Hey everybody, I'm new to bluelight so please bear with me. I question whether my usual kratom dose can be taken concomitantly/concurrently with 5-htp? I only ask because kratom is said to act on the same mu-opioid receptors as tramadol and 5-htp is a precursor to serotonin. I have had a couple of bad experiences because of tramadol interactions - 1 being a seizure accompanied by renal failure and primary pulmonary hypertension when I stayed up late the night before, drank a few, then the following morning took both adderall and tramadol. The second disastrous seizure happened the first day i started an SSRI (paxil) treatment and ignorantly took tramadol the same day. This second seizure was not nearly as bad as the first, for one I was released from the ER a couple hours later with no lingering side effects. But I was hospitalized for the weekend after my first seizure with the kidney failure and the primary pulmonary hypertension (which all went away in a couple of days) I am unsure if adderall produces serotogenic effects and that it's interaction with tramadol (does raise serotonin in the brain) caused serotonin syndrome and the associated side effects ie)seizure. I am almost positive my second seizure was due to serotonin syndrome from mixing an ssri with tramadol as I felt very lightheaded and proceeded to have a syncopal episode (faint) then convulse. Sorry for such a long story but I think the details are important. Does kratom increase serotonin in the brain? Will it cause serotonin syndrome if taken in conjunction with 5-htp? Thank you for your interest.
Kratom and 5-htp - Serotonin Syndrome?
- Thread starter bigkoho
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rickolasnice
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Tramadol also acts as a serotonin releasing agent.. 5-htp does not..
I'm no expert so don't take my word for it but i can't see a problem with combining kratom and 5-htp.
I'm no expert so don't take my word for it but i can't see a problem with combining kratom and 5-htp.
I'm no expert either, but isn't 5-htp a precursor to serotonin and converts directly into serotonin after it is metabolized in the body? I guess I should better phrase my question to: does kratom increase serotonin in the brain, much like tramadol? If so, wouldn't the interaction of the increase in serotonin from kratom interact negatively with the serotonin created by the 5-htp that is already in the brain? enough to cause serotonin syndrome? Or do kratom and 5-htp have different mechanisms of action, so that would negate any trouble? Or, would mechanism of action have little to do with it if both increase serotonin?
Thanks for your earlier reply
rickolasnice
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Taking 5-htp is just like eating a lot of foods high in tryptophan.. it's just missing a step.. It doesn't cause your brain to release more.. it just gives it the building blocks necessary to make it..
People take MDMA (a well known 5-ht releaser) and 5-htp all the time with no troubles.
People take MDMA (a well known 5-ht releaser) and 5-htp all the time with no troubles.
But because 5-htp creates the building blocks necessary to make serotonin, won't your body, in turn, create that level of serotonin?
rickolasnice
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Nah it doesn't work like that.. you can eat handfuls and handfuls of serotonin and it won't get you high.. Your body will only make as much as it needs and the rest will be washed away in your piss (as 5-htp or another broken down metabolite?)
ok, gotcha. thanks, i was unsure. kinda confused still...don't different people have different amounts of serotonin in their brains? I didn't know the body had a set amount at which it needed...I was under the impression that eating more 5-htp, after all said and done, added more serotonin to the brain. Kind of like an SSRI inhibits serotonin reuptake, recycling the serotonin to make more available in the brain. Kind of like a person who suffers from mild depression takes that ssri and it doesn't just make them feel normal, it makes them feel really happy and euphoric. I understand what you're saying though, and it makes sense. Thanks for your imput.
rickolasnice
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SSRIs are different as they actually change the brain works.. 5-htp, at the end of the day, is just a supplement..
L-Dopa is a precursor to dopamine. Take as much as you want and it won't drastically increase the amount of dopamine in the brain, it will never get you high. Take a DRI or a dopamine releaser and you start changing the way your brain works, flooding your synapse with un-natural amounts of dopamine..
Same with serotonin.. like i said before.. it's like eating fuck loads of food high in tryptophan (precursor to 5-htp -> serotonin).. it will never increase the amount of serotonin in your synapse beyond natural levels (it may increase it to above what you normally have, but that would only be if you are normally deficient in it (as in.. your 5-ht levels are low)). What ever isn't needed will go un-used and be flushed from your system.
No problem, hope I helped
L-Dopa is a precursor to dopamine. Take as much as you want and it won't drastically increase the amount of dopamine in the brain, it will never get you high. Take a DRI or a dopamine releaser and you start changing the way your brain works, flooding your synapse with un-natural amounts of dopamine..
Same with serotonin.. like i said before.. it's like eating fuck loads of food high in tryptophan (precursor to 5-htp -> serotonin).. it will never increase the amount of serotonin in your synapse beyond natural levels (it may increase it to above what you normally have, but that would only be if you are normally deficient in it (as in.. your 5-ht levels are low)). What ever isn't needed will go un-used and be flushed from your system.
No problem, hope I helped
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xtcgrrrl
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Um, I'm not sure that this is correct. 5HTP may be just a supplement but it's a very very dangerous supplement...I've gone into serotonin syndrome just from taking about 5 200 mg pills of 5HTP...Also I'm overly sensitive to serotonin (just the way my brain is for some reason) and I've gone into serotonin syndrome from taking ONE 200 mg pill of 5HTP with Tramadol...from taking 5HTP with Kratom, and from taking Kava, Tramadol and Kratom together and redosing way too much. I want to add that I've found out that taking Zyprexa can help you get rid of serotonin syndrome. It's a really shitty thing to have and it sucks that I've had it so often. Not to mention that it's dangerous. I finally threw the 5HTP away!!!!
.:Holy::Toast:.
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It shouldn't cause serotonin syndrome.
People can preload with 5-htp and take MDMA and be fine, and MDMA is a much more potent serotonin releaser
Just don't take stupidly high amounts of 5-htp or kratom and you should be fine
People can preload with 5-htp and take MDMA and be fine, and MDMA is a much more potent serotonin releaser
Just don't take stupidly high amounts of 5-htp or kratom and you should be fine
sorry to say this, but I'm not sure the 5htp was your issue. tramadol would be my first guess. SWIM was on tramadol for many many months and it is the scariest and most dangerous drug they have ever ingested. tramadol is not only a pain killer but a VERY powerful SSRI, a LOT more powerful than most of the current "popular" ones on the market. SWIM went through INTENSE withdrawal from tramadol alone. in the first week it was more vile than ANY opiate withdrawal they ever been through. and they've been prescribed a LOT for their condition, oxy, hydro, oxycontin.. the tramadol was the worst two weeks they ever lived through. excruciating is putting it mildly.. SWIM is currently on 5htp alone with kratom and only 5mg oxcodone (3 times daily) and i can tell you they've had no problems. SWIM is prescribed this all and have their GI and pain management doctor on the same page and they have no issues taking it.. the tramadol however is NEVER going back on their radar.