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Kratom induced liver injury?

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Ok feel I've got to support Samavenger. Have never been on a forum before but feel I should tell you my story. In January I started taking Kratom daily- between 1-3 teaspoons of crushed leaf. 5 weeks later I felt ill- stomach pain and mild flu like symptoms. My feet really itched. A week later my eyes turned yellow- cue very worried husband. Blood tests ensued and the results were so shocking( liver enzymes through the roof) that I was called in to A & E at 11o'clock at night!!
I spent 4 very scary days there. I told them about Kratom and they were very concerned. Many tests later and the fact that my enzymes were reducing meant that I could be discharged - but I am still under the consultant as an out patient. No other drugs were involved. Yes- I drink wine in moderation. Kratom was to blame.
 
whizz I'm very sorry this happened to you also. I wish you a speedy recovery. how are you feeling now if you don't mind my asking? If it's any consolation I'm feeling a quite a lot better than I was a couple of weeks ago even. eat well, sleep a lot and be kind to your body.

i'm not closing my eyes and ears to evidence, show me some studies! the ones posted were not relevant! AT ALL! except one that was outdated and not conclusive.

I should've addressed this before, but please actually read the studies I posted. you're simply wrong. All of them contain data on hepatic toxicity of kratom - even if it's not the specific focus of the study - and they all seem to indicate that kratom has cytotoxic properties which is consistent with both user reports and medical reports.

I don't suppose you can find a 'conclusive' study which proves the safety of kratom?
 
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Hi Samsavenger and thanks for your concern. Ten weeks on and I feel great! I'm waiting on a liver function test result- bit anxious- but hopefully things are going in the right direction. When this happened to me I ( like you) researched everything I could about Kratom. All of the studies and personal reports you've listed I had read. One female Bluelighter had had the same experience as me only the weekend before! My concern is this. It's taken a lot of courage for me to eventually come on line and report what happened. How many others out there have had bad experiences? The hospital told me that they have many cases of Hepatitis due to herbal remedies- "Black Cohosh" is of concern at the moment. This and many more are available in health food shops(Uk)
Kratom however isn't and I purchased it online from a reputable dealer. I thought it was fantastic. It has been suggested that perhaps it was contaminated. Who knows? All I do know is that it made me dangerously ill.
 
^ you raise a good point regarding possible contamination. It was the first thing that crossed my mind too. I gave my doctor a sample of my kratom... I'm not sure how extensively they analysed it or with what methods but it according to the doc it appeared to be standard dried, powdered kratom leaf with nothing remarkable about it. I bought it from a reputable online supplier based in the netherlands who imported it in bulk from another large reputable company based in indonesia who ships large amounts of kratom all over the world. I won't name names but if you're interested I'm sure a couple mins of google detective work will let you know.

This study I mentioned earlier also involved a detailed chemical analysis of the kratom involved. Since the study was in germany, it's highly likely that it was from the same supplier/distributor.... but they didn't find any unusual contaminants... nothing other than known kratom alkaloids that could be attributed to acute hepatoxicity... so I guess in conjunction with the 1975 study on users of kratom in thailand who used local fresh plants, and who also exhibited symptoms of hepatoxicity, it seems fairly easy to draw the conclusion that kratom can basically just fuck your liver.

good luck with your blood test man, I have my next follow up in 2 weeks. fingers crossed everything is back to normal.
 
Hi Sam- hope you don't mind me abbreviating your name?!! Yes- will keep you posted. I'm so pleased I found your post. You make a great deal of sense.
 
I have no idea how this would factor in, but I had gotten kratom with pieces of metal in it. Either from the grinder or mesh screen. Not to mention kratom is often dirty, from dust in the air I suppose. I am bringing all this up because of poppy seeds leaching heavy metals really well from soil(I exposed myself to this more than I could tell you before taking steps to stop it)

I know there isn't really direct botanical ties to the two species but kratom on one hand, I found that varieties, or cultivars "species" vary incredibly. There are localized differences between regions where one variety will have or lack a specific chemical. Another region will do the same. I infact found some of the most non psychoactive kratom noting the difference of regional varieties, which I thought could be beneficial for catechin research...


When I got the kratom with metal in the batch it, around that time it got to the point where afterwards I couldn't dose anymore without nausea.
It sucked and I made myself just go into abrupt withdrawal after a while of running out of resources.

In my withdrawal to my morbid amusement, I saw some show "my strange addiction" about a girl who chewed and ate plastic. Sure enough, she had chunks of plastic shown by X-ray in her liver. This scared her and myself.

Remember kratom is a CYP2d6 inhibitor, I had it circumvent codeine conversion to my dismay as well. Im pretty sure resveratrol in wine too is somewhat a liver enzyme inhibitor as well.
 
yeah metal is probably not good for your guts, but I'm pretty sure your body could deal with small amounts... I mean this guy eats glass and metal every day without any serious health consequences: http://youtu.be/h6Pl2-lx12A ... and a little bit (or even a lot) of agricultural dirt/dust is not going to harm your liver... never heard of anyone getting hepatitis from eating raw/unwashed fruit and vegetables.

but yeah, there wasn't any metal present in my kratom on visual inspection, and I'd guess it would be something that the GC/MS lab test at the hospital would've detected if there was, even in trace amounts... same applies with toxic pesticides, I'd say it would've been among the first things they detected.

I haven't found any links between CYP2D6/P450 activity and intraheptic cholestasis in any published studies or elsewhere, but I'd be interested to know if that could be a potential cause... mitragynine is a known CYP2D6 inhibitor but there are over 40 identified (and many more unidentified) alkaloids in kratom with more or less unknown enzyme activity. we don't actually know fuck all about it.
 
Two above posts very interesting. I've recently read something indicating that ground up mosquito coils are sometimes found. However- not in my bag of crushed leaves( have examined by eye) and yes- I still have it. Am thinking more likely to be a chemical in the leaf. No results yet- but bank holiday here in England( and great weather for once!)
 
Mosquito coils are part of some oddball mixture used in Thailand, I've never seen any suggestion that they're present in commercial samples.

Kratom is well known to cause hepatic issues in long term use, it makes sense that there are going to be a few people who are especially sensitive to this effect and will experience consequences from just a couple uses. Alternatively, perhaps it's a lie and this person is actually a heavy user. Who knows, this is the internet.

There's little reason to go looking for alternative explanations when a very good explanation is readily available. You may want an alternative to be true, but that doesn't make it true. This isn't the GOP here...
 
^ would be a funny thing to lie about. obviously user reports are subjective but if I was a heavy/long term user I'd just say so... after all, this is the internet.

it's worth noting that there does seem to be a growing number of reports (erowid/forums/medical journals) of people experiencing serious liver problems and being hospitalised after minimal/short term use in recent years. my report is hardly unique. seems to correlate with increasing popularity in the western world in recent years, but who knows.

follow some of the links posted on this thread if you're interested. the idea that small amounts of some types of/all types of kratom are quite hepatoxic to either some/many/all users is not particularly far-fetched at all. the worrying thing is that there is not enough data to see any kind of pattern with regards to susceptibility or sources.
 
No of course I haven't lied! As Sam says why would you? Unfortunately with Kratom there are no dosage guidelines. I thought my dose was fairly small- but I did take it every day for 6 weeks.
 
Totally misread the timeperiod between the apap/ paracetamol event and the kratom induced liver problems thanks for clearing it up. I do feel its best to not treat all to lightly apap. Especially in case some person takes Kratom and 1500 mg Valproic acid (Bad for the liver) and and something to kill the pain like paracetamol. No idea if this is as bad a combo for the liver or iff it just sound like one buts its what I am on minus the apap. Your stories do worry me maybe I and a lot of others could just as well face liver problems later on in live. and will Kratom be proven to be hepatotoxic.

I hope the facts about safety of Kratom extends to now as it was probably based in a time when the normal age to die was 50, a guess but I am assuming it was at least lower then now.


Would preloading with liver protaction be an idea you guys think, some kinda safetynet. And outta curiousity which strains were you on before an during samsavenger and Whizz111.
 
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Is his particular flavor heavy metals though? Also does he take stuff that slows down stomach secretions and etc?
I just had been casually taking poppyseed tea rewashed years ago many many handfuls of times where I didn't realize I was intaking lead and cadmium.

I just hold special attention to this in other plants, and it in turn helped me show a vendor his stuff was contaminated with metal. And there was alot more stuff this magnet didnt pull, but it was like a piece of a staple? maybe easier to bend, but not what I was hoping to remove.
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Also remember toss and washing isnt really practiced at all in the east compared to the west. Im sure there is reasoning behind this. Not that you stated this was your ROA but I am adverse to it after too much woes from abuse.
A single leaf which (a dose?) when dried measures to .5 gs.
 
Also remember toss and washing isnt really practiced at all in the east compared to the west. Im sure there is reasoning behind this. Not that you stated this was your ROA but I am adverse to it after too much woes from abuse.

This was something that crossed my tired mind last night and slipped away. The toss & wash method was never my favorit Always had a feeling I had to dump some boiling water over it in order to kill any germs and bugs. Paranoid me. How did the two posters ingest there kratom?

And don't forget that even a bee sting kills some people, but you have to be extremely sensitive. Doesn't happen a lot but it does happen.
 
I was using Borneo White vein crushed leaf. I would slightly heap a teaspoon and put in in a mug with warm water and then quickly down it. This wasn't easy - I often had quite a bit of leaf left in my mouth which I would chew and swallow. I noticed that this caused slight numbing of the tongue which I attributed to its pain killing properties-perhaps I should have been worried? Also think I was silly not to rest the Kratom in boiling water prior to ingesting it. So this was a kind of toss and wash I guess. I did this twice a day.
 
I would also like to add that I am not against Kratom. I am well aware that it is loved by many to no seemingly adverse effect. I do however think that it is important to report experiences such as mine. Had I paid more attention to the negative rather than positive Internet posts I may have given more thought to not only if I should take it - but how to take it and how often. Maybe im one of a minority that just cant metabolise it. Maybe i took it incorrectly. I am female and petite- dose too high? I just don't know - all I can say is be careful- you don't want to mess with your liver !
 
I used 2 strains, both in powder form. "bali" and "borneo white". the borneo white was the one I used the night before becoming sick, but it's important to note that intrahepatic cholestasis as with many drug induced liver conditions can take several days to show symptoms. It's just as likely that it was the bali i used 4 days earlier as it was the borneo white the night before, but whichever dose initiated the hepatic damage was likely exacerbated by any subsequent doses.

it seemed like the borneo white was considerably stronger, I took about a third less of it for the same effect. this could be because my liver function was compromised by the time I took it though.

obviously there's a correlation with both of us having 'borneo white'... but as someone pointed out before, correlation does not equal causation... but it wouldn't surprise me at all if it's from the same distributor since Whizz is in the UK and I'm in the Netherlands... though it still doesn't explain the countless other stories reporting near-identical issues with different strains in different countries in different years.... also, again, contamination seems an unlikely culprit since nothing strange was reported by the hospital laboratory to which I gave samples of both strains.. nor was any contamination reported in the GC/MS test on the kratom in the german study (pdf).

re: method of ingestion - I boiled it thoroughly for at least 20 mins to reduce the fluid content. mixed with sugar and lemon juice.

the hospital tested copious amounts of my blood/urine/stool. there was no mention of bacterial/parasitic infection and my blood panel did not register for any unusual heavy metals or any other type of poisoning. just mitragynine and ridiculously elevated liver enzymes. mitragynine was still detected in my bloodstream many days after ingestion, though the rate gradually fell - presumably because my damaged liver could not metabolise it at a normal rate. my liver enzymes correlated closely with detectable mitragynine in the bloodstream, but this could mean a number of things.

It's worth noting that both powders seemed very hydrophobic, the borneo white moreso.... but I think this is just a general property of kratom powder.

emkee I'm not a doctor... but it seems kinda futile to 'preload' with 'liver protectors' when both the cause of the toxic reaction and the metabolic mechanism of the substance are totally unknown. I don't even know if there's anything you could take that would even protect your liver in that sense... but obviously the simplest solution to avoid poisoning is to refrain from ingesting poison.
 
Sam- all very interesting. Yes it is likely that we may have purchased from the same source. Would also like to add that it was a full week after I felt Ill before I became jaundiced. By then the stomach ache and flu like symptoms had passed- I thought I was better!! It was the yellow eyes that made my husband make me go to the doctors! Once in hospital there was no detection of any infection. I had all sorts of blood tests; an x ray and ultrasound on my abdomen. All normal. Liver enzymes were abnormally high though- but these were reducing during my stay. As soon as I told them I'd been taking Kratom the penny dropped.
 
I once had some white Bali that was white colored. That shit made me so fucking nauseated like after 1 teaspoon. Some shit like red riau is like an antipode. Super delicious smelling and tasting like chocolate and Yerba mate, so fucking weak it doesn't even numb and its no trouble to eat it by the ounce.
I only drink cold water steeped and filtered kratom now for the catechin/ecgc. So way is eat metal anymore.

Also could they test for 7ho at all?
 
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