Kratom Is drinking kratom everyday really a problem?

[Neuroborean]

I do not allow myself to do Kratom more than once a week. I generally use it for work or a hangover. (about 1/2 or less of a normal dose will kill a hangover nicely) Usually, it's less than once a week. I'm not finding this too hard.

I love my pot and do it too much when I'm doing it. I intend to go ahead and get hooked hard on that after a while.
I think about it when I'm not smoking, making pipes and roach clips for presents and keeping up with legalization news.
I don't know if loving and craving pot helps with Kratom control or not, but I drink alcohol much less when I'm smoking reefer, so there's that.

My girlfriend, who I have corrupted (She had never done anything but alcohol before I met her.), I allow Kratom once a week. Once in a great while, twice in a week. I'm keeping doses kinda low as well. She does have pain issues (I do too).
She is always saying, "Why would it be so bad to get hooked on Kratom. It really helps me.".
I am constantly telling her about diminishing returns and escalating doses. I kinda feel bad for introducing her to it.
As a side note, she likes pot OK, but nothing like I do.

Just to say, my ex-gf uses kratom sparingly, perhaps once or twice a week, very often she uses none for weeks...
FOR YEARS she has taken just a dose a day, normally 2-4 grams, never escalated, only once ever took a double dose...
I mean, she got very excited with the positive effects at first, but after a while, when used more often she felt that kratom didn't exert the same positive results so she started using it less and less, only when I recommended her to take it (for difficult days or whatever).
I mean, I understand your worries, I also felt a bit guilty when I thought that she was going to get addicted, but she finally didn't

 

[Neuroborean]

I've been drinking it every day for around 5 years, for me it's not really an issue. But I had periods where I'd take more than I needed and jacked my tolerance up. I keep it low, 5-6g a day. Some people go ridiculously high and take 30g, even 50g a day. I just like the stuff, and it's great for pain. I'm getting my wisdom teeth out soon and have kratom capsules that I intend to use instead of the Vicodin they wanted to prescribe. I guess I could have fun with that later, but Idk, opiates like that and I don't have the feeling kratom gives me which I enjoy far more. It just feels more natural.

Addiction and withdrawal are always going to be a problem of course, but my liver enzymes are all normal, I have no issues using the bathroom and overall I'm just riding it out. Maybe it'll get banned one day and that'll be my last dance, but FDA has been failing to do this for 7 years now lol. It shouldn't be banned but it should be controlled in some way because it's the safest opioid hands down. You cannot overdose, your body will puke it up, and the higher you dose, the more opioid antagonist effect is likely to happen. I.E, it cancels out its own effects. I've experienced this many times when I've redosed. Felt good, took more, then in 10 minutes I feel less (this is why you can't combine it with oxy or something, it will reduce or not get you feeling anything at all). Has to be a 1g dose or something, that works.

Yeah, my experience is similar, I dose a bit higher (8-12) but honestly it's not a problem for me. It was when I reached the peak (12-15 grams during a period of very very high stress) It started feeling "different" in a bad way, like I was abusing something and doing some damage to my body (specifically my mind...)
then I thought "well, I like the plant, it helps me, but this is too much"
I reevaluated my use and precipitated a withdrawal on purpose, just to keep in under check,
it worked, I started using it less anxiously (I was dosing like 5-6 times a day..) and I finally found my sweet spot.. at the beginning my sweet spot was 3-4 grams, then when dosing before lunches (helps me a lot with diabetes type 1, that why I use it daily...) it became 2.5-4g per dose. It has been like that for years.
now I'm "withdrawing", barely feeling negatives,
barely had any sleep on first day, then my ex-gf gave me a dose that she had (I had cravings, to be honest) on day 2, then yesterday was day 1 again, I slept perfectly.
Now I'm feeling 75% normal. Only used ashwagandha, haritaki and coffee. Mucuna helps A LOT, if I'm feeling fucked.

 

[Juicewrldfan]

Interesting how there are mixed feelings about this. For now I am going to stick to not taking it everyday, just wanted to get some opinions. I may take it a bit more frequently if my job becomes more demanding.

Dr. Chris McCurdy like the leading reasearcher for kratom that the FDA listens to calls it an atypical opioid BUT he says that he wants to create an entirely new class for it.

What I will say about it from my limited experience (only been taking it regularly for three months) is that less is definitely more with this which I had a hard time wrapping my head around at first but I started off taking about 12 grams a dose and doing that multiple times a day and I eventually started getting many side effects that were concerning.

I lowered my dose and regimen significantly and I still get pretty much the same effects at half that dose I was taking and less times per day. I have zero notable side effects now.

I still take it every day but that’s just because it’s hard not to when I bought a shit ton of it so I have it laying around the house and I use it as a harm reduction drug. It took away my stimulant cravings and helped me break that dreaded cycle of which I couldn’t function normally on ir off the stimulants (between uses) and had severe depression from the stimulant abuse

So, I mean every drug has its risks verses benefits. Just be mindful of what those are for you I guess and if the risks ever stop being less than the benefits then might want to rethink things.

I am not an advocate for daily use but if it helps you get away from harder more extreme things or helps you manage difficult mental health symptoms then I would say it may not be a bad option temporarily. Say fir a few months while you work on other areas of your life to resolve those things that your using it for.

For example, I have significant trauma issues that severely effect my life and when my trauma is triggered I get into this painful darkness and obsess about suicide. I use drugs (kratom) to help get me out of this headspace or if probably be dead by now. BUT and this is a big but I am also working with a therapist to resolve those issues. It’s a very long process though.

Drugs in themselves are not good or bad. It’s just like firearms, not good or bad. It’s how we use them that make it good or bad. Every single drug has some kind of medicinal benefit and consequences. It’s about the risk verses benefits.

 

[Neuroborean]

Although the same amount works everyday for me. I am down to about 20 grams a day. So much better than 50 gr a day. I know how that is. I think the ability to taper is where kratom shines should a person have some will power.

In my opinion you could go back to 12-15 grams without an issue.
When I "relapsed" the second day of withdrawal those 3-4 grams I took WOWW... they felt like absolute pleasure, I don't know exactly what happent, but they felt so fucking perfect..
I mean, even a day off could do wonders, last time I quitted I was using a new vendor the last days, I can tell you that the mix of tapering and new vendor it's amazing, I felt the euphoria I hadn't felt in years... I was almost nodding at 3 grams of a powerful red (normally I prefer euphoric greens/fast greens/balanced whites...)
So I think it's more the habit and not the benefit which makes taking more kratom more "desirable".

EDIT: by the way, I'm on day 3 off, feeling pretty well, a bit anxious, but slept more or less good. I took a bit of ashwagandha and 2 mucuna capsules (around 100mg l-dopa). Now I feel even better. I think kratom withdrawal it's much much better than having diabetes type 1... if you have a disease like this, you start appreciating physical discomfort differently, so you don't give a fuck to the downsides if the benefits makes your chronic disease much better..
My T-breaks are around a month (3-5 weeks) every 2-4 months. I used it for a year straight once but it's not worth it.

So my final veredict would be: if you have a chronic illness, use it, being careful with the dosage protocol, trying to do t-breaks, changing vendors/strains...
if you don't have any illness then be extra careful not to do it daily, and if you do use it, do t-breaks very often and don't dose more than 7-10gpd or twice a day.

 

[washingtonbound]

Dr. Chris McCurdy like the leading reasearcher for kratom that the FDA listens to calls it an atypical opioid BUT he says that he wants to create an entirely new class for it.

What I will say about it from my limited experience (only been taking it regularly for three months) is that less is definitely more with this which I had a hard time wrapping my head around at first but I started off taking about 12 grams a dose and doing that multiple times a day and I eventually started getting many side effects that were concerning.

I lowered my dose and regimen significantly and I still get pretty much the same effects at half that dose I was taking and less times per day. I have zero notable side effects now.

I still take it every day but that’s just because it’s hard not to when I bought a shit ton of it so I have it laying around the house and I use it as a harm reduction drug. It took away my stimulant cravings and helped me break that dreaded cycle of which I couldn’t function normally on ir off the stimulants (between uses) and had severe depression from the stimulant abuse

So, I mean every drug has its risks verses benefits. Just be mindful of what those are for you I guess and if the risks ever stop being less than the benefits then might want to rethink things.

I am not an advocate for daily use but if it helps you get away from harder more extreme things or helps you manage difficult mental health symptoms then I would say it may not be a bad option temporarily. Say fir a few months while you work on other areas of your life to resolve those things that your using it for.

For example, I have significant trauma issues that severely effect my life and when my trauma is triggered I get into this painful darkness and obsess about suicide. I use drugs (kratom) to help get me out of this headspace or if probably be dead by now. BUT and this is a big but I am also working with a therapist to resolve those issues. It’s a very long process though.

Drugs in themselves are not good or bad. It’s just like firearms, not good or bad. It’s how we use them that make it good or bad. Every single drug has some kind of medicinal benefit and consequences. It’s about the risk verses benefits.

Phenomenal info thanks

 

[Lizanoliza6]

Last year I posted a thread criticizing the idea of drinking kratom everyday and now I’m having different thoughts about it. Lately I’ve been drinking more coffee and have started a bad habit of having energy drinks most days when I need to be more physically active. The other day I had kratom for the first time in a while and felt a solid boost in energy/stamina and my overall mood for many hours. So I thought if I had kratom in the morning instead of coffee, it would stick with me longer and I could ditch the crappy energy drinks for good. I feel like I could definitely limit kratom consumption to two drinks a day because if I exceed that, it usually results in me getting sick. The place I go to sells growlers of their kratom drinks so I don’t know precisely how many grams I’d be taking, but figured it would be a good substitute for excess caffeine. I also feel better about it since trying a strain that’s better for productivity (white). The only thing to consider is tolerance, therefore I ought to take a day off whenever I can.

For those who drink a lot of kratom or are around people who do, what are your thoughts on daily use?

I've been drinking it daily for 6 years... pretty much had to cut back cuz was loosing too much hair but I still do at least 2-3 times a day ... I can't stop but I'll like to find something else

 

[Dropperneck]

It’s not good to do long term, like any opiate. It messes with your hormones, lowers T in males. Makes you have to pee a ton, and can really mess up your long term motivation and outlook. I am doing it about once every few weeks, took me a long time to get here. But I plan on discontinuing it completely soon.

 

[Keif' Richards]

The alkaloids found within Kratom, namely Mitragynine and its analogs are essentially Opioids. I know there is a lot of conjecture out there on the subject, but the fact that there is a demonstrated cross-tolerance between other Opioids and Kratom seems to be a pretty undeniable indicator that the effects produced by Kratom are due to agonism of the Opioid receptors.

 

[Xorkoth]

I think the ability to taper is where kratom shines should a person have some will power.

I find it extremely hard to taper effectively on kratom, simply due to the fact that I always feel bad on it after the first few days of feeling pretty good. It's like when I take it and it hits me, the restlessness and agitation goes almost all the way away, but not quite. I'm grumpy, pissy, and distracted. And like 2 hours later, the teary eyes come back, and then the restlessness a few hours later. After many, many times on and off it, this seems to happen almost immediately. It's like I'm ultra-sensitized to the withdrawal. The urge to take a little more every 2 hours is very strong. I even start waking up at 4-6am after taking it as the last thing before bed, because of withdrawal, and needing to dose to finish sleeping. I feel so bad, so easily, that I can't stick to a taper, in fact my usage escalates just to try to not feel really bad. But, I think my situation is atypical. I have also been using it since 2002 or 2003, I can't remember for sure which year it was. So 20 or 21 years, which is longer than I would imagine almost anyone on here. In fact my trip report on it on Erowid is among the first published. So it might be that, or the fact that I went up to harder opiates, or that I spent a very long time on 50+ grams a day, up to about 100... or some unique property of my body chemistry (I started out with a very strong tolerance to opiate effects, from day one, it took 25mg of hydrocodone to get much more than a faint feeling of pleasant lightness).

Whatever the case is, tapering on kratom is harder for me than it is on just about anything, unfortunately.

Suboxone is BY FAR the easiest opiate I've been addicted to to taper. It's because I don't feel anything on it, and I feel fully better (other than a general lower motivation and reduced testosterone/etc), so there is no incentive to take more, and I can reduce it a little bit at a time and it makes no difference in the way I feel.

For me, kratom causes less and less intense withdrawal as time passes, I mean, every time I quit I experience less and less intense withdrawal symptoms...

That's awesome, lucky for you! I wish that was the case with me, but sadly, it's the opposite. With all opiates.

Just to say, my ex-gf uses kratom sparingly, perhaps once or twice a week, very often she uses none for weeks...
FOR YEARS she has taken just a dose a day, normally 2-4 grams, never escalated, only once ever took a double dose...

My ex-wife used to take kratom every day with me, sometimes up to 3 times a day. But she only took 2 grams at a time, sometimes 1. And she never experieced any withdrawal. But she was taking 1-2 grams a time, so 2-6 grams a day, and I was taking 12 grams at a time, 4-6-8 times a day (depending on what period of time it was). So our amounts were massively different. She always accused me of just pretending once I told her I wanted to get off of it, and then would take it behind her back. That I was pretending just because I was weak and wanted to take some, and he reasoning was "well, I never experienced any withdrawal at all".

 

[Juicewrldfan]

I find it extremely hard to taper effectively on kratom, simply due to the fact that I always feel bad on it after the first few days of feeling pretty good. It's like when I take it and it hits me, the restlessness and agitation goes almost all the way away, but not quite. I'm grumpy, pissy, and distracted. And like 2 hours later, the teary eyes come back, and then the restlessness a few hours later. After many, many times on and off it, this seems to happen almost immediately. It's like I'm ultra-sensitized to the withdrawal. The urge to take a little more every 2 hours is very strong. I even start waking up at 4-6am after taking it as the last thing before bed, because of withdrawal, and needing to dose to finish sleeping. I feel so bad, so easily, that I can't stick to a taper, in fact my usage escalates just to try to not feel really bad. But, I think my situation is atypical. I have also been using it since 2002 or 2003, I can't remember for sure which year it was. So 20 or 21 years, which is longer than I would imagine almost anyone on here. In fact my trip report on it on Erowid is among the first published. So it might be that, or the fact that I went up to harder opiates, or that I spent a very long time on 50+ grams a day, up to about 100... or some unique property of my body chemistry (I started out with a very strong tolerance to opiate effects, from day one, it took 25mg of hydrocodone to get much more than a faint feeling of pleasant lightness).

Whatever the case is, tapering on kratom is harder for me than it is on just about anything, unfortunately.

Suboxone is BY FAR the easiest opiate I've been addicted to to taper. It's because I don't feel anything on it, and I feel fully better (other than a general lower motivation and reduced testosterone/etc), so there is no incentive to take more, and I can reduce it a little bit at a time and it makes no difference in the way I feel.



That's awesome, lucky for you! I wish that was the case with me, but sadly, it's the opposite. With all opiates.



My ex-wife used to take kratom every day with me, sometimes up to 3 times a day. But she only took 2 grams at a time, sometimes 1. And she never experieced any withdrawal. But she was taking 1-2 grams a time, so 2-6 grams a day, and I was taking 12 grams at a time, 4-6-8 times a day (depending on what period of time it was). So our amounts were massively different. She always accused me of just pretending once I told her I wanted to get off of it, and then would take it behind her back. That I was pretending just because I was weak and wanted to take some, and he reasoning was "well, I never experienced any withdrawal at all".

Not to say anything bad about your ex intentionally but she sounds very close minded and invalidating. Like everyone has different experiences with how drugs/meds impact them. I mean that’s obvious to most people I would think. Think of all the times people have to try multiple ADs before they find one that works for them and can tolerate the side effects. There’s so many different ADs being used today because of this. I’m sorry you had this experience. Just angered me a little because just sounds like a very unsupportive partner.

Hopefully you have worked things out and been able to stay away from kratom since it impacts you so horribly which I think you have because you sound like you’re on suboxone instead these days. Anyway, best wishes to you man.

 

[Dropperneck]

I find it extremely hard to taper effectively on kratom, simply due to the fact that I always feel bad on it after the first few days of feeling pretty good. It's like when I take it and it hits me, the restlessness and agitation goes almost all the way away, but not quite. I'm grumpy, pissy, and distracted. And like 2 hours later, the teary eyes come back, and then the restlessness a few hours later. After many, many times on and off it, this seems to happen almost immediately. It's like I'm ultra-sensitized to the withdrawal. The urge to take a little more every 2 hours is very strong. I even start waking up at 4-6am after taking it as the last thing before bed, because of withdrawal, and needing to dose to finish sleeping. I feel so bad, so easily, that I can't stick to a taper, in fact my usage escalates just to try to not feel really bad. But, I think my situation is atypical. I have also been using it since 2002 or 2003, I can't remember for sure which year it was. So 20 or 21 years, which is longer than I would imagine almost anyone on here. In fact my trip report on it on Erowid is among the first published. So it might be that, or the fact that I went up to harder opiates, or that I spent a very long time on 50+ grams a day, up to about 100... or some unique property of my body chemistry (I started out with a very strong tolerance to opiate effects, from day one, it took 25mg of hydrocodone to get much more than a faint feeling of pleasant lightness).

Whatever the case is, tapering on kratom is harder for me than it is on just about anything, unfortunately.

Suboxone is BY FAR the easiest opiate I've been addicted to to taper. It's because I don't feel anything on it, and I feel fully better (other than a general lower motivation and reduced testosterone/etc), so there is no incentive to take more, and I can reduce it a little bit at a time and it makes no difference in the way I feel.



That's awesome, lucky for you! I wish that was the case with me, but sadly, it's the opposite. With all opiates.



My ex-wife used to take kratom every day with me, sometimes up to 3 times a day. But she only took 2 grams at a time, sometimes 1. And she never experieced any withdrawal. But she was taking 1-2 grams a time, so 2-6 grams a day, and I was taking 12 grams at a time, 4-6-8 times a day (depending on what period of time it was). So our amounts were massively different. She always accused me of just pretending once I told her I wanted to get off of it, and then would take it behind her back. That I was pretending just because I was weak and wanted to take some, and he reasoning was "well, I never experienced any withdrawal at all".

2002? Where did they even sell it back then? I think the serotonin affect is what causes it to be so temperamental.
Such a hard thing to quit, I did a few week run and broke down and got an opms shot since work sort of broke me. Didn’t even get a great effect. It’s such a atypical substance, you can never replicate an affect, but the desire to gets the best of you every time. Fml

 

[emkee_reinvented]

No, not imo, take a break in a while. Ans use quality stuff.

 

[Neuroborean]

I find it extremely hard to taper effectively on kratom, simply due to the fact that I always feel bad on it after the first few days of feeling pretty good. It's like when I take it and it hits me, the restlessness and agitation goes almost all the way away, but not quite. I'm grumpy, pissy, and distracted. And like 2 hours later, the teary eyes come back, and then the restlessness a few hours later. After many, many times on and off it, this seems to happen almost immediately. It's like I'm ultra-sensitized to the withdrawal. The urge to take a little more every 2 hours is very strong. I even start waking up at 4-6am after taking it as the last thing before bed, because of withdrawal, and needing to dose to finish sleeping. I feel so bad, so easily, that I can't stick to a taper, in fact my usage escalates just to try to not feel really bad. But, I think my situation is atypical. I have also been using it since 2002 or 2003, I can't remember for sure which year it was. So 20 or 21 years, which is longer than I would imagine almost anyone on here. In fact my trip report on it on Erowid is among the first published. So it might be that, or the fact that I went up to harder opiates, or that I spent a very long time on 50+ grams a day, up to about 100... or some unique property of my body chemistry (I started out with a very strong tolerance to opiate effects, from day one, it took 25mg of hydrocodone to get much more than a faint feeling of pleasant lightness).

Whatever the case is, tapering on kratom is harder for me than it is on just about anything, unfortunately.

Suboxone is BY FAR the easiest opiate I've been addicted to to taper. It's because I don't feel anything on it, and I feel fully better (other than a general lower motivation and reduced testosterone/etc), so there is no incentive to take more, and I can reduce it a little bit at a time and it makes no difference in the way I feel.



That's awesome, lucky for you! I wish that was the case with me, but sadly, it's the opposite. With all opiates.



My ex-wife used to take kratom every day with me, sometimes up to 3 times a day. But she only took 2 grams at a time, sometimes 1. And she never experieced any withdrawal. But she was taking 1-2 grams a time, so 2-6 grams a day, and I was taking 12 grams at a time, 4-6-8 times a day (depending on what period of time it was). So our amounts were massively different. She always accused me of just pretending once I told her I wanted to get off of it, and then would take it behind her back. That I was pretending just because I was weak and wanted to take some, and he reasoning was "well, I never experienced any withdrawal at all".

I think the problem with kratom starts (at least for +75% of people) when you surpass 6-8gpd... specially when you surpass 10-12gpd. Over 15gpd the withdrawals are similar to opiate withdrawal but IMO and IME the withdrawal you get with less than 8gpd it's barely opiate-ish, mainly because (my subjective experience) tells me that it barely hits opioid receptors at low doses specially if you use green-white strains.
Once you get into abusing red/golds... then you're dealing with an "intermediate" opioid withdrawal. So you did more than +25gpd for longs period of time, isn't it?
I never did that, nor I've used other opioids/ates, so maybe that's the reason.
My opinion it's that if you've never dealt with other opioids nor you get into certain higher doses, dealing with kratom withdrawal it's more like adrenergic/stimulant + low grade antidepressant + low grade opioid withdrawal.
As you go into higher doses or you are more experienced with opioids I think kratom withdrawal becomes less adrenergic/stimulant-like and becomes worse in terms of opioid withdrawal + worse antidepressant-like PAWS,
but well, this is just an opinion.

 

[JackARoe]

Damn, what does feeling normal even feel like anymore? Experiences all over the spectrum here.

I do think the smartest thing a person can do if they are going to indulge is to keep their dose is low.

 

[Dead Machination]

I find it extremely hard to taper effectively on kratom, simply due to the fact that I always feel bad on it after the first few days of feeling pretty good. It's like when I take it and it hits me, the restlessness and agitation goes almost all the way away, but not quite. I'm grumpy, pissy, and distracted. And like 2 hours later, the teary eyes come back, and then the restlessness a few hours later. After many, many times on and off it, this seems to happen almost immediately. It's like I'm ultra-sensitized to the withdrawal. The urge to take a little more every 2 hours is very strong. I even start waking up at 4-6am after taking it as the last thing before bed, because of withdrawal, and needing to dose to finish sleeping. I feel so bad, so easily, that I can't stick to a taper, in fact my usage escalates just to try to not feel really bad. But, I think my situation is atypical. I have also been using it since 2002 or 2003, I can't remember for sure which year it was. So 20 or 21 years, which is longer than I would imagine almost anyone on here. In fact my trip report on it on Erowid is among the first published. So it might be that, or the fact that I went up to harder opiates, or that I spent a very long time on 50+ grams a day, up to about 100... or some unique property of my body chemistry (I started out with a very strong tolerance to opiate effects, from day one, it took 25mg of hydrocodone to get much more than a faint feeling of pleasant lightness).

Whatever the case is, tapering on kratom is harder for me than it is on just about anything, unfortunately.
....

I have a similar experience with tapering, I've noticed that phenibut or a benzo, just for the day or two (more than 3 days of a GABA drug is risky for me) during the dose drop of the taper, is incredibly helpful with the restlessness and irritability. Every time I've successfully quit kratom it's been with phenibut.

 

[TheFrogEffect]

Tolerance develops, you'll probably become addicted, you will experience withdrawals, and I believe Kratom has shown to have potential to cause pretty severe adverse health effects that can be very harmful or even fatal. Probably a risk of OD as well but I want to look into that more before I say for certain.

If you truly keep your limit to two drinks per day and keep your doses as low as possible, the negative health impacts may be highly unlikely, but you can still form a dependency and experience withdrawals and what not.

I would never take kratom daily but I don't really think it's the worst drug you can subject yourself to ingesting on a daily basis. You'll certainly be better of than if you did heroin or fentanyl daily.

 

[Xorkoth]

2002? Where did they even sell it back then? I think the serotonin affect is what causes it to be so temperamental.
Such a hard thing to quit, I did a few week run and broke down and got an opms shot since work sort of broke me. Didn’t even get a great effect. It’s such a atypical substance, you can never replicate an affect, but the desire to gets the best of you every time. Fml

I got it from a head shop in 2002, it was crushed leaf. I had recently read the one or two trip reports on Erowid at the time. It was 10 grams for like $20. I brewed it up using the traditional double simmer extraction method, and it got me SO high, I was floored, first I felt like talking a mile and minute and gushing how much I loved everyone, then an hour in, I got really nauseous and puked, but loved every minute of puking, the I smoked weed and nodded out for a couple of hours, it was total bliss.

I found that there was one online distributor in America back then, or at least, I only ever found one. It was like $150 per pound, and you could only get crushed leaf. I only ever made it using the traditional brewing method as it was the only way I read about doing. It took 45-50 minutes to make a dose, and I never did less than 10 grams at once. I got up to 16-18 grams per dose. It brewed up into the color of creamed coffee when cooled enough to drink, and it was way nastier than drinking the fine powder mixed in water. But I swear it was just plain better in every way. Every friend I introduced to it loved it and was blown away by how awesome it felt.

I remember like 3 or 4 years in, the flour-like powder started to become the norm, and the first time I got a batch of that, I thought they sent me a different drug, it made me dizzy and sick at my normal dose, and under no circumstances could I get the same high. But it still felt decent and kept me out of withdrawal. I haven't ever experienced the kratom highs from the OG batches again. I'd think it was purely a tolerance/receptors no longer being virginal thing, except that the difference happened overnight all of a sudden when I could no longer get the crushed leaf anymore. But I found crushed leaf again last year before I got on suboxone, and it wasn't really any different from the flour-like powder.

*I mention prices only because it was 21 years ago, and it highlights how times have changed with respect to kratom.

Probably a risk of OD as well but I want to look into that more before I say for certain.

Kratom does not cause respiratory depression, so the risk of overdose is negligible or even nonexistent (I am unaware of any cases of fatal OD, or even a trip to ER or anything, if you take too much you get dizzy and vomit, there seems to be a ceiling effect). It has that going for it.

 

[Didgital]

Kratom does not cause respiratory depression, so the risk of withdrawal is negligible or even nonexistent (I am unaware of any cases of fatal OD, or even a trip to ER or anything,

Couple things here.

I assume you mean risk of "overdose" because ability to cause respiratory depression has nothing to do with addiction or withdrawl?

2nd, unfortunately, there have been a few documented fatalities that have been ascribed to kratom alone. I happen to know half the people named in the lawsuit

Parents sue over son's death after he took kratom supplement

The parents of a 23-year-old Georgia man who died after using kratom have filed a wrongful death lawsuit against about a dozen people, companies and organizations connected to the manufacturing, marketing and sale of the herbal supplement

abcnews.go.com

Um for the original question, some people (me) can take kratom everyday for months and stop cold turkey with little more than a tired feeling for a week. On the other hand, I have known two people in my life that truly are addicted and will freak out if they cant dose every 4 hours or so. Kratom does have an ugly side imo.

 

[Dropperneck]

I got it from a head shop in 2002, it was crushed leaf. I had recently read the one or two trip reports on Erowid at the time. It was 10 grams for like $20. I brewed it up using the traditional double simmer extraction method, and it got me SO high, I was floored, first I felt like talking a mile and minute and gushing how much I loved everyone, then an hour in, I got really nauseous and puked, but loved every minute of puking, the I smoked weed and nodded out for a couple of hours, it was total bliss.

I found that there was one online distributor in America back then, or at least, I only ever found one. It was like $150 per pound, and you could only get crushed leaf. I only ever made it using the traditional brewing method as it was the only way I read about doing. It took 45-50 minutes to make a dose, and I never did less than 10 grams at once. I got up to 16-18 grams per dose. It brewed up into the color of creamed coffee when cooled enough to drink, and it was way nastier than drinking the fine powder mixed in water. But I swear it was just plain better in every way. Every friend I introduced to it loved it and was blown away by how awesome it felt.

I remember like 3 or 4 years in, the flour-like powder started to become the norm, and the first time I got a batch of that, I thought they sent me a different drug, it made me dizzy and sick at my normal dose, and under no circumstances could I get the same high. But it still felt decent and kept me out of withdrawal. I haven't ever experienced the kratom highs from the OG batches again. I'd think it was purely a tolerance/receptors no longer being virginal thing, except that the difference happened overnight all of a sudden when I could no longer get the crushed leaf anymore. But I found crushed leaf again last year before I got on suboxone, and it wasn't really any different from the flour-like powder.

*I mention prices only because it was 21 years ago, and it highlights how times have changed with respect to kratom.



Kratom does not cause respiratory depression, so the risk of withdrawal is negligible or even nonexistent (I am unaware of any cases of fatal OD, or even a trip to ER or anything, if you take too much you get dizzy and vomit, there seems to be a ceiling effect). It has that going for it.

I used to get the crushed leaf from a headshop. I brewed it, but never really noticed any positives. Likely a combo of a quality source and low tolerance.

 

[Dropperneck]

I got it from a head shop in 2002, it was crushed leaf. I had recently read the one or two trip reports on Erowid at the time. It was 10 grams for like $20. I brewed it up using the traditional double simmer extraction method, and it got me SO high, I was floored, first I felt like talking a mile and minute and gushing how much I loved everyone, then an hour in, I got really nauseous and puked, but loved every minute of puking, the I smoked weed and nodded out for a couple of hours, it was total bliss.

I found that there was one online distributor in America back then, or at least, I only ever found one. It was like $150 per pound, and you could only get crushed leaf. I only ever made it using the traditional brewing method as it was the only way I read about doing. It took 45-50 minutes to make a dose, and I never did less than 10 grams at once. I got up to 16-18 grams per dose. It brewed up into the color of creamed coffee when cooled enough to drink, and it was way nastier than drinking the fine powder mixed in water. But I swear it was just plain better in every way. Every friend I introduced to it loved it and was blown away by how awesome it felt.

I remember like 3 or 4 years in, the flour-like powder started to become the norm, and the first time I got a batch of that, I thought they sent me a different drug, it made me dizzy and sick at my normal dose, and under no circumstances could I get the same high. But it still felt decent and kept me out of withdrawal. I haven't ever experienced the kratom highs from the OG batches again. I'd think it was purely a tolerance/receptors no longer being virginal thing, except that the difference happened overnight all of a sudden when I could no longer get the crushed leaf anymore. But I found crushed leaf again last year before I got on suboxone, and it wasn't really any different from the flour-like powder.

*I mention prices only because it was 21 years ago, and it highlights how times have changed with respect to kratom.



Kratom does not cause respiratory depression, so the risk of withdrawal is negligible or even nonexistent (I am unaware of any cases of fatal OD, or even a trip to ER or anything, if you take too much you get dizzy and vomit, there seems to be a ceiling effect). It has that going for it.

Have you ever tried opms or kshot extract shots? I wonder how many grams those are. A opms black shot, if it hits, can feel like 90mg of Roxy. Sometimes nothing though. Shits cancer though and I don’t do that shit anymore.