How do YOU determine which is a HARDER drug?

[Bob Loblaw]

Well I guess I didnt understand what you were saying..........you were talking about strawberries and the like and addiction and we are in a how do you rate drug hardness thread.

Maybe a better question I could put to you is to ask you to explain why you dont rate drugs hard or soft? There are a lot of other aspects of drugs other than addiction.

Oh, I was comparing different foods and different drugs.

I don't believe that drugs are hard or soft because the drugs are not responsible for most of the damage to one's body from drug use (sharing needles, improper synthesis, excessive/unknown doses, frequent use, addiction, using money to snort things, etc.). While drugs may cause more harm to body than others, I don't believe that with responsible, limited use the effects are terrible. It is not the drugs that are hard or soft, it is people's actions and behaviors with the drugs that determine whether they are hard or soft, and that is completely dependent on each person.

For example, I might try heroin, a drug considered by many to be hard, and hate it. I might then try weed, and love it. I might smoke everyday, get fired for failing drug tests and being high at work, and spend all my money on weed. Then THC and other cannibinoids are the hard drugs for me, while they are not considered very hard for most people.
Does that make more sense?

 

[Tab]

While drugs may cause more harm to body than others, I don't believe that with responsible, limited use the effects are terrible.

Unfortunately the majority of people who do drugs like heroin, meth or crack don't use them in moderation. It's a safe bet to assume there aren't many casual heroin, meth or crack users out there; at least compared to how many people abuse those drugs and have it affect their life in a negative way.

Walk around in a slum part of town or go into a police station. Ask which drugs the majority of people are dependent on and which have the most consequences for extended use. I guarantee people will tell you drugs like weed and ecstasy are on the lower end of the spectrum.

 

[perputuousdreamer]

In my own opinion of rating drugs soft to hard it has to be how things have messed with my mind.

From soft to hard they would be:-

Alcohol
Cocaine
Speed
MDMA
E/whatever is in the pill
Mushrooms
Ketamine
LSD

(I would have added crack somewhere, but I was off my nut on K at the time and as its the only time I've done it, I dont know what my mind state would be like doing it sober, so I've left it out)

 

[Care]

It is not the drugs that are hard or soft, it is people's actions and behaviors with the drugs that determine whether they are hard or soft, and that is completely dependent on each person.

I'm going to have to disagree. Some drugs are much more easy to get addicted to than others.

In a perfect world everyone would have total self-control and drug addiction would not exist because you could stop whenever you decided to. No one would ever cross the line from recreational use to habitual use. Sadly this is not the world we live in.

If two people who are exactly the same in every way do drugs every day for a week, one on caffeine and the other on methamphetamine the one doing meth has a much higher chance for addiction. Certain drugs have a much higher addiction potential and are physically addictive. They are therefore harder drugs because of the increased effect they have on your body and your lifestyle, at least that’s the way I see it.

 

[aBakes]

Weed
Shrooms
LSD
MDMA
Alcohol
Cocaine
H
Meth

 

[Harrisboy42]

Heroin, MDMA and Marijuana are all chemicals. However some are chemically addictive and some are psychologically addictive. Some have large side-effects in the short term and some don't.

I see where you are coming from, all chemicals have the potential to be addictive. The primary difference between them in terms of addiction is they can make a person addictive to the chemical, or the emotions/feelings they bring. Something that isn't physically addictive is a lot less dangerous or "hard" than one that is.

That's how you split them, imo (and again, in my opinion ). Good discussion point Bob!

Edit: Marijuana itself isn't a chemical strictly speaking...it's a plant lol. Just noting before any smart arse comes in and points it out lol

It is a plant. But there are chemicals within the plant, that is what you get high from, not the plant matter.

 

[OhEmGee]

I don't have a hard and fast rule but my considerations are:

Ease of addiction
Ease of overdose
Aftermath (comedown and the days following)

I use a very similar scale, with a few additional factors:
Potential for Psychological Damage
Physically Addictive Properties

Drugs with physically addicting properties such as cocaine, meth, tobacco, herion etc. are up at the top of the 'hard' list. Drugs with little physical dependency like marijuana and ecstasy are down near the 'soft' side of the spectrum. Mental/emotional dependency is on a user-to-user basis, so I don't bother to calculate it in. Most people don't have withdrawl from weed, but God help you if you talk to a quitting smoker who hasn't conquered the three day hump.
Any psychedelics like LSD and shrooms I place closer to the 'hard' end of the spectrum than most, because bad trips can be extremely psychologically damaging. Ecstasy can potentially make you hallucinate, but only in very high doses (assuming it's MDMA, not a mix of MDMA and who knows what else,) and it's easier to pull someone out of a bad trip on E than say, LSD (from personal experience.)
I suppose the list would go something like this, from soft to hard: Marijuana, Ecstasy, Alcohol, Mushrooms, LSD, Tobacco, Cocaine, Heroin, Meth. (Obviously, I'm skipping a few in the interest of time.)

 

[kILLzy]

from soft to hard: Marijuana, Ecstasy, Alcohol, Mushrooms, LSD, Tobacco, Cocaine, Heroin, Meth.

I agree with the order of this.

 

[woodpecker]

I know plenty of people who have/had a 20 year love affair with MDMA but no one whose stuck it out that long on crack or meth. I imagine there are quite a few junkies whom have been using consistently for 20 years but they are probably on a economic order above me.

And potheads do suck IMO. I grew up with two and then married one.

So...

hardest to softest: (based on mind/body damage)
Solvents
MDMA
Prescrition painkillers
OTC pain meds
Vitamins (in the hands of 3 year olds, look at the stats)
Heroin
Cannabis (mind only)
Meth
Crack
Powder coke

 

[Bob Loblaw]

^So crack, meth, coke, and heroin would all be safer drugs to use once a day than some vitamins?

And cannabis is more damaging mentally than meth, crack, or coke? And next time I have a headache I should snort some heroin because it's less damaging than some hydrocodone? Can you please go into greater detail on your list? Because tbh, it makes no sense to me.

 

[kILLzy]

^So crack, meth, coke, and heroin would all be safer drugs to use once a day than some vitamins?

And cannabis is more damaging mentally than meth, crack, or coke? And next time I have a headache I should snort some heroin because it's less damaging than some hydrocodone? Can you please go into greater detail on your list? Because tbh, it makes no sense to me.

I'm pretty sure he just got it backwards. Maybe Softest to Hardest rather than Hardest to Softest?

 

[RexHunt]

Interesting find Rex............can you provide a link please and also credit the site it came from?

Sorry for the delay - been busy at work and also only been scanning ED quickly lately..

Original Site - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cocaine

Link for Pic -http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/9/9c/Rational_scale_to_assess_the_harm_of_drugs_(mean_physical_harm_and_mean_dependence).svg

I'll compile a response to this thread tomorrow, I'm extremely scattered at the moment.

 

[Bob Loblaw]

I'm pretty sure he just got it backwards. Maybe Softest to Hardest rather than Hardest to Softest?

Even if he did get it backwards, it still makes no sense to me.

 

[ThaiDie4]

Sorry, bringing back a really old post.... i was going to ask this, but decided to give the search engine a whirl.

I would define a "hard" drug as the emotional and physical impact that it has on a person. Addiction plays in as well. But I think you have to factor all 3 of those.

Meth and tobacco, for instance, both have the potential to be highly addictive. However, you don't hear of people robbing their grandmothers blind to pay for cigerettes or losing all their friends to a tobacco addiction. I think some drugs just have a way of changing you as a person, and those are the "hard" drugs.

Thats just IMHO but I'm not very expierenced with drugs so my perspective is from seeing the affects of people that I know.

 

[freedomthroughchem]

This is a very interesting question that deserves extreme respect. As a young kid being taught that drugs are "bad" noone really differentiated the difference between the difference in severity of drugs. Many people would consider Lsd a hard drug because it alteres perception far more than cocaine does but in the end cocaine will stop your heart 1 million times quicker. I would rank from softest to hardest....

1) Cannabis
2)Lsd/Mushrooms/Mescaline
3)Mdma
4)Ketamine
5)Alcohol
6)cocaine
7)Heroin
8) Meth

Although mdma or lsd may take you "Farthur out" than alcohol or heroin", Most people have little desire to take mdma or lsd everyday. While drugs like alcohol and heroin can easily lead to daily troublesome habits. How many peple do you see in rehab or intervention who are lsd or Mdma addicts? Although I have heard reports of mdma addicts.

 

[royksopp]

Source- thedea.org

 

[smoking-aces]

Hey this is a really interesting thread, and I think determing how hard a drug is I judge it by looking at several factors:

1. Toxicity
How bad is it for the physical, emotional and mental state of the user.
2. Intoxication
How much a person becomes 'fucked up'
3. Addiction/Dependance potential
How easy it is to become addicted, (physical and psychological)
4. Severity of Withdrawal symptoms
How dangerous and uncomfortable withdrawals may be.
5. Acute effects compared to chronic effects
Does the substance produce significant harm after first time use, or after 200 times?

In this case my list would be from soft to hard:

Marijuana
Shrooms
MDMA
LSD
Codeine/Hydrocodone
Ketamine
DXM
Oxycodone/Morphine
Amphetamines
Benzodiazepines
Cocaine (snorted)
Alcohol
Methamphetamine (excluding IV and smoked)
PCP
Datura/Belladonna and other delieriants
Cocaine (IV)
Crack Cocaine
Methamphetamine (IV / smoked)
Heroin
Any RC with extremely limited human use

 

[ebola?]

I find the hard/soft drug distinction woefully imprecise.
We can think of a drug's 'hardness' along the following dimensions (plus whatever you guys add):

propensity for compulsive redosing
propensity to elicit physical dependence (reflected by severity of withdrawal)
difficultly in ceasing overusage
(the above three are all aspects of addictiveness)
neurotoxicity
general bodily toxicity with chronic usage
risk of immediate overdose

Note that MDMA, IMO, tends to lack addictiveness, and there's little risk of acute overdose, but it scores rather high in terms of neurotoxicity and general toxicity.

So MDMA is a mixed case. It's a lot easier with drugs that are clearly hard along all these dimensions (eg, classical stimulants with a rapid ROA) or soft along all of them (eg, LSD).

ebola

 

[Gormur]

Source- thedea.org

LOL! People going to emergency for marijuana? So they're high and start freaking thinking something is wrong with them? Never heard of that in my life...8) Leave it up to the dea to come up with some bullshit like this.

 

[Gormur]

This is a very interesting question that deserves extreme respect. As a young kid being taught that drugs are "bad" noone really differentiated the difference between the difference in severity of drugs. Many people would consider Lsd a hard drug because it alteres perception far more than cocaine does but in the end cocaine will stop your heart 1 million times quicker. I would rank from softest to hardest....

1) Cannabis
2)Lsd/Mushrooms/Mescaline
3)Mdma
4)Ketamine
5)Alcohol
6)cocaine
7)Heroin
8) Meth

Although mdma or lsd may take you "Farthur out" than alcohol or heroin", Most people have little desire to take mdma or lsd everyday. While drugs like alcohol and heroin can easily lead to daily troublesome habits. How many peple do you see in rehab or intervention who are lsd or Mdma addicts? Although I have heard reports of mdma addicts.

heroin is much safer than meth, mdma, or cocaine...maybe even alcohol toxicity-wise.