How much has your life changed since you started bodybuilding?

[aanallein]

I wrote a big response and my browser ate it but essentially:

Scientific evidence contradicts everything you are saying El_Toro. The basics of nutrition and the body's biological responses are WELL understood. This isn't quack science. Insulin release after eating is well understood by scientists. The way the body digests, stores, and uses the various macro nutrients is also extremely well understood. Your ideas, while fine and work well for you, go against the body of scientific evidence available at this time.

The only time you want a big insulin spike is during / post work out. Eating 1-2k calories at a sitting is going to produce an insulin spike. Doing so 3 times a day is going to have your blood sugar all over the place especially if you throw an intense work out into the mix at any point in that schedule.

Having an understand and control over your blood sugar level and insulin release is a pretty big part of bodybuilding/weight training if you want to go anywhere with it.

 

[aanallein]

And your last post doesn't even make any sense. BigBenn asked you for something simple - an example of one of these meals you speak of and he said he didn't think he could eat it.

A 1500 calorie breakfast of clean food is massive. Please give an example because I'd like to see what it is.


Then you dropped it down to 700 which btw, 700 x 6 = 4200... which would be right on target for what BB probably aims for.

 

[El_Toro]

I wrote a big response and my browser ate it but essentially:

Scientific evidence contradicts everything you are saying El_Toro. The basics of nutrition and the body's biological responses are WELL understood. This isn't quack science. Insulin release after eating is well understood by scientists. The way the body digests, stores, and uses the various macro nutrients is also extremely well understood. Your ideas, while fine and work well for you, go against the body of scientific evidence available at this time.

The only time you want a big insulin spike is during / post work out. Eating 1-2k calories at a sitting is going to produce an insulin spike. Doing so 3 times a day is going to have your blood sugar all over the place especially if you throw an intense work out into the mix at any point in that schedule.

Having an understand and control over your blood sugar level and insulin release is a pretty big part of bodybuilding/weight training if you want to go anywhere with it.

You could not be more wrong. You do realize the field of sport nutrition still has a lot of tapped potential, and that most nutritional research is made on average populations, and then paralellisms are drawn for athletes/bodybuilders?

And how the body manages and stores nutrients is not well understood at all. Look at leptin, it was discovered not that long ago (1994) and it created a major fuzz amongst the scientific community, We are just starting to understand its role in obesity and body composition. Couple that with how most of the bodybuilding nutrition information is absed upon quackery and n=1, and you have a bunch of believers who eat every two hours and "spike" (as you say) insulin pre/post workout.

I suggest doing some reading at mindandmuscle or bodyrecomposition. You will be surprised at how, despite so much data, little is still known in practical terms.

 

[El_Toro]

And your last post doesn't even make any sense. BigBenn asked you for something simple - an example of one of these meals you speak of and he said he didn't think he could eat it.

A 1500 calorie breakfast of clean food is massive. Please give an example because I'd like to see what it is.


Then you dropped it down to 700 which btw, 700 x 6 = 4200... which would be right on target for what BB probably aims for.

He did not ask for an example, he said he'd like to see. It does make sense, only that you just are bro's with the moderator, you know, cos mods say the real shit. He is actually causing the confusion, since what he says is not what I said.

1000 calorie breakfast:

6 boiled eggs (about 500 calories)
Two scoops of protein in semi-skim milk
Add in some fruit, veggies and/or oats, since you have about 200 calories left, which can easily be two bananas or 50 grams of oats.

Is that healthy enough for you?

And I went down on calories, because you two are scared of eating 1000 calories in one sitting.

 

[aanallein]

That's still only 1k calories though. Not to nitpick but that's only 3000 calories per day.

And I went down on calories, because you two are scared of eating 1000 calories in one sitting.

No you went down because you don't eat as much as you claimed to begin with. I'm not scared of your diet I simply think its a stupid approach and defies basic logic.


And I agree with BigBenn because he makes sense in this situation. I'm definitely not agreeing with him merely because he's a mod (of a different forum btw). I'm sure we don't see eye to eye on steroid use amongst other things.

 

[El_Toro]

That's still only 1k calories though. Not to nitpick but that's only 3000 calories per day.



No you went down because you don't eat as much as you claimed to begin with. I'm not scared of your diet I simply think its a stupid approach and defies basic logic.

I eat about 3000 calories a day, since I am interested in keeping my weight stable.

Well, what can I say, other than to browse the websites I mentioned above. There is plenty of research there, experts who actually talk the talk and walk the walk, and you will find ,at the very least, amusing to see how much of what you believe to be nutritional wisdom is debunked.

 

[aanallein]

Maybe you should read some of the stuff there yourself?
This seems to back up what me and BigBenn are saying:

http://www.mindandmuscle.net/mindandmuscle/magpage.php?artID=98

 

[nickels]

Anybody who says "I'm stronger than you are" on an internet forum or otherwise tries to put themselves over another person they have no way of knowing anything about is - quite frankly - a jackass.

Quoted for emphasis.





What are you going to do next, Toro, challenge people to a fight? Fucking loser.

 

[rolls]

And thats where I lost respect for your opinion.

We will agree to disagree.

I think what el_toro is trying to say in a round about way is that you don't necessarily have to eat 6 meals a day and put such a big focus on diet to get big. Sure it is easier and will definitely help, but without it you can still get decent results.

I used to do the whole diet and plan meals etc, it definitely did work well. However now I'm pretty slack and just maintaining my muscle mass with 1-2 gym sessions a week (3 day split) so my muscles don't see much action, my diet is pretty average with 3 meals a day usually and I'm still gaining in some areas.

nickels - That really isn't nesessary and doesn't help anyone.

 

[dada]

Well how has my life changed... I have no neck! Lifes pretty different without a neck. People won't stop looking at me and calling me freek. What good is tearing phone books in half with nobody to do it in front of. I have a vein in my arm the breadth of a garden hose. Such well developed quads and hip flexors that i can't see my genitals.

 

[nickels]

nickels - That really isn't nesessary and doesn't help anyone.

My bad.

 

[El_Toro]

Quoted for emphasis.





What are you going to do next, Toro, challenge people to a fight? Fucking loser.

Hey little fairy, I got called out for being fatter and less muscular, I posted my pics and proved him wrong. Then I said I am stronger than he is, because I am sure I am. What, I can't call people when I get called?

 

[El_Toro]

I think what el_toro is trying to say in a round about way is that you don't necessarily have to eat 6 meals a day and put such a big focus on diet to get big. Sure it is easier and will definitely help, but without it you can still get decent results.

I used to do the whole diet and plan meals etc, it definitely did work well. However now I'm pretty slack and just maintaining my muscle mass with 1-2 gym sessions a week (3 day split) so my muscles don't see much action, my diet is pretty average with 3 meals a day usually and I'm still gaining in some areas.

nickels - That really isn't nesessary and doesn't help anyone.

Yeah, that is what I am trying to get across. You can make just as much progress with a standard nutritious 3 meal a day regimen. The most important thing is HARD training. Many people worry more about lifting forks and spoons than lifting real weights.

Now, if you are a competitive bodybuilder (that means, you compete), things differ. But for average joe's who just want to look good (which is all of us here it seems), the way you arrange your nutrition plan makes little difference as long as you cover the basics.

 

[El_Toro]

Maybe you should read some of the stuff there yourself?
This seems to back up what me and BigBenn are saying:

http://www.mindandmuscle.net/mindandmuscle/magpage.php?artID=98

What are you trying to prove with that mirror poser?

Whilst I respect Kelly Baguett (I have exchanged emails with him), he is known for making stuff which is unknown (don't mean it is wrong). There are no references to what he claims (duh!), and what he claims is something HE claims. There are many other experts who say other things, amongst one, that somatyping/phenotyping is something pulled out of someone's arse. Of course different people utilize different macro nutrients differently, otherwise in today's world we would all either be fat slobs or lean folks.

I dont understand why you post such link, proves nothing. Next time try harder. And yes, there is plenty to read in such emagazine and forums. 100% reccomended.

 

[aanallein]

Are you psychotic? I provided an article from the very website you linked that proved you wrong.

Honestly you're just going on ignore right here right now. You have personal issues and shouldn't be allowed access to an internet forum.

 

[El_Toro]

Are you psychotic? I provided an article from the very website you linked that proved you wrong.

Honestly you're just going on ignore right here right now. You have personal issues and shouldn't be allowed access to an internet forum.

Huh? There are hundreds of articles in that website, some bad and most food. Overall it has a good amount of knowledge which you could use.

And I was talking about references. If you read my previous posts, I say that there is hardly any relevant nutritional research on athletes and less on bodybuilders. You just go and put some article with no references. Woaaa, Kelly wrote it, that means I will believe what he says 100%.

Here is a proper article, with references and all, from the same website.

http://www.mindandmuscle.net/mindandmuscle/magpage.php?artID=999125

Me psychotic? Haha At least I do not go around posting 1000 pics of me and my arms, son. Go get a back, chest and legs and then call yourself a bodybuilder. Enough said.

 

[aanallein]

Not sure why I'm replying but here we go,

You've insulted every single person in this thread on a personal level instead of backing up your claims with hard evidence. Instead of debunking the claims made in the article I posted, which came from the first page of the site you asked me to visit, you attacked the author and then you attacked me.

As for you insults,
I've posted pictures of myself in the Nudie thread, the 4 month challenge thread, and in my gallery. I think I've posted around 10 pics in a 4 month period (had some of my back and chest too)? You've posted some pics lately too if I'm not mistaken.

Why am I a poser? I've been lifting for 4 years casually and for 5 months with a lot of dedication. I've gained tremendously in that time period and am able to lift about twice as much - atleast - on every lift. I don't recall a single time ever calling myself a bodybuilder and I certainly don't have any misconceptions about myself - I have a long way to go to reach my goals. But I am bodybuilding on a daily basis and thus, I am a bodybuilder whether you wish to call me a poser or not.

You are the only person who's ever given me any kind of negative feedback whatsoever. Unsurprisingly you've insulted nearly everybody you've come across in this thread as well. Maybe you should keep your hostilities and resentments to yourself? If you have preconceived notions or beliefs about nutrition and building go ahead and post them but instead of insulting people who disagree with you, why not post some studies instead or at least some form of logical explanation of why your approach would superior to another. Also, linking to mindandmuscle.com and giving nothing further, and then making the broad claim that "most of the stuff is trash on that site anyways" does very little good in proving your points.


Anyways I think you're a knowledgeable person and you certainly put work into your body. Your abdominals are really defined which is something I'm working on. However, insulting people you don't know over an internet forum makes you look like a loser and invalidates everything you have to say immediately. When I asked if you were psychotic I wasn't insulting you by the way, it was a legit question. You provided the very source I linked back to you and you said was trash. So I had to ask if you had all your marbles or not after that.

Anyways, goodluck.

 

[Charlie Brown]

1000 calorie breakfast:

6 boiled eggs (about 500 calories)
Two scoops of protein in semi-skim milk
Add in some fruit, veggies and/or oats, since you have about 200 calories left, which can easily be two bananas or 50 grams of oats.

Dude I aint gonna eat that breakfast in the morning...all I eat is a vegemite roll or maybe a bowl off cereal...maybe 2 fried eggs sometimes...Who can be fu**ked eatting that much or who has the time !!!

for lunch i eat a roll with some meat and salad and then have a big ass dinner...cos i dont have time too prepare all these meals...

I still hit the gym everyday and still make small gains....it is true you dont have too eat 6 meals a day to make gains...but im sure if i did eat properly i would make much BETTER gains

now dont tell me you seriously eat 6 eggs for breakfast everyday? !!!, i aint gonna eat 6 eggs in one sitting just too put on a bit off muscle!!! but then again i weigh 70kg but at 78kg...6 eggs every morning ...fuck thats piggish !

 

[rolls]

now dont tell me you seriously eat 6 eggs for breakfast everyday? !!!, i aint gonna eat 6 eggs in one sitting just too put on a bit off muscle!!! but then again i weigh 70kg but at 78kg...6 eggs every morning ...fuck thats piggish !

I used to eat 5 whole eggs, its not that much and if you are trying to get the protein intake up and its a good way to do it.

 

[thesean001]

i feel like its too late for me to even try and im only 17.

my body is brittle and weak from meth and im depressed as hell and anxious and i cant force myself to do anything. im an IV opiate addict and take benzos daily too.

i feellike its too late for my body...

smoking so much cigs / meth / whatever ruined my ability to run.

2 years ago i could runa 5:54 mile er so and now its like a 13 minute mile going all out cause i just cant breathe.