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Gun, drug texts feature in new Trayvon Martin shooting evidence

No... Not walk. I'm not sure what should happen.

I'm really not viewing the likely hood that he is or isn't a d-bag (Zimmerman)... But what happened at the point of discharge. Clearly at this point, his face and head were bloodied. I highly doubt a guy wanting to keep his job would draw first blood. Yes he may have been wrong to begin with... but that's not what I'm really worried about.

Trayvon shouldn't have attacked a guy who had a gun. And I doubt it was really Zimmerman's intention to kill the kid.

The justice won't be perfect in a situation like this. Life in prison would not be right.
 
Sounds like manslaughter at least to me. You kill someone, even if punched in the nose first, then you should get manslaughter yeah?
 
Not every murder case is one with a violent cold-blooded killer. If you get in a fist-fight with someone, and they fall and bang their head the wrong way, you could be charges with murder! In some cases it may get dropped down to manslaughter, but Zimmerman drew a gun and shot Trayvon Martin.

He was not commiting any crime. Zimmerman thought he looked suspicious. He chased Trayvon Martin and tried to detain him! Trayvon Martin didn't just start swinging at him when he casually walked up to him!

Whether or not Zimmerman is an "evil" man, I don't really know...but he shot and killed a 17 year old in a situation that was created by him!
 
Apparently he was repeatedly hit. And perhaps the threat was ongoing.

I'm not clear, was Zimmerman supposed to have a gun?

The best thing Trayvon could have done for himself, was turn and face his accuser. If Zimmerman had to chase him... why? And would that not to someone looking for it confirm or hint that they (Trayvon here) were up to no good? Do you run from a dog that is aggressive? I dont know... I haven't.

Is that what happened? Zimmerman wouldn't have tried to detain him forcibly (I don't see why at least) if Martin had stopped and talked?
 
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He was legally carrying the gun...I don't think it was part of his job as "security guy" for the community, a job he wasn't paid for, he was the only one that volunteered and they gave it to him.

Now, I live in a large apartment complex with about 12 buildings with 20 apartments in each building. All different types of people live here, and I'm sure if I wandered around right now, I could find at least one person that seemed suspicious. If I found someone I deemed suspicious, called the police, but then chased that person down, got in a fight with them, and then killed them with my gun because I was losing the fight, should I really just be allowed to walk free?! I really don't think it works that way!

If Trayvon Martin came up to George Zimmerman and launched an unprovoked attack on him and was pummeling him while he was on the ground, it would be a different story. But that's not what happened!

whether Zimmerman was racist or not is really not the issue as far as I'm concerned. It's the Sanford police department not initially charging him with a crime that's suspicious to me! It's almost implied that, "Well you saw a suspicious BLACK kid walking around, got in a scuffle with him and killed him, it could have happened to anyone!"....If it had been a white mother in her mid 30s that Zimmerman "killed in self-defense", he probably would have been charged with murder without a second thought! But because Trayvon Martin was a pot-smoking little hoodlum, it's understandable! That's the whole problem that a lot of people have with this case.
 
BlueHues said:
Now, I live in a large apartment complex with about 12 buildings with 20 apartments in each building. All different types of people live here, and I'm sure if I wandered around right now, I could find at least one person that seemed suspicious. If I found someone I deemed suspicious, called the police, but then chased that person down, got in a fight with them, and then killed them with my gun because I was losing the fight, should I really just be allowed to walk free?! I really don't think it works that way!
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not sure where you live but where i'm from you get called a snitch if you call the police...

I think the stand your ground statute could be argued in Trayvon's favor that he was defending himself though, and Zimmerman could easily go down for manslaughter..
 
BlueHues said:
He's walking home minding his own business, drinking Arizona Iced tea, and then some wanna be cop maniac confronts him and starts harassing him, in his own neighborhood! Fuck Zimmerman! You don't pull out a gun in a fist-fight!

Zimmerman was the instigator...the wanna be hero! If he was capable of minding his own fucking business, none of this would have happened!

It wasn't like two people having an argument about something real, it was Zimmerman running around like a fuckin nut-job harassing people living in the neighborhood! Fuck him, he deserves life in prison!

Edit: If I was walking home from the store back to my apartment complex and some guy ran up to me and said "What are you doing here?! don't leave the cops are coming!"...I would tell him to fuck off! If he laid hands on me and tried to stop me from walking away?! You bet your fucking ass I'd crank him right in the face!

so if I'm minding my own business, someone harasses me for no reason and then puts their hands on me and we end up in a fist-fight, he's justified in shooting and killing me? Because that's exactly what happened!!

It's the police's job to stop suspicious persons, and if the police stopped me, I'd politely answer their questions, give them my ID and then walk home afterward!

He had no right to question and try to detain Trayvon Martin! If he thought he was suspicious, he should have called the police and them do THEIR job! It's not HIS place as just a normal dude to police the neighborhood!

I know the type....and I hope he gets everything he has comin to him!
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This case infuriates me, and some of the replies on here infuriate me.

Luckily for me I do not have to bother writing a long post, since BlueHues has succinctly said exactly what I wanted to say.

I'll just add this: Arming yourself come with responsibility. You do not have the right to arm yourself, go around picking fights, and then shooting people when they in fact do fight. If this were the case, we could all eliminate anyone who irritates us by doing exactly that.
 
severely etarded said:
not sure where you live but where i'm from you get called a snitch if you call the police...

I think the stand your ground statute could be argued in Trayvon's favor that he was defending himself though, and Zimmerman could easily go down for manslaughter..
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I agree here. People talk about Zimmerman's right to self defense or to stand his ground. WTF? HE was the one aggression against Martin, putting Martin on the defensive, and trying to move Martin off his "ground." Martin has a right to self defense, and a right to stand his ground. At no point was Martin trying to chase zimmerman away from zimmerman's "ground," so how the hell could the stand your ground law apply on zimmerman's behalf?

If a fight ensues that is not mutually agreed upon by the combatants, then someone was the aggressor. The aggressor does NOT get to claim self defense if he kills the other combatant! In a non-mutual fight, only one party gets to claim self-defense, and it isn't the aggressor!
 
I just doubt he started a "fight". He may have tried to question him... The kid ran, and the hothead pursued. Is this what happened?
If so why did the kid just not turn and face him/answer questions. Because I've dealt with hot heads. And this does often defuse them, to just not show fear... To stay calm.

I knew I was taking an unpopular stance when I replied. I am just wondering why it led to this... That the only reason Zimmerman would need to detain anyone is if they were trying to get away. If he did nothing wrong, hr really should have been more cool headed (Martin).

I'm not really saying Zimmerman should have chased him down. I don't know.

And I seem to be missing facts. Its been a few since I read the facts. Was Zimmerman wearing any kind of uniform? If not, I apologize and withdraw from this stance. Trayvon could have easily thought, "who the fuck is this guy chasing me?", and he was merely defending himself.
 
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What 23 said:
And I seem to be missing facts. Its been a few since I read the facts. Was Zimmerman wearing any kind of uniform? If not, I apologize and withdraw from this stance. Trayvon could have easily thought, "who the fuck is this guy chasing me?", and he was merely defending himself.
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My understanding is this is exactly what happened (that Trayvon thought, "who the fuck is this guy chasing me?", and he was merely defending himself.).

Zimmerman was not wearing a uniform. He is just a guy who was part of a neighborhood watch. Just for the record, if someone Zimmerman's size was following/chasing me, my response would have nothign to do with whether I had done anything wrong. First of all, as far as I know, he is a criminal who means to do me harm. I am absolutely NOT going to think to myself, "Okay, no problem, I have done nothing wrong, so I'll just stop, let the creepy large man approach me and explain myself to him." No. My first thought would be to flee. My second would be to fight if fleeing does not work.
 
What 23 said:
I just doubt he started a "fight". He may have tried to question him... The kid ran, and the hothead pursued. Is this what happened?
If so why did the kid just not turn and face him/answer questions. Because I've dealt with hot heads. And this does often defuse them, to just not show fear... To stay calm.

I knew I was taking an unpopular stance when I replied. I am just wondering why it led to this... That the only reason Zimmerman would need to detain anyone is if they were trying to get away. If he did nothing wrong, hr really should have been more cool headed (Martin).

I'm not really saying Zimmerman should have chased him down. I don't know.

And I seem to be missing facts. Its been a few since I read the facts. Was Zimmerman wearing any kind of uniform? If not, I apologize and withdraw from this stance. Trayvon could have easily thought, "who the fuck is this guy chasing me?", and he was merely defending himself.
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No uniform, just some dude stalking him though the complex. Trayvon acted like any normal person would in that instance. Even if he was in some rent a cop uniform he would have no right to try and detain a resident that did nothing wrong.
 
JD55 said:
No uniform, just some dude stalking him though the complex. Trayvon acted like any normal person would in that instance. Even if he was in some rent a cop uniform he would have no right to try and detain a resident that did nothing wrong.
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This is another good point. If a uniformed police officer started stalking/following/chasing/harassing me for no reason, I would be just as afraid as I would be if someone else did it. The police officer is DEFINITELY armed, and can act with impunity. I hate when people say things such as, "If you have done nothing wrong there is no reason to run." Bullshit! People are attacked and killed every day for doing nothing wrong, and would have been better off assuming the worst and running.
 
Pretty sure Zimmerman was not wearing a uniform. It was a gated community, but he was essentially walking down a public roadway. If there's no evidence of a crime, chasing down someone merely because you don't like the way you think they're staring at houses is no excuse for Zimmerman's behavior. I do respect the job that the police are assigned to do, and if I was walking around late at night and they stopped and asked me what I was up to, I'd have no problem answering their questions. It's happened to me several times, and the cops are usually very cool about it and don't usually give you a hard time, if you're not doing anything wrong. some cops will take the opportunity to search you for drugs or whatever, but most won't even bother if they determine that you're not doing anything wrong. and that's exactly what probably would have happened had the REAL police been allowed to do their job.
 
The question is: did Trayvon believe his life was in emanate danger when he decided to assault Zimmerman? If so, then the stand your ground statute would say he was defending himself, giving Zimmerman the duty to retreat as the aggressor.
 
If it were someone in a uniform, the best thing to do to avoid trouble, though, is to go and meet them.

I learned that the other week when I pulled out of a place where I picked up an oxygen machine, and a cop stopped and turned around, to follow me. I kept putting my hands up, like "what?!" and finally he just pulled me over. Made up a reason to detain me. When I asked him why he pulled me over, he didn't tell me at first- until I gave him my license, which I was holding onto because I hadn't done anything wrong (he had to threaten criminal charges for me to comply), but then he told me it was because I was pulling out of a place that was closed/after hours, and that I didn't signal 200 feet before turning, which I replied including that I was a courier and why I was there, that- "well, i don't even think there's 200 feet between the place you saw me pull out of, and the turn"- to which he did agree that that was a high possibility, so I basically caught him breaking the laws he's supposed to uphold, and bullshitting. He had already decided to pursue me... I was detained momentarily, and a patient had to go without their oxygen machine for another 15 minutes or so. I was pissed, but it could have been avoided had I just rolled up next to him when he slowed as he went by the place I was pulling out of, and said, "Hi...".

It really didn't matter that the officer was in the wrong to begin with, here... for me... It was at that point, to minimize the danger and impact on myself, I should have just known what was up, like "hey, man, i know you suspect me of something. look. nothing in my hands. am i clear? not a bad guy".

But, some of the facts are coming back. I remember now that he didn't really have authority to pursue this guy. I am not sure if he really detained him, though, or tried to. He should have at the very least identified himself (Zimmerman) to Trayvon. I probably have no right to an opinion, or stance, because I haven't paid a ton of attention to it, and wasn't there. I just know that he media portrayed Trayvon as a sweet, innocent "boy", showing pictures of him when he was 15 or so, and with recent things that came to light (and before, that he's not some little 15 year old), it warrants more thought.

But the fact that Zimmerman wasn't wearing anything to ID himself, and was just in regular clothing, following this kid... well, it doesn't look too good for Zimmerman. The only thing he should have done, is call the police, if he had suspicions. Perhaps keep the kid in eye-shot. And if an altercation happened then, then it would not have really been his fault.

My opinions change a lot. But recent information does show the kid wasn't on the greatest path. But, they don't know that the guns were his, do they?

I may have been wrong to say "he got what was coming to him", but if he was serious about being "gangsta", and there was anything to those guns, it could have happened sooner or later. Not to say it's right how it did.

But he may have, really been, acting suspicious. Not just because he was black, either.
 
even if Trayvon Martin was a multiple felon in his late 20s, he had every right to be where he was doing what he was doing...His past has nothing to do with it whatsoever! If you're walking free, you have the same rights as everyone else, for the most part.

I have a felony from over 10 years ago for a drug charge, if someone murdered me for looking suspicious tonight, would that really have anything to do with it?
 
^no... but what came to light with the images (and "hostile" looking images), i think it was within the day/days, so i imagine it would, or could, possibly, weigh in.
 
BlueHues said:
I have a felony from over 10 years ago for a drug charge, if someone murdered me for looking suspicious tonight, would that really have anything to do with it?
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well let's not skew the facts it would be more like if someone with a gun followed you, confronted you, and then you assaulted them (either in fear for your life or aggression/hostility) and then they shot you. Obviously the drug charge is irrelevant. I think this looks like some degree of manslaughter but at this point the facts need to be presented in trial before I can really come up with any solid conclusions.
 
It's definitely not a pre meditated murder with any "real" motive, but this guy should go to prison for at least 5 years! there's people with non-violent drug charges doing 4 times that!
 
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