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Recovery I can't go on, I'll go on

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I feel ya bro! im being tested like never before!!. My job is coming to and end next month after 15 years here my company is closing. So last week my wife tells me she got fired from her job! she says she didnt tell me because im always complaining about the nerve pain in my feet and coming off wds couple months ago she didnt want to add to my problems. Crazy shit so i told her finding out now is much better thanks!!!! :( I was more upset that she was keeping it from me. She was very unhappy there with pay etc. but whenever i asked she said its ok but very busy always. So now things are gonna get real fucking interesting with no ins. etc etc im just happy in not still on opioids that would suck without jobs and insurance. All i can say Sim is reading your problems and mine sometimes i think its all about bad timing and testing us hang in there bro!
 
Sim,

We've been going back and forth in another thread, but I'd figure I would add a few thoughts here if that's ok. First off, you have way more experience with beating this than I do, and the fact that you are now 4+ months clean is fucking amazing. That's worth way more than a pat on the back. I noticed you and a few others mentioned hallucinogens about a month ago. That is certainly something I can speak on, and they can have a profound effect on your outlook towards life. I followed Phish for about 5 years (after the hiatus) and went to around 15 shows per year. A lot of tripping happened during that time. My most recent trip (lsd) was at their Fall show here in North Charleston. I was using heavily at that time, and I took a bit more acid than I realized, which can always be a problem with that stuff. Anyway, that night was extremely intense and introspective. I don't even remember the music or show, I went to a very dark place and during the trip, I remember telling myself "dear God, if you get me through this, I will never use opiates again." I truly thought I was going to die that night, I guess that's my first bad trip out of 20+ other trips. It didn't stick at the time, but I find myself thinking about it now, and I'm starting to think another experience could be beneficial. They almost always are for me, but be warned (you prob already know) that tripping is different every time.

In regards to your job, man are we similar. I had an extremely lucrative job for 5 years, but it demanded 55+ hours per week and I hated it. When I quit a couple weeks ago, I knew I couldn't go back, so I quit the job on a whim. As of right now, it's the best thing I've ever done. I have no energy, but I know if I went back to that job, I'd be using immediately. Hence the money fueling the drugs and the drugs fueling the money.

In regards to your moving to another location, I CAN NOT support that more, you need to do it. Change of scene is huge from what my former addict buddies have told. In all seriousness, you should look into Charleston, SC. I moved here from the D.C. area about 4 years ago and other than quitting dope, it's the best decision I ever made. The people here are overly friendly, the cost of living is decent (but going up fast, everyone seems to be moving here), there are plenty of outdoor activities. Hell, you're welcome on my boat any day. I'll teach you how to surf as well. Not to sound like a dumb ole bro but it can have a profound effect on your life. Charleston was rated the number 1 city in the world to visit by CNN a couple years ago, I prefer to to live here. Anyways, just a few thoughts, talk to you soon.
 
^^
Hey, man...thanks for the good ideas!

First thing--what a weird coincidence, I actually used to live in Charleston. It was for about a year in 1994-95. I did like it a lot, but I moved there straight out of college to be with a girl, and you can imagine what ended up happening. But from there I did end up living in NC for about 6 years. Fucking love it there.

I'm really glad to hear you've found a good place and a way out of a job that sounds soul-eating. A lot of folks claim that 'you can't run away from your problems' by moving. But like you, I disagree. Sure, if moving is the *only* thing you did for your recovery, I suppose the chances of much success are slim. But I'm with you...getting away from the gazillion triggers in my podunk town seems like it can only be tonic. Likewise, my wife and I are looking at new locations where we can spend time hiking, climbing, etc--shit we used to love but had to give up when we moved to the Midwest. Funny thing to me about the midwest...the thing that makes life (for me at least) less than awesome isn't the weather, which of course many people complain about. Rather it's the fact that the only open space to speak of is private farmland (read, corn/soybeans). There's simply nowhere to go unless you want to go shopping. Bleah!

Lastly, psychedelics. Yes indeed, still on my todo list. I wasted about an 1/8th of mushrooms a few months ago before I realized that my zoloft counteracted them. But as it happens, my new (and somewhat dodgy-seeming) shrink has decided to take me off all SSRIs. It's now been about two weeks since my last zoloft. After another week or so, I think I should be good to go, wrt another run at the mushrooms. Though I'm also going to wait until my mood stabilizes before throwing that into the mix. It's kinda funny, despite being strung out on heroin for years, and despite doing a lot of pretty gnarly other drugs, I've never tripped before...always seemed to spooky for me. But these days it's seeming like a more reasonable idea. I'm very curious to try.

Thanks, Oxygen.
 
No need at all to thank me my friend, just reading through your previous posts have done a world of good for me in my recovery, as early as it is. I'm really curious and excited to watch your healing process and get a better idea of when the depression gets better. I KNOW you're going to get there. You've kicked the shit out of your addiction over the past 4 months and you're becoming a role model to me, as well as others on this site I'm sure.

The fact act that you've lived here before cracks me up, because it seems half the people I talk to about Charleston have lived here at one point or another. But you're right and there's a reason they call it the "low country." No hills here and it's very flat. I'd hate that normally but I'm a waterbaby and there's enough around to have plenty of outdoor activities. Having spent 5 years while at school in Blacksburg, VA, I fell in love with the New River and all the amazing hiking trails up and down Appalachia. I miss that part a lot, some amazing memories there. Ironically, that's also where my depression started at age 19. I had the best life ever (so I thought) but it still reared it's ugly head. Guess what my first symptom was...if you guessed starving myself, you nailed it. I truly became anorexic. I would get nauseous just looking at food and sometimes when I'd force it down, I'd throw it back up again. Herb and booze were the only things that could make me suppress it. Turns out, it was all due to a relationship I was in at the time, which I think I knew in the back of my mind all along. The worst part was that the girl was amazing, cute, and had a huge heart. So it took me two years to break up with her and I didn't have a legit reason to at the time. She was blindsided and it got ugly. A week later, my anxiety was gone. I had about 5 years of happiness before it came back around and that I blame on my job.

One more interesting thing that we share is SSRIs. I've been on Celexa for 2 years and Prozac for the last 5 years. They never had an effect on hallucinogens for me, I went to space every time. Then again, I FAR AND AWAY prefer lsd to mushies. I did mushies 4 times before trying lsd and I never went back to them. One, given my food intake issue at the time, they were tough to get down even with pizza, etc. If you get the real stuff, lsd is a much cleaner high and trip, and I can control it better too. Yes, it does last longer, so I wouldn't do more than 1 hit the first time just to test the waters. The problem with lsd is that it's very easy to fake, as it is colorless and odorless. It's tougher to fake mushrooms. When you eat mushies though, you're literally giving yourself food poisoning, though a mostly harmless version of it. That's why a lot of people puke right before they come up on them. I know we can't source on BL, but I'd never buy lsd off the streets. Go to a hippie kind of concert and it'll find you. Those hippies are usually very friendly and want you to share in the experience with them. I've literally never gotten bad stuff at a concert (knocks on wood).
That brings me to another point. If you do decide to try to trip again, make sure you don't do it alone your first time. Do it with somebody you trust and are close to, because if things start to go south it's crucial to have a friend or two be there to talk you back to the good side.

Personally, given where you're at in your recovery, I don't think you can have a bad experience. You'll be exhausted afterwards, but in a very good way, like a cleanse almost. You'll also go to certain places in your head that you didn't know existed. I'm not saying you'll find the meaning of life, but I have known people to claim that. Ok enough of the preaching about those kind of drogas, got a little carried away. I'll be reading your thread here every day. STAY STRONG, there are probably hundreds of people out there like myself that are depending on you in a way. No pressure of course, I just want you to know that we are all blown away by your progress. It's very comforting to those of us that are in the earlier phases of PAWS. YOU are an inspiration and you should be very proud to be someone that helps so many other people, even if you don't even know it. Talk soon.

-Oxygen
 
simco said:
I've been having trouble getting motivated recently. For whatever reason, my old ghosts--depression, primarily--are up and full of blood. Actually, I think the reasons aren't that complicated--feels like a combo of continued fallout from my mom dying, as well as the older lowness I used to feel...it's like being on a teeter-totter, with my long-standing, organic depression on one side, and drugs on the other. If I take the drugs away, the depressive side comes down hard. At the same time, I know I can lighten the depression by putting drugs back into the equation. For a while when I was using, I managed to balance this teeter-totter OK. But obviously, over time, the whole thing got sideways and finally fell apart. In other words, adding drugs (at least dope) back into the mix is tempting, but at least for now it's pretty clear to me that this would be a very bad idea.

Actually, the reason I wanted to write this post is different than what I just prattled about. Last week I resigned from my job. I really thought this would be a giant relief. And there is some relief in there. (Almost zero disappointment, too.) But the emotion is just dull and shallow.

Hopefully this funk will let go of me soon, so I can get properly excited. This is something I've been wanting to do for years. I'll be leaving my position in May, and after that my wife and I are going to start looking at new states/towns, with plans to move over the summer. The job was really an albatross for me--way too much stress and way too little pride or satisfaction.

Kind of amazing, though. I went to school for a long-ass time to get this gig. And I've been doing the job for about 13 years. So the people who are seeing this from the outside (e.g. my boss and my colleagues...and my family/friends) think I'm nuts.

This is one thing that annoys me to no end about recovery, at least as I'm going about it. I've got great family and friends in my support network. But that does come with the cost of eroding my privacy. Constant Q&A about how/what Sim is feeling and doing. As such, quitting my job has raised all kinds of red flags and I'm having to justify my decision over and over. I try to explain to people that I didn't make the decision lightly, that I waited more than 4 months into recovery before acting on the idea, and that I pulled the trigger precisely so they're less likely to see me in the condition I was in last summer (suicidal, psychotic and strung-out as fuck). They try to understand, but I know they don't.

Reading over this post, I realize how scatter-brained it sounds. Yes, I definitely feel off my game.

But I did want to make sure that this event--resigning my job--made it into my journal before too much time went by.
Click to expand...

This makes perfect sense to me. Navigating those boundaries can be hard with family and friends. I have found it to be important to be conservative, firm and consistent with what and to whom I will disclose recovery stuff to. Then again, it sounds like these friends of yours are scared and confused, or just pushy worry-warts.
 
Man if I had the energy, is have said what oxygen had said. Simmy.. lol.. but I don't, so he gets to write it and I get to pat you on the back brother.

I hope your doc weened you of the SSRI. I had a tough time coming off celexa.

Thinking of you lots buddy

Sixx
 
Aw, Oxygen, you made my day, man.

A couple things I want to reply to from your post.

First, I also LOVE hiking in Appalachia. After grad school, my wife and I spent time living in both Asheville and Boone, NC and did very little besides hiking. God it's gorgeous up there. In the end, I had trouble assimilating in Appalachia so we had to go onto greener pastures. But it was lovely.

I may have mentioned this already, but like you, I also have serious trouble eating. Along with cutting myself up, I know that this has to do with feeling out of control. In fact I've intentionally starved myself since long before I started using H. Now that the dope is gone, those extremely maladaptive coping skills have come rushing in to fill the gap. Oxygen, if you don't mind my asking--am I right that you're a dude? I ask just because it seems rare that men get anorexic. But it sure does happen sometimes.

Mushies...I love that name! So much better than 'shrooms.

My thinking was that I'd give the mushies a try once I'm good and sure the zoloft is gone. If that experience winds up to be good/helpful, I've thought about grabbing some acid for another go. The problem is it is a bit hard for me to get such things. I'm old as fuck (well, not THAT old...45), and I'm sure any kids who saw me coming would think I'm either a child molester or a cop. ;)

Last thing, that's interesting that your ssri's didn't get between you and tripping. I've heard that it's pretty much a coin flip...some people can do both just fine, while others simply can't trip while taking ssri's. So weird.

Take care, my friend.
 
TPD, as always, great advice. "Conservative" is a good word in this situation--I'm gonna try to keep that one on hand. I suspect there are ways to be honest, even quite open, without going into gory details. As to your question, my posse is mostly scared and confused. They only push what the fear or confusion boils over.

Thanks man, so glad you're back online!
 
Sixx, yeah, my doc has indeed weened me off of zoloft. I did a fairly quick taper, and now it's been about 2 weeks without any zoloft, for the first time since 1998!!!

Obviously--due to my earlier posts--I'm kinda an emotional basket case. But that was true well before he took me off the zoloft. So my assessment so far is that I'm not really having any ill effects from coming off. Frequent brain zaps for the first week, and now very sporadic ones. But basically fine.

I been thinking about you too, man. Keep up the fight. Hard to believe it, but we're actually doing this shit!
 
Just saying, hello, Sim... it seems you have a lot going on... just want you to know I offer you my unconditional support and I will leave the "advice giving" to others.
 
Ha, yeah man, I'm a dude. I know my picture's a bit sappy but it's a memory of doing something I love, catching bait with a cast net on a springtime day. Those days are coming soon and I plan to fish like a crazy man. Can't beat the spring and fall red drum and trout run we have down here in the low country.

I can relate to the emotional haywire feelings, but probably not to extent that you may be feeling. I know it's part of the PAWS for me. You know what I'm experiencing that's weird? I'll be curious to see if others have these feelings as well. Recently over the past week, I've been getting weird pins and needles feelings, sometimes they'll start off like I stood up too fast and got lightheaded, except that I haven't stood up or moved. I like to think it's my brain just firing off at random times trying to get its equilibrium back.

You and the other mods have been very helpful and hopefully continue to be. It's nice to have a roadmap of what to expect.

Regarding the starving yourself part, I'm not sure if it would be fair to truly consider my issue as anorexia. It very well may have been, but because it's so rare for males, it took me 2 years to seek help for it. My inability to eat was brought on entirely by anxiety. For example, when the gf that caused that anxiety left, my appetite came back immediately. DON'T LEAVE YOUR WIFE, that's not what I'm trying to say, just that it's often an underlying issue that leads to the starving and it can be hard to dig up. In my shitty case, I knew the cause the whole time but didn't have the balls to end things. I got em back eventually and made the call.

You know what might be interesting to look into? They say that dope addiction literally changes the way your brain works. I bet that change could also cause SSRIs that worked for years for you or me, to suddenly stop working well when you try to get your mind back. Just something I've been curious about lately. Like you mentioned, everybody is different. I was almost maniacal at times on Zoloft, but I got off it after 3 weeks and switched to Prozac. Obviously it worked much better for me. I was lucky to not be one of those pill expirements that shrinks often try to create, intentionally or not.

We started calling shrooms mushies instead when I was in my late teens. Shrooms just sound poopy, or sad, like gloom. It's dumb but it makes it sound like a happier experience off the bat.

You're not old yet my man, not even close really. I find it very interesting to read posts of folks in a different age group but going through the same stuff that most of us are or have experienced at some point. Age doesn't mean a damn thing, at least not mid-40s. You've got a long, happy life ahead of you once we all get through this BS together.

I'll be monitoring this thread daily. KEEP ON KEEPIN ON!
 
I knew that was a fishing dude in that avatar :) we've got some exceptional fellas in SL right now, this I must say.

And what did I tell you sim, these kinds of issues with eat and control are not at all uncommon among men in recovery. In a sense I'd say more common than not, at least to one degree or another (and I definitely have a tendency to at least try and use food to exercise "control" over my situation when things have gotten out of hand before myself).

Think of it like this: Generally those with an unhealthy relationship with substances will have a likewise, to one degree or another, unhealthy relationship to food. If you think about it, much of what we eat (if not nearly all of what we eat) affects our neurochemistry. And what do substance do? Just that. Sugar is the prime example of course.

Anyways, yes indeed it is good to be back.
 
Thanks, Oxygen and TPD! Yeah, it is interesting how many guys speak up once we start talking about eating problems (that is, problems with eating, not eating our problems, though I think I've tried that too :D).

For me the problems with food are pretty clearly about two things:
1. Control, as you all mentioned. When I feel overwhelmed, withholding meals is one of the first things I jump to.
2. Self-esteem and feeling emotionally compromised. The drugs hid some of this, but for most of my life, I've used various kinds of self-harm to enact some kind of fucked up psychodrama...a kind of late-modern hairshirt thing.

But thanks for the reminder, TPD...I hadn't thought of the neurochemistry aspect of the whole deal. I actually fell like this might give me a kick in the ass to try a new approach to relating to food.

Last thing--Oxygen...you guys have trout down there? I don't fish much. But I do love trout fishing. I would have thought it was too warm down there for those cute little guys.
 
Good to know, it sounds like you're doing very well right now, and that's awesome as I'm hanging onto your bandwagon of success. I noticed in a former post, may have even been this one, but somebody mentioned reading up on mindfulness. I'm a few chapters into Fully Present by Diana Winston and can attest to its helpfulness.

I actually grew up on freshwater fishing, mainly largemouth bass but caught some brown and rainbow trout here and there. All the fishing I do here is saltwater or brackish, so we catch spotted sea trout down here all the time. They are typically larger than the freshwater fish and are great eating although I've never been a big fish eater. I like to catch and release, though I might keep a couple decent ones for fried fish and chips.

Gotta run, no wall of text this time. Keep kickin butt.
 
HI Sim,
I hope your day is going well. and I also heard about genetic testing in order to more successfully narrow the field of what types of anti-depressants work well with each individual. I do not know anyone who has gone through the process, though, so have no idea if it works or not.
 
That will be cool to learn more about P0ke :)

Diana is one in 7 billion, outstanding person, I am really glad you are checking out her book. It really has the best overview of mindfulness from a secular, neuroscience perspective. Which is why I am such a big fan of the way they do things with mindfulness at UCLA/MARC. But I won't digress too far.

Hope you're doing well simco!
 
Hey, all. So yesterday I had a nice little win.

I hadn't told this to anybody, but I had squirreled away four bags of dope in my house "just in case." I didn't think about them that much, and they seemed to slake my appetite for scoring drugs, which is almost as strong as my appetite for using them. But deep down, I knew it was some stupid shit keeping that dope on hand.

I'm not sure why, but yesterday when I woke up I wanted the bags out of the house, so I grabbed them and ditched them.

Just one more knot I had to untie. But I'm glad I did it. Now all I have to do is convince myself not to replace them.
 
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