I can't think of any autoimmune disease which causes symtpoms such as this, if it were due to an autoimmune drug-associated haemolysis then the symptoms would be things like fatigue, jaundic and having a big spleen. Peripheral cyanosis because of inadequate blood supply is surely much more likely, someone should do a proper study into it.
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N&PD Moderators: Skorpio
How toxic is Mephedrone?
- Thread starter Giovanni
- Start date
I can't think of any autoimmune disease which causes symtpoms such as this, if it were due to an autoimmune drug-associated haemolysis then the symptoms would be things like fatigue, jaundic and having a big spleen. Peripheral cyanosis because of inadequate blood supply is surely much more likely, someone should do a proper study into it. 
sackynut
Bluelighter
^ well its completely possible its a toxic/build up effect, as well as just auto immune, thinking its a foreign bad guy.it doesnt have to be disease specific.DooMMooD
Bluelighter
Auto immune is when it attacks itself, correct? So your cells attacking themselves is an auto immune issue, not your cells attacking foreign bodies, which is in fact an allergy. Anything can be an allergn. Sounds more likely that something in the meph or the meph itself was causing an allergic reaction to you: your lips or w/e got swollen then shrank and there was skin left over. The rest of that stuff points to just a normal allergic reaction as well.
Source: terrible allergies? got allergy shots for over a decade and spent probably a couple months of my life in an allergists office getting poked and prodded and talking to doctors/nurses.i've been off the drone for a year now, i was quite a heavy user 10-15grams per session (once however splitting 2 ounces with a mate in 1 night)- 4/5 times a week, dosages up to 4.5 grams- (you'll say im lying, but i assure you these are conservative estimates)
Noticeable side effects, still vavioconstricted around knees, i rush to music now, or any exciting event (rush includes raise in heart rate and change in breathing rate) become alot more sensation based as a person. Wierd heart prangs, paranoia now and again.
xsackynut
Bluelighter
^ holy shit im glad youre alive man, thats some LARGE dosing. i can barely fathom killing 2 grams in a session
pofacedhoe
Bluelight Crew
been there, get off the drone, it cant be good when your skin gets so fucked up by a drug its a sign to cut it outsackynut
Bluelighter
^its just dehydration, meph causes bad cotton mouth, and its important to hydrate. but i highly doubt dry lips are a sign of coming doom. but if it is please tell me!!!
pofacedhoe
Bluelight Crew
i've had dry mouth on a lot of other drugs, i'm talking about the skin on your lips/hands/feet peeling were if you rub it it starts to peel. no other drug has caused this for me and i've had quite a long drug historybuzzmoonwalker
Greenlighter
- Joined
- Jun 6, 2011
- Messages
- 2
So what's the verdict: unfortunate 5ht2b antagonism or autoimmunity? If it's just about cardiotoxicity, what about coadministration with beta blockers? Why hasn't this been tried?
ebola?
Bluelight Crew
beta-blockers are not safe coadministered with strong adrenergic agonists due to the possibility of unopposed escalating alpha-agonism.
ebolabuzzmoonwalker
Greenlighter
- Joined
- Jun 6, 2011
- Messages
- 2
then why not block both?
What about a non-selective alpha/beta blocker?
ebola?
Bluelight Crew
This is what will likely be administered in controlled medical settings, but you need the effective knowledge of a registered nurse or more to calibrate the dosages.
ebolaHello,
i am taking mephedrone for 4 months now, about once a week, on average 250mg per one session. can someone please tell me how bad is mephedrone on my heart if i take it on such manner? i will continue this usage for at least 3 more months (till my meph supply ends), will my heart valves be ok after that?
i tryed to search throught the thread, but i found a lot of mixed information. from some posts it seems that it is extremly toxic and will unevitably destroy my heart valves. but in some posts people say like they have taken 2g a day for 1 year, and everything seems find. so what i the current consensus please?
thanks for answer
ebola?
Bluelight Crew
Honestly, no one yet knows, and even with firm data, you'd still be working with a great deal of uncertainty.
ebola[B^its just dehydration, meph causes bad cotton mouth, and its important to hydrate. but i highly doubt dry lips are a sign of coming doom. but if it is please tell me!!! ][/B]
Recent hydration is a good thind. I would say 1-3 litters in a 24 hour period. Make sure your producing urine! I belive MDxx reduce the release of antiduretic hormone and couse more concentrated urine and volume retention. You can drink yourself to death and get over treated diabetes insipidus symptoms theoretically and electrolytes embalances which are especially bad if you have a heart condition. Plus fuid overload aint good.
Ebola
Maybe low dose coreg: 6.25 mg might help as far as prophylaxis, but if you BP runs low (under 100 sys) you might be asking for problems and then you'll blunt any reflexive tachycardia and f-up your cardiac output: CO= stroke volume x heart rate. Preload and afterlaod are essential to normal cardiac function. Preload is mainatined by adequate hydration. Afterload by a decrease in systemic resistance (vasodialation). Mess with any of those parameters and not knowin what your cardiac rhythm is asking for trouble when titrating meds. Guess you can visit your doc on mephedrone, show the decrease in perpheral resistance, tachycardia, and hypertension, and see what they Rx.
8).
Achille
Your playing with fire. I would avoid all stimulants/empathogens, inclusing nicotine, stop drinking, and stay away from mephedrone absouletely. If this does cause an auto immune disorder I'm guessing maybe its rhematic heart disease like- maybe via a different mechanism, but maybe antibodies are attacking heart valves- we don't know what the basis of the neurotoxicity is. I am very serious about this- you might be alright but I see best case ending up in the hospital with your valves replaced, worst case death, worst still- lingering on life support because of anoxic brain damage r/t poor tissue perfusion. I would say your better off on opiates, maybe bezos, but if you used opiates and decided to go IV your at an increased risk of endocarditis. make sure your dentist knows this.
If the liver is being damaged, whether autoimmune or otherwise, Hep C or a history of heavy drinking with elevated liver panel would be an absolute contrindication. You could theoretically treat with high dose prednisone or immusupressive drugs but the cure is worse than the disease and needs to be started prior and tapered (for the corticosteroids).
Non-selective beta blockers or combining lower doses of doxosin and metoprolol before taking might work but there could be untoward, uninteded effects that might negate this strategy. Actvity and maybe applying warm packs to the extrmities might help.
If platlet aggregation is a problem, poor blood flow to the extrmities would put you at risk for developing a DVT (blood clot in an extrmity- usually legs. Taking a small dose of aspirin (81-325 mg might be a good idea.)
This drug is starting to sound worse every second. Avoid redosing- go out with one or two doses and leave the rest at home, or with a friend, or buy it in smaller batches.
Amphetamines have this effect to some degree.
Watch for temperature spikes. Treat with Ice packs to the arm pits and back of the head if the temp gets above 100 F or 38 celsius.
Don't use:
If you have any type of heart disease.
If you have impaired liver or kidney problems
Diabetes Melitus
Seizure disorders
On a drug that increases the amount of serotonin or an MAOI in the last 2 weeks. Dont take this with ayahuasca.
Be aware that long term problems associated from using this drug might not appear until latter.
The degree of peripheral vasocontriction is worrisome. Quiting smoking isn't enough. Dancing might help and pumping and releasing fists, moving around arms. Plus heating pads. Iwould check my feet after a drone session as cuts/ blisters might put you at risk for infection.
If its an IGE mediated allergic reaction- benadryl might help, but that might have some untowrd effect.
Autoimmune disease are scarry- sometimes they can become permanent or semi permanent: think lupus, myasthenias Gravis, or Guillane-Barre.
I good way to check circulation is to push on your nail. If it takes more than 3 seconds for the color to come back then your circulation is impaired. But blusih limbs is a late respose.
Ask yourself- is the high worth a potential amputation, or permanent oragan damage?
Stick to coke, meth, or MDXX. They sound alot safer- until more is known about this drug. This is the wrong place probably to ask this but is the high superior to E or coke? Do you feel loved up- how are the empath/entactogenic properties? How does it compare?
I wouldn't use this until more is known. However, with the amount of people using the drug, the amount of side effects reported might be small relative to the number of people doing this. Unfortunately this is hard to quatify without carefully controlled studies.
Any dizziness, fainting, sortness of breath, chest pain, skipped beats, racing heart, spiking a temp, or feelings of impending doom- seek medical attention immediately, especially if illict batches are gonna be on the market- but the chinese have a track record of producing toxic products, in their grey area labs, who knows what the level of quality control is.
Its sad when people think a drug is ok just because its legal. Sometimes the illegal drugs are safer because they are time tested.Last edited:Disregard some of my earlier advice: It sounds like blusih hands, racing heart, and occasional palpitation are part of the symptoms of use, especially late in the session. Also read about comparisons to E:
http://www.bluelight.ru/vb/showthread.php?t=497376&highlight=mephedrone+subjective+effects&page=2
My question would be, and its slightly off topic but it might shed light on its toxicity- is there cross tolerance between MDMA and mephedrone. How about with MDA?
But the rest of my advice stands and it is based on non evidence based wide ass guessing from what I'm reading on BL.sackynut
Bluelighter
@jspun. in my subjective experience i prefer the high of mephedrone to that of MDMA or coke, or methamp or any amp for that matter. however EVERYONE is different, and there are plenty who will disagree with me. let me change that a little: i would prefer the MDMA high, if i could get high off it every day, not worry about health problems, and not lose too much to tolerance. and while mephedrone is obviously NOT safe, and one shouldnt do it every day, i would probably bet that daily chronic use of 4mmc is much safer than daily chronic use of MDMA for weeks at a time. the high it produced compared to its negative consequences i think makes it very attractive. that and the price....compared to street coke i would go with mephedrone any day.
the high seems to have a much higher serotonergic quality than other stims, but to be honest i think a lot of the high revolves around DA and NE, and that nice little SE boost just does the trick and makes it perfect. the meph high can be achieved many days in a row, something thats very hard to do with pure MDMA in my opinion (and yes ive done it.) which leads me to believe it awesome effects arent purely serotonergic. because even the "lovey dovey" feeling can be achieved a few days in a row...however it drops off after about 3 days and youre left purely with stimulation.
there is a cross tolerance with MDMA and MDA, but it doesnt seem as large as one would expect. plus how often, and long youve been doing mephedrone plays a roll. the longer you expend that serotonin the lesser effect of other enactogens will be.
jspun every paragraph of your posts makes me want to stop 4mmc completely more and more. kind of off topic, but do you know anything about the signs of kidney failure or kidney problems? i highly doubt i have any, but like 5 years back i had some elevated chemical levels on a blood test that showed possible future kidney issues.
this stuff also DESTROYS the inside of your nose. if i didnt stop when i did, i might have a collapse nose, or deviated septum right now.
thanks man your posts are extremely informative. i live in sd too
Sackynut
Their are two major test- BUN (Blood Urea Nitrogen) and Creatinine are the 2 ajor lab values- When creatine starts creepin up above 1.3 it becomes indicative of acute renal failure. People on Dialysis typically have creatinines that are like 3.5 range. GFR (Glomerular Filtration rate is another.) Signs of kidney disease is conectrated urine depite adequate hydration (oliguria), sometimes flank pain. The follow up diagnostic test is usally a renal ultrasound. Hope that helps as nephrology/dialysis mursing isn't my strong suite. Swelling (edema) could be another symptom.
If your diabetic tight glucose control is essential as is control of high blood pressure. Easy on the salt. Avoid alcohol. Drink lots of fluids unless you are on a fluid restricted diet.
Hope this helps and hope your kidneys turn out to be ok. I go for another physical ASAP- you could have been dehydrated or partying to hard that day or days or weeks before- anyway hopes this helps and your kidneys are ok.
Lady Codone
Bluelighter
- Joined
- Mar 6, 2008
- Messages
- 2,134
As a previous user who averaged 2 grams per week for 4 months, I don't think meph is necessarily "more toxic" than MDMA or any other serotonin-boosting empathogen. At least it doesn't feel like it to me. But feelings/opinions mean little when it comes to stuff like this. We need some major scientific studies ASAP, but you know how that goes. Ban first, ask questions 20 years later (see MDMA).
