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  • EADD Moderators: axe battler | Pissed_and_messed

Human beings are the only earth bound 'animal' to administer drugs to their own harm.

Was referring to this really:

I think you are talking about the often cited one where they where given the opportunity to self-administer coke or heroin by pressing a button. Those on coke kept at it until the ODed, those on heroin pressed the button and headed off to the corner to goof off a bit, returning to the button when the effects wore off.

Do the rats have free will in this situation? If you trap a rat and supply it with cocaine, is that the same thing as elephants eating fermented apples, and is that the same as humans administering drugs they know to be harmful?
 
Was referring to this really:



Do the rats have free will in this situation? If you trap a rat and supply it with cocaine, is that the same thing as elephants eating fermented apples, and is that the same as humans administering drugs they know to be harmful?

I wasn't saying I agree with the popular view of the experiments, I actually learned a lot from that link, a lot of that info would not have been present in psych/drug research books I have read and studied over the years.

We are into dodgy ground with free will though are we not? Can we say animals like rats have free will or the intelligence or self-consciousness to use it? I don't know I would certainly have to think on that.

The reactions of the rats in the park certainly give us food for thought according to that link, and it is a pity that research isn't used more, thinking back to my time in college, I remember there just been a picture of a dead rat with the basic info about it oding, none of the critical thought that has been raised here.

Actually the more I think on the few different examples mentioned in this thread, the rats, the elephants etc, I don't think I remember coming across a detailed study dealing with all the various examples studies, rather I have just found small reference here and there along the way. [ It would make an interesting paper] That's if I remember correctly, but I could be wrong.

I don't know, I do think that human drug use is certainly different to animal drug, if drug use [and addiction] is subjective amongst humans [which I think it is]
then it is in such way different for us all, so it is certainly different to animals.

What do you think on those questions?
 
I wasn't saying I agree with the popular view of the experiments, I actually learned a lot from that link, a lot of that info would not have been present in psych/drug research books I have read and studied over the years.

We are into dodgy ground with free will though are we not? Can we say animals like rats have free will or the intelligence or self-consciousness to use it? I don't know I would certainly have to think on that.

That is a dilemma yeah. Not one that we can really find a solution to either. I'm sure if rats came across cocaine in the wild, they would no doubt use it, but whether they would destruct themselves on it like they do in a laboratory situation is another matter. There's plenty more factors at play in the wild.

The reactions of the rats in the park certainly give us food for thought according to that link, and it is a pity that research isn't used more, thinking back to my time in college, I remember there just been a picture of a dead rat with the basic info about it oding, none of the critical thought that has been raised here.

Hopefully more research will be conducted in the future. Hopefully as the issue becomes less taboo in society, a wider range of scientific studies will be greenlighted.

I don't know, I do think that human drug use is certainly different to animal drug, if drug use [and addiction] is subjective amongst humans [which I think it is]
then it is in such way different for us all, so it is certainly different to animals.

The main difference seems to me to be that humans are informed of the dangers of drug use, whereas other animals are not. We knowingly use harmful drugs in ways we know to be harmful. There's an element of innocence and ignorance attributable to drug use in other animals that is not attributable to human beings. We also have a self-destruct button...Do other animals self-harm?
 
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what about those monkeys that get pissed up all the time at resorts.
 
my pig Francis who was a Gloucester old spot back-cross boar regularly shared a gallon of scrumpy with me. I had a pint, he had the other 7 and wouldn't come up for air until he'd finished the lot.Then he'd get all misty-eyed and affectionate and eventually just lie down and go to sleep. This story is happy endings all the way,he didn't end up as bacon, he went for stud!
 
my pig Francis who was a Gloucester old spot back-cross boar regularly shared a gallon of scrumpy with me. I had a pint, he had the other 7 and wouldn't come up for air until he'd finished the lot.Then he'd get all misty-eyed and affectionate and eventually just lie down and go to sleep. This story is happy endings all the way,he didn't end up as bacon, he went for stud!

It sounds like Mr Piggy had as good a life as he could have wished for. How good would that be, to be The Stud Pig, Ram, Bull, or whatever. There you go Mr Ram; see that field of 1000 sheep, you have to impregnate every one of them, and we'll put a marker on your stomach that will leave a mark on every ewe you mount, so that we make sure every one of them gets done.

Very interesting to see the way this discussion has developed. I wasnt expecting much from my OP but as its had 49 replies its doing much better than i expected.
 
...and we'll put a marker on your stomach that will leave a mark on every ewe you mount, so that we make sure every one of them gets done.

Is that why sheep often have coloured paint on them? I thought the farmer just tagged them a certain colour so he knew what ones were his :|
 
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