Is the knowledge of good and evil, good or evil?

[Gnostic Bishop]

Forbidden knowledge is always going to be a problem of "Us" and "Other". A truth you cannot look in the face. Yes, you can go out and rape someone right now, get away with it, and not be judged in the afterlife. Not only is it truths about nature it's about Ideology and culture, the ramifications of scribbling on the margins or not listening to authority.
The Bible will always show its age in how sloppily written it is and how wanton its ethics are applied. However, 'is the knowledge of good and evil, good, or evil?' it simply occupies both spaces at the same time. Just don't over push any boundaries..."OKAY EVE, JESUS, IT'S THAT FUCKING TREE OVER THERE. DO NOT GO OVER THERE."

You break the law of the excluded middle with your view.

Regards
DL

 

[Gnostic Bishop]

It's evil.

Why?

Regards
DL

 

[Gormur]

So if a woman is raped, it is not evil. Ok.

That is why I mostly ignore you. Delusional thinking is poor thinking.

Regards
DL

If a woman is raped by a demon it is, by a man it's just a terrible injustice. One could call it wrong as well

I guess I don't see the use of terms right and wrong because people already know the social problems caused by their misdeeds

 

[Brendan12]

Right and wrong is about moral codes.. which are tested in the new enviroment..

Test lab certified.

The wrong actions seem.. or in this pun.. sew themselves out of order..

Breaking the fabric of existence..

Bad things creates knots in the left intestine.

 

[Branggen]

I think its good, one way I like to look at 'the knowledge of evil' is as the knowledge that you can inflict pain and suffering on another being for any reason, or even just for pleasure in the case of sadists. The knowledge of good would then be the knowledge that we can help each other, without it benefiting ourselves in the survival sense. I don't think animals know either of these things, they only help or hurt each other for survival reasons as far as I can tell

 

[Gnostic Bishop]

I think its good, one way I like to look at 'the knowledge of evil' is as the knowledge that you can inflict pain and suffering on another being for any reason, or even just for pleasure in the case of sadists. The knowledge of good would then be the knowledge that we can help each other, without it benefiting ourselves in the survival sense. I don't think animals know either of these things, they only help or hurt each other for survival reasons as far as I can tell

IOW, we do exactly what the lower animals do. Right?

Compete when we must and cooperate when profitable.

Regards
DL

 

[Branggen]

IOW, we do exactly what the lower animals do. Right?

Compete when we must and cooperate when profitable.

Regards
DL

I think the difference is that humans can torture, as opposed to just compete as all animals do, and on the good side humans can give charity without any profitability, or mutually beneficial relationship needed.

 

[Gnostic Bishop]

I think the difference is that humans can torture, as opposed to just compete as all animals do, and on the good side humans can give charity without any profitability, or mutually beneficial relationship needed.

Have you never seen a cat playing/torturing it's meal? I have.

As to charity. When we give, we reap the benefits of not only doing our duty to each other but also the good feelings we get for doing them. Our selfish gene is our guide to life and works for selfish reasons.

Regards
DL

 

[Branggen]

Have you never seen a cat playing/torturing it's meal? I have.

As to charity. When we give, we reap the benefits of not only doing our duty to each other but also the good feelings we get for doing them. Our selfish gene is our guide to life and works for selfish reasons.

Regards
DL

To me torture is to purposely cause pain, I dont think a cat knows its causing pain when it 'plays' with a mouse. When a cat in the outdoors catches a mouse it eats it quickly, its accepted that indoor cats do this because they have their hunger taken care of, yet are still reacting to their natural instincts to catch the mouse. A bit different from the torture im thinking of because of its basis in survival. The kind of torture im thinking of is more like, malevolence, even to 'torture' someone for information is different that what im thinking of because you do that for information, for survival reasons

Or perhaps the knowledge of evil is the understanding that we have evil built into us as animals, that we must kill, and sometimes hurt others in order to succeed as individuals. Conceptualizing it like this the knowledge of good would be something like knowing that we are also more than just the individual, that we are all the same thing; I think that is what give us the reason to help others when it has no benefit to us, when they wouldn't even know our name.

Sure we also give charity for selfish reasons sometimes, but not every time. Thinking about it like this, everyone's got both good and evil in them

 

[Vastness]

You break the law of the excluded middle with your view.

Regards
DL

This isn't the first time I've seen you refer to "the law of the excluded middle" and honestly I feel like you do so just to be deliberately obtuse.

I really don't think this "law" applies in the context of this discussion or really any other discussion I've seen you try to start.

Rather than referring to obscure logical principles which may or may not even be relevant, but that most people obviously are not even going to bother to look up or challenge you on, how about you just explain clearly what it is about whatever post you are responding to that you disagree with?

As far as I can tell, to boil down the post you were responding to, you are disputing that it makes sense to suppose that knowledge of good and evil can be both good and evil?

Good and evil aren't like matter and antimatter, it's obviously possible for a single entity to possess both good and evil traits, the law of the excluded middle does not apply. But even if it did I can't think of a situation that wasn't an explicit discussion about logic where it would make sense to even bring it up instead of just saying "I don't agree because both X and Y cannot be true".

 

[Gormur]

The problem is one has to understand evil in order to fight it. It's like the real sixth sense. I see evil

By sensing it, one can remove it from their presence. I wanted to say one could destroy it but I don't know if that's possible in the realm we exist in

 

[Gnostic Bishop]

To me torture is to purposely cause pain, I dont think a cat knows its causing pain when it 'plays' with a mouse. When a cat in the outdoors catches a mouse it eats it quickly, its accepted that indoor cats do this because they have their hunger taken care of, yet are still reacting to their natural instincts to catch the mouse. A bit different from the torture im thinking of because of its basis in survival. The kind of torture im thinking of is more like, malevolence, even to 'torture' someone for information is different that what im thinking of because you do that for information, for survival reasons

Or perhaps the knowledge of evil is the understanding that we have evil built into us as animals, that we must kill, and sometimes hurt others in order to succeed as individuals. Conceptualizing it like this the knowledge of good would be something like knowing that we are also more than just the individual, that we are all the same thing; I think that is what give us the reason to help others when it has no benefit to us, when they wouldn't even know our name.

Sure we also give charity for selfish reasons sometimes, but not every time. Thinking about it like this, everyone's got both good and evil in them

Indeed.

A lot more natural good in us than natural evil, if we believe the stats that show just how nice we mostly are to each other.

Preachers in the god religions are liars and their denigrations of us should be ignored, or better yet, opposed.

We are the best that a god could create. Nice for nature.

Regards
DL

 

[Gnostic Bishop]

This isn't the first time I've seen you refer to "the law of the excluded middle" and honestly I feel like you do so just to be deliberately obtuse.

I really don't think this "law" applies in the context of this discussion or really any other discussion I've seen you try to start.

Rather than referring to obscure logical principles which may or may not even be relevant, but that most people obviously are not even going to bother to look up or challenge you on, how about you just explain clearly what it is about whatever post you are responding to that you disagree with?

As far as I can tell, to boil down the post you were responding to, you are disputing that it makes sense to suppose that knowledge of good and evil can be both good and evil?

Good and evil aren't like matter and antimatter, it's obviously possible for a single entity to possess both good and evil traits, the law of the excluded middle does not apply. But even if it did I can't think of a situation that wasn't an explicit discussion about logic where it would make sense to even bring it up instead of just saying "I don't agree because both X and Y cannot be true".

Of course we all have good and evil traits.

We just can't exercise them both at the same time.

Accuracy in language, is always a must, especially when making stupid statements that break linguistic laws.

If you want to chat, use descent intelligent language.

I am French learning English, an inferior language, so to try to teach me well.

Regards
DL

 

[Gnostic Bishop]

The problem is one has to understand evil in order to fight it. It's like the real sixth sense. I see evil

By sensing it, one can remove it from their presence. I wanted to say one could destroy it but I don't know if that's possible in the realm we exist in

Yin cannot exist without Yang. They compliment each other. They do not oppose each other.

Regards
DL

 

[Gormur]

Yin cannot exist without Yang. They compliment each other. They do not oppose each other.

Regards
DL

Yeah but that's Taoism, which is fine but doesn't address evil by itself. What I'm doing is recognizing evil as an entity, all by itself in isolation. That's my point; evil stands by itself just like good stands alone

The two don't have to have any relation to each other or harmonize. They exist within beings, demonic ones and in dimensions where they dwell, angelic beings may be victorious or good-natured but I even dispute angels' existence; at least in the sense of existence of demons like Ba'al versus archangel Michael. Demons just seem to know so much about us and what we do because they live close to us; in those other dimensions. Heaven would be somewhere too far away for them to see us and vice versa

I just like talking/writing about this, cheers

 

[Vastness]

We just can't exercise them both at the same time.

Of course we can. Killing in self defense or the defense of another? Stealing to feed one's starving family? Devoting one's life to charitable causes to feed one's ego and convince oneself that you are a good person? Torture, even, in an effort to save millions of lives? The very fact that good and evil are so difficult to properly define, and of course, that no action is a result of one single drive, but a result of a myriad of conflicting and overlapping influences, should be evidence enough that any action undertaken by a human being is tinged with both "good" and "evil" aspects of our nature.

Accuracy in language, is always a must, especially when making stupid statements that break linguistic laws.

LOL, well, yeah. But the law of the excluded middle isn't a linguistic law, and invoking it rather than using explicit, clear language is intellectually dishonest, especially when making ludicrous - one might even say stupid, although this would be childish and just as intellectually vapid - statements, such as the one you just made above.

 

[PtahTek]

I have asked myself for the longest of times what is the fruit of the knowledge of good and evil:
I am afraid it is (IMO) judgment; which condemns the judge and leaves one in a world of hurt and misery.
Just opining and dustin' out the mem-brain for a second.
Peace

 

[Gormur]

I don't think the way it's portrayed is right. Knowledge to these people would've been like seeing their reflections in water and seeing different creatures, being aware of their bodies and surroundings. Everything else would then be secondary to this

Instead of sitting around talking to God all day they now had to face survival and avoid getting killed. The knowledge they gained was that they were [now] autonomous beings, like demons they could choose their fate

I don't believe in freedom as real or rather anything but a concept. If they, Adam and Eve had freedom before their fall then they lost it afterwards. Now they were controlled by the physical realm rather than by a psychic one

 

[Gnostic Bishop]

Yeah but that's Taoism, which is fine but doesn't address evil by itself. What I'm doing is recognizing evil as an entity, all by itself in isolation. That's my point; evil stands by itself just like good stands alone

The two don't have to have any relation to each other or harmonize. They exist within beings, demonic ones and in dimensions where they dwell, angelic beings may be victorious or good-natured but I even dispute angels' existence; at least in the sense of existence of demons like Ba'al versus archangel Michael. Demons just seem to know so much about us and what we do because they live close to us; in those other dimensions. Heaven would be somewhere too far away for them to see us and vice versa

I just like talking/writing about this, cheers

Without two points of reference in space, as Einstein showed, there is no time.

Without evil to compare, --- as a point of reference to good, good becomes a meaningless term.

You never end with a proof of concept of what good is.

Logos is superior thinking to mythos.

Regards
DL

 

[Gnostic Bishop]

The very fact that good and evil are so difficult to properly define,

??

Only to those too young.

Adults do not tend to have a problem, unless they believe in one of the vile and immoral supernatural gods like Yahweh/Jesus/Allah.

Regards
DL