Stimulants How is Levo-amphetamine so powerful and nasty?

[ErgicMergic]

So, I took my first bit of Adderall today. I've been taking Dexedrine for the last 6 weeks, on (15-17.5mg/day) and off (2.5-5mg/day), but mostly dosing every day for my severe inattentive ADD, and using Ephedrine for the last year at 12.5-50mg/day about 15 days a month.

I usually supplement my Dexedrine dosage with 12.5mg Ephedrine and caffeine, and this causes absolutely no problems.

My question is, how the hell is L-amp so powerful compared to Ephedrine? I only took 6mg Adderall (cut a 30mg IR into 4 unequal pieces and used a scale) with a 10mg Dex Spansule. This equates to only 1.25mg L-amp, but I feel so nasty. I got noticeable jaw clenching and leg cramps in the shower 20 minutes after, and food tasted nasty and I felt full so quickly. This never happens on Ephedrine or caffeine. Is ephedrine more CNS active than L-amp?

What makes Ephedrine so much weaker than L-amp? I feel as if 1.25mg L-amp is equivalent to 20-25mg Ephedrine. How do people abuse Adderall without getting heart attacks? They should really remove the L-amp in the Adderall formation and replace it with Ephedrine, at a 10:1, Ephedrine:L-amp replacement ratio.

They can call it Dexephedrine! (name credits: Tricomb)

 

[tricomb]

All I gotta say is fuck levoamphetamine. That product could never make a pharmaceutical company money due to the side effects, that's probably why they only make adderall 25% l-amp, that or a patent renewal.

 

[kokaino]

Dexedrine all the way! Best pharmaceutical stimulant. Beats out even Desoxyn.

 

[MaltLiquor]

Levoamphetamine has a much weaker dopaminergic effect and a higher affinity for releasing norepinephrine than dextroamphetamine.

D-amp is more of a CNS stimulant while l-amp can hit the peripheral nervous system hard.

I would definitely not recommend using ephedrine with adderall and I wouldn't recommend it with Dexedrine either honestly. I myself used to be an ephedrine connoisseur but that shit can seriously wreak havoc with your heart.

For me, d-amp (dexedrine) has a more relaxed clear headed stimulation while adderall preperations make me feel like a tweaked out p.o.s.

 

[PriestTheyCalledHim]

Maybe you're ultra-sensitive to it? I was prescribed Adderall for ADD and I took it in the low dose I was prescribed. I didn't get leg cramps from it, however I did get dry mouth, and I'd grind my teeth. Food didn't taste any different but I had to force myself to eat since I was on a stimulant. An odd side effect that would sometimes happen to me was that I'd actually fall asleep while on it. It didn't happen all the time but it sometimes would. I've never taken ephedrine but I've read how it's not good to take regularly or with stimulants.

 

[Cone]

I preferred the small amount of l-amp in adderall to get my body amped up in lower doses. At higher doses it becomes too much.. and pure d-amp is superior.

 

[Psychonauticunt]

Dexedrine all the way! Best pharmaceutical stimulant. Beats out even Desoxyn.

Agreed. I'd go as far as saying the best stimulant of all - or the one I would always take, given a choice. I don't like any of the tweaky effects levo seems to add to the picture; dextroamphetamine is just pure, clean, focused stimulation, with hardly any unpleasant side effects unless you dose too much. Also, I prefer amphetamine to methamphetamine in general, as I value my sleep. If I want to stay up, I can take more amphetamine.

 

[ErgicMergic]

Priest, yeah I find myself getting tired frequently on Dexedrine, and this is with a perfect sleep and diet. Some ADDers like Adderall more than Dexedrine since it doesn't get them as sleepy.

Cone, I seriously think L-amp is there as just a cut preventing abuse for non-ADDers, who regularly take more than 20+mg per dose. I can't even imagine 30mg of IR Adderall, that would feel so nasty. The only problem is that some recreational users like the L-amp "tweak" they get, making Adderall more popular than Dexedrine on the streets around here, lol

Psychonauticunt, Kokaino, agreed. Dexamp is perfect in my eyes. At therapeutic doses it doesn't last a long time, doesn't make you feel like you're "on drugs" like Adderall does, doesn't cause anxiety (actually anxiolytic to me), has no comedown, and is not hard on your cardiovascular system.

 

[tricomb]

It's just like levomethamphetamine, what they put in Vicks inhalers. The levo isomer of methamphetamine, purely symptomatic symtoms, no euphoria just CNS side effects.


And I have no idea how you guys hate on dextromethamphetamine, yeah, dextroamphetamine is alright but idk, I know I have a subjective experience but there's no way I could sleep on Dexedrine, but Desoxyn, it's not a problem at all and theres like no side effects compared to Dexedrine.

If I'm ever need a stimulant, I can't think of any situations where I'd pick Dexedrine over Desoxyn. Desoxyn can't be beat IMO.

 

[ErgicMergic]

We're all wired differently, tricomb. Personally, my anxiety is pretty mild, with no other mental conditions that can cause a surge of DA/NE, so my levels of norepinephrine are very low, being inattentively ADD.

This is why ephedrine worked so great for me before I discovered ADD meds, where to most people with moderate-severe anxiety (who have high baseline levels of NE naturally due to anxiety), ephedrine would just make them anxious: too high of a NE release with not enough DA release. People with moderate-severe hypertension also have naturally high levels of NE, and dislike Adderall.

You are very knowledgable in psychopharmacology, have a lot of experience with ADD meds, and are a cool guy imo, but you need to realize what works with your unique brain chemistry does not necessarily work for the different brain chemistry of others.

From what I've read, Desoxyn is terrible for inattentive ADD'ers, it just chills them out even more than usual and makes them overly sociable and lazy. Yes, Desoxyn can't be beat in your experience, but it can definitely be beat in the experiences of others. You should stop hating on Dexedrine when it's a perfect medication for plenty of people out there.

We're all trying to get to the same, balanced brain chemistry through the use of medications, we just have different ways of getting there.

 

[tricomb]

I'm not hating on Dexedrine, I love the medication (also desoxyn is partially metabolized into dexedrine) just not the side effects.

I have many psychiatric diagnoses so I'm sure there's some reason why desoxyn is good for me. Dexedrine makes me uncomfortably manic and worsens schizophrenia, desoxyn, Ironically, (well maybe its due to me taking very low doses but) it doesn't have much effect on my Schizophrenia.

 

[ErgicMergic]

Reading your post makes me grateful to live in a developed enough country to have every formulation and enantiomer of ADD medications like amp and MPH available to us. We are all different, and a "one size fits all" approach to psychopharmacology is not the way to go.

I'm not saying the US is the most amazing country in the world, but we are certainly lucky to have every single medication possible available to us, for better or for worse. Japan, for instance, has completely outlawed all sorts of amphetamines, whether it's prescription-obtained or not.

 

[tricomb]

yeah but they have all kinds of crazy benzos haha

 

[Epsilon Alpha]

Well there is a lot of reasoning behind the L-AMP in Adderall, and frankly with so many other amphetamine variations on the market I'm glad its there. If it doesn't work for you try to switch medications.
Adderall will also likely have the greatest effects on memory acquisition for what its worth. L-AMP binds to some targets D-AMP doesn't which explains its strangely dissimilar subjective effects.

 

[DroneLore]

I always thought l-amp was inactive because I find adderall less potent than dexedrine. I agree with the earlier poster who lamented adderall's greater popularity. pure dextroamphetamine is where its at!!

 

[tricomb]

Well there is a lot of reasoning behind the L-AMP in Adderall, and frankly with so many other amphetamine variations on the market I'm glad its there. If it doesn't work for you try to switch medications.
Adderall will also likely have the greatest effects on memory acquisition for what its worth. L-AMP binds to some targets D-AMP doesn't which explains its strangely dissimilar subjective effects.

I've heard that it's only in there for patent reasons.

 

[freehugs]

Cone, I seriously think L-amp is there as just a cut preventing abuse for non-ADDers, who regularly take more than 20+mg per dose.

Adderall was originally made as a weight loss supplement (hence the leavo) and then switched to an ADHD medication when the company didn't want to re do their entire setup for a new chemical.

 

[Cloudy]

i honestly prefer having the 12.5% levo amp in the product. I've tried dex-amp alone, and it wasn't as beneficial for studying or getting high imo.

 

[Epsilon Alpha]

I've heard that it's only in there for patent reasons.

Well it increases NE release and activates hippocampal (did I just make a word there? spell check is shitting a brick) gene expression. Its not for everyone but it does make a llot of sense on the biological side to have a preperation on the market for it.

Google L-amphetamine and MS for more info.

PS: Shire if you're reading this could you please make a Vyvanse preperation with L-amphetamine in it? Plweeeeese?

 

[tricomb]

spell check is pretty much only good for layman's terms IME.

Interesting read though, as always, thanks EA.