• S E X
    L O V E +
    R E L A T I O N S H I P S


    ❤️ Welcome Guest! ❤️


    Posting Guidelines Bluelight Rules
  • SLR Moderators: Senior Staff

is homosexuality a choice?

Status
Not open for further replies.
Damien8787 said:
I liked it. Maybe it's just cause I agree with you though lol.
Click to expand...

I also found it insightful, and wouldn't even really classify it as a "rant" to be honest. It's a complex question, and the answer is of more complex than yes or no. There's some definitional ambiguity, of course - and then there's lots of questions about identity, action versus intention, perception versus expectation, and so forth. At a macro level, the issues are fairly clear - in the details, it's complex.

As a microcosm of the whole thing: I can choose to have a sexual relationship with a woman - in fact I've done this before, for years. I can choose to be open-minded about it, and I can choose to enjoy the experience on a physical and non-conflicted level. I can, and I have done that. Conversely, despite choosing to be open-minded, I don't find (in my own experience) that I am able to change my deeper emotional engagement with this process. I can choose to go through the motions, but I can't choose to deeply enjoy those motions no matter how much I may will it.

Peace,

Fausty
 
Fausty said:
As a microcosm of the whole thing: I can choose to have a sexual relationship with a woman - in fact I've done this before, for years. I can choose to be open-minded about it, and I can choose to enjoy the experience on a physical and non-conflicted level. I can, and I have done that. Conversely, despite choosing to be open-minded, I don't find (in my own experience) that I am able to change my deeper emotional engagement with this process. I can choose to go through the motions, but I can't choose to deeply enjoy those motions no matter how much I may will it.
Click to expand...

A couple questions for you, Fausty, if you don't want to answer or would rather answer privately, that's just fine. :)

1. When you were in your previous sexual relationship with a woman, were you sexually exclusive with her? Did the two of you have an agreement?
2. Do you think in the future you may have either an exclusive male or female partner (or both - like a triad)?

Damien: I had shingles 6 years ago. It caused me absolutely no permanent disfigurement, though it was hideous at the time.

I don't know whether people "choose" to be gay, but it's my opinion that sexual involvement with the partner of your liking does take an element of choice. If you weren't interested, you wouldn't want to have sex with them. I do believe there is a significant biological basis behind attraction that has not fully been identified.
 
Mariposa said:
1. When you were in your previous sexual relationship with a woman, were you sexually exclusive with her? Did the two of you have an agreement?
Click to expand...

I've been in two long-term relationships with women (one marriage, one engagement). In both cases, we discussed prior to our relationship my existing relationships with the boys. In both cases, I was given assurances that it was "no problem" as there was no sense of cheating or jealousy that could arise for the woman in question. In both cases, after time passed, that exact sort of jealousy arose and came to have genuine destructive power. In both cases, I was eventually given a "promise you will change and not be with them, or I can't stay with you" kind of ultimatum.

One phrase I'll never forget, during the melt-down phase of my marriage: "it is clear that you've found the love of your life: it's him, and not me, and I can't live with seeing that every day." I had no idea how to respond to that - because basically, it was true - but it was true before I'd met the woman in question, so I wasn't sure how I'd done wrong. I'm still not sure what I did wrong.

I'm not currently mixed-up with any two-legged partners, so the answer I provided each of them after the put forth the "it's either them, or me" question is fairly obvious: don't let the door hit you on the way out, honey. :\ Actually, with the second one it didn't get that far - I could feel things headed right down that path, and cut it off before it got that bad.

I never cheated on either woman, with a two-legger. Interestingly, both later expressed "well of course" feelings about whether they'd feel slighted if I was with a female critter at some point. This seemed utterly mysterious to me, and I suppose it still does. Both were deeply jealous, right off the bat, of any sort of (purely Platonic) friendships I'd develop with mares or bitches. So jealous that it almost seemed like parody - but wasn't.

2. Do you think in the future you may have either an exclusive male or female partner (or both - like a triad)?
Click to expand...

Are we talking two- or four-legged? That might sound like an odd question, but I wanted to be sure I understand before I answer.

With regards to the original topic (sorta), I am deeply confident that zooish proclivities have a significant genetic component - as much or more so as is found in the gay/straight determinism. There's exactly zero solid research on that question, so that hunch is based on my own 20+ years of experience in meeting and getting to know other zoos, around the world. Interestingly, it very much runs in families - you can see it come down from generation to generation, in some cases, clear as day. I have a theory on where the evolutionary basis of this proclivity may have roots, in humanity, but my theoretical framework needs much more research and refining before it's ready for public consumption.

Peace,

Fausty
 
Ninja, ah - but let's not forget the difference between homosexuality as an adjective and homosexuality as a noun.

The acts you chose can be described as homosexual. But just because you (who identifies as "open-minded hetero")decided to let a guy suck your cock, doesn't mean that people who are gay chose to be that way. This is a logical fallacy, like Damien's. Also like Damien, if we are strictly talking about categories, when you say you're straight then you claim to have found a sexual act with a guy pleasurable, then that makes you bisexual. You are free to not accept being labelled, but since this is the subject of our discussion, I can only tell you that you are bi.

As for choice vs genetics, these are not necessarily the only options we have. So while I believe it isn't a choice, and is biological on some level (ie. endocrine), I am still not sure if it is genetic or developmental (or spiritual, or magical, whatever). I am only sure about the fact that it operates on a molecular level in my body and (through my observation), other people's bodies.

One thing that has recently struck me is the behaviour of "flamboyant"-type gay men. I find that their body language, and even the odours they emit (!!), to be identical all over the world, regardless of cultural norms. I found it to be exactly the same in North America, Europe, The Middle East, and East Asia. I simply cannot be convinced that all these culturally-different people "chose" to have the exact same body language.

Btw, about changing the way you taste things - your argument is almost identical to Damien's!! Again, you are changing you are desensitizing to yourself to the fact that your tastebuds find a certain flavour repulsive - you aren't changing the fact that that flavour is in fact repulsive to you.
 
Last edited:
>>
As for choice vs genetics, these are not necessarily the only options we have. So while I believe it isn't a choice, and is biological on some level (ie. endocrine), I am still not sure if it is genetic or developmental (or spiritual, or magical, whatever). I am only sure about the fact that it operates on a molecular level in my body and (through my observation), other people's bodies. >>

Spot on.
How I see it:

There are 2 phenomena that build on each other.

sexual desire: what arouses you. this is hardly chosen, but we don't yet have a clear picture of the interaction of factors that determines it.

I bet that this could be adjusted through classical or operant conditioning. This would amount to creating a psychological disorder though.

sexual orientation/identity: this is how we navigate sexual desire socially. There is some choice involved, but the choice is not free, subject to a host of contextual influences.

ebola
 
Based on an episode of Taxicab confessions, I'm sure it's not a choice. This guy was talking about how he wanted to have gay sex at age 4, and how his life would be so much easier if he was straight. I mean it's pretty obvious to me, you can't help who you're attracted to.

Appearing homosexual to the rest of the world is a choice IMO.
 
i would say most people who are homosexual were born to be homosexual but i think there must be choice involved somewhere for some people.
2 of my friends are a perfect example of each argument and it does make me wonder.
i have a friend who has always been gay. we were child friends that lost touch and then became friends some years later after she came out. i asked her how she knew she was gay and her repy was "i always knew" she hates the thought of sleeping with men, has never slept with a man and wouldn't.
but on the other hand, another friend i have was straight growing up and went thru a "phase" in her late teens. she lived with another woman, had a full blown relationship with her and when they eventually broke up she chose to marry a man and now has 2 children. her reason for her choice of sexuality is that women can fuck up your head a lot more than men.

so.....i think it varies with person.
a question i have is why do some homosexuals choose genger confused partners? for instance a gay man may have a male partner that chooses to act and dress like a woman and the same for a gay woman, she may choose a woman that looks, talks and acts like a man.
 
I don't think people are born straight or gay. There is a whole spectrum of sexuality, which whilst maybe irrelevant in the majority, is still an important consideration, even if you don't go all 50s studies over it.

To me, the most important thing about sexuality is that it doesn't matter, and thus shouldn't define your personality. I guess i've never felt close to the loons going on about "God's holy unity" between a man and a women, or the gay guys who HAVE to identify themselves through their sexuality, in order to feel (socially) complete.

I think homosexual acts can be a choice - you sure as hell can be gay and remain celibate (the Christians have it right there). "Straight" men can also choose to engage in homosexual acts, not because they "love" other men, but just..... because? There we enter the realm of god-knows-what; hendonism and sparta all mixed together.

I think upbringing and social attitude will definitely affect who you feel comfortable being attracted to, and having relationships with, of course, but that doesn't mean that the actual desires for the same sex aren't genetic, on some base level. Whatever's the case, I think it's largely irrelevant, because it doesn't change things in the real world; people have feelings for the same sex, and act on them. They always have, and always will. Period.
 
Hi just joined this site and noticed this post. Im gay. Have known from when i was about 6 yrs old. While my mates wanted army toys i wanted barbie dolls. No really.I did. I belive it is built in.Like the way u have u favourate food.Some people would like it. Others wouldnt. And wouldnt it be a boaring place to be if everyone was the same hey
 
I think homosexual is based on personality.I know some guys and I always had the expression its simply part of them. There is no question.Further more I havent thinking about this.But about that Im sure. I think they havent any choice.
 
How anyone could say "yes, gay men are born that way" or "No, it is a choice" is beyond me. Does anyone honestly believe its the same for every person? I haven't thoroughly read this thread but I read the first few responses and I couldn't believe some of them. Its different for everyone guys.

One gay man could have been raped at a young age, traumatized into being aroused by men, and therefor submits to being gay with no problem.

Think about this strait guys, your penis has a mind of its own right? It has gotten aroused for some weird things hasn't it? Some things you'd never admit to it being aroused by, but the truth is, its your penis, and it gets aroused by it. Hell, I'll admit it, I've been aroused by bumpy roads, my cat on my lap, a cute girl burping...

So surely some Gay men start out strait, aroused by girls, but they somehow get to thinking about guys, and they change. Maybe they liked muscular women to begin with? Maybe they liked women with deep voices?

Then I'm sure theres some gay men that started out as attention whore teenagers that just wanted to piss off their parents and shock their friends... but they ended up prefering their own sex.

And some boys have feminine attributes and just become aroused by other boys before they're aroused by girls and grow up gay. This is a fact. Maybe they were raised by their mom, or lesbians?

Finally I bet theirs even gay men, that aren't even gay. They're just pretending to be gay because their so anxious around women... or they dislike the way woman look or act...and these men aren't aroused by men at all but they'd rather live with a man than a woman...

Or theres probably a few men that are in it for the money... I mean men get paid more than woman, so surely two men living together would live more luxuriously than a man and a woman.

Think about this: Maybe some men started out liking dominant woman (like myself) but they eventually started thinking about how strong and dominant men can be. I mean... I'm sure it can happen for some men. I would never LET it happen to me, and I never want it to happen, but I'm sure its a possibility for some men. SO theres plenty of ways to choose gay, theres plenty of ways for men to be forced to be gay, and theres plenty of ways to FAKE gay.

For any of you to say "OH NO, YOU ARE BORN GAY, NO DOUBT ABOUT IT" or "OH, YOU CHOOSE TO BE GAY, NO DOUBT GUYS" is ridiculous.
 
Live&Learn- i can't believe how many crazy hypothetical scenarios you've come up with to justify why a man would choose to be gay. i'm sorry, but i think your ideas are ridiculous. do you really think some 9th grader wakes up in the morning and says "i think people will like me better if i'm gay, so im gonna wear hot pink and act like a fag from now on". GREAT idea man, why didn't I try that.....

but seriously, i hope someday you come to terms with your sexuality and learn to accept yourself for who you are.
 
I've only read the last page of this thread because of my shocking internet connection atm, so I'm sorry if this has already been said, but - my mostly heterosexuality isn't and has never been a choice for me. It's just the way it is. Why would it be any different for homosexuality?
 
smart-e said:
How are animals gay? This is totally off topic but ive never seen a gay animal. My dog isn't gay he's just not that choosy. He has sex with with male dogs, females dogs, shit he seen has sex with my kitchen table leg if i left him. I don't think he's gay though he's just not that smart. Apart from this one instance ive never seen a gay animal.
Click to expand...

Zoologists have.

smart-e said:
Personally I like men. I like women too but I wouldn't call myslef Bi or gay.
Click to expand...

If you are attracted to people of the same sex, you are bi or gay, by definition.
 
smart-e said:
How are animals gay? This is totally off topic but ive never seen a gay animal. My dog isn't gay he's just not that choosy. He has sex with with male dogs, females dogs, shit he seen has sex with my kitchen table leg if i left him. I don't think he's gay though he's just not that smart. Apart from this one instance ive never seen a gay animal.
Click to expand...
300px-Two_Giraffes.PNG


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Homosexual_behavior_in_animals
 
i havn't read the whole thread but in my opinion it's not a choice for the majority of people. it is a choice to either act on your sexuality or suppress it, but whether you deny it or not you're still gay. i mean some gay men have sex with women and get married to a woman but they're still gay. a person's sexuality isn't based on who they have sex with but who they're attracted to. and i don't think most people can choose what turns them on.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Top