Detox Hallucinogens for Withdrawals -+-+- Your Opinions, Please.

[urselonthewildone]

Hi. Haven't actually posted here in a loooooong time. So long, in fact, that I cannot recall my initial account details and had to make a new one. So, sorry about that.

Anyways, been experimenting with drugs since just out of highschool, on and off, did a lot of stuff in my 20s when I wasn't addicted and stuff was readily available through the mail by various means, pretty much slowly fell down the opioid addiction rabbit hole and haven't had a good time, let alone a meaningful trip in the past 10 years or so. I'm 35 now. And, to be quite frank I am quite simply, done.

I've been done before. Hell, I was even clean for a few months last year. But when I got home I relapsed hard. Always told myself I would slowly lower my dose of subutex or Suboxone until I was free and clear and, instead of doing that, I had them change my wife's prescription (which we were both surviving off of) to pills instead of strips so I could abuse them even further. And then, inevitabley, because of my massive habit I would take too many and we would run out before we could fill her script again, and then either suffer withdrawals or go back to Blues.

It did not help that these generic pills had more filler in them than the ones I used to order online. Quickly gunked up my nose snorting them to the point I was constantly sniffling and could feel my nose becoming damaged. And yet, I couldn't stop .....

I don't know why my brain works the way it does and I hate that sometimes but I always knew to REALLY QUIT you need to be in the proper headspace. And I was just never there. The thing that finally did it was my dealer wasting 4 entire days of my life waiting on her to show up, continually telling my neurotic ass she'd be ready in just one more hour. All I did during that time was sit and wait and do nothing. For 4 WHOLE DAYS!

When she finally did show up, I had a good night with her Blues and that was enough for me. As the movies say, there are last hits and there are last hits. And I feel pretty good going out on that one.

We've missed my wife's appointment so now we don't really have any options but to go cold turkey. I feel so stupid. Why do I have to push myself into a corner to actually get away from this? I had YEARS to do it sensibly! But, whatever. I'm done. I am ready.

I can take the sickness and the weakness. The hardest part is the rampant insomnia. THAT I can barely deal with. But we have some hydroxizine and some trazodone, so hopefully that will help. But I've been thinking. I still have a somewhat decent stash of chemicals from my last order, stuff that I just never got around to trying. And, looking into it there is some scientific evidence of Hallucinogens being able to help with withdrawals.

Most of us know about Iboga but that is usually to help you break your addiction, not help you with the symptoms. Or, so I thought. But the research shows it may help. The paper I read from last year specifically said that Psilocybin might be worth looking into but I can only work with what I have.

Does anyone think this is worth trying? Or am I just the world's biggest idiot to think one drug might help the issues another has caused?

I have some 4-ho-mipt fumarate, 3-meo-pcp, I think I have one VERY STRONG hit of acid, and some 2C-E.

I also still have some DPT but after a life altering experience with it, I think I'm good, lol. Not that I didn't enjoy it, I just don't think there is more for me to learn there. I feel somewhat similar about the 2C-E.

Did a lot of 2C-E back in the day and had my fill to boot. But it is familiar. And maybe I could use a little chat with an old friend right about now.

So, what does everybody think? Which one is the best option? Or is so little known that if I did it, I'd be doing it for science as much as myself?

tl;dr:
I am interested in trying to cope with my withdrawal symptoms by taking one of a couple of Hallucinogens I have laying around that you can find a few paragraphs back. What should I do?

 

[neversickanymore]

Read Naked Lunch.. i pretty much agree with his take.

They may help with eventually treating addiction.. but likely literally would likely be utter Hell during opiate withdrawals.

 

[neversickanymore]

look at this though

P

Recovery Post in thread 'Painless Opiate Withdrawal using 1 shot sublocade'

Nov 24, 2025

I can voucher for this twice, cause I mistakenly relapsed without the proper tools in place when I tried recovery without treatment, going from Suboxone to the 300mg sublocade , I got the first then second shot and my desire to stay off opiates was stronger than my desire to do them and I can say no withdrawal symptoms whatsoever, the second time just recently I only got the one shot and never went back even though they want me on it for a year but I'm sorry I've already taken enough lumps I'm good thanks, thank you medical science for the life saving advancement. Highly recommend...

• Picklepete

• 

 

[urselonthewildone]

Yes, well. I have heard good things about Sublocade but without insurance that or any medicine seems so far away.

Even if our local MAT program were to take us back, it took weeks to get approved last time. As far as I can tell, I literally have no other options at this point.

 

[neversickanymore]

Right figure out the insurance.. you figured out the junk all the time you can figure this out… I would not even consider this and I’m over a decade down the road.. I’ll trips 4$ure but if I rememberer right he described it as literately “Hell”.

You can do this.. if i can anyone can.

Hell is quite the statement especially from him.

 

[Jnowhere]

Read Naked Lunch.. i pretty much agree with his take.

They may help with eventually treating addiction.. but likely literally would likely be utter Hell during opiate withdrawals.

Naked Lunch was unreadable. I still laugh when I hear the band name, Steely Dan.lol
Junkie was interesting and I still can't find it! It is in my house somewhere!

There was a Supreme Court case over it.

The movie was weird and I passed out during the first half of it.

I was going to say exactly that very last part, sort of. WD's and a bad trip. Better not have a gun around.

 

[neversickanymore]

Naked Lunch was unreadable. I still laugh when I hear the band name, Steely Dan.lol
Junkie was interesting and I still can't find it! It is in my house somewhere!

There was a Supreme Court case over it.

The movie was weird and I passed out during the first half of it.

I was going to say exactly that very last part, sort of. WD's and a bad trip. Better not have a gun around.

in a part he goes into the all the horrible ways he tried for opiate withdrawal.. nothing works and i’m pretty sure he states that trying psychedelics for opiate withdrawal was literal hell. Set and setting just think of worst case.. dropping acid in acute opiate withdrawal.. sounds like 14 2 10 of hell to me. It’s like something you would do to torture someone in an attempt to destroy their mind.

I disagree think Naked Lunch is really good.

edited after reflection

 

[Jnowhere]

It started off like I would expect from him( or his friend Jack kerouac). Then I read for a while and couldn't. When my sister( rip) was college age I gave to her.

She read it. I just have to get past his first and probably best book( I think Kerouac encouraged Williams s. Burroughs to write). Junky was great.
--------
I just found a book I never read: One Flew Over The Cuckoo's Nest. Ken Kesey. I saw the movie. Is the book any good? Have you read it. I just don't wanna waste my time.

Yeah, I know the stories, some; of that group of writers.

 

[neversickanymore]

yeah it’s pretty good.. i read/listen voraciously though.. i have listened to 557 titles in the last 4 years.. i get to listen to earbuds while i work.

Check out Shantaram if you haven’t yet. it’s cream imho.

 

[neversickanymore]

Better not have a gun around.

Very well stated..

 

[mr peabody]

Treating addiction with magic mushrooms

Psilocybin has been shown to help addicts, but will the stigma of drug addiction halt research?

by Jacqueline Ronson | INVERSE

Psilocybin, the substance that gives magic mushrooms their magic, is a drug with enormous potential. In recent years a new wave of research of therapeutic uses of psychedelics has risen, and early results are nothing short of astonishing.

A single dose of psilocybin, administered in a controlled environment with the support of talk therapy beforehand and afterwards, has reduced anxiety and depression in cancer patients, and cured smokers of their addiction. In a recent Johns Hopkins University study, 80 percent of heavy smokers treated with the drug were still cigarette-free six months after treatment. The best nicotine treatments available on the market today, on the other hand, have success rates of just 20 percent. A variety of conditions related to psychological distress — including addiction, obsessive compulsive disorder, anxiety, depression, and PTSD — have been alleviated, if not cured, by magic mushrooms.

Despite this, psilocybin remains a Schedule 1 controlled substance — by official definition, it has a high potential for abuse, is not useful as a medical treatment, and is not safe even when administered under doctor supervision.

There’s a groundswell, though, of doctors, researchers, therapists, enthusiasts, and activists who are pushing for legalization of psychedelics and acknowledgement of their potential for good. The good news is that these individuals and groups are dedicated to the cause, and committed to following through until they reach their goals. The bad news is that getting any new medical therapy through the regulatory hoops is a massive, expensive, time-consuming endeavor, and the hurdles are magnified many times over for psychedelic drugs.

The Heffter Research Institute is currently planning Phase 3 clinical trials for using psilocybin to ease anxiety and depression in patients with cancer. It’s a big undertaking, expected to cost millions of dollars and take several years. The money will be raised from multiple sources, including philanthropists and possibly crowdfunding, Dr. George Greer, co-founder of the institute, told Inverse in an email.

Pharmaceutical companies have no interest in psilocybin because it can’t be patented. Also, patients appear to have their symptoms go away for months or years after a single treatment, and it’s difficult to make money off a drug that does not require regular use.

The Phase 3 trials will involve hundreds of patients across the country. If they are successful, the Food and Drug Administration will be under a great deal of pressure to approve psilocybin for treatment of anxiety and depression in cancer patients. And the DEA will have to change the drug’s categorization under the Controlled Substances Act. But if you decide to go harvest some wild magic mushrooms, you could still go to jail.

“It will still be illegal to use outside of medical treatment, and FDA will have considerable authority to limit its use,” says Greer. “But there is no way to predict what those restrictions might be at this point.”

And if you want to use magic mushrooms to ease your addictions to nicotine, alcohol, and other substances? The day that you can get a prescription for that will likely one day come, and hopefully before you need psilocybin to treat your lung cancer-related depression. “Based on the surprisingly positive results from the pilot studies for alcohol and nicotine, I do believe it will,” says Greer.

In the clinical trials to date, doctors haven’t seen the adverse effects, like psychosis or “bad trips,” associated with psychedelic drugs like mushrooms and LSD. Part of the of the reason for that is likely how closely controlled the dosage and the environment are controlled. Patients receive counseling before the trip about what to expect and how to deal with scary things that may come up in their minds (the trick is to shine light on the scary thing, to see how it’s not really so scary, rather than turning to run away.) Before they receive the drug they are put in a comfortable environment where they can safely explore the darkest parts of their mind. The patient typically has access to a blindfold and some trippy, wordless music. And a trained medical professional is always on hand to help if they are needed. Afterwards, the patient receives counseling to help process their experience during the trip.

Many patients describe the experience on mushrooms as a highly spiritual experience — feeling at one with the universe or close to God. This maybe isn’t too surprising, given how our brains light up on hallucinogens.

Party drug MDMA is also inching closer to accepted medical use, though it works in a different way. Rather than getting lost in your own head, MDMA has been shown to work as an aid to psychotherapy, allowing the patient to connect to their own feelings, and their therapist, more easily.​

 

[mr peabody]

Ibogaine significantly reduces opioid withdrawal and cravings

by Eric Dolan | PsyPost

New scientific research provides more evidence that the psychedelic drug ibogaine can help treat opioid withdrawal and cravings. The new findings are reported in the Journal of Psychoactive Drugs.

Ibogaine a psychoactive substance found in the root bark of the African Tabernanthe iboga plant, which has been used in the shamanic rituals of the Bwiti religion in West Africa. The drug is outlawed in the United States and many other countries, but remains legally available in Mexico. The new research examined 50 patients addicted to heroin or prescription opioids who participated in a week-long ibogaine treatment program in Tijuana.

“As a lover of biology, spiritual experience, indigenous cultures, and consciousness I developed a curiosity and passion for psychedelic substances, as they perfectly intersect these interests. This led me to pursue formal education and training in psychiatric pharmacy as well as public health, which further inspired me to be involved in researching the utility of psychedelic substances in the treatment of illness,” explained study author Benjamin J. Malcolm of Western University of Health Sciences’ College of Pharmacy.

“Recent (and older) research suggests that many psychedelic substances have potential clinical benefits in a variety of psychiatric illnesses, although ibogaine is seemingly unique in its ability to interrupt opioid addiction,” he told PsyPost. “Given the epidemic of death and harm associated with opioids in the United States presently and limitations of current therapies in treating opioid use disorders it seems very timely to study ibogaine further.”

Malcolm and his colleagues found ibogaine treatment was associated with significant reductions in opioid cravings and withdrawal symptoms. Most of the patients (78 percent) did not exhibit clinical signs of opioid withdrawal 48 hours after receiving ibogaine.

“It seems that ibogaine can interrupt the underlying neurocircuitry of opioid use disorder while delivering a profound psychological experience that reinforces recovery efforts,” Malcolm explained to PsyPost. “In our study ibogaine appeared to be able to reduce both the physical signs and symptoms of opioid withdrawal as well as reduce cravings for opioids.”

“This means that ibogaine may simultaneously address both physical and psychological aspects of opioid use disorder, whereas other therapeutic agents for opioid use disorders address either physical aspects through continued opioid dependence (methadone, buprenorphine) or psychological aspects of addiction like craving (naltrexone), but do not address both and cannot be used together.”

“Furthermore, the psychedelic nature of ibogaine tends to induce a dream-like state in which many report autobiographical subjective experiences, like watching their life as a movie from the vantage point of an observer,” Malcolm continued. “They see the moments of hurt or traumas from the past that predisposed them for substance use and undergo an emotional processing that allows for resolution of the underlying pain.”

In the early 1960s, anecdotal reports surfaced that ibogaine could help defeat drug addiction, prompting some scientists to investigate the anti-addictive properties of the drug. But ibogaine became a Schedule I substance in the United States in 1970, severely limiting the research into the psychedelic drug’s potential.

“Ibogaine and other psychedelic substances that are deemed illegal by the U.S. federal government have demonstrated therapeutic potential, albeit mostly in preliminary studies and anecdotally. This means that many psychedelics are likely subjected to erroneous classification as it is part of the definition of an illegal substance that it has no medical utility.”

“The other piece of the government’s definition of an illegal substance is a high potential for abuse, which is also very questionable with psychedelics, particularly ibogaine that tends to produce less euphoria than others like LSD. This regulatory framework results in oppression of legitimate scientific inquiry, and ultimately hurts the public given epidemic harms of opioids as well as enormous therapeutic need for better treatments.”

However, the new research — like all studies — has limitations.

“There are some caveats to this study as well as many unanswered questions in ibogaine research,” Malcolm explained. “The largest caveat of this type of study is the research design. This study did not have a control group and participants were not randomized to treatment or placebo, which introduces potential biases that can skew results.”

“It was a chart review of participants that received ibogaine at one center and different centers may have different administration or dosing protocols or practices that could enhance or diminish the therapeutic or adverse effects so it’s unclear how generalizable or optimal the studied setting is in the treatment of opioid use disorder.”

“This study also only followed participants through the acute withdrawal phase so lacks information on relapse rates after opioid detoxification with ibogaine. However, there are some other small studies that have partially addressed longer term outcomes and overall appear promising.”

Ibogaine can also have potentially fatal side effects.

“There are cardiac safety concerns with ibogaine and there are some reports of death in the literature, even in clinical settings,” Malcolm said. “Factors that increase risk for adverse cardiac effects require further study (we have some clues) and a cautious approach to participant selection in research is advisable.”

“Some would argue that a drug with a risk of death is too risky to continue clinical research with, although the current mainstay of opioid use disorder treatment is methadone which has FDA black box warnings for addiction, abuse, and misuse as well as fatal respiratory depression (death due to not breathing).”

“Furthermore, opioid use disorder is a deadly illness with 115 deaths per day reported by the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC) for 2016 in the US. So it appears that due to the risk of death from both the illness and current treatments that in this example further research is favorable despite known cardiac safety concerns.”

“Overall, the current body of research would probably be sufficient in other areas of medicine to garner enthusiasm and funding for research, yet due to the stigmas associated with psychedelic substances as well as drug addiction (opioid use disorder), the approach has been to attempt prohibition of research,” Malcolm remarked.

“Studies with more stringent methods are costly, yet due to the illegal regulatory status of ibogaine, are unlikely to be paid for by government or pharmaceutical sponsors without further action such as re-scheduling to a controlled substance instead of an illegal one.”

Malcolm also cautioned that ibogaine should not be over-hyped as the solution to opioid addiction.

“While results are very promising, ibogaine is surely not a magic bullet for the treatment of opioid use disorder and is in experimental stages of drug development as a therapeutic entity. If ibogaine proves to be safe and effective in controlled trials then one possible treatment model could feature ibogaine as the experiential core of a larger treatment intervention that incorporates preparatory counseling/psychotherapy before and after ibogaine as well as residential or inpatient aftercare programming-care to give individuals the best chances at successful recovery.”

“This type of model would combine elements of successful psychedelic protocols from MDMA or psilocybin research with traditional rehabilitation programs used in substance use disorders.”

“I also think for this type of model to work that a fundamental shift away from the stigmatized conceptions society holds for substance use disorders as well as psychedelics are necessary to earnestly facilitate rehabilitation,” Malcolm added.

“As far as substance use disorders, we should also be investigating and aggressively intervening on societal drivers of substance use (isolation, loneliness, lack of spirituality or connectedness, boredom, lack of alternatives to drug use, physical or emotional pain), which would probably offer the greatest rewards for society in the prevention of drug use."

“Lastly, maybe a disclaimer: due to known risks of ibogaine and illicit status in the US, please do not try a home detoxification. Consult medical professionals if you have a problem with opioids. Nothing in this interview is meant to encourage illegal activity.”

http://www.psypost.org/2018/04/trea...-reduces-opioid-withdrawal-and-cravings-51041​

 

[paranoid android]

Treating addiction with magic mushrooms

Psilocybin has been shown to help addicts, but will the stigma of drug addiction halt research?

by Jacqueline Ronson | INVERSE

Psilocybin, the substance that gives magic mushrooms their magic, is a drug with enormous potential. In recent years a new wave of research of therapeutic uses of psychedelics has risen, and early results are nothing short of astonishing.

A single dose of psilocybin, administered in a controlled environment with the support of talk therapy beforehand and afterwards, has reduced anxiety and depression in cancer patients, and cured smokers of their addiction. In a recent Johns Hopkins University study, 80 percent of heavy smokers treated with the drug were still cigarette-free six months after treatment. The best nicotine treatments available on the market today, on the other hand, have success rates of just 20 percent. A variety of conditions related to psychological distress — including addiction, obsessive compulsive disorder, anxiety, depression, and PTSD — have been alleviated, if not cured, by magic mushrooms.

Despite this, psilocybin remains a Schedule 1 controlled substance — by official definition, it has a high potential for abuse, is not useful as a medical treatment, and is not safe even when administered under doctor supervision.

There’s a groundswell, though, of doctors, researchers, therapists, enthusiasts, and activists who are pushing for legalization of psychedelics and acknowledgement of their potential for good. The good news is that these individuals and groups are dedicated to the cause, and committed to following through until they reach their goals. The bad news is that getting any new medical therapy through the regulatory hoops is a massive, expensive, time-consuming endeavor, and the hurdles are magnified many times over for psychedelic drugs.

The Heffter Research Institute is currently planning Phase 3 clinical trials for using psilocybin to ease anxiety and depression in patients with cancer. It’s a big undertaking, expected to cost millions of dollars and take several years. The money will be raised from multiple sources, including philanthropists and possibly crowdfunding, Dr. George Greer, co-founder of the institute, told Inverse in an email.

Pharmaceutical companies have no interest in psilocybin because it can’t be patented. Also, patients appear to have their symptoms go away for months or years after a single treatment, and it’s difficult to make money off a drug that does not require regular use.

The Phase 3 trials will involve hundreds of patients across the country. If they are successful, the Food and Drug Administration will be under a great deal of pressure to approve psilocybin for treatment of anxiety and depression in cancer patients. And the DEA will have to change the drug’s categorization under the Controlled Substances Act. But if you decide to go harvest some wild magic mushrooms, you could still go to jail.

“It will still be illegal to use outside of medical treatment, and FDA will have considerable authority to limit its use,” says Greer. “But there is no way to predict what those restrictions might be at this point.”

And if you want to use magic mushrooms to ease your addictions to nicotine, alcohol, and other substances? The day that you can get a prescription for that will likely one day come, and hopefully before you need psilocybin to treat your lung cancer-related depression. “Based on the surprisingly positive results from the pilot studies for alcohol and nicotine, I do believe it will,” says Greer.

In the clinical trials to date, doctors haven’t seen the adverse effects, like psychosis or “bad trips,” associated with psychedelic drugs like mushrooms and LSD. Part of the of the reason for that is likely how closely controlled the dosage and the environment are controlled. Patients receive counseling before the trip about what to expect and how to deal with scary things that may come up in their minds (the trick is to shine light on the scary thing, to see how it’s not really so scary, rather than turning to run away.) Before they receive the drug they are put in a comfortable environment where they can safely explore the darkest parts of their mind. The patient typically has access to a blindfold and some trippy, wordless music. And a trained medical professional is always on hand to help if they are needed. Afterwards, the patient receives counseling to help process their experience during the trip.

Many patients describe the experience on mushrooms as a highly spiritual experience — feeling at one with the universe or close to God. This maybe isn’t too surprising, given how our brains light up on hallucinogens.

Party drug MDMA is also inching closer to accepted medical use, though it works in a different way. Rather than getting lost in your own head, MDMA has been shown to work as an aid to psychotherapy, allowing the patient to connect to their own feelings, and their therapist, more easily.​

A friend of mine who was a heavy smoker clompletely forgot that he smoked one night. He didnt smoke at all during that trip or that night at all actually

 

[4DQSAR]

I can only say that I've known a few people who found MXE to be an extremely useful tool in opioid detoxification.

I think I am correct in saying the the 'Detox 5' franchise used to use a ketamine/naltrexone cocktail in the past.

I am in no way asserting this is a safe option and of course physical dependence and psycholgical addiction are two entirely different things.

It may well be the case that after the fact psychedelics may help former opioid users to confront their addictions but I can't seem them being of value during withdrawal.