Guards tear down Aboriginal protesters' shelter

[zephyr]

LOL.. it made me laugh too. The guys there are some of the most peaceful, respectable people ive ever talked to. Really, a great bunch of people. Dealing with upper class white women daily as a part of my job, it would be easier for me to believe she was mouthing off to them or the entourage of homeless people that live in that park and she exaggerated the story for dramatic effect or to feel more important.

For gods sake those who are able to visit this site, do it before you come on here making judgements.

And yet you can make a judgement on this "white upper class woman" without having met her? Thats a crap over generalisation. Bear in mind the same guy did lunge at the news cameraman later on, but maybe that was all staged for extra effect too.

 

[m4dd0g]

One of the very few times I disagree with you EE

I believe excercising rights and claiming land that other Australians can not further widens the cultural gulf between white and black Australia.

Ive no issue whatsoever with someone pitching a tent and burning a fire for whatever reasons they feel justified about.

The benefit is purely selfish, the cost is another fistful of "us versus them"

Maybe im just not sentimental (despite being part aboriginal)

 

[endlesseulogy]

And yet you can make a judgement on this "white upper class woman" without having met her? Thats a crap over generalisation. Bear in mind the same guy did lunge at the news cameraman later on, but maybe that was all staged for extra effect too.

Well yeah, I happened to be there when it happened. The man involved in the TV camera incedent was not a part of the protest camp. Yes I do agree that the white women comment was a generalisation and a apologise if it offended anyone. It was out of line.

One of the very few times I disagree with you EE

I believe excercising rights and claiming land that other Australians can not further widens the cultural gulf between white and black Australia.

Ive no issue whatsoever with someone pitching a tent and burning a fire for whatever reasons they feel justified about. I guess the people involved want some sort of satisfaction that makes them feel proud.

The benefit is purely selfish, the cost is another fistful of "us versus them"

Maybe im just not sentimental (despite being part aboriginal)

I do see where you are coming from man, but do you think this is more of an attempt to be heard in a sea of voices that arnt willing to listen?

 

[m4dd0g]

^ Very possibly. Just have to hope that they are 'heard' saying the right things. Im not in their shoes, all i know is observing the end result.

I think 'sending in the guards' was act of pure stupidity

I'd so much prefer to see 'Aboriginal environmental initiative*, or some such in the paper rather than 'Aboriginal protest - we want stuff'

If people want to achieve something dont think "It should be this way, people should just understand whats fair" and think of it as "If I do X then it will make people sympathetic to me and my cause"


* Note: of course the papers wouldnt bother with something lacking in moral outrage despite the power of the message

 

[endlesseulogy]

wow! you actually visited the camp? that mustve taken a good 5... maybe 10 minutes out of your day.

and you consider that "standing up for what you alledgedly believe in"? what am i thinking? you're also posting on the internet!!

For one who claims to be so passionate about so many controversial issues... you dont seem to do an awful lot besides pissing and moaning about "how things just arent so gosh-darn fair!"

To summarise: There are people who complain about the darkness, and there are those who change the fucking light-bulb.

Guess what you are?

You have no idea what i do and you definatly have no idea how long i spent at the camp. Unless you have somehow planted a mobile camera on my body and are following my every movement!

m4dd0g :

What you say does bear much truth. Such initiatives would be extremely helpful and positive. I think things are a bit different for the native community in Melbourne and in Victoria as a whole. Aboriginals here have very very little recognised native land in comparison to the rest of Australia. I remember hearing the figures on RRR a few weeks before the C'weath games and it was some tiny figure like 0.12% was listed as traditional land.

 

[zephyr]

Well yeah, I happened to be there when it happened. The man involved in the TV camera incedent was not a part of the protest camp.

LOL.. it made me laugh too. The guys there are some of the most peaceful, respectable people ive ever talked to. Really, a great bunch of people. Dealing with upper class white women daily as a part of my job, it would be easier for me to believe she was mouthing off to them or the entourage of homeless people that live in that park and she exaggerated the story for dramatic effect or to feel more important.

Did you see the female jogger incident? Well- did she exaggerate or not?
Regardless- she has every right to use a public place to go for a jog without being accosted or threatened- by anyone. Its kinda scary being threatened when you are a lone female jogger. Thay should be able to have their camp if thats what they want but not if it interferes with public access to a public place.


And on that tv camera thing- I guess news reports can get exaggerated or skewed for extra dramatic effect but it did appear to be the same guy they were interviewing from the camp that actually lunged at the camera.

 

[endlesseulogy]

^^ I saw the jogger incident. The person in question had a large pole-like object (most likely a spear) that he was pointing in the direction of the runner and she came storming up to nearby officials and accused him of being threatening. It was blown out of proportion as having met these people a few times, would not so much as lay a finger on innocent bystanders. They were extremely friendly to council officials and police who came to give them news of their case.

That particular track is used by HEAPS joggers at that time and nobody else seemed to be reporting any issues with the camp. Infact a few of the joggers seemed to be arriving at the camp to check it out before i left to goto work.

 

[Shnouzerpuff]

Pangs - 1999

Buffy: Will, you know how bad I feel about this. It's eating me up...

[to Anya]
Buffy: 1/4 Cup of brandy and let it simmer.

[to Willow]
Buffy: But even though it's hard, we have to end this. Yes, he's been wronged, And I personally would be ready to apologize.

Spike: Oh, someone put a stake in me.

Xander: You got a lot of volunteers in here.

Spike: I just can't take all this namby-pamby boo-hooing about the bloody indians.

Willow: Uh, the preferred term...

Spike: You won. All right? You came in and you killed them and you took their land. That's what conquering nations do. It's what Caesar did, and he's not going around saying, "I came, I conquered, I felt really bad about it." The history of the world isn't people making friends. You had better weapons, and you massacred them. End of story.

Buffy: Well, I think the Spaniards actually did a lot of - Not that I don't like Spaniards.

Spike: Listen to you. How you gonna fight anyone with that attitude?

Willow: We don't wanna fight anyone.

Buffy: I just wanna have thanksgiving.

Spike: Heh heh. Yeah... Good luck.

Willow: If we could talk to him...

Spike: You exterminated his race. What could you possibly say that would make him feel better? It's kill or be killed here. Take your bloody pick.

Xander: Maybe it's the syphilis talking, but... Some of that made sense.

 

[preacha]

Originally Posted by endlesseulogy
No keej, your simplistic attempt at trying to justify this doesn’t really work.

Unlike the aboriginal people of this nation, your green garb wearing fraternity hasn’t been obliterated, domesticated, slaughtered, marginalised and hated for over 200 years.

^^ two words EE: british occupation. it's what caused our potato famine in the first place. but since you wouldn't have any idea regarding how particular white races have been mistreated, i'll try and skip that for you

now in regards to this conumdrum, this may seem like the basic way out
if they don't want to abide by the rules set by our government, the government can always revoke their citizenship

no more abstudy
no more centrelink
no more 'if you are an aboriginal/torres strait islander' tick box on every form you see
it might be interesting to see the reaction

otherwise, my recommendation is that the aborigines just accept the fact that at the end of the day, britain won.

they were technologically inferior and in terms of the evolutionary scale, the aborigines were well beneath the intellect of the british (now this IS a dangerous train of thought, as i could elaborate on the fact that no race evolves to such an extraordinary degree that within 200 years since settlement, they finally match their aggressors, thus insinuating that all men AREN'T created equal). but of course, i'm just mentioning warfare, which is what us whiteys do best right EE?

tribes in africa are still taking piss showers
however, those tribes aren't trying to claim welfare
stop apologising for your race EE

 

[drEaMtiMe*@#]

i'm still on-topic... just in a round-a-bout sorta way :D

most conquers were stupid fucking barbarians. take the normads for example, who ended up over throwing the roman empire. the romans in their day had RUNNING WATER and SEWERAGE SYSTEMS, then the normads came along and murdered pretty much any roman that they could lay their hands on, including the highly intelligent ideas men, who if they'd been smart enough to have let those guys live, could of advanced their own civilisation, instead of taking us all about a gazillion steps backward into the middle ages.

grrr.

give me brains over brawn any day, thank you.

 

[Shnouzerpuff]

^^ I wonder if you have ever heard of Operation Paperclip?

It was all about how the US broke their own laws by granting freedom to Nazi scientists.

US Military Intelligence "cleansed" the files of Nazi refrences and by 1955, more than 760 German scientists had been granted citizenship in the U.S. and given prominent positions in the American scientific community. Many had been longtime members of the Nazi party and the Gestapo, had conducted experiments on humans at concentration camps, had used slave labor, and had comitted other war crimes.


As much as I hate it when the word "Nazi" enters any thread, given your previous post, I am curious to see what your opinion is of Operation Paperclip.

 

[preacha]

i thought operation paperclip was my letter writing campaign to Microsoft to remove the paperclip helper from Microsoft Word

 

[drEaMtiMe*@#]

i pretty much hate the americans because they are devious fucks, who have the brains to do something like that, but still all the while value and rely on brutality as their weapon of choice, and regard the acquisition of money and power to be the most important thing in life.

 

[drEaMtiMe*@#]

which i should probably also add means that they haven't moved far away from the mentality of their barbarian ancestors, except that they've learnt a few lessons along the way (which you would of hoped would have happened in those last x odd years).

i also like brilliant minds who work for good instead of evil.

 

[endlesseulogy]

i pretty much hate the americans because they are devious fucks, who have the brains to do something like that, but still all the while value and rely on brutality as their weapon of choice, and regard the acquisition of money and power to be the most important thing in life.

is is exactly right. Intelligence has nothing to do with it. If white people were intelligent they would have realised that we are all one and that industrialisation is and was ruining the planet and that other cultures are not to be feared. Building special ships and weapons was the British Empires attempt to concur and divide. They wouldnt have had the brains to do it if their motive was for the good of all humanity. Aboriginal people were in touch with their natural surroundings and have far greater knowledge of the natural world then the British ever did. When the British were advancing on outback Australia they always were amazed at how much the aboriginals knew about the natural environment and survival involved with it. Intelligence works on many different levels and its pretty stupid for you precha to use that as a lame justification.

 

[preacha]

if we are 'all one', why are aboriginals trying to reclaim 'their' land?

 

[endlesseulogy]

They are trying to reclaim the pride and recognition they lost, preacha. They aren’t saying their land wont be accessible to other people.

 

[Shnouzerpuff]

^^
oh rly?

April 16, 2006 - 3:37PM


"I've lit my fire as per tradition and I've explained that to them, that I'm doing this as part of my cultural rights and cultural heritage, so I pointed out that they were prohibited from entering herewith and I pointed out these points of our lore to them," Mr Terrick said.

"They entered here on to our land and they poured water over our fire and extinguished it."

The fire was rebuilt about noon today to cook lunch. Mr Terrick said the council or police had no right to extinguish the new fire because it was allowed under cultural provisions in the Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander Heritage Protection Act (1984).

"I consider it my cultural right to practice my cultural heritage here in the state of Victoria ... in the city of Melbourne," he told about 30 onlookers at the site.

"This is a sacred site. I feel especially privileged to be able to do this.
"This reinstates our culture, reinstates the dance, reinstates the corroboree, reinstates our fire."

Mr Terrick reclaimed the land on behalf of Aboriginal people and the Wurundjeri tribe of Melbourne.

"I hereby take possession of this site, this area that belongs to the Wurundjeri people of Melbourne."

The group has been allowed to stay in the park, and the burning of a sacred fire is permitted after it was given emergency heritage protection for 30 days.

A traditional hut built on the camp has also been allowed if it is used only to house fuel for the fire.

AAP

http://www.smh.com.au/news/national...testers-shelter/2006/04/16/1145125996441.html

 

[preacha]

but wouldn't this be the reclamation of material possessions? coming from a race that believes that we belong to the land and not vice versa, you gotta admit that is kinda funny

it's been 200 yrs since settlement anyway. if they continue to whine about the pride and recognition they have lost, it makes them no better than those new generations in the middle east who continue to wage war based on what their forefathers lost

it isn't pride
it is greed
aborigines want their money for nothing and their chicks for free

edit: and again, schnouzerpuff beats me to pointing out your shitty argument

 

[endlesseulogy]

^^
oh rly?

and the people trying to enter wernt a threat? paste the whole article.