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little advice would be nice

I'm sorry to say it, but it sounds like you experiences the norm in terms of addiction treatment in America. Super fucking sad. You clearly need MAT, some bullshit abstinence based outpatient program or rehab just clearly isn't going to cut it for you. Disgusting. My heart goes out to you. Wish there was more we could do for you. My advice, find yourself a Suboxone doctor or methadone clinic. And get yourself another doctor, like one who knows his or her shit and actually cares.
 
Man, that sucks!! Im so sorry. I was really hoping hed help you. What a jerk. I hate youre in this position. You want help and you cant get it. Do what you gotta do i guess. Be careful with ercs. The Tylenol in them will fuck your liver up. I wish i had some advice but im stumped. PM ya tomorrow. Be safevman
 
Ya thanks guys

Is super annoying when I actually want get clean ya moneys helping me want quit but this is nothing new I have been doing this for close to 2 years and have only had one or two days empty handed seems like for this shit I can always pull something out of my ass.
But I actually want to quit I'm tired of being this way and the ppl I have to deal with I don't want be like them and quitting is the only thing that will keep that from happening. But when you try reach out for help n just get shot down I mean it was hard for me to do that today and for what. Nothing.

And yea closeau I no that shit hard on my liver I try not think about it but I'm sure my livers fucked I know the pills are hard and the fact I was an alcoholic for seven years and the last two I drank a half gallon of whiskey a day I don't no how I'm still alive. I have no doubt it's going catch up with me in a bad way.
 
Maybe not man. Try to be somewhat positive. You want to quit so there ya go. Nobody wants to go cold turkey but that may be your only choice. Just clear tou sched as long as you can or try another Dr so you can at least get some clonidine. It will suck but after youll be free. But if youre like me and always need something to brighten your mood, it may be tough. I used to drink a half gallon of Seagrams 7 every dam day so i can relate there. Dude, its not pity i feel for you i just truly feel bad for ya man. Please let me know if theres anything i can do and you just hang tight and be safe bro.
 
The only failure is in giving up fatcat. Believe me when I tell you that if you keep trying, eventually you will find something that works for you. When I wanted to get clean it took me four years of trying different things, and I am still working on returning to sanity.
 
Me too manboychef, me to. Listen to him Opie, he knows what hes talking about. When you get deep into addiction it takes repeated attempts and different ways for sure. Maybe a meeting may help you. Youll meet some guys who may have some ideas. At least it will give you a chance to be around others who suffer like you do. If you spend all your time alone or with your wife who cant relate then youre natually gonna feel like a man on an island. Might be worth an hr to go check one out. Schedules can be found online easily. Just an idea but yeah i agree with manboychef totally
 
Recovery is always worth the effort, but it can be very dangerous and emotionally and physically traumatic if you dont know what youre getting into and keep your witts about you.

I was drugged and then rapped by the sponsor affiliated with the first rehab i went to after they assigned him to me, a.k.a. the "13th Step." So be very careful.

That said, im infinitely happier with my life today, find more fullfilment in everyday happenings and am more self confident and able than ive ever been before.

After all, how could one succeed without trying? If you put in the effort and stay smart you will more likely than not walk away with a better, more nuanced understanding about yourself, your disease and treatment and recovery moee generally.
 
Well guess I'm goin have cold turkey it after I run out this 3mg sub plan on it lasting few days so hope it help some I just hope when it runs out I don't freak out n do whatever it takes to get something and that's what happened every time before just goin have try fight hard this time I hope I make it I'm scared but when am I not
 
Dude, its completly normal to be scared. Kicking the drug of your choice is a miserable process but if done correctly it will cause things to emerge that are wonderful. If you cold turkey it you will freak out, go cope get high for awhile but youre in the middle spot. You wanna stop so everytime you score and get high youll feel guilt. Interesting question for you. Whats the difference between guilt and shame? There very different. Look it up if youre bored. To be honest man i see you in rehab at some point. If its done right youll go to detox center and the nurses will get you thru the first several days of acute withdrawl. Im sure they give you meds to help then once youre out of the horrible withdrawl youll go to rehab thats been set up by you as far as what place takes your insurance or cheapest place. Rehabs can be stupid expensive. The place i went was 2800$ which was nothing conpared to others. One at the beach was 20000$ for 28 days but they took insurance. I would love to see you in Methadone treatment but thats too far. PM me and tell me where you live and i can help looking for somewhere to go.

Im just afraid once you feel that hardcore wd kick in you will freak and if you can score, why go thru that billshit. I think its time for yu to decide what you wanna be, high or clean. Like really decide. If you get high during this process thats ok man. I hope its clean but you may decide its high. Ive taken a liking to you and i understand where you are. For years man i said im quitting drinking and never would and i really wanted to quit. In AA they talk about the jumping off place, where you cant imagine life with the substance. So true and youre there my friend. I dont pray much but ill pray for you man. 3mg subs only gonna do so much. Man just dont break the law. I mean getting shit is illegal but dont let the drugs turn you into a criminal. Dude ive seen it happen. Do what your heart says and your concious and youll be fine. Ill PM you in a bit and tell you something personal. Take your subs but decide that question honestly and get at me if you need me

Toothpastedog, homie, im so sorry that happened tobyou. Youre a hell of a guy for overcoming both that and your addictions. Youre def my role model for me out here. I need to PM you too. Be looking for it soon.
 
Oh my god when it rains it pours. I didn't keep car today probably a good thing I don't have a penny probably a good thing someone calls n says they have percs man this has fucked up my head
 
Trust me Fatcat. This is momentary. You will feel better soon.

I have to agree with close. Basically you will have the moment when you just are fed up, and willing to do anything to quit. I know it sounds cliched but mine happened in jail. I was sick, sitting in a cell, and I realized that I have been trying things my way for so long, and maybe it was time to try someone else's way. I had been to rehab before, but I held onto a lot of bitterness and resentment which always led me back to using. I tried detoxing at home many times and I never made it. I was/am a chronic relapser. I had to accept that, and accept that I am going to be uncomfortable for a good amount of time. I ended up getting bailed out, and my bondswoman was extremely compassionate. She gave me the option of being bonded out and going to rehab, or staying in jail. I chose rehab. The difference this time was that I was ready to stop. I was willing to do what others suggested, no matter how mundane, or painful.

The biggest thing for you right now is to decide what you want to do. You know you have a problem, you know you need help. Maybe a stint in rehab might help you. Not only will you get away from all your triggers, but if you let them, they will help you with any mental issues you may have (which tend to be one of the problems for the self medicating addict, which most of us are.) Just know that we are all here for you. Be kind to yourself and take it easy.
 
Said well manboychef. The gift of desperation. Everyone i met when i was in program all had that at begining of their recovery. It had to be taught to me cause im an idiot and always knew i could figure a way out of any situation and keep going and using. I am also a chronic relapser and threw grace of God i havent had a dink in a year yesterday but opiates, uuugh. Same routine, different substance. I often think about if i had listened better in rehab and had that gift of desperation in 2006 how much different my life would be. I self addmittley still have problems occasionally and i really believe it stems from my mental illness. My first and best sponser would not let me use that as an exuse and really thats not my intention. I think a bigger light needs to be shone on the connection between mental illness and addiction. Thats all. When i was rediagnosed from schizophrenia to bipolar 1 with phycosis they gave me a printout and it said 87% of people with my condition are substance abusers. And thats for of us lucky enough to get a diagnosis and shrink. They wonder why the streets are littered with crackheads and shit. Ill step off my box now, lol.
 
And it makes sense, I mean considering the stigma surrounding mental illness and the huge barriers to quality treatment, no wonder so many people with co-occurring disorders seek out drugs in order to self medicate to reduce the suffering they experience in their day-to-day lives. This is the whole point of Lance Dodes' book The Heart of Addiction, where he argues that using drugs (as a form of self medication) is a completely rational, extremely sane coping strategy, even if it does generally turn out to be, on the whole, very unhealthy for the individual suffering from untreated or poorly treated mental illness.
 
I wrote that down and will check it out. I ordered "In the realm of hungrey ghosts" today be here tomorrow. Im having trouble with the pdf. I look forward to dicussing it with you. Very interesting.

Yeah, even where i go see my shrink their involved in state programs and...lets just say its far from private practice andvpeople in there will be raising hell all the time usually about controlled substances and they need more and so on. I see mental illness everytime i go in there and i live it bc i am. If you talked to me youd never know that im severe bipolar and experience phycosis. Meds arevjust means to an end. One of my symptoms is i hearvmy name being yelled out and it happened today at DMV. I looked a couple of times then just ignored it cause i know its not real. I took my meds this morning but they dont work 100%. What does? That book sounds interesting. Drug use isnt good but its better than theftcand murder but drug use in inner cities def leads to a lot of the crime here. Like a vicious cycle. Like ive said, they have to modernize mental health care and addiction treatment in this country. I dont know how but i know theres at least a dozen meds for bipoar and so on so where are the drugs for addiction? I know addiction runs deep and has to be attacked at several sourses but cant they come up with a pill for craving? All they have is Antabuse and Naltrexone and shit that will make you sick if you use. People still use on that shit or just dontvtake it. For people who wanna stop a pill that takes away craving is a great start. Recovery is easier without that monkey biting into your neck!!

Maybe im way off but i think waiting for a higher power to remove your obsession is outdated especially in these anti God times. Medicine is the answer then theray whether group or one on one and giving back and helping people is a good combo. But i sit here with my own problems. I think if they made recovery a bit easier more people would clean up cause how many people want to but the thought of withdrawl and meetings or whatever keeps them locked in addictive patterns. I know it did with me and not until they ripped my colon out did iblose the urge to drink now im stuck with opiates bc of my chronic pain but could easly fall backbonto abuse again. Like i said before, my mental illness contributed to my addiction. Nobdoubt. I was born with it and eben at 7-8 i would hear and see shit and at 10 i was in a childs phyc ward for a month cause i used to see a monster and when the shrink asked me if these things told me to hurt myself or others and i said yes, i was in a room in 10 min. I look back on that as a peaceful time. Mefs were working and we had fun. Put nerf rims up and had tournaments and thats the first time i was ccalled an artist by art teacher. Then is was back home to hell and i was miserable till 12 when i was given my first joint and a 40. I had found peace and over my life the mental shit and addiction shitbjust fed. Eachother. Sorry to get so long and ersonal with my post but this is a topic i feel very passioatly about. Thanks for putting up with my perhaps conterversal views.
 
ya mike great post.

if anyone should be worried about people putting up with them it should be me. Some people in my real life are giving up. And I don't blame em I keep fucking up. After 35-40 ish hours I think with only 1.5 mg sub I got some oxy even tho I can't afford it and it's hurt my family a lot. But I appreciate you guys still helping. I just got save up and get on maitnence. Going be hard to do if I keep feeding monkey but I'm goin check on free places n see how long wait is. I lost help from a family member today cause I didn't try go to a rehab close by but I'm goin try find one that does sub n go if I can. I don't want to at all but I think it's only thing to stop me if even only for month
 
Closeu: Hey man, I am right there with you. I too hear people calling my name when I am stressed out. I was always a little different as a child. Constantly scared, always worried about things that most kids would not even think about. I also have been in therapy since I was just a sprout. It finally took using pain pills and morphine for me to feel normal. What is funny is that as a kid I thought everyone's brain worked the same as mine...they were just better at hiding it.

I also think the whole finding a higher power thing is outdated. As an addict I had to realize that I do have the power not to use. I am not powerless over my addiction. I was just choosing not to exert that power in a constructive way. Passing it on to a higher power is just not taking responsibility for your mental health problems...and saying it is a higher power that can heal you is making addiction into a moral failing, rather than a health concern. I am working right now on a different recovery protocol, because we are still using synanon, and 12step based recovery which has an abysmal success rate.

@fatcat: Listen man, just go to a rehab. Try that before maintenance. Basically, you just need to get a little time under your belt before you make that choice. Remember: Do not get upset if people don't go back to trusting you. Those people never stop loving you, but liking you is a different story. It can take a lifetime of doing the right thing to get their admiration back.
 
manboychef said:
I also think the whole finding a higher power thing is outdated. As an addict I had to realize that I do have the power not to use. I am not powerless over my addiction. I was just choosing not to exert that power in a constructive way. Passing it on to a higher power is just not taking responsibility for your mental health problems...and saying it is a higher power that can heal you is making addiction into a moral failing, rather than a health concern. I am working right now on a different recovery protocol, because we are still using synanon, and 12step based recovery which has an abysmal success rate.
Click to expand...

Likewise great post :) Hope you're feeling better Z!
 
Thats really interesting manboychef. I hold same veiws and have often wanted to create a more modernized way of tavckling addiction. I spent 10 yrs in AA with little sucess and it was always the higher power that got me. Higher Power, so PC. I do believe in God but i think he has nothing to do with my addictions. My sponser used to get so frutrated with me then i started believing there is something wrong with me. Why cant i get it? The moralizationbof 12 step programs has always bothered me. Even though in begining of book Dr Silkworth says something like alcoholism is a disease not a moral issue yet the steps are designed to make you a "better" person.?uuurrgh, I get so frustrated

If you wouldnt mind, PM me and we can discuss this. We share a lot of same views. I would love to hear some of your ideas as i have some of my own. Always nice to relate to someone. I look forward to hearing from you. So manybmore addicts would get better if they had prper treatment. I wanted to be a cousler but why go to school to sit behind a desk and grill people on their habits then send them to meeting. Ridiculous!!
 
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