clear difference in the alkaloid profile, with a shift to several new non-polar spots which couldn't be identified. Very likely the LSA converted to LSH (LSA + acetaldehyde adduct = LSH). IIRC Erhlichs was used to develop the plates so these were indole compounds.
Click to expand...
In Chapter 4 and 7 of my book, I also provide 4 scientific papers which back up my successful experimental results.

Yes flame_assay, The TLC performed back on 1.24.26 shows (again) several new non-polar spots which could not be identified compared to the original LSA extract, so new indole products are forming with incubation in acidic water after 10 minutes of stirring. Dr. Nichols (LSD scientist at Purdue University) is actively investigating and taking this further he told me, as his assistant gifted chemist is in the process of synthesizing LSI. There is a MAPS meeting in Greece on the Kykeon and I have conference calls scheduled with chemist at the Shulgin Institute.

The proof is in the pudding, drinking the kykeon (which means "to stir") results in an absolutely incredible psychedelic experience, which I will respect for the rest of my life. Absolutely zero side effects (no nausea, no cramping, no vasoconstriction). I have taken LSD at least 200 hundred times, Ayahuasca at least 120 times, and zero nausea bridgesii cactus tea at least 120 times as well (I keep a trip diary), yet I find this LSI experience to my absolute favorite psychedelic....yes, this is how powerful and potent she is.

I am not the first to have experimented with these doses of HBWR seeds in chapter 5, see Kash who posted this over 12 years ago. Only he mixed his LSA with peppermint oil, which I don't recommend as peppermint oil contains only tiny amounts of isovaleraldehyde, the Aojiru 100% Japan domestic grown young barley grass powder I discovered 5 years ago contains 100x times the level found in peppermint essential oil, which is what we need to simulate the SOMA & the Eleusis kykeon. I recount Kash's report with 40 HBWR seeds below.

I was the first chemist to post about the reaction of LSA with peppermint oil over some 20 years ago, which I posted at the Lycaeum forum (which is now defunct). What inspired me to try a mix of peppermint oil with LSA was the quote from “The Road to Eleusis” that mint was added to the Kykeon. At the time I thought it was acetaldehyde in the oil, but I was wrong, it was not until 7 years ago, I discovered it was due to isovaleraldehyde.

Kash, 69ron and Hermes were just a few of the people who listened to my discovery back then and discovered for themselves there was a difference in the effects when peppermint oil was added, but again I don't recommend peppermint oil, it contains weak amounts of isovaleraldehyde, but at least enough to notice a difference. The Aojiru 100% Japan grown young barley grass powder contains x100 (one hundred times) the levels of isovalelraldehyde as what is found in peppermint, which is what we need.

Kash said in the thread “Kash’s advanced LSA extraction” back in 2012:
https://www.dmt-nexus.me/forum/default.aspx?g=posts&t=35607
Just took a 40 HBWR seed portion of LSA extract that was mixed for 15 minutes with peppermint oil yesterday and tripped his face off with a friend. It was very clean and relaxing. Rainbows and vibrant fractal energy danced all over the skies and throughout his surroundings and music sounded great. The head-space was very acid-like but different. Was a bit intense but he was able to keep it together lol. The whole trip was about 8 hrs long. I have tried a 20 seed extract without peppermint oil and it seemed uncomfortable and sedating with no visuals, while every time he has added peppermint oil he has gotten visuals.
Click to expand...
Kash is correct, in that if the LSA is not mixed with 3grams of the Aojiru 100% Japan domestic grown young barley grass powder, the experience is just like your typical LSA experience: uncomfortable and sedating with no visuals. LSI and LSV are stimulating and VERY POTENT psychedelics on the other hand.

69ron said decades ago:
I know some of you out there are apt to believe the statements above because you've failed at making LSH and those statements above help you feel better about your failure. Don't fall victim to that kind of crap. Try it again. Find out what you did wrong. When it works, the difference is huge, not a tiny difference, the experience is totally different. I know the effects of LSA and LSD very well. He’s used them many times. He guarantees that when the reaction works, there is no noticeable LSA left at all in the experience. It becomes almost identical to an LSD experience at low doses. Totally different from LSA. According to Albert Hofmann (the inventor of LSD), LSH is an adduct of LSA and acetaldehyde. Adducts are very simple to make. You just mix them in solution, that's all. The effect of adding acetaldehyde is huge. I cannot feel any leftover LSA when the process is done right. So, like I said, I think those guys don't know what they're talking about and I believe Hoffman does, and that LSH is an adduct of LSA and acetaldehyde and nothing more. No complex reaction is needed to make it. You just mix the two together and LSH forms. And I believe all of the LSA forms LSH, not just a small amount of it because you cannot feel any of the effects of LSA after this is done right. When the conversion from LSA to LSH is complete it feels completely different. The reason some people can't tell the difference is because their conversion failed. The difference in effects are night and day. No one would ever think the effects of LSH are anything at all like LSA. It's that different.
Click to expand...
20 years ago, at the time of my discovery, again I believed it was acetaldehyde in the peppermint oil and peppermint leaf responsible for the change, but it was actually due to isovaleraldehyde as I discovered around 7 years ago. For years these psychonauts repeated the story of LSH being formed from LSA + acetaldehyde when it was actually LSI being formed from LSA + isovaleraldehyde.

As I have corresponded with Dr. Labate in San Francisco (author of "Ayahuasca Religions") this is all very reminiscent of Ayahuasca which requires the stirring of 2 ingredients. She had a great influence on me as I have read all her books.

The most amazing part of all of this is that AFTER I discovered LSI and LSV (same chemical formula, both forming with stirring) as I mentioned to Dr. Mckenna towards the end of the broadcast, is that I cracked open the book "SOMA and the Indo-European Priesthood, Cereal Cultivation and the Origins of Religion" to provide additional references for my book, and discovered by accident that Shelley (also the author of the book "The Elixir" about the Eleusis kykeon) said at least 5 times in his book that SOMA (likely the Indian originating HBWR seeds) is mixed with barley. Dr. Mckenna also found this very fascinating, so much so that he is providing a link to Shelley's book attached to the Brainforest podcast going up next week: https://mckenna.academy/mka-podcast/

(SHELLEY, 2018):
SOMA is mixed with barley, and SOMA is the color of barley
Click to expand...
Which is exactly what I am doing when I am mixing the LSA with barley (source of aldehydes) to form LSI + LSV + LSCr. Similar to the cover of my book, the women poured the psychedelic elixir for the men seated or reclining before the fire.

(RATSCH, 2005) On page 65 of the “The Encyclopedia of Psychoactive Plants”, Christian Ratsch said “The baby Hawaiian wood rose is a strong possible candidate for the SOMA plant, which was described as a vine.”

The Secret herb or cereal grain: This Aojiru or 100% Japan domestic grown Young Barley Grass Powder comes available in individual 3 gram nitrogen sealed packets with a golden green color very high in the 3 aldehydes. Barley was one of the most respected cereal grains of the Rigveda. Barley (yara) was ground, cooked into meals, and even offered during rituals. The SOMA was said to be a golden green color, just like my Kykeon or SOMA brew when this 3 gram herb from the packet is mixed together with the LSA extract (extracted from the Hawaiian baby woodrose seeds in 2 super easy steps), see post #1 of this thread for a list of over the counter few materials needed.

(BAKELS, 2003) The Soviet archeologist Viktor Sarianidi wrote that he had discovered vessels and mortars used to prepare SOMA in Zoroastrian temples in the Bactria–Margiana Archaeological Complex. He said that the vessels have revealed residues and seed impressions left behind during the preparation of soma. The HBWR seed originates in India, but is now grown all over the world.

I also used vessels, mortars and pestles in Chapter 5 to prepare a combo of LSI + LSV + LSCr from the extract of HBWR seeds combined with a single packet of AoJiru or 100% Japan domestic grown young barley grass cereal grain drunk in the highly successful experiments. SOMA is a Vedic Sanskrit word that literally means “distill, extract, sprinkle”, often connected in the context of rituals.

Mycotopia thread: download 2022 paper on the sky high levels of the 3 important aldehydes in Aojiru young barley grass from post #21 here: https://mycotopia.net/topic/112442-lsi-ancient-lsd-secret-of-the-eleusis-kykeon/page-2

Hip forums thread: https://www.hipforums.com/forum/thr...-a-more-euphoric-colorful-musical-lsd.526544/

My profound psychedelic experience with 40 seeds (equivalent to 160ug LSD, but even more euphoric, colorful, and musical) from page 1: https://www.bluelight.org/community...-of-the-eleusis-kykeon-and-vedic-soma.950819/



Home made LSI from HBWR seeds in 3 super simple steps, a more euphoric, colorful, musical LSD

UPDATE 2.1.26:
I tripped on 40 seed converted to LSI last night on Saturday!! unbelievable, so much better than LSD, exactly like 160ug of LSD but so much better!!!! just incredible !!!!!!!! you have to try this.
again, zero side effects, zero anxiety, had hours of closed eye colored visions, insane euphoria, music was so bad ass, colors out of this world, no anxiety, so freaking bad ass !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! my ultimate favorite. I drank the 60ml brew
at 3pm, and was still able to fall asleep exactly at midnight, way easier to fall asleep than after LSD.

This time I stirred for only 10 minutes for each of the 2 stirring steps (instead of 20 minutes each) and it worked just as well as before, it shortens the procedure time in half. Instructions in chapter 5, 3 super simple steps illustrated.

The LSA residue scraped up from the pyrex dish (40 seeds) LSA weighed 180mg, took this LSA residue and stirred it in 60ml water with the 3g of aojiru for only 10 minutes, and drank, just incredible.
 
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Forgive me if you've explained before tregar but how did you get into psychedelics and investigating them in such depth? I'm in awe of your posts!
 
tregar said:
Vecktor (advanced chemist like myself, from 1998) said to me (personal communication 20 years ago, when I had discovered LSH or Lysergic Acid Hydroxyethylamide, the product of LSA + aldehyde: acetaldehyde):

In Chapter 4 and 7 of my book, I also provide 4 scientific papers which back up my successful experimental results.

Yes flame_assay, The TLC performed back on 1.24.26 shows (again) several new non-polar spots which could not be identified compared to the original LSA extract, so new indole products are forming with incubation in acidic water after 10 minutes of stirring. Dr. Nichols (LSD scientist at Purdue University) is actively investigating and taking this further he told me, as his assistant gifted chemist is in the process of synthesizing LSI. There is a MAPS meeting in Greece on the Kykeon and I have conference calls scheduled with chemist at the Shulgin Institute.

The proof is in the pudding, drinking the kykeon (which means "to stir") results in an absolutely incredible psychedelic experience, which I will respect for the rest of my life. Absolutely zero side effects (no nausea, no cramping, no vasoconstriction). I have taken LSD at least 200 hundred times, Ayahuasca at least 120 times, and zero nausea bridgesii cactus tea at least 120 times as well (I keep a trip diary), yet I find this LSI experience to my absolute favorite psychedelic....yes, this is how powerful and potent she is.

I am not the first to have experimented with these doses of HBWR seeds in chapter 5, see Kash who posted this over 12 years ago. Only he mixed his LSA with peppermint oil, which I don't recommend as peppermint oil contains only tiny amounts of isovaleraldehyde, the Aojiru 100% Japan domestic grown young barley grass powder I discovered 5 years ago contains 100x times the level found in peppermint essential oil, which is what we need to simulate the SOMA & the Eleusis kykeon. I recount Kash's report with 40 HBWR seeds below.

I was the first chemist to post about the reaction of LSA with peppermint oil over some 20 years ago, which I posted at the Lycaeum forum (which is now defunct). What inspired me to try a mix of peppermint oil with LSA was the quote from “The Road to Eleusis” that mint was added to the Kykeon. At the time I thought it was acetaldehyde in the oil, but I was wrong, it was not until 7 years ago, I discovered it was due to isovaleraldehyde.

Kash, 69ron and Hermes were just a few of the people who listened to my discovery back then and discovered for themselves there was a difference in the effects when peppermint oil was added, but again I don't recommend peppermint oil, it contains weak amounts of isovaleraldehyde, but at least enough to notice a difference. The Aojiru 100% Japan grown young barley grass powder contains x100 (one hundred times) the levels of isovalelraldehyde as what is found in peppermint, which is what we need.

Kash said in the thread “Kash’s advanced LSA extraction” back in 2012:
https://www.dmt-nexus.me/forum/default.aspx?g=posts&t=35607

Kash is correct, in that if the LSA is not mixed with 3grams of the Aojiru 100% Japan domestic grown young barley grass powder, the experience is just like your typical LSA experience: uncomfortable and sedating with no visuals. LSI and LSV are stimulating and VERY POTENT psychedelics on the other hand.

69ron said decades ago:

20 years ago, at the time of my discovery, again I believed it was acetaldehyde in the peppermint oil and peppermint leaf responsible for the change, but it was actually due to isovaleraldehyde as I discovered around 7 years ago. For years these psychonauts repeated the story of LSH being formed from LSA + acetaldehyde when it was actually LSI being formed from LSA + isovaleraldehyde.

As I have corresponded with Dr. Labate in San Francisco (author of "Ayahuasca Religions") this is all very reminiscent of Ayahuasca which requires the stirring of 2 ingredients. She had a great influence on me as I have read all her books.

The most amazing part of all of this is that AFTER I discovered LSI and LSV (same chemical formula, both forming with stirring) as I mentioned to Dr. Mckenna towards the end of the broadcast, is that I cracked open the book "SOMA and the Indo-European Priesthood, Cereal Cultivation and the Origins of Religion" to provide additional references for my book, and discovered by accident that Shelley (also the author of the book "The Elixir" about the Eleusis kykeon) said at least 5 times in his book that SOMA (likely the Indian originating HBWR seeds) is mixed with barley. Dr. Mckenna also found this very fascinating, so much so that he is providing a link to Shelley's book attached to the Brainforest podcast going up next week: https://mckenna.academy/mka-podcast/

(SHELLEY, 2018):

Which is exactly what I am doing when I am mixing the LSA with barley (source of aldehydes) to form LSI + LSV + LSCr. Similar to the cover of my book, the women poured the psychedelic elixir for the men seated or reclining before the fire.

(RATSCH, 2005) On page 65 of the “The Encyclopedia of Psychoactive Plants”, Christian Ratsch said “The baby Hawaiian wood rose is a strong possible candidate for the SOMA plant, which was described as a vine.”

The Secret herb or cereal grain: This Aojiru or 100% Japan domestic grown Young Barley Grass Powder comes available in individual 3 gram nitrogen sealed packets with a golden green color very high in the 3 aldehydes. Barley was one of the most respected cereal grains of the Rigveda. Barley (yara) was ground, cooked into meals, and even offered during rituals. The SOMA was said to be a golden green color, just like my Kykeon or SOMA brew when this 3 gram herb from the packet is mixed together with the LSA extract (extracted from the Hawaiian baby woodrose seeds in 2 super easy steps), see post #1 of this thread for a list of over the counter few materials needed.

(BAKELS, 2003) The Soviet archeologist Viktor Sarianidi wrote that he had discovered vessels and mortars used to prepare SOMA in Zoroastrian temples in the Bactria–Margiana Archaeological Complex. He said that the vessels have revealed residues and seed impressions left behind during the preparation of soma. The HBWR seed originates in India, but is now grown all over the world.

I also used vessels, mortars and pestles in Chapter 5 to prepare a combo of LSI + LSV + LSCr from the extract of HBWR seeds combined with a single packet of AoJiru or 100% Japan domestic grown young barley grass cereal grain drunk in the highly successful experiments. SOMA is a Vedic Sanskrit word that literally means “distill, extract, sprinkle”, often connected in the context of rituals.

Mycotopia thread: download 2022 paper on the sky high levels of the 3 important aldehydes in Aojiru young barley grass from post #21 here: https://mycotopia.net/topic/112442-lsi-ancient-lsd-secret-of-the-eleusis-kykeon/page-2

Hip forums thread: https://www.hipforums.com/forum/thr...-a-more-euphoric-colorful-musical-lsd.526544/

My profound psychedelic experience with 40 seeds (equivalent to 160ug LSD, but even more euphoric, colorful, and musical) from page 1: https://www.bluelight.org/community...-of-the-eleusis-kykeon-and-vedic-soma.950819/

And yes, every 3 months (when I receive royalties) I am donating a portion of the proceeds from my book to the following forums: 10% bluelight, 10% mycotopia, 10% hip forums, 10% drugs forum, and 10% to the vespiary.org. I am well off as a life long chemist and don't need the funds from the book. I was banned by the moderators of reddit, shroomery and dmt nexus living in their mom's basement for posting this sacred knowledge (as they did not believe any of it, or even bother to read the theory), so they will receive no proceeds and zero exposure. These 3 forums banned me for life and will never find out about this sacred discovery. I was a member of the last 3 forums for over 15 years, yet they did not hesitate to ban an actual chemist, and even deleted many of my old posts on my other sacred discoveries (all relayed to me by an ancient Aztec Shaman during a profound psychedelic trip covered in Chapter 1) of the book: https://www.amazon.com/Ancient-Secret-Eleusis-Kykeon-Vedic-ebook/dp/B0GD1TG6LL/ref=tmm_kin_swatch_0
Click to expand...
Can you provide images of the tlc reports? I frankly don’t think “somebody else said it’s legit” is really any more credible than you saying it’s legit.

Also btw, I have doubts David Nichols wants to write a book about LSI. He is semi-retired, and on papers because his lab members collaborate with others. His last year of publications only had one paper he was a corresponding author on, which was a review.

I would love to be proven wrong, because this is a somewhat interesting (if unlikely) concept, but without images of characterization (and an explanation of the assay type) I don’t think what you are saying is convincing.
 
(RATSCH, 2005) On page 65 of the “The Encyclopedia of Psychoactive Plants”, Christian Ratsch said “The baby Hawaiian wood rose is a strong possible candidate for the SOMA plant, which was described as a vine.”

(BAKELS, 2003) The Soviet archeologist Viktor Sarianidi wrote that he had discovered vessels and mortars used to prepare SOMA in Zoroastrian temples in the Bactria–Margiana Archaeological Complex. He said that the vessels have revealed residues and seed impressions left behind during the preparation of soma. The HBWR seed originates in India, but is now grown all over the world. Much more on this below.

SOMA is a Vedic Sanskrit word that literally means “distill, extract, sprinkle” This is exactly what I am doing when I am extracting the LSA from the seeds in 2 easy steps to mix it with barley. I also used a mortar and pestel just like the ancients.

The word "kykeon" means to stir, this is exactly what I am doing when I stir the LSA in water with the barley to make LSI + LSV + LSCr = just as powerful as LSD but even beyond LSD.

SOMA was said to be not only entheogenic but also stimulating, guess what: LSI is also very entheogenic AND stimulating, if you take it at 3pm, you will not be able to sleep until around midnight. It gives you energy, yes! Ephedra is stimulating but not entheogenic, has nothing in common with LSD.

I tripped on 40 seeds (HBWR seeds, which originate in India) converted to LSI this past saturday, the conversion done in 3 steps in record time, INCREDIBLE experience, please see bottom of this post, and ZERO side effects.

There is no doubt in my mind this is SOMA, it's even better than LSD imho: No anxiety, hours and hours of closed eye colored visions just like LSD, extreme mescaline like euphoria all night, just as colorful and music enhancing as mescaline, tracers as powerful as lightning strikes, whereas LSD can have choppy visuals, the visuals are flowing with LSI, continuous diamond like shimmering of all visuals, LSI is the most bad ass psychedelic equal to mescaline and Ayahuasca that I've ever had the pleasure of trying, yes, it's that good, and it's super cheap to make, with no nastiness to the 2oz brew, down in 2 gulps.

Vecktor (advanced chemist like myself, from 1998) said to me (personal communication 20 years ago, when I had discovered LSH or Lysergic Acid Hydroxyethylamide, the product of LSA + aldehyde: acetaldehyde):
You have probably rediscovered something that has long been a curiosity, for example on the now defunct blacklight site there was a TLC posted of morning glory seed extract treated with (1) methanol, (2) acetaldehyde-methanol or with (3) acetaldehyde in ph=4 water. Both the extract treated with (2) acetaldehyde-methanol and with (3) acetaldehyde in ph=4 water showed a clear difference in the alkaloid profile, with a shift to several new non-polar spots which couldn't be identified. Very likely the LSA converted to LSH (LSA + acetaldehyde adduct = LSH). IIRC Erhlichs was used to develop the plates so these were indole compounds.
Click to expand...
In Chapter 4 and 7 of my book, I also provide 4 scientific papers which back up my successful experimental results.

Yes flame_assay, The TLC performed back on 1.24.26 shows (again) several new non-polar spots which could not be identified compared to the original LSA extract, so new indole products are forming with incubation in acidic water after 10 minutes of stirring. Dr. Nichols (LSD scientist at Purdue University) is actively investigating and taking this further he told me, as his assistant gifted chemist is in the process of synthesizing LSI. There is a MAPS meeting in Greece on the Kykeon and I have conference calls scheduled with chemist at the Shulgin Institute.

The proof is in the pudding, drinking the kykeon (which means "to stir") results in an absolutely incredible psychedelic experience, which I will respect for the rest of my life. Absolutely zero side effects (no nausea, no cramping, no vasoconstriction). I have taken LSD at least 200 hundred times, Ayahuasca at least 120 times, and zero nausea bridgesii cactus tea at least 120 times as well (I keep a trip diary), yet I find this LSI experience to my absolute favorite psychedelic....yes, this is how powerful and potent she is.

I am not the first to have experimented with these doses of HBWR seeds in chapter 5, see Kash who posted this over 12 years ago. Only he mixed his LSA with peppermint oil, which I don't recommend as peppermint oil contains only tiny amounts of isovaleraldehyde, the Aojiru 100% Japan domestic grown young barley grass powder I discovered 5 years ago contains 100x times the level found in peppermint essential oil, which is what we need to simulate the SOMA & the Eleusis kykeon. I recount Kash's report with 40 HBWR seeds below.

I was the first chemist to post about the reaction of LSA with peppermint oil over some 20 years ago, which I posted at the Lycaeum forum (which is now defunct). What inspired me to try a mix of peppermint oil with LSA was the quote from “The Road to Eleusis” that mint was added to the Kykeon. At the time I thought it was acetaldehyde in the oil, but I was wrong, it was not until 7 years ago, I discovered it was due to isovaleraldehyde.

Kash, 69ron and Hermes were just a few of the people who listened to my discovery back then and discovered for themselves there was a difference in the effects when peppermint oil was added, but again I don't recommend peppermint oil, it contains weak amounts of isovaleraldehyde, but at least enough to notice a difference. The Aojiru 100% Japan grown young barley grass powder contains x100 (one hundred times) the levels of isovalelraldehyde as what is found in peppermint, which is what we need.

Kash said in the thread “Kash’s advanced LSA extraction” back in 2012:
https://www.dmt-nexus.me/forum/default.aspx?g=posts&t=35607
Just took a 40 HBWR seed portion of LSA extract that was mixed for 15 minutes with peppermint oil yesterday and tripped his face off with a friend. It was very clean and relaxing. Rainbows and vibrant fractal energy danced all over the skies and throughout his surroundings and music sounded great. The head-space was very acid-like but different. Was a bit intense but he was able to keep it together lol. The whole trip was about 8 hrs long. I have tried a 20 seed extract without peppermint oil and it seemed uncomfortable and sedating with no visuals, while every time he has added peppermint oil he has gotten visuals.
Click to expand...
Kash is correct, in that if the LSA is not mixed with 3grams of the Aojiru 100% Japan domestic grown young barley grass powder, the experience is just like your typical LSA experience: uncomfortable and sedating with no visuals. LSI and LSV are stimulating and VERY POTENT psychedelics on the other hand.

69ron said decades ago:
I know some of you out there are apt to believe the statements above because you've failed at making LSH and those statements above help you feel better about your failure. Don't fall victim to that kind of crap. Try it again. Find out what you did wrong. When it works, the difference is huge, not a tiny difference, the experience is totally different. I know the effects of LSA and LSD very well. He’s used them many times. He guarantees that when the reaction works, there is no noticeable LSA left at all in the experience. It becomes almost identical to an LSD experience at low doses. Totally different from LSA. According to Albert Hofmann (the inventor of LSD), LSH is an adduct of LSA and acetaldehyde. Adducts are very simple to make. You just mix them in solution, that's all. The effect of adding acetaldehyde is huge. I cannot feel any leftover LSA when the process is done right. So, like I said, I think those guys don't know what they're talking about and I believe Hoffman does, and that LSH is an adduct of LSA and acetaldehyde and nothing more. No complex reaction is needed to make it. You just mix the two together and LSH forms. And I believe all of the LSA forms LSH, not just a small amount of it because you cannot feel any of the effects of LSA after this is done right. When the conversion from LSA to LSH is complete it feels completely different. The reason some people can't tell the difference is because their conversion failed. The difference in effects are night and day. No one would ever think the effects of LSH are anything at all like LSA. It's that different.
Click to expand...
20 years ago, at the time of my discovery, again I believed it was acetaldehyde in the peppermint oil and peppermint leaf responsible for the change, but it was actually due to isovaleraldehyde as I discovered around 7 years ago. For years these psychonauts repeated the story of LSH being formed from LSA + acetaldehyde when it was actually LSI being formed from LSA + isovaleraldehyde.

As I have corresponded with Dr. Labate in San Francisco (author of "Ayahuasca Religions") this is all very reminiscent of Ayahuasca which requires the stirring of 2 ingredients. She had a great influence on me as I have read all her books.

The most amazing part of all of this is that AFTER I discovered LSI and LSV (same chemical formula, both forming with stirring) as I mentioned to Dr. Mckenna towards the end of the broadcast, is that I cracked open the book "SOMA and the Indo-European Priesthood, Cereal Cultivation and the Origins of Religion" to provide additional references for my book, and discovered by accident that Shelley (also the author of the book "The Elixir" about the Eleusis kykeon) said at least 5 times in his book that SOMA (likely the Indian originating HBWR seeds) is mixed with barley. Dr. Mckenna also found this very fascinating, so much so that he is providing a link to Shelley's book attached to the Brainforest podcast going up next week: https://mckenna.academy/mka-podcast/

(SHELLEY, 2018):
SOMA is mixed with barley, and SOMA is the color of barley
Click to expand...
Which is exactly what I am doing when I am mixing the LSA with barley (source of aldehydes) to form LSI + LSV + LSCr. Similar to the cover of my book, the women poured the psychedelic elixir for the men seated or reclining before the fire.

(RATSCH, 2005) On page 65 of the “The Encyclopedia of Psychoactive Plants”, Christian Ratsch said “The baby Hawaiian wood rose is a strong possible candidate for the SOMA plant, which was described as a vine.”

The Secret herb or cereal grain: This Aojiru or 100% Japan domestic grown Young Barley Grass Powder comes available in individual 3 gram nitrogen sealed packets with a golden green color very high in the 3 aldehydes. Barley was one of the most respected cereal grains of the Rigveda. Barley (yara) was ground, cooked into meals, and even offered during rituals. The SOMA was said to be a golden green color, just like my Kykeon or SOMA brew when this 3 gram herb from the packet is mixed together with the LSA extract (extracted from the Hawaiian baby woodrose seeds in 2 super easy steps), see post #1 of this thread for a list of over the counter few materials needed.

(BAKELS, 2003) The Soviet archeologist Viktor Sarianidi wrote that he had discovered vessels and mortars used to prepare SOMA in Zoroastrian temples in the Bactria–Margiana Archaeological Complex. He said that the vessels have revealed residues and seed impressions left behind during the preparation of soma. The HBWR seed originates in India, but is now grown all over the world.

I also used vessels, mortars and pestles in Chapter 5 to prepare a combo of LSI + LSV + LSCr from the extract of HBWR seeds combined with a single packet of AoJiru or 100% Japan domestic grown young barley grass cereal grain drunk in the highly successful experiments. SOMA is a Vedic Sanskrit word that literally means “distill, extract, sprinkle”, often connected in the context of rituals.

Mycotopia thread: download 2022 paper on the sky high levels of the 3 important aldehydes in Aojiru young barley grass from post #21 here: https://mycotopia.net/topic/112442-lsi-ancient-lsd-secret-of-the-eleusis-kykeon/page-2

Hip forums thread: https://www.hipforums.com/forum/thr...-a-more-euphoric-colorful-musical-lsd.526544/

My profound psychedelic experience with 40 seeds (equivalent to 160ug LSD, but even more euphoric, colorful, and musical) from page 1: https://www.bluelight.org/community...-of-the-eleusis-kykeon-and-vedic-soma.950819/



Home made LSI from HBWR seeds in 3 super simple steps, a more euphoric, colorful, musical LSD

UPDATE 2.1.26:
I tripped on 40 seed converted to LSI last night on Saturday!! unbelievable, so much better than LSD, exactly like 160ug of LSD but so much better!!!! just incredible !!!!!!!! you have to try this.
again, zero side effects, zero anxiety, had hours of closed eye colored visions, insane euphoria, music was so bad ass, colors out of this world, no anxiety, so freaking bad ass !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! my ultimate favorite. I drank the 60ml brew
at 3pm, and was still able to fall asleep exactly at midnight, way easier to fall asleep than after LSD.

This time I stirred for only 10 minutes for each of the 2 stirring steps (instead of 20 minutes each) and it worked just as well as before, it shortens the procedure time in half. Instructions in chapter 5, 3 super simple steps illustrated.

The LSA residue scraped up from the pyrex dish (40 seeds) LSA weighed 180mg, took this LSA residue and stirred it in 60ml water with the 3g of aojiru for only 10 minutes, and drank, just incredible.

I will be waiting for someone/anyone to duplicate my 3 super easy steps from the book....this is my all time favorite super potent psychedelic, so easy to make and drink, and no nastiness to the taste, just a slight herbal taste.

Links to interviews, etc: https://www.hipforums.com/forum/thr...-a-more-euphoric-colorful-musical-lsd.526544/
 
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@tregar I hear you when you say that 'the proof is in the pudding' :) but one of my main reservations about trying this out for myself is that your recipes call for such a large amount of HWBR seeds to be used.

So I might say to myself "What's the worst that can happen? If LSI and LSV are not being formed, then the worst case is presumably that I'm just consuming LSA and some barley grass powder."

But 25 or 40 HWBR seeds' worth of LSA is a lot, well into territory that is generally not recommended and which some people report uncomfortable experiences etc.

For now I'm hoping for a few more guinea pigs to report back before I pursue this further.
 
flame_assay said:
...one of my main reservations about trying this out for myself is that your recipes call for such a large amount of HWBR seeds to be used.
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One way would be to titrate your extract. Say you used 25 seeds and your extract was in 25ml of liquid, you could start with 5ml. The next trial would be a bit more, say 8-10ml, and so on.

flame_assay said:
But 25 or 40 HWBR seeds' worth of LSA is a lot, well into territory that is generally not recommended and which some people report uncomfortable experiences etc.
Click to expand...
I'm thinking that people using high doses have been either ingesting the seeds themselves or using extracts which have included the more problematic substances. Imo neither of those approaches are appropriate.
 
Allylbenzene said:
I'm thinking that people using high doses have been either ingesting the seeds themselves or using extracts which have included the more problematic substances. Imo neither of those approaches are appropriate.
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Allylbenzene is correct, it's the crushed seed shell fragments that cause nausea, follow the instructions in my book in Chapter 5, illustrated with pictures...we are leaving behind the nausea causing seed fragments from the HBWR seeds at the bottom of the shot glass, these dust like fragments STICK to the bottom of the shot glass and get throw away, 100% eliminating nausea and any side effects, as the 1oz everclear (95% grain alcohol spirit) contain the active alkaloids which we pour off into the brownie dish and evaporate the everclear (or other high proof alcohol you want to use) leaving behind the pure LSA extract which we then scrape up with two razor blades, add this pure LSA extract to 2oz water, pour in your 3g of AOJIRU young barley grass powder from the individual nitrogen sealed packet (come 46 to a box) and stir for 10 minutes using a magnetic stirrer (cheap from amazon) and consume for a profound psychedelic experience even better than LSD imho, like a combination of ALD-52 (anxiety free version of LSD also discovered by Dr. Hoffman) and mescaline combined, my absolute favorite psychedelic.

I promise you even with 40 seed extract converted to LSI + LSV (equivalent to 160ug LSD) there are ZERO side effects, no nausea, cramping or vasoconstriction at all, complete infinite euphoric psychedelic bliss for the entire night: 8 strong hours with 10 hour duration.

I hear your concern flame_assay, you can do as Allylbenzene states above, or do what I did in the very beginning: -->I started out with just 5 seeds and noticed it felt about like 20ug LSD, then I went up to 25 seeds which felt like (25 x .04mg per seed) = 100ug LSD, then I moved up to 30 seeds which felt exactly like (30 x .04mg LSA per seed ) = 120ug LSD, then I moved up to 40 seeds (40 x .04mg LSA per seed) = 160ug LSD.

This may help you to feel more comfortable, see here how Kash (very well respected, author of the LSA extract TEK) used up to 40 seeds:

Kash said in the thread “Kash’s advanced LSA extraction” back in 2012:
https://www.dmt-nexus.me/forum/default.aspx?g=posts&t=35607
Just took a 40 HBWR seed portion of LSA extract that was mixed for 15 minutes with peppermint oil yesterday and tripped his face off with a friend. It was very clean and relaxing. Rainbows and vibrant fractal energy danced all over the skies and throughout his surroundings and music sounded great. The head-space was very acid-like but different. Was a bit intense but he was able to keep it together lol. The whole trip was about 8 hrs long. I have tried a 20 seed extract without peppermint oil and it seemed uncomfortable and sedating with no visuals, while every time he has added peppermint oil he has gotten visuals.
Click to expand...
Kash is correct, in that if the LSA is not mixed with 3grams of the Aojiru 100% Japan domestic grown young barley grass powder, the experience is just like your typical LSA experience: uncomfortable and sedating with no visuals. LSI and LSV are stimulating and VERY POTENT psychedelics on the other hand. Don't use peppermint oil as it contains 100 times less isovaleraldehyde as barley, always use AOJIRU barley, it comes in 3grams nitrogen sealed packs. Just snip open the pack and pour it into your 2oz (60ml water) with the LSA extract, spin for 10 minutes, and consume.

Keep in mind, we are extracting PURE LSA from the HBWR seeds, then converting it to LSI + LSV (main alkaloids) in record time in 3 super simple steps. There is ZERO or no side effects, as we are leaving the nausea causing seed pulp behind at the bottom of the shotglass, which gets thrown away.

For decades, people have been consuming the whole seeds crushed, which is the wrong way, as the seed pulp is what is nauseating and has side effects galore, the pure LSA has none of this at all, just like Kash notes above.

Start off with just 5 seeds if you want, just as I did....I was cautious just like you in the beginning.

I have taken 40 seeds (equivalent to 160ug of LSD) x twice now, spaced 1 month apart, and she is my all time favorite psychedelic, that I will respect for the rest of my life:
She is even better than LSD imho: No anxiety, hours and hours of closed eye colored visions just like LSD, extreme mescaline like euphoria all night, just as colorful and music enhancing as mescaline, tracers as powerful as lightning strikes, whereas LSD can have choppy visuals, the visuals are flowing with LSI, continuous diamond like shimmering of all visuals, LSI is the most bad ass psychedelic equal to mescaline and Ayahuasca that I've ever had the pleasure of trying, yes, she is that good, and she is super cheap to make, with no nastiness to the 2oz brew, down in 2 gulps.

As there is zero or no anxiety with LSI + LSV, I plan on even taking her at 40 seed dose converted to LSI + LSV and walk down the street and trip all morning and early afternoon long at one of the world's largest waterparks, which we live down the street from.

I know this will be absolutely incredible! As I used to take zero nausea bridgesii cactus tea at least 20 times at the waterpark. This LSI + LSV is just as incredible as mescaline, my other all time favorite psychedelic.

From 2.1.2026:
This time I stirred for only 10 minutes for each of the 2 stirring steps (instead of 20 minutes each) and it worked just as well as before, it shortens the procedure time in half. Instructions in chapter 5, 3 super simple steps illustrated. You can use 40mg pure ascorbic acid (pure vitamin C powder) for the 1st stirring step, and 20mg pure vitamin C powder for the last stirring step, works just as well as DL tartaric acid or citric acid.

The LSA residue scraped up from the pyrex dish (40 seeds) LSA weighed 180mg, took this LSA residue and stirred it in 60ml water with the 3g of aojiru for only 10 minutes, and drank, just incredible.
Click to expand...


--> Remember, even though LSI + LSV is stimulating just like LSD, it's way easier to fall asleep on than after LSD, I can take LSI + LSV 2oz brew at 3pm, and be able to fall asleep at midnight, whereas with LSD, I would still be up till 3 or 4am in the morning, a huge benefit to this very powerful no anxiety LSI + LSV Sacred ancient Elixir <--

Search amazon for "LSD", the book has been in the #1 spot for weeks now, with over 60 copies sold in 1 month, which is good as I will be able to make sizeable donations here to bluelight every 3 months to help support its operation.
Don't forget my interview with Dr. Mckenna goes up in just a few days: Podcast McKenna Academy of Natural Philosophy | Archives

perpetualdawn said:
Wow young barley greens eh? Not what I expected at all. I can't find anything published talking about isovaleraldehyde, valeraldehyde and crotonaldehyde content in aojiru, how do you know this @tregar?
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Attached File 1-s2.0-S2212429222000074-main-2.pdf 3.29MB 41 downloads

Assessing the product quality and biological activities of barley Hordeum vulgare L grasses at different harvest times, 2022, see PAGE 5, ALDEHYDE TABLE:

Isovaleraldehyde, Valeraldehyde & Crotonaldehyde levels eclipse the levels of the other 10 aldehydes in young barley, resulting in a triple action LSI, LSV and LSCr experience when simulating the Eleusis Kykeon. Aldehydes strongest at Z21 young growth stage:

Propionaldehyde = 2.18
Isobutyraldehyde = 1.41
Butyraldehyde = 0.69
2-methylbutyraldehyde = 2.28
→ Isovaleraldehyde or Butanal = 7.52 (converts LSA to LSI)
Hexanal = 3.73
Trans-2-hexenal = 1.60
Trans-2,4-heptadienal = 1.17
Benzaldehyde = 1.12
2,6,6-trimethyl-1-cyclohexene-1-carboxaldehyde .3
→ Valeraldehyde = 13.40 (converts LSA to LSV)
→ Crotonaldehyde or 2-Butenal = 7.63 (converts LSA to LSCr)
2-hexenal = 1.39

The levels of isovaleraldehyde in AOJIRU young barley grass powder is x100 (one hundred times) the levels found in peppermint, which is what we need (these super strong levels of these 3 aldehydes to form LSI + LSV + LSCr) for a profound triple psychedelic action when the 2oz Sacred Psychedelic Elixir is consumed.

I am a long time bodybuilder: https://anabolicminds.com/community...or-5-years-straight-with-7-bloodworks.329132/
 
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