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Kratom Addiction/ Need Help After Withdrawals Are Over

OK guys, I got addicted to this thread kinda. Will some of you update me on how you're doing?

As for me, I got some kratom from an online vendor, finally a larger amount, not these tiny bags from the mini marts for ridiculous prices. Now is my dilemma. I also have the option of buying another order from a site that had a long process for paying through a third party payer site sort of like paypal, but not.

Anyhow, Aside from the 12g I have set aside for today, I have about 80g. I'm contemplating whether this is enough to do a taper and get out while the gettin's good. If indeed the gettin' is good. Or whether I should buy the second order, which is really reasonably priced, and do a longer taper.

Part of my addict mind wants to keep taking it, but I know it's not sustainable in the long run.... but for now... like beat it said in the OP: super powers.

I'm also starting a step study group in AA. The guys know I quit the pods and quit drinking, but I've not told anyone about the kratom, partially because I don't want to have to explain it, and partially because I want to work the steps without them worrying too much over a kratom habit/addiction.

Having switched to kratom after tapering a larger pod habit over a looong month, I'm not sure how my WDs might be if I cold turkeyed the kratom or did an aggressive taper. I don't wanna CT it, but I'm thinking I might be able to forego the second purchase and taper off using the kratom I have.

I got recreational with the kratom that came for a couple of days. It was nice to see such a decent amount of it after buying these tiny pricey bags at mini marts. So, I did not follow much of the advice I've given here. But I'm gonna try to be as good as my words so far.

I think for today I'll try to use just 2 of the 3 4g doses I have measured out. If I do that just fine, I can probably taper from there, and then not cave to the urge to make the second, slightly larger purchase, and risk the kratom getting its hooks into me further.

OK, now it's yall's turn to give ME some advice!

love and peace to you all,
pnm
 
podsnomo said:
OK guys, I got addicted to this thread kinda. Will some of you update me on how you're doing?

As for me, I got some kratom from an online vendor, finally a larger amount, not these tiny bags from the mini marts for ridiculous prices. Now is my dilemma. I also have the option of buying another order from a site that had a long process for paying through a third party payer site sort of like paypal, but not.

Anyhow, Aside from the 12g I have set aside for today, I have about 80g. I'm contemplating whether this is enough to do a taper and get out while the gettin's good. If indeed the gettin' is good. Or whether I should buy the second order, which is really reasonably priced, and do a longer taper.

Part of my addict mind wants to keep taking it, but I know it's not sustainable in the long run.... but for now... like beat it said in the OP: super powers.

I'm also starting a step study group in AA. The guys know I quit the pods and quit drinking, but I've not told anyone about the kratom, partially because I don't want to have to explain it, and partially because I want to work the steps without them worrying too much over a kratom habit/addiction.

Having switched to kratom after tapering a larger pod habit over a looong month, I'm not sure how my WDs might be if I cold turkeyed the kratom or did an aggressive taper. I don't wanna CT it, but I'm thinking I might be able to forego the second purchase and taper off using the kratom I have.

I got recreational with the kratom that came for a couple of days. It was nice to see such a decent amount of it after buying these tiny pricey bags at mini marts. So, I did not follow much of the advice I've given here. But I'm gonna try to be as good as my words so far.

I think for today I'll try to use just 2 of the 3 4g doses I have measured out. If I do that just fine, I can probably taper from there, and then not cave to the urge to make the second, slightly larger purchase, and risk the kratom getting its hooks into me further.

OK, now it's yall's turn to give ME some advice!

love and peace to you all,
pnm
Click to expand...

I would go ahead and get the other purchase, 80g does not seem like enough to taper off it if your taking 8g a day that would be a very very quick taper of 10 days or so, it took me around 1 month to fully taper off kratom and I think I should have tapered for another week before kicking it actually, I think I tapered a little too quickly towards the end. If you do a 10 day taper you will surely have pretty bad withdrawals still, not as bad if you didn't taper at all but not that much better.
 
podsnomo said:
OK guys, I got addicted to this thread kinda. Will some of you update me on how you're doing?

As for me, I got some kratom from an online vendor, finally a larger amount, not these tiny bags from the mini marts for ridiculous prices. Now is my dilemma. I also have the option of buying another order from a site that had a long process for paying through a third party payer site sort of like paypal, but not.

Anyhow, Aside from the 12g I have set aside for today, I have about 80g. I'm contemplating whether this is enough to do a taper and get out while the gettin's good. If indeed the gettin' is good. Or whether I should buy the second order, which is really reasonably priced, and do a longer taper.

Part of my addict mind wants to keep taking it, but I know it's not sustainable in the long run.... but for now... like beat it said in the OP: super powers.

I'm also starting a step study group in AA. The guys know I quit the pods and quit drinking, but I've not told anyone about the kratom, partially because I don't want to have to explain it, and partially because I want to work the steps without them worrying too much over a kratom habit/addiction.

Having switched to kratom after tapering a larger pod habit over a looong month, I'm not sure how my WDs might be if I cold turkeyed the kratom or did an aggressive taper. I don't wanna CT it, but I'm thinking I might be able to forego the second purchase and taper off using the kratom I have.

I got recreational with the kratom that came for a couple of days. It was nice to see such a decent amount of it after buying these tiny pricey bags at mini marts. So, I did not follow much of the advice I've given here. But I'm gonna try to be as good as my words so far.

I think for today I'll try to use just 2 of the 3 4g doses I have measured out. If I do that just fine, I can probably taper from there, and then not cave to the urge to make the second, slightly larger purchase, and risk the kratom getting its hooks into me further.

OK, now it's yall's turn to give ME some advice!

love and peace to you all,
pnm
Click to expand...

If you do a 4 week taper with 80g, it would be something like dropping down to 8g starting tomorrow, 8g each day week 1, 6g week 2, 4g week 3, 2g week 4 - then you're out before week 4 is over. Seems kind of rapid.

I suggest going down to 8g tomorrow. Try 3 nights of that. If you flat out can't function then order 1 more shipment and plot a more conservative taper but draw the line there. Use loperamide and OTC pain relievers before you turn to anything else. Exercise will be the best thing you can do.
 
Also - keep track of your intake of everything if you're on anything else. Take note if you're ramping up your other habits in place of the kratom. If you are then you're just trading habits. Try to make it so you are uncomfortable but not miserable. If you're hiding this from your friends and/or coworkers then tell them you are working through some sleep problems (they're going to notice your not right) but tell whoever you can the truth so you have support. The more people that know the better off you'll be.

If you're serious then post your progress on BL so you can get support here. You likely know the drill - you are going to backslide a few times, will not be perfect with your schedule, will likely find yourself buying some more little bags, etc. Don't let that alter your overall trajectory though.

You might be better off doing:
week 1: 8g (per day)
week 2: 6g
week 3: 6g
week 4: 4g
week 5: 4g
week 6: 4g
week 7: 2g
week 8: 2g
week 9: 2g
week 10: 2g
week 11: 1g
week 12: 1g
week 13: 1g
week 14: 1g
week 15: 1g
week 16: 1g
 
aallaann said:
Also - keep track of your intake of everything if you're on anything else. Take note if you're ramping up your other habits in place of the kratom. If you are then you're just trading habits. Try to make it so you are uncomfortable but not miserable. If you're hiding this from your friends and/or coworkers then tell them you are working through some sleep problems (they're going to notice your not right) but tell whoever you can the truth so you have support. The more people that know the better off you'll be.

If you're serious then post your progress on BL so you can get support here. You likely know the drill - you are going to backslide a few times, will not be perfect with your schedule, will likely find yourself buying some more little bags, etc. Don't let that alter your overall trajectory though.

You might be better off doing:
week 1: 8g (per day)
week 2: 6g
week 3: 6g
week 4: 4g
week 5: 4g
week 6: 4g
week 7: 2g
week 8: 2g
week 9: 2g
week 10: 2g
week 11: 1g
week 12: 1g
week 13: 1g
week 14: 1g
week 15: 1g
week 16: 1g
Click to expand...

Thanks for the support, feedback, encouragement and advice slayer and alan. I did go ahead and get the second order. It's 6 oz: 4 oz bali, which I haven't tried yet and 2 oz thai. That's 170 g on top of the about 80 I have now of kratom that was just called kratom, with no variety marker on it from that vendor.

Anyhow, I haven't done all the math yet, but I took three 5g doses today and then a cheaty little spoonful I didn't measure, but know to be around 3-4 grams, which I didn't really need. Tomorrow I'm cleaning my house and doing all kinds of stuff, so I'm probably going to do 3 5g doses again.

When I take a break tomorrow I'll sit down and make the taper plan.

The only other things I take are 1.5mg klonopin and 10mg ambien per day. I have some extra benzos though because of switching from xanax to klonopin after filling the xanax. I don't want to trade one for the other. Or, at least, I don't want to turn the manageable amount of benzos I've been taking for years (for legitimate panic disorder) into a serious problem. So my plan is to save the extra benzos for the worst part of the taper. I did this during my poppy pod taper, but they weren't quite enough, and so I relapsed on alcohol for a couple weeks.

Now I'm feeling so much better b/c the kratom is way less of a destroyer than the poppies were. But it's kind of up and down. The best dose is the morning one with coffee, say around 7 or 8, then I'm feelin' like I really need the 2nd when it gets to be 2 or 3. Then I take the third between 7-9 so that the more energetic phase will pass for bed time. I'm looking forward to being able to take the bali closer to bed time, in a smaller amount maybe, to help with the taper.

After tapering pods, I know I can do this, and I hope it'll be easier. For sure it'll be different. This kratom is such a different animal dammit!

Thanks for the guide Alan. I may need to adjust it per the 15g I seemed to need today.
Have you done this type of taper?
What's your experience with kratom...like how often you took it, how much, and for how long?

Thanks again guys!

peace,
pnm
 
I used to make tea (then eat the leftover plant matter) along with toss n wash powdered leaf. When I did it I took about 9g per day for about 6 months but it was between other opiate addictions. I ended up on bupe eventually (which was supposed to be the end), then tramadol, then pregabalin / benzos. Right now I'm finishing my benzo taper which took years. I kept jumping from opiate to opiate until I was averaging 800-1200mg tramadol per day for a few months then hit 1600 then stopped cold turkey. I started doing grams of pregabalin per day to make the tramadol wd easier and it was. But I was basically just transferring one substance for another all the way into the pregabalin. After this started to really effect my life I tapered and just dealt with the unpleasantness of it.

I think you'll be fine if you write down a taper plan (a realistic one) and then try to stick with it. Just be on the watch for another habit waiting to take kratom's place.
 
^ I already have a habit ready to take kratom's place, the gym. There's worse things to be addicted to, eh? Thanks again alan.
 
I broke today at day 28 and consumed a medium dose probably 4-6 grams about an half hour ago, feel it a little. I need some to get through some brutal community service I'm gonna do tomorrow hopefully it won't set me back. Anyone think it will bring withdrawals back? I'm thinking probably mental but not physical. How much do you think it would take to get physically addicted again? Gonna probably do 3 doses in the course of a couple days. Any thoughts?
 
Beat It said:
I broke today at day 28 and consumed a medium dose probably 4-6 grams about an half hour ago, feel it a little. I need some to get through some brutal community service I'm gonna do tomorrow hopefully it won't set me back. Anyone think it will bring withdrawals back? I'm thinking probably mental but not physical. How much do you think it would take to get physically addicted again? Gonna probably do 3 doses in the course of a couple days. Any thoughts?
Click to expand...
If you dose it multiple times in a period of a couple days then you could very easily get readdicted to it, seems like a bad idea. As for it bringing the w/ds back, did you have any w/ds left when taking it again? If not you should be fine. If you still had w/ds left even very slight ones then it could reignite the w/ds and make them worse but probably not as bad as they were before.
 
Oh my Goooood Beat it! You slipped! This has never happened to an addict evvver! ;)

Relax man. It'll be OK. For now, just count it as a temporary slip and get back on track if you can. I'm gonna go more depth in response to your PM. Just hang in bro.
 
Yeah, I think I read that the primary alkaloids in kratom have a half life of 5 hours. By comparison xanax has a half life of around 11 hours and most would consider xanax a drug that is rapidly eliminated. What I'm getting at is that a single dose should give you a hangover either later the same day or the next day but after that you should be back to your normal withdrawals (where yo left off before you slipped).
 
aallaann said:
Yeah, I think I read that the primary alkaloids in kratom have a half life of 5 hours. By comparison xanax has a half life of around 11 hours and most would consider xanax a drug that is rapidly eliminated. What I'm getting at is that a single dose should give you a hangover either later the same day or the next day but after that you should be back to your normal withdrawals (where yo left off before you slipped).
Click to expand...

I found a source showing the half life of xanax at 6-12 hours. For me, my body eats through that shit in no time flat. More like 4 hours. Which is why my doc switched me to k-pin. I need to get a read on my kratom use and dosage schedule. This 5 hr half life thing wouldn't have occurred to me, so thanks. I'll use it in my taper plan.
 
^^ Thanks guys, so I've taken some small doses in the past few days but I think I'm gonna be fine. The first time I dosed a couple days ago I got sooo sick, didn't even feel a buzz either so the next day I took a much smaller dose, (compared to what I used to take) maybe 3-4 grams... it was actually nice. Just a mood boost and a slight euphoria that seemed far from intoxicating, maybe like a couple percs... I haven't had any for 12 hours and I feel fine, doubt there's gonna be any w/d's. I guess I was just being a fiend... 8)

slayerhatesusall said:
If you dose it multiple times in a period of a couple days then you could very easily get readdicted to it, seems like a bad idea. As for it bringing the w/ds back, did you have any w/ds left when taking it again? If not you should be fine. If you still had w/ds left even very slight ones then it could reignite the w/ds and make them worse but probably not as bad as they were before.
Click to expand...

Well I am already addicted, I am always going be addicted, so I don't think I can get "readdicted" but your right, it probably was a bad idea. At least Kratom is not that bad though in terms of using it uncontrollably/ can't stop taking it in one sitting. A dose is enough for me. I don't have to take dose after dose like other drugs. Also, my w/d's had been gone for weeks. There were no lingering body w/d's, my mind was just a little fuzzy.

For someone who's quit a drug they were dependent on and started using again, how long do you think it would take to get dependent a second time? It probably would depend on how long they quit vs. how long they were dependent in the first place... Guess I'm just wondering if previous dependency would make a difference like the body could easily readapt to the drugs presence.
 
aallaann said:
Also - keep track of your intake of everything if you're on anything else. Take note if you're ramping up your other habits in place of the kratom. If you are then you're just trading habits. Try to make it so you are uncomfortable but not miserable. If you're hiding this from your friends and/or coworkers then tell them you are working through some sleep problems (they're going to notice your not right) but tell whoever you can the truth so you have support. The more people that know the better off you'll be.

If you're serious then post your progress on BL so you can get support here. You likely know the drill - you are going to backslide a few times, will not be perfect with your schedule, will likely find yourself buying some more little bags, etc. Don't let that alter your overall trajectory though.

You might be better off doing:
week 1: 8g (per day)
week 2: 6g
week 3: 6g
week 4: 4g
week 5: 4g
week 6: 4g
week 7: 2g
week 8: 2g
week 9: 2g
week 10: 2g
week 11: 1g
week 12: 1g
week 13: 1g
week 14: 1g
week 15: 1g
week 16: 1g
Click to expand...

Aallaann this is awesome! I've scoured over the internet trying to find a taper plan! Would definitely use this if I needed it. I've heard at 1 gram it doesn't even pass the threshold so I think those doses would just keep your head on... at that point you'd probably been done with w/d's.
 
Beat It said:
Aallaann this is awesome! I've scoured over the internet trying to find a taper plan! Would definitely use this if I needed it. I've heard at 1 gram it doesn't even pass the threshold so I think those doses would just keep your head on... at that point you'd probably been done with w/d's.
Click to expand...

I wondered about that threshold deal. So, when weaning/tapering off, and you drop below the "threshold" does the dose not affect you in the buzz-way but still keep the WDs at bay? I'm hoping this will be easier than tapering off pods. All I can be sure of though is that it'll be different.

Also, that taper program is loooong. Much longer than opiate tapers I've seen. Is there a reason(s) for that?

Thanks again alan!
 
I could feel 3g but not much below when I had a normal tolerance. But I've read of individuals in the midst of withdrawal getting relief from minuscule doses (leftover scrap at the bottom of old bags).

You're right, it is pretty long. The taper below should not be too bad. You could jump off at weeks 6-8 if you're not feeling awful. The idea is to make bigger cuts in the beginning and then slow it down as you taper. So if you plotted your use on a graph you should see it slopping gently downwards. Also spreading your doses out more throughout the day would help (avoiding peaks and valleys is best).

Pods (morphine / codeine) has a listed half life of 2-3 hours. That's pretty damn short and I imagine wd must suck. Kratom should be easier. Note that I'm not convinced kratom has a half life of 5 hours though. I suspect that mitragynine might be the alkaloid that was measured since its been studied longer and not 7-hydroxymitragynine which is now thought to be the primary alkaloid.

week 1: 8g
week 2: 6g
week 3: 4g
week 4: 3g
week 5: 3g
week 6: 2g
week 7: 2g
week 8: 2g
 
Pods for me, and for many others I've talked to, lasted ALL DAY, like 8+ hours, even with a stiff tolerance, so not sure where you got that 2-3 hour HL, but I don't think it's right.

aallaann said:
I could feel 3g but not much below when I had a normal tolerance. But I've read of individuals in the midst of withdrawal getting relief from minuscule doses (leftover scrap at the bottom of old bags).

You're right, it is pretty long. The taper below should not be too bad. You could jump off at weeks 6-8 if you're not feeling awful. The idea is to make bigger cuts in the beginning and then slow it down as you taper. So if you plotted your use on a graph you should see it slopping gently downwards. Also spreading your doses out more throughout the day would help (avoiding peaks and valleys is best).

Pods (morphine / codeine) has a listed half life of 2-3 hours. That's pretty damn short and I imagine wd must suck. Kratom should be easier. Note that I'm not convinced kratom has a half life of 5 hours though. I suspect that mitragynine might be the alkaloid that was measured since its been studied longer and not 7-hydroxymitragynine which is now thought to be the primary alkaloid.

week 1: 8g
week 2: 6g
week 3: 4g
week 4: 3g
week 5: 3g
week 6: 2g
week 7: 2g
week 8: 2g
Click to expand...
 
Heya guys, Sorry i aint posted in a while i aint really been up to it, i dunno wot happened but a couple of weeks ago while i was on the kratom i went into a horrid depression , so i quit cold turkey well the first week was absolute hell i couldnt sleep but was taking naps in the day i used alcohol and diazepam for 1 night which worked for a 6 hour sleep for some relief,i took loperamide on day 6 which helped with the loose stools, i had extreme brain fog by day 7 for some reason but that seems to have improved slightly ,im on day 12 now but just feel emotionally flat which makes me feel like using again, im currently taking b complex ,calcium and 5htp supplements and some melatonin at nights , my sleep seems to be getting bk to normal the last few nights which is a relief My daytimes at the moment are just pacing around the house maybe akathesia but not sure i just hope this passes soon ,Im just trying to stop the the temptation of using again now! sorry if its hard to read my heads a lil all over the place at the moment Hope everyones ok, will keep updated , Much love, Andy!
 
Last edited:
Hang in there andy. You've done the hardest part dude. It's good you're getting those supplements in you. If you can add some exercise, even though I know that idea may sound like shit, that'll help you feel better, lots better. If you have slipped and used, just put it behind you and move on. It won't put you back to day 1.

Let us know how you get on.
You can do it brother!
pnm
 
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