Juries are 'unsympathetic' to women who claim rape after drunken binge

[yummy22]

Okay I didn't mean to say that being silent automatically gives you the right to go ahead and do whatever. I am saying it really means nothing and should not mean anything in the eyes of a jury. I am saying if you don't want to have sex with someone and don't say no or show any obvious signs that you actually don't want to, you shouldn't go and say that the person raped you, even if you didn't want to have sex with them.

It does mean yes much more often than it means no and I'm sure you knew what I meant when I said it does equal consent. I should have said it usually does mean that.

By not saying no you are leaving it open to interpretation whether you consent or not.

If a woman is too drunk to speak obviously she does not consent to having sex with you. But what do you say to someone who thinks they were raped but can't remember because they were too fucked up? I don't know really but it surely should not be that they are automatically right about it. I guess it's that they are shit out of luck until they get some actual proof.

Pardon for asking, but is there some unwritten social contract I am unaware of that if you buy a girl 3 drinks she's supposed to have sex with you ? WTF

Yes there is and if you don't believe that it exists you are naive. I'm not saying women have to follow it but it certainly exists. Come on now, I'm sure most women know exactly what most guys are trying to do when they buy them drinks for no reason. I don't really agree with it but it's there.

 

[Khadijah]

Good, Juries should be unsympathetic to women who claim rape after drinken binges.

No woman should be raped and rapists to me are the lowest forms of life, right there with pedophiles and all fucked up twisted sex predators.

BUT, if you get real wasted, and fuck a guy that you wouldnt fuck while you were sober, you didnt get raped. you were stupid and werent thinkin straight cuz you were drunk.

Rape is MAKING a woman have sex against her consent. its FORCING a woman to give you sex, or taking it from her, while she dont want to.

Rape is NOT having sex, then regrettin it later, and blaming the guy.

I do think women should take some responsibility for what they get into. if a woman is so strong, and independent, and liberated, and equal to a man, then shouldnt she be able to say no when shes drunk and a guy wants to have sex with her?

Straight up, if you are shit faced drunk, and you are with a dude, and hes puttin the moves on you, and you dont resist them, then everything that follows after that is not rape. You cant say "i was too drunk to resist" the only way youre too drunk to resist is if youre passed out, cold on the ground unconscious. if you are capable of goin to the bathroom, puking, gettin yourself another drink, answering your phone,or holding a conversation then youre capable of sayin no.

Im sorry maybe it sounds harsh, but i am sick and fuckin tired of weak-ass females who cant control themselves KNOWINGLY putting themselves into compromising, potentially risky situations, then gettin shit faced drunk , and then cryin when somethin bad happens. You gotta take measures to protect yourself. reality and what "should" be, are not the same thing.

Im sick of it cuz i am a female, and it makes every one of us look like shit when some stupid bitch goes out, gets too drunk to know whats goin on, has sex with a random guy, then cries rape afterwards.

I think a dude who would do that type of thing is still a piece of shit and a scumbag. But i think a woman who would knowingly put herself directly into harms way , and then knowingly decrease her ability to defend or protect herself by drinkin herself retarded, deserves some of the blame when some shit goes down.

 

[theWorldWithin]

exactly lacey, even after blacking out I think all people are capable of saying no if it is against their will. Not that you should ever get to the point of blacking out among anyone but trusted indivduals in private places.

 

[ChemicalBeauty]

Nothing in that article seems unreasonable to me.

This post was especially poignant

If the key witness to any other type of crime was smashed when the crime was committed, the jury would likely be "unsympathetic" to their testimony as well.

 

[Psychedelics_r_best]

Yes! I can't wait to go rape some belligerent bitches in the UK!

 

[rm-rf]

If I buy a bitch 3 drink I am expecting someting in return. I would never intentionally rape anyone but by the same token I am entirely unsympathetic of most women claiming rape. 9 out of 10 times it is just for attention or out of spite.

oh we totally need to keep this quote around ... in reported posts forum lol

 

[NameTaken]

oh we totally need to keep this quote around ... in reported posts forum lol

Uhhh, something in return doesn't mean sex, it could mean a kiss, or a hug or buying the guy three drinks later in the night.

I want girls to buy guys drinks sometimes.

 

[DarthMom]

If I buy a bitch 3 drink I am expecting someting in return.

*swoons* golly, too bad i am not single anymore and miss out on hot catches like this one.

I would never intentionally rape anyone but by the same token I am entirely unsympathetic of most women claiming rape. 9 out of 10 times it is just for attention or out of spite.

you are a brilliant man obviously, after reading your previous comment. because it was obvious sarcasm, since only inbred morons would say something and be serious, and you can access the internet, so you must not be that obtuse....only a witty and intelligent man would make a comment mocking such moronic men. so pray tell, how do you know which woman to be sympathetic to, and which to spit on? any tell tale signs that we should look for to spot these liars?

also, can i get your address to add to the neighborhood watchlist, because frankly, with what you have said, i would be shocked if you haven't "date raped" already.

it is attitudes like yours that contribute to the abuse of women, and lead men to think that abuse of a girl who can't accept your advances is okay. it is attitudes like yours that make good men so easy to spot. you are a prime example of what to steer clear of. you are the big fucking iceberg to a woman's titanic.

congratulations.

hope this doesn't get deleted, but will PM you a copy just in case.

have a fantastic day. just do your next vic a favor, and at least wipe your splooge when you are done.

i do apologize to the forum for going overboard in this post. that comment rubbed me the wrong way, understandably

 

[Putingrad]

It's always stunning to me the amount of people who will say things like "If I buy a bitch 3 drink I am expecting someting in return. I would never intentionally rape anyone but by the same token I am entirely unsympathetic of most women claiming rape. 9 out of 10 times it is just for attention or out of spite." Have you ever been raped? Have you ever known someone who has been? Are you aware at just how common a thing rape is, and how it's quite likely that someone you know, maybe even know well, has experienced it? Such opinions in a year like 2006 is truly disgusting. Grow up.

 

[Beatlebot]

See the problem here is that we still put the blame on women to 'not get themselves in situations where they will get raped', rather then on the men who are doing the raping.

Saying that a girl who drinks too much put herself in a dangerous situation is the same as saying the girl who wore a short skirt was asking for it is the same as saying the girl who isn't wearing full hijab derseves to be raped IS THE SAME AS SAYING that it's OK to rape women.

That's what it boils down to

 

[E-llusion]

^^ Amen

Really, I am appalled at some of the replies in this thread, really really sad

 

[NameTaken]

Saying that a girl who drinks too much put herself in a dangerous situation is the same as saying the girl who wore a short skirt was asking for it is the same as saying the girl who isn't wearing full hijab derseves to be raped IS THE SAME AS SAYING that it's OK to rape women.

That's what it boils down to

Thats a horrible escalating comparison, and you know its wrong.

Obviously the rapist is responsible, but when a girl gets so drunk she can be taken advantage of, it irresponsible of her, puts her in more danger, and allows more rapes to take place. Saying the girl is not responsible for avoiding dangerous situations is ridiculous.

Therefore, a girl (or even guy) who went out in public and got so drunk she blacked out does not have any of my respect. She certainty does NOT deserve to get raped like some suggested, but she must be aware that by doing this, she is putting herself in greater danger.

 

[New]

I mean, what the hell? Whatever happened to human decency? I know I can get wasted off of my ass at a party and expect not to be raped(although, on a side note, I wish was, at this point ), or get unwanted sexual attention. Why shouldn't a woman expect the same courtesy? It's like saying women are inferior to men just because we(men) want to get laid.

 

[Beatlebot]

Thats a horrible escalating comparison, and you know its wrong.

Obviously the rapist is responsible, but when a girl gets so drunk she can be taken advantage of, it irresponsible of her, puts her in more danger, and allows more rapes to take place. Saying the girl is not responsible for avoiding dangerous situations is ridiculous.

Therefore, a girl (or even guy) who went out in public and got so drunk she blacked out does not have any of my respect. She certainty does NOT deserve to get raped like some suggested, but she must be aware that by doing this, she is putting herself in greater danger.

I believe what I said, that's why I said it.

Have you never mistakenly drunk more than you intended and become drunker than you can handle? Part of growing up is learning what your limits are. It's very easy for ANYONE to go out and accidentally get more drunk than they intended. That doesn't mean they deserve to be raped, or that it is in any way their fault.

Most young women going out at night do not realise they are putting themselves in danger. They're having a night out with friends and consider themselves safe. In most cases of rape the victim knows the perpetrator, considers him a friend, even. When you go out with your mates do you expect one of them to rape you? I sure as hell don't think like that, if I did I'd spend all my time cowering in my room at home, where it's "safe."

Rape is the fault of one person only. The rapist.

 

[Psychedelic Gleam]

"Rape is the fault of one person only. The rapist."

That seems like blatant disregard to the realities that surround us... nothing is as simple as that...

"Have you never mistakenly drunk more than you intended and become drunker than you can handle?"

Yes, and anything and everything that happens at that point, that would have been in some way preventable or avoided is in some ways on my shoulders. (to varying degrees.)

"That doesn't mean they deserve to be raped, or that it is in any way their fault."

Noone thinks they deserve to get raped just that individuals should realize the signals they are sending out to the majority of men who are in a bar buying strangers drinks, they don't want your social company, they don't want good conversation, they aren't particularly charitable... don't go along with the game if you don't want to fuck the dude... Guys can't read minds, at all, just tell us straight up, "i'm not interested." and it would solve alot of problems it seems.

In no way though to i mean to excuse rape, its disgusting, and fucked up... and way too acceptable/unreported/ignored...

 

[Khadijah]

The woman is not always right.



And, once again, what IS, and what SHOULD be, are two different things. no woman deserves to get raped. But should a woman in a thong and bikini top walk around in the middle of the projects at 2 am, unarmed, with a sign that says "free sex"? And then should she be able to cry when someone does rape her?

do you think that in the interest of SELF DEFENSE and HARM REDUCTION, it would be a wise idea to knowingly intoxicate yourself to the point of being unconscious , while around many people you dont know, much less trust?

 

[Khadijah]

^^Good.....glad i made someone think about it.....

OK, heres another one...

If you walk around dressed extremely high class , makin it obvious that you are very rich, and decide to take a stroll by yourself thru a area that you know is dangerous, violent, and known for robberies, assault, and general crime, in the middle of the night, with no weapon, while carrying hundreds of dollars in your back pocket, and you get robbed, would people feel bad for you?

Or do you think it would be more likely for them to say "what the FUCK were you doin there, lookin like that, at three in the damn morning , alone, with no protection? Of COURSE you got robbed, what the hell did you think was gonna happen?"

Why would it be any different with rape? its alot worse to get raped than robbed. dont get me wrong. im just sayin, why is the blame any different in that situation? all the things leadin up to it are pretty much the same IMO....

In any situation but rape, knowing that you are going into somethin dangerous, where somethin bad could potentially happen to you, and then makin it even worse by disabiling your good judgement and self defense with every drink you swallow, would be considered stupid, lack of judgement, not usin common sense, and etc. So why suddenly when its a woman attacked, then its not her fault, in any way, at all, ever, what so ever? It can be.

I aint sayin its a womans fault if she gets raped. Im sayin that there is not always a clear cut black and white line of whose to blame. If you deny that certain acts a woman does that lead up to her gettin raped, have ANYTHING to do with the situation, then you just bein ignorant. KEEP IN MIND THIS IS SOMETIMES NOT ALL THE TIME. Sometimes a random rapist just picks a poor, poor woman on the street and takes her human dignity away. But alot more times , its a lil more sketchy. once again, reality and the ideal world aint the same. if you aint got the ability to see that then youre kiddin yourself, and if you aint gonna accept the facts of real life and live by those, instead of what "should" be then youre willfully acting against better judgement. Cause and effect. you cant act like this shit aint real, or like it aint got somethin to do with it. you can either live in a made up world where things are as they should be, and choose to live by that, and there fore put yourself in bad situations cuz "nothing SHOULD happen", or, you can be smart, and do what it takes to protect yourself, and that includes bein responsible for your own actions and doin whatever you can to keep yourself safe and out of harms way. I think all this shit about women always bein the victim and never havin nothing to do with it, is actually degrading and less empowering to women who are raped.

 

[Beatlebot]

The woman is not always right.

I'm not saying a woman is always right, I'm saying a woman has the same right as anyone else on this planet not to be raped.

And, once again, what IS, and what SHOULD be, are two different things. no woman deserves to get raped. But should a woman in a thong and bikini top walk around in the middle of the projects at 2 am, unarmed, with a sign that says "free sex"? And then should she be able to cry when someone does rape her?

Why would it be rape if she is giving away free sex? If she is giving away free sex why would anyone rape her? Please keep your analogies within the realm of realistic situations.

But for the sake of argument, yes, I think a woman should be able to walk around completely naked in any neighbourhood at 2am and not be raped. Men are not wild animals, any person who knows the difference between right and wrong knows not to rape people.

do you think that in the interest of SELF DEFENSE and HARM REDUCTION, it would be a wise idea to knowingly intoxicate yourself to the point of being unconscious , while around many people you dont know, much less trust?

Did you read my post? Most rapes occur between people that do know eachother. That means friends and people you trusted not to rape you. Of course people should not drink to the point of being unconscious, but how many people do you know actually begin drinking with that intent?

If a man drank himself to unconsciouness and was raped, would you be standing there telling him he shouldn't have drunk so much and it's partly his fault?

If your friend gets raped in prison, are you going to tell him it's his own fault for breaking the law in the first place?

I certainly wouldn't, because I don't think ANYONE deserves to be raped. It's a terrible thing to have to happen to someone and for people in this forum to tell me that I should be responsible for myself not getting raped by thinking about it every time I get dressed, go out, have a drink or talk to a man - Well, you can all fuck off, seriously.

 

[Beatlebot]

I aint sayin its a womans fault if she gets raped. Im sayin that there is not always a clear cut black and white line of whose to blame. If you deny that certain acts a woman does that lead up to her gettin raped, have ANYTHING to do with the situation, then you just bein ignorant. KEEP IN MIND THIS IS SOMETIMES NOT ALL THE TIME. Sometimes a random rapist just picks a poor, poor woman on the street and takes her human dignity away. But alot more times , its a lil more sketchy. once again, reality and the ideal world aint the same. if you aint got the ability to see that then youre kiddin yourself, and if you aint gonna accept the facts of real life and live by those, instead of what "should" be then youre willfully acting against better judgement. Cause and effect. you cant act like this shit aint real, or like it aint got somethin to do with it. you can either live in a made up world where things are as they should be, and choose to live by that, and there fore put yourself in bad situations cuz "nothing SHOULD happen", or, you can be smart, and do what it takes to protect yourself, and that includes bein responsible for your own actions and doin whatever you can to keep yourself safe and out of harms way. I think all this shit about women always bein the victim and never havin nothing to do with it, is actually degrading and less empowering to women who are raped.

Say you and I were having this argument in person and I didn't like the way it was going so I hit you hard in the face and break your nose.

Whose fault is it?

Is it my fault, because I hit you in the nose?

Or is it your fault, because you should have known better to argue with me in the first place? Is it your fault for antagonising me? Is it your fault because I just don't like the way you look, the way you talk or the way you dress? Is it your fault because I thought you looked at me the wrong way? Is it your fault because everyone knows you were just asking for it?

Of course not, it's my fault because I didn't control myself and I punched you in the nose, nobody else's.

not that I'd ever hit you, I'm just using this as an example

 

[gloggawogga]

Has anyone here actually served in a jury box?

I did once. It is not an easy decision to put a person in prison for a long long time. Yet I helped put a woman away for 20 years for aggravated robbery. Coming to guilty verdict was actually pretty easy in this case, because the evidence was pretty damming. But when it came to sentencing phase, we had to decide,under Texas law, from between 5 years probation and 100 years in prison. We had deliberated the guilty verdict in a few hours. It took us a couple of days on the sentencing and it was a very hard decision to make. But based on the circumstances of the robbery (it was pretty violent robbery, someone was tortured and then died as a result of it), her past record, etc. we gave her 20 years.

But the point I'm trying to make is if you're in the jury box sending someone away to prison is very serious thing. You send some guy to prison for 10 years or so, you can figure he's gonna get raped again and again, for 10 fucking (no pun intended) years. Now I have no objection to it, if you can prove he's responsible for raping a women, he deserves everything he gets and I'd have no trouble convicting him. If there is good physical evidence like proof of a physical struggle and some DNA evidence, I'd be willing to convict pretty much regardless of the victims credibility. But if I have rely on just the victims testimony to put someone away for a very long time, that victim better dam well prove her credibility to me, beyond a reasonable doubt. Because thought of sending an innocent man to prison where he will get raped repeatedly in a cold cage for 10 years or so is much more appalling to me than the thought of a woman being raped once.