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Is there anything more addictive than heroin?

I've been a social smoker for close to four years and have never had urges nor the will to buy a pack of cigs.
Tobacco is addictive, but it's also very available. If it were illegal, it'd probably be as sought out as Khat is.

I believe if you indulge a person into Alprozolam, meth or heroin for a few days, addiction will set in no matter what. But it requires a certain mindset to rationalize using a hard drug.

I think stoners and alcoholics fall into Heroin use easier while Cocaine/Ecstasy/Prescription ADD medication users fall into meth use. It all depends on your world view, genetics and psychological issues.
 
If heroin is the most addictive thing for you (like it was for me) consider yourself lucky. Alcoholics, crackheads, meth heads, gamblers all get wayyyyy more fucked up from their addictions. With heroin you get over the sickness and PAWS and then you feel better than you did before the drugs. Coke and meth change people, alcoholics get that brain damage and gamblers go in serious debt.
 
Effuzion said:
If heroin is the most addictive thing for you (like it was for me) consider yourself lucky. Alcoholics, crackheads, meth heads, gamblers all get wayyyyy more fucked up from their addictions. With heroin you get over the sickness and PAWS and then you feel better than you did before the drugs. Coke and meth change people, alcoholics get that brain damage and gamblers go in serious debt.
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That's not really true at all but okay..
 
Effuzion said:
What's not true?
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You still do quite a bit of bodily harm if you shoot it and most people lose quite a bit of money on the habit as well.

Finally, Heroin is more dangerous than all of those addictions in terms of mortality.
 
Renz Envy said:
You still do quite a bit of bodily harm if you shoot it and most people lose quite a bit of money on the habit as well.

Finally, Heroin is more dangerous than all of those addictions in terms of mortality.
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Needles aren't exclusive to heroin though. A lot of people who actually get addicted to meth and coke use needles with those drugs, too. And yeah it costs money but all drugs cost money and gambling costs even more. I'll give you the mortality, with the caveat that last time I saw a study it said that nearly all heroin/opiate related deaths involved more than one drug (usually benzos or alcohol).

I'm not saying "go do heroin its not that bad!". But I walked away from a 3 years of almost daily use and today I feel better than before I did drugs. I'm one of the few who can say I learned from my addiction and walked away without any serious consequences. The tweakers and alcoholics I met in rehab... not so much. I consider myself lucky heroin was my DOC.
 
Effuzion said:
Needles aren't exclusive to heroin though. A lot of people who actually get addicted to meth and coke use needles with those drugs, too. And yeah it costs money but all drugs cost money and gambling costs even more. I'll give you the mortality, with the caveat that last time I saw a study it said that nearly all heroin/opiate related deaths involved more than one drug (usually benzos or alcohol).

I'm not saying "go do heroin its not that bad!". But I walked away from a 3 years of almost daily use and today I feel better than ever. The tweakers and alcoholics I met in rehab... not so much. I consider myself lucky heroin was my DOC.
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3 years is not a lot of time man.. Hah. I know a lot of people that were still having a grand ole' time at the 3 year mark... Just because you happened to meet a few people in rehab who were worse off than you and had different DOC's.. doesn't mean you can make a blanket statement like "Alcoholics, crackheads, meth heads, gamblers all get wayyyyy more fucked up from their addictions" There are varying levels of every addiction and depending how long you use for and how hard you go.. all of those things will ruin your life, change you, make you broke, and possibly kill you. But heroin has destroyed a shit load of lives.. killed a shit load of people.. and if you think it's any better of an option than anything else, you are severely mistaken or just haven't been through enough shit yet or seen it first hand.
 
I honestly believe that it depends entirely on the person, though I'd honestly have to say tobacco for me. I've done a lot of different things and easily stopped or at least kept it to doing it rarely, but after a week of just trying cigarettes, I just got hooked and now I can't stop. Not a hardcore smoke-a-pack-a-day smoker, but I do indulge in one every other day because I usually get uncomfortable without some form of artificial relaxation.
 
mr.scagnattie said:
3 years is not a lot of time man.. Hah. I know a lot of people that were still having a grand ole' time at the 3 year mark... Just because you happened to meet a few people in rehab who were worse off than you and had different DOC's.. doesn't mean you can make a blanket statement like "Alcoholics, crackheads, meth heads, gamblers all get wayyyyy more fucked up from their addictions" There are varying levels of every addiction and depending how long you use for and how hard you go.. all of those things will ruin your life, change you, make you broke, and possibly kill you. But heroin has destroyed a shit load of lives.. killed a shit load of people.. and if you think it's any better of an option than anything else, you are severely mistaken or just haven't been through enough shit yet or seen it first hand.
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I would argue that if heroin "makes you" go broke and ruins your life, it's you that's the problem, not the drug. I'm talking about the physical effects. Heroin doesn't cause lasting brain damage, the other drugs I mentioned all do.

Obviously there's varying levels of every addiction and one heroin addict who uses for 20 years will be worse off than someone who used crack for 6 months, but I think any rational person can figure that out for himself and I don't need to mention that.
 
Effuzion said:
I would argue that if heroin "makes you" go broke and ruins your life, it's you that's the problem, not the drug. I'm talking about the physical effects. Heroin doesn't cause lasting brain damage, the other drugs I mentioned all do.

Obviously there's varying levels of every addiction and one heroin addict who uses for 20 years will be worse off than someone who used crack for 6 months, but I think any rational person can figure that out for himself and I don't need to mention that.
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So you're speaking about just psychical tole on the body? That isn't the only way to measure how bad a drug effects you..

But I suppose in that regard you're correct. If looking at the psychical tole alone, somebody who has been using crack/booze/meth for the same amount of years as someone who has been solely using heroin, than yes.. their bodies are probably going to be much more fucked up. But like I said.. the tole on the body is only one factor involved in addiction.
 
mr.scagnattie said:
So you're speaking about just psychical tole on the body? That isn't the only way to measure how bad a drug effects you..

But I suppose in that regard you're correct. If looking at the psychical tole alone, somebody who has been using crack/booze/meth for the same amount of years as someone who has been solely using heroin, than yes.. their bodies are probably going to be much more fucked up. But like I said.. the tole on the body is only one factor involved in addiction.
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It's not the only factor in addiction, no, but the physical toll is basically the only difference between the drugs. Every addiction comes with low self-esteem, lying, cutting out friends/family, spending money you don't have, doing illegal/stupid/"what the fuck are you retarded" type shit.
 
Effuzion said:
It's not the only factor in addiction, no, but the physical toll is basically the only difference between the drugs. Every addiction comes with low self-esteem, lying, cutting out friends/family, spending money you don't have, doing illegal/stupid/"what the fuck are you retarded" type shit.
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When I was in detox/rehab/ etc. I would always look at the alcoholics as people who I seriously felt bad for. For one, their withdrawals were brutal (the real long-term ones).. But also, I thought about what I'd do if I had the same love affair with booze that I do dope.. I'd be fucked. Imagine being able to just walk down the block and buy your drug of choice in a store.. Liquor stores on every corner, people drinking in restaurants, TV shows showing social drinking.. It's got to be fucking hard to stay sober in this world as an alcoholic.
 
Effuzion said:
I would argue that if heroin "makes you" go broke and ruins your life, it's you that's the problem, not the drug. I'm talking about the physical effects. Heroin doesn't cause lasting brain damage, the other drugs I mentioned all do.

Obviously there's varying levels of every addiction and one heroin addict who uses for 20 years will be worse off than someone who used crack for 6 months, but I think any rational person can figure that out for himself and I don't need to mention that.
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The illogical part of this whole debate is that the subjectivity of the matter applies everywhere.

Some meth heads don't lose their marbles
Some Crack Heads don't... Forget crack
Some Alcoholics are functional
Some gambling addicts can maintain a normal life and run a business.
Some Heroin Addicts don't die from OD

But God damn, people need to quit rationalizing hard drug use just because it's their DOC. It's called keeping a level head and recognizing that maybe the category you fit under has shit that smells just as bad as all the other peas in the pod.
 
Agreed. You know you're fucked when heroin addicts feel bad for you.

The illogical part of this whole debate is that the subjectivity of the matter applies everywhere.

Some meth heads don't lose their marbles
Some Crack Heads don't... Forget crack
Some Alcoholics are functional
Some gambling addicts can maintain a normal life and run a business.
Some Heroin Addicts don't die from OD

But God damn, people need to quit rationalizing hard drug use just because it's their DOC. It's called keeping a level head and recognizing that maybe the category you fit under has shit that smells just as bad as all the other peas in the pod.
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Do enough meth and you will lose your marbles. Sure, you might hold a great job, a happy marriage and get whatever you want in life, but enough of that drug (and coke and alcohol) and you will have permanent, irreversible brain damage. You could say "well plenty of heroin addicts die from OD" and I won't disagree with you there. Heroin isn't the only drug that can kill you, though, and those that do get away from heroin don't have to try to face sobriety with brain damage.

Anyway, I'm not trying to say heroin is good, or I'm better than you or whatever. I'm just bored with a laptop and finals I don't want to study for.
 
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Of course.

Meth's brain damage has never been proven to be permanent in humans, but it is known to last anywhere from 6 months to 2 years. Yikes.
But you can reduce it by taking precautions such as eating, taking breaks, nootropics, sleeping, hydrating, keeping temperature down, ROA management.

In the end it's all a matter of how hard you let the addiction control your rational thought process.

I've seen the darkside of all those worlds... Except Crack o_O;

And meth heads typically try and claim their addiction is less harmful anyway. Seems sort of rare coming from heroin's side.
 
I think its up to the individual. No drug can be said to be more/less addictive objectively. Granted some have higher addiction potentials, but as already stated, alcohol w/d's are fucking brutal, same with alot of other gabergics. Perhaps its not the high, but the w/d's that make them so addictive compared to the non-physically (relative) addictive drugs like cocaine, methamphetamine, etc.

Still, the psychological relief the non physically addictive drugs can provide, is a powerful incentive to keep the addiction going, at least in the case of meth/cocaine imho. Hell, cannabis could fall into this catergory, assuming its being used to self medicate some serious problems, which symptoms flare up upon discontinuation of use. Knowing relief is one hit away, is a powerful incentive to keep using. But idk if that qualifies as addiction, as its not the drug, but the underlying condition and how it treats the symptoms. Still a relevant thing to take into consideration when comparing addictive potential of drugs.

Its all about the individual, and why they are abusing the drug in question.
 
Opiates/oids in fact can cause brain damage due to lack of oxygen (at reasonable doses). There's a thread in the archives here which covers it very well. Let me know and I think I might be able to dig it up.
 
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