Is MDMA as "harmless" as we wish to believe?

[ShytK]

I think its relatively safe. I know many people who use MDMA and have never heard of someone having any sort of comedown if using less than 170mg, not redosing, and not using frequently. The reports of bad side effects are always with untested product, unknown dosage (or excessive dosage, ie: >~180mg), overusing, and/or redosing. It just isn't meant to be abused the way most people are "taught" to use it.

I got a better and more responsible formula. 0mg once a day.

 

[F1n1shed]

I'm gonna leave it short and simple because haters like to flame on me for telling the truth . You can use MDMA responsibly and still get fucked over. I have seen it countless times, people only rolling a few times total and noticing severe changes in all aspects of their brain. You tell me, how many other drugs do that besides mephedrone and other neuro toxins.

 

[F1n1shed]

I got a better and more responsible formula. 0mg once a day.

Agreed, 0mg of MDMA is the only responsible usage of it. The chemical is just too strong and mind altering, too much of a risk to mess up your brain.
After my first roll i felt fried for at least a week after, and lingering effects lasted until my next roll which was over a month later.

 

[rickolasnice]

Why the fuck would any one "pop pills daily for several years".

Up until that comment I was quite liking some of your posts on this forum. When you say pills, are you saying you took MDMA every day for years. If so thats just fucking stupidity of the highest order.

Why would anyone take any drug every day for years?

Chill out you ass munch.

 

[severely etarded]

After my first roll i felt fried for at least a week after, and lingering effects lasted until my next roll which was over a month later.

What the fuck did you take? Was it tested? How much and how many doses?

 

[angeleyes]

I'm gonna leave it short and simple because haters like to flame on me for telling the truth.

HAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHA Finished you need to relax more!

MD has great life changing effects, more than any other adulterants from a one-time use probably on par with LSD in my experience but ymmv.

 

[F1n1shed]

What the fuck did you take? Was it tested? How much and how many doses?

I've had maybe 25 different life time rolls. I admit a few were pipes / meth but for the most part they were pokeball pressed... real clean and nice.
My first roll was on 1 orange buddha which was confirmed MDMA, and the other 2 were blue doves which pill reports showed for MDMA. Anyways yea i definitely feel like shit after piperazine pills but even when i take clean pokeballs i notice problems with my self.

And before you ask, yes i always spaced out by at least one month. Usually more than 1 month, it all varies.

 

[severely etarded]

^ So one MDMA pill in one single dose left you "feeling fried for a week after"?

I only felt bad for a week after doing multiple 100+mg doses, very irresponsibly. But I recovered afterward.

 

[F1n1shed]

^ So one MDMA pill in one single dose left you "feeling fried for a week after"?

I only felt bad for a week after doing multiple 100+mg doses, very irresponsibly. But I recovered afterward.

No dude read it again, it was a total of 3 doses that night. That is my normal rolling night, 3 pills at a rave.

1st roll ever was 1 orange buddha, followed by 2 blue doves. Came back home still had the music going in my ears, woke up feeling fried as hell. Yea i feel pretty recovered from my rolling days, but i went through hell getting to recovery. MDMA = not worth it unless you keep it to like once or twice a year.

 

[Maya]

^ Then you're one of the people who really get it, IMO.



MDMA is not safe, and it's sure as hell not harmless... it's a drug, it will do what it's supposed to do. It's up to you to keep that in line.

Best answer!

 

[Le'Mix]

I've only ever treated it as a w/e thing, in fact more like twice a month these days as it is not as easy to find.

So long as what you are getting is genuine Mandy then as far as I am concerned it is safe. Less is more for sure, that is what makes it good, doing Mandy during the week has never made any sense to me. Guess that is a product of my raving days though, but still, there are certain substances that simply should not be used during the week. It's all about looking forwards to the w/e for me as far as Mandy is concerned.

 

[lightforce]

I've learnt my lesson by abusing it a few times. Those brain zaps are not fun. I keep it to maybe 5 times a year now and don't usually do more then 2 capsules or 250mg. Usually only at festivals too, I'm not a fan of going to a one night show and taking MDMA since I have to drive a long distance to get them.

 

[its.euphoric]

The drug itself is fairly nontoxic, but that's not where the damaging effects of drugs start from.
It's the stress. A lot of people will take drugs be it mdma, lsd, amphetamines, even weed, and have a "bad trip", or some will even have a very good time, While the drug itself is relatively non toxic that is not what causes all the problems, drugs like MDMA, especially in a rave setting, very little food or drink, dancing past the point of normal exhaustion is EXTREMELY stressful on the body. People take the drugs and then think "it must have caused brain damage and that's what's causing my problems" but that's not really the case.

It's the high stress that is caused to the body. This throws the body out of homeostasis. When your body and your stress response system, your hpa axis, are driven too far from resting point it becomes very hard for your body to return to normal. Not only this but once it's driven too far out of balance it becomes a negative cycle because your body becomes even more sensitive to stress. Most people's stress responses are robust and can recover from it but then there are many others that aren't. The same thing can, and I've seen it happen with other types of highly stressful situations. A person has a traumatic experience, rape, loss of loved one, victim in war etc..

If you look up HPA axis dysfunction you'll find lots of information on it.
Hpa axis dysfuntion you will feel very apathetic, usually hyper-vigilant but at the same time very tired. Most have anxiety and derealization and depression. Your HPA axis is the center for your emotional well being and happiness, every time you are excited or experience a positive feeling or emotion, your hpa axis is activated. When this is thrown out of balance the world can seem very black and white and you'll feel almost a detached feeling to the world around you.

 

[JWills20]

The drug itself is fairly nontoxic, but that's not where the damaging effects of drugs start from.
It's the stress. A lot of people will take drugs be it mdma, lsd, amphetamines, even weed, and have a "bad trip", or some will even have a very good time, While the drug itself is relatively non toxic that is not what causes all the problems, drugs like MDMA, especially in a rave setting, very little food or drink, dancing past the point of normal exhaustion is EXTREMELY stressful on the body. People take the drugs and then think "it must have caused brain damage and that's what's causing my problems" but that's not really the case.

It's the high stress that is caused to the body. This throws the body out of homeostasis. When your body and your stress response system, your hpa axis, are driven too far from resting point it becomes very hard for your body to return to normal. Not only this but once it's driven too far out of balance it becomes a negative cycle because your body becomes even more sensitive to stress. Most people's stress responses are robust and can recover from it but then there are many others that aren't. The same thing can, and I've seen it happen with other types of highly stressful situations. A person has a traumatic experience, rape, loss of loved one, victim in war etc..

If you look up HPA axis dysfunction you'll find lots of information on it.
Hpa axis dysfuntion you will feel very apathetic, usually hyper-vigilant but at the same time very tired. Most have anxiety and derealization and depression. Your HPA axis is the center for your emotional well being and happiness, every time you are excited or experience a positive feeling or emotion, your hpa axis is activated. When this is thrown out of balance the world can seem very black and white and you'll feel almost a detached feeling to the world around you.

Not entirely convinced by your stress hypothesis. If all MDMA-induced damage came from acute stress as a result of little food/drink & excessive dancing, then you could take high doses - stay hydrated and minimize exercise - without experiencing anything negative. It's kind of obvious that is not the case. Enough rats have had their brains fried (5mg/kg - multiple doses), and analyzed, to reveal serotonin abnormalities that usually take 2-3 weeks to recover. The drug itself does produce central toxic metabolites, just like many other substances, and it's certainly not nontoxic. Then again, the neurotoxic effects of MDMA really aren't very prominent at usual recreational doses (1-2mg/kg), so I agree with you somewhat. Not all stress is a bad thing. Exercise is regarded as a 'stressor' yet the neurobiology proffers a paradoxical effect. That is, those that chronically exercise are more psychologically equipped to deal with negative stressors in their life (work deadlines, emotional problems etc).

I do agree that HPA axis dysfunction, caused by high-dose MDMA, could contribute to the hangover. But it's certainly not the only contribution.

 

[justaddictedddd]

Harmless? If you seriously believe that MDMA is harmless to the human body, you must be out of your damn mind. I guess people who accept drugs as a given part of life and don't give one slight thought to the detriments it can bring you have discovered the wonder drug.

Personal experience? I started in 07, went really heavy (almost 4-5 rolls a day about 4 times a week for 6 months straight) in the beginning, later I dropped my dosages as soon as I started getting tired of it. After the first year, I hardly got any feelings of euphoria and just felt like a zombie when I rolled. In 2009 I ended up dropping my dosages to only when I rave. Last time I dropped was back in December 2010 and have been clean off of ecstasy since. My worst enemy were the blue pills filled with methamphetamines. When I was strung out on them, one time I took about 8 naked ladies in a span of one hour and chewed 4 in that same hour around 7PM. Swear to god, last thing I remember was heading home and I woke up on my bed at like 4am rolling balls and feeling like the worst fucking tweaky high I've ever had in my life. After that day I seriously lost all concentration and willpower to live, and I'm glad I had support when I needed it because maybe things might not have turned out well. Couple months later I took 4 mickeys and actually rolled fine, woke up the next day at like 11AM and was going through serotonin syndrome. I was sweating profusely and felt like my body was heating up, but at the same time I felt cold as ice (can't explain it better than that). My head was spinning and I tried to get up to go take a shower. Almost dropped a couple times stumbling, when I got to the shower and turned on the water I literally almost passed out and hit my head. I seriously felt like I was going to die in the next hour by the way my body was reacting. After that it opened my eyes to a lot of the misconceptions about ecstasy and the harm it can really do to one that has an addicted personality.

Please, do not flame me saying "Oh, why'd you take those dirty MDMA pills," or "Oh, your fault you blah blah blah." I really don't want to hear it. Drug addiction is a lifelong battle and it's hard to control the demon within you. Yes, I have gotten pure MDMA as well, not the non-filtered bullshit brown stains and super hard white moonrocks that you see so prevalent in 2011+. Back then I used to abuse drugs and chose the high over anything. I learned the hard way about the true meaning of quality.

 

[MrSpeedyG]

methamphetamines.

God dam there it is again.

I used to dable in MDMAs, marijuanas, cocaines (no S please, thankyou)

 

[F1n1shed]

The drug itself is fairly nontoxic, but that's not where the damaging effects of drugs start from.
It's the stress. A lot of people will take drugs be it mdma, lsd, amphetamines, even weed, and have a "bad trip", or some will even have a very good time, While the drug itself is relatively non toxic that is not what causes all the problems, drugs like MDMA, especially in a rave setting, very little food or drink, dancing past the point of normal exhaustion is EXTREMELY stressful on the body. People take the drugs and then think "it must have caused brain damage and that's what's causing my problems" but that's not really the case.

It's the high stress that is caused to the body. This throws the body out of homeostasis. When your body and your stress response system, your hpa axis, are driven too far from resting point it becomes very hard for your body to return to normal. Not only this but once it's driven too far out of balance it becomes a negative cycle because your body becomes even more sensitive to stress. Most people's stress responses are robust and can recover from it but then there are many others that aren't. The same thing can, and I've seen it happen with other types of highly stressful situations. A person has a traumatic experience, rape, loss of loved one, victim in war etc..

If you look up HPA axis dysfunction you'll find lots of information on it.
Hpa axis dysfuntion you will feel very apathetic, usually hyper-vigilant but at the same time very tired. Most have anxiety and derealization and depression. Your HPA axis is the center for your emotional well being and happiness, every time you are excited or experience a positive feeling or emotion, your hpa axis is activated. When this is thrown out of balance the world can seem very black and white and you'll feel almost a detached feeling to the world around you.

You bring up some valid points, and it does make sense. I have brought it up my self in other posts how MDMA leaves your brain in high stress mode. And yea a lot of it has to do if you do it at a hot rave setting. People every where, getting light shows making your eyes roll back, seeing trippy masks or people off their mind looking like they are about to die. All of those things factor in on the experience it leaves you with. But the reason why it throws your body out of homeostasis is because of how powerful the chemical is not the stress response. The actual stress response comes from what the drug is doing, MDMA releases insane amounts of serotonin and dopamine/norepenephrine at once.

For your body to come back to homeostasis it takes a while. Most drugs don't release that meany neuro transmitters at once, and especially not that much serotonin which is such a vital brain neuron.
You saying the drug is relatively non toxic is false though. MDMA is well known among most credible researches to be neuro toxic. I mean it is usually one of the first things pointed out with the drug. You don't usually read about neuro toxicity with other drugs when researching them, but with MDMA it always comes up. 90% of my rolls have been at a rave setting so i am sure that caused more stress and over stimulation to my brain, but even if i rolled at home i'm sure i'd run into problems just not to the same degree.

Also people get anxiety , derealization, etc etc because their serotonin system has been altered so quickly. Serotonin has a large role in many brain functions, perception being one of them. If you are perceiving things differently all the time it will cause anxiety and derealization / DP.

 

[OGM]

I think ITS.EUPHORIC and F1N1SHED both have good points. The neurotoxicity of the drug combined with the; lack of sleep. over-exertion, over-heating, improper water management and lack of proper nutrients during many associated events can make for a dangerous scenario. Now add to this adulterated MDMA...8(

 

[bass face]

Is it harmless? No way. Do I believe that one can enjoy it in a relatively safe manner with the proper precautions? sure.

Mdma is one of those compounds in my opinion, where a little knowledge goes a long way. I tried it for the first time this year and I am very glad that I did. I am also super thankful that I found this forum because I quickly realized I was making or about to make some serious mistakes. mdma combined with ignorance can be a very harmful combo.

A lot of the trouble I think, stems from;

A. People being to trusting of others and not testing what they ingest. Before I would just take my friends word that what we were given was mdma, now I don't take it without testing it first.

B. Not knowing how much you are taking. I have watched friend get handed a giant crystal and just swallow it. I've done stupid shit like take a fat bag of molly to a rave and take a dip every hour... Now I weigh out an initial dose and a small redoes and put them in labeled gel caps before I go out for the night.

C. Taking it to often. I did it back to back a couple nights at a festival before I knew any better. Luckily the gear was bunk and I didn't roll that hard. Now I space out rolls by at least a month.

D. Mixing it with other drugs that only make it more dangerous. Oh hey we've been up all night and are about to rave all day let's pop an Adderall for a little extra kick. I did that once but luckily did not experience any adverse effects, never again.

E. Not paying attention to how dehydrated they are getting.

 

[quidamsoul]

You said MDMA, so I'll talk about MDMA, and assume we're speaking of users who acquire pure MDMA pills, capsules, or crystal/powder grams outright, either from trusted, reliable sources or using test kits for unsourced/unknown product. I will not consider the (potentially severe) harmfulness of popping random "E" bought off shady junkies inside a nightclub or EDM event.

First off, there's the harmfulness inherent to all chemicals foreign to one's system. MDMA, just like chocolate or aspirin, can cause allergic, paradoxical or unpleasantly intense effects on a small percentage of the population, who should not engage in MDMA usage after determining their own negative reaction to it. However, this manner of harm should not be life-threatening, even if someone's reaction is extreme sensitivity and a starter dose makes their heart pound out of their chest, a good trip sitter should be able to handle most, if not all such situations, and the worst that can happen might be a trip to the hospital, a shot of something to calm them down or to counter allergy, and perhaps some explaning to an unfriendly police officer.

Now, MDMA is also psychedelic/entheogenic, and like many such substances, it carries the potential harmfulness of triggering latent mental illness. This form of harm seems unavoidable as far as I know, short of never trying any psychedelics if you have history of mental illness in your immediate family. However, MDMA does not itself cause the latent mental illness, it merely awakens it, something that would've happened naturally at some point down the road. This harm is not life threatening, and not exclusive to MDMA, as it is shared by the likes of LSD, which is universally thought of as a safe drug, AFAIK.

Thirdly, the only "true" form of harm I am aware of involving MDMA, and by true, I mean that all users qualify to experience it--consists of the consequences, symptoms and manifestations of MDMA addiction/prolonged, multi-day binging that spills over to the next day and the next day and so on. I know a couple people who have partied on MDMA nonstop (only breaks for sleep, every couple days or so) for days, weeks and months, and the effects seem devastating--an unwavering depression, being too jaded to feel happy, extreme thinness, hellish comedowns, severe anhedonia, self-harm, you name it. MDMA addiction is the ultimate sadness. This can lead to suicide, obviously, which would be a lethal harm to MDMA.

Finally, there's the obvious harm potential of overdosing, but that is common to pretty much all substances known to man. If you pop twenty times an effective (for you) dose of most things, it'll kill ya.