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LDN for reducing opioid tolerance

debored13 said:
buprenorphine should have less chance of respiratory depression relative to therapeutic effect and less chance of building tolerance quickly than other opioids, right?
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Yes to both of those. You started at a good dose too. I’ve found opiate naive individuals can feel .125 to .5mg fairly easily. The thing is it takes forever to feel it so often people redose.

IMO 1mg equals 20-40mg Oxycodone. Although it’s like comparing apples to oranges.

-GC
 
i find it interesting you guys keep relying on sekio's knowledge about things here, asking him hundreds of questions! anyone can use GOOGLE, you know? I actually hope so, unless you are a disabled monkey...
 
allone said:
i find it interesting you guys keep relying on sekio's knowledge about things here, asking him hundreds of questions! anyone can use GOOGLE, you know? I actually hope so, unless you are a disabled monkey...
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i am quite literally a disabled monkey

problem?
 
G_Chem said:
Yes to both of those. You started at a good dose too. I’ve found opiate naive individuals can feel .125 to .5mg fairly easily. The thing is it takes forever to feel it so often people redose.

IMO 1mg equals 20-40mg Oxycodone. Although it’s like comparing apples to oranges.

-GC
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it is apples and oranges, its not just euphoria that feels inferior, the analgesia does too. i may not be absorbing it right bc cutting the little pieces of strips up and using htem is probably suboptimal wrt strip placement in mouth, either way it really takes me 1 mcg or 1.5 to really feel it and it doesnt last all day. i hope i dont build tolerance from that... the idea was that this would build up my tolerance LESS than oxy rotating it... but idk... maybe ill just go on kratom and use bp meds to try and offseet the side effects... or try mementaine for tolerance lowering--i still havent done that
 
do all partial agonists have less tachyphylaxis than full agonists or what. why does bupe supposedly build tolerance less than other opioids
 
@dopamimetic how long and how high of a dose of memantine did it take you to achieve this effect of tolerance reset? bc my tolerance and pain is becoming an issue
 
please, id really like to know. ive been cautious with memantine bc of my high bp but, i could always take a bp med. @sekio do you know the mechanism behind the high bp in memantine usage, so i could know what bp med to take with it to be protective? I have losartan, clonidine, and guanfacine, which have different mechanisms of action
 
@dopamimetic idk if you've been taking a break from bluelight but just really curious how long u had to use memantine and at what dose to get the total toelrance reset. seems really promising . thanks
 
debored13 said:
my calculation says that 1 mg bupe would equal about 20 mg oxy but probably with less euphoria but longer lasting. so to be cautious since im basically opioid naive and dose calculations can be wrong i took about .5 mg... hope that the bupe in these 8 mg films is distributed equally
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Buprenorphine is an odd one. It is supposed to be >x100 morphine IV but the various tablet formulations are less (and are all different). Lots of side-effects, not recommended.
 
guys, ive switched to bupe for pain, and i take it a max three times a week, but sometimes i take a spoonful of kratom or two on the days off. i wonder about how kratom affects my tolerance for other opioids. any thoughts? Im going to a pain clinic soon and getting surgery soon, tired of having to navigate self medication, but
 
debored13 said:
guys, ive switched to bupe for pain, and i take it a max three times a week, but sometimes i take a spoonful of kratom or two on the days off. i wonder about how kratom affects my tolerance for other opioids. any thoughts? Im going to a pain clinic soon and getting surgery soon, tired of having to navigate self medication, but..
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Cross-tolerance
 
G_Chem said:
This may explain why Suboxone is the only opiate I can taper and/or maintain at a certain dosage, without rising tolerance.

...
-GC
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I've recently found how easy a Suboxone taper has been for me, after being on 24mg daily for about a year. I dropped to 12mg a day: a half dose, and after roughly two months dropped again to 6mg.

Almost no negative consequences and I feel better on 6mg than I did on twenty-four. I recall someone here telling me they did better on 1mg than 36mg, I was inclined to believe them then; but now am quite satisfied with the concrete experience.

I always felt pain while walking distances on those earlier amounts, and though my prescriber denied it: claiming no naloxone reaches the bloodstream via the sublingual route, I always felt the Narcan played a role. That is now almost non-existent on 6mg. As it was similarly absent while taking heroic dosages of loperamine (as admittedly reckless as it is to say considering the dosages, I must admit I vastly prefer lope to subs for maintenance 8mg to 192mg respectively, and I did the latter for years)

Perhaps it is an acute case of hypochondria, but I always thought I was particularly sensitive to the mixed agonism/antagonism of bupe, if that means anything (I notice the subjective 'negatives' and dysphoric side readily.)
 
dopamimetic said:
Really I guess pure adamantane will not make it through the blood brain barrier, though I am not really competent to make this disclusion.. Memantine is available from some online pharmacies who tend not to require prescription. I have more difficulties sampling bromantane here ...

Ketamine works and is safe when used sparingly.
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does bromantane and ketamine have any negative interaction??
 
Guys I had a surgical procedure that was technically "minor " but left me in a lot of pain. Invasive cervical traction. I was given two iv blouses of dilaudid after , without tolerance , and still had a headache, then discharged with a few days of oxy. I have been turning to larger doses of suboxone to self medicate while desperately trying to get in touch with the doctors about proper follow up care. Worei3e I will permanently fuck my tolerance but hoping suboxone causes less serious tolerance increases than other meds. The pressure headaches are really awful. Am not allowed to take aspirin or other NSAIDs bc of the incisions. Vertigo too. How keep tolerance down ?
 
Nagelfar said:
I've recently found how easy a Suboxone taper has been for me, after being on 24mg daily for about a year. I dropped to 12mg a day: a half dose, and after roughly two months dropped again to 6mg.

Almost no negative consequences and I feel better on 6mg than I did on twenty-four. I recall someone here telling me they did better on 1mg than 36mg, I was inclined to believe them then; but now am quite satisfied with the concrete experience.

I always felt pain while walking distances on those earlier amounts, and though my prescriber denied it: claiming no naloxone reaches the bloodstream via the sublingual route, I always felt the Narcan played a role. That is now almost non-existent on 6mg. As it was similarly absent while taking heroic dosages of loperamine (as admittedly reckless as it is to say considering the dosages, I must admit I vastly prefer lope to subs for maintenance 8mg to 192mg respectively, and I did the latter for years)

Perhaps it is an acute case of hypochondria, but I always thought I was particularly sensitive to the mixed agonism/antagonism of bupe, if that means anything (I notice the subjective 'negatives' and dysphoric side readily.)
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I have heard a number of people say that they experience better effects from bupe at 2mg or under than on higher than 2mg. My guess is the naloxone starts to have an effect.

Loperamide damages the heart and can kill you at above 100mg, 192mg is a very high dose, you're lucky you didn't have complications from that. I used to use lope to come off opiates, but for some reason it really makes me feel bad now, I mean it calms the restlessness a nd acute edge of the withdrawals, but it makes my insides so dry that it feels really bad, my stomach hurts, my esophagus hurts, drinking water doesn't seem to make my mouth wet, it's bad. Plus the constipation is really bad. Loperamide in high doses just feels so sketchy to me. Plus, it really doesn't get you high, per se, it makes you feel heavy and numb, but bupe has a much better high, it is legitimately one of my favorite opioids, on account of how functional it is and how long it lasts. Kind of like a stimulant and opiate together, I like it.
 
↑I was living on the streets taking lope, and on the move it still took away all the effort walking constantly, for some reason bupe doesn't do that at all for me. I wouldn't recommend it, but it did the trick for me on a daily basis for years. I'd be hesitant to go that way again especially since I weighed <170lbs probably the entire time I was on the street and now last week the clinic weighed me @ 208lbs, the most I've weighed in my life (I still wasn't over 170lbs in work release, just last year, after doing 24 months only sleeping and eating.)
 
I was on buprenorphine for a decade, and 2 mg was definitely the sweet spot. That’s the only dose I could get as close to full agonist opioid-like effects. When I first got on Suboxone, when doctors were only allowed to have 10 patients at a time, I was prescribed 32 mg/day for a brief period of time. Absolute waste, in my opinion, anything over 4mg / day created a mental hell for me, > 50% opioid receptor saturation of a partial agonist opioid was like a cruel joke of the greatest proportions.
 
Deru said:
I was on buprenorphine for a decade, and 2 mg was definitely the sweet spot. That’s the only dose I could get as close to full agonist opioid-like effects. When I first got on Suboxone, when doctors were only allowed to have 10 patients at a time, I was prescribed 32 mg/day for a brief period of time. Absolute waste, in my opinion, anything over 4mg / day created a mental hell for me, > 50% opioid receptor saturation of a partial agonist opioid was like a cruel joke of the greatest proportions.
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The reason for that is to make it impossible to get high off full agonists at the same time because it would take a huge dose of morphine to displace all that buprenorphine from the receptors. And also to make the dose stay longer in your system so that you don't get too sick even if you miss one day's dose for some reason.

Buprenorphine blocks delta opioid receptors at higher doses, and that could be the reason why a larger amount actually produces less mood lift.
 
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