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General Election 2015

Which party would you cast your vote for?

  • Conservative

    Votes: 2 4.2%

  • Labour

    Votes: 8 16.7%

  • Lib Dems

    Votes: 0 0.0%

  • Greens

    Votes: 14 29.2%

  • UKIP

    Votes: 3 6.3%

  • BNP

    Votes: 2 4.2%

  • SNP

    Votes: 6 12.5%

  • Plaid Cymru

    Votes: 2 4.2%

  • None of the above (feel free to post in thread)

    Votes: 11 22.9%
  • Total voters
    48
  • Poll closed .
Wanna bet?

We have grass roots activists here too, whether affiliated with a party or not. They've been powerless to stop the impact of the cuts, and there are more on the way.
 
StoneHappyMonday said:
Then why hasn't he said vote SNP in the Scottish Sun previously? You know, to destroy Labour like you say?

Sorry, but you have on this occasion. Doesn't make you a running dog lacky. Calm down dear. ;)

Murdoch backs winners, always has done.
Click to expand...

I'm sorry, but I don't understand your point, or how you think that I've somehow "fallen" for something. What are you on about?

Murdoch switched "allegiance" to the SNP to:

1. Sell more papers, like you said.

2. Hurt Labour in Scotland, which could only help the Tories in England.

Please explain to me why we seem to have crossed wires on this? :)
 
Sammy G said:
I wonder how much different the results would have been had the independence referendum not happened, or had it been held three or four years ago?
Click to expand...

The main influence the referendum had on this general election, I think, is that it meant simply that scottish voters were energised about politics, far more engaged and far more informed than people in england may or may not have been. Probably expains the higher turnouts in scotland.
 
That was kinda my point... except maybe for 'informed'.

I think a lot of people forgot they were voting in a UK-wide election, and got caught up in nationalistic fervour. Forgetting that even if every Scottish seat were filled by SNP candidates, they'd still have less influence on the Westminster parliament than the Dems had as part of the coalition.

Cute Tory move.
 
Sammy G said:
Murdoch would not back anybody who wasn't part of his agenda. He didn't back Kinnock when it looked like he might be (I can't believe I'm typing this) a winner, did he?
Click to expand...

Kinnock didn't look like a winner to anyone who knew what was going on. That was the 'will the last one to leave turn out the lights' election. Murdoch turned the screws nicely at the end. Of course he's a Tory supporter, he's big business. But that's business through profits. He'd have supported Kinnock if Kinnock was going to win a landslide. Just like he supported Blair. And he'd have turned Kinnock like he helped to turn the Labour party under Blair. Let's face it, Kinnock was there for turning, scab bastard.

Murdoch supported SNP because their landslide was assured. He also knows its an irrelevance come the next election and you can have any money/price you like he won't back the SNP (to defeat Labour or for any other reason) come the next general election (or any type of election).

Murdoch apologized to scousers having slandered them remember? Were lefty football fan scousers part of any agenda of his? Or were the Sun's sales catastrophically hit in the wake of Hillsborough?

PS. I've got every election right since 1979 (when I was 15). Just saying.
 
Sammy G said:
That was kinda my point... except maybe for 'informed'.

I think a lot of people forgot they were voting in a UK-wide election, and got caught up in nationalistic fervour.
Click to expand...

I completely reject this simplistic and patronising generalisation.
 
felix said:
I'm sorry, but I don't understand your point, or how you think that I've somehow "fallen" for something. What are you on about?

Murdoch switched "allegiance" to the SNP to:

1. Sell more papers, like you said.

2. Hurt Labour in Scotland, which could only help the Tories in England.

Please explain to me why we seem to have crossed wires on this? :)
Click to expand...

Murdoch had to hold his nose while he let the Scottish Sun support the SNP. It wasn't because their agenda was his agenda. That's falling for Greenthumb's/Sammy's line that a vote for the SNP was a vote for the Tories. Up there ^ you criticized Greeny and Sammy for that. Now, essentially, you are saying a vote for the SNP indeed did help the Tory agenda.

A vote for the SNP helped the SNP agenda and, obviously, those who support Scottish separatism without necessarily being full blooded SNP supporters (like you and Ceres).

The Tories won because Labour were hopeless, not because the SNP were good (look at their failure to make inroads into Tory and Liberal seats). A vote for the SNP, as advocated by Murdoch for short-term commercial reasons, was a vote for independence, or for being fucked off with the manipulation of the devolution referendum, not a vote for a Tory government. We got a Tory government because of the inadequacies of Labour.
 
Sammy G said:
That was kinda my point... except maybe for 'informed'.

I think a lot of people forgot they were voting in a UK-wide election, and got caught up in nationalistic fervour. Forgetting that even if every Scottish seat were filled by SNP candidates, they'd still have less influence on the Westminster parliament than the Dems had as part of the coalition.

Cute Tory move.
Click to expand...

my point is that the referendum made a lot of scottish people feel (myself included) for once that their vote really could make a difference, and gave them increased confidence to go out on a limb and support a party other than the labour party.

conversly you have videos like that one linked earlier in this thread, interviewing voters in Nuneaton, who were completely ambivalent or ignorant and obviously happy just to squander the opportunity to tip the balances in a highly marignal seat.

The result of the election today just reinforces my feeling that britain is a country with an awful lot of people who couldn't give a flying fuck about anyone except themselves as long as they have their material comforts.
 
Sammy G said:
I'm not saying it applies to you, but surely the figures from 2010 compared to 2015 speak volumes? What has Labour done during that time to alienate Scottish voters?
Click to expand...

Do you want a list?

Aligned themselves with the Tories during the referendum
Aligned themselves with the Tories for more public spending, more austerity
Aligned themselves with the Tories on spending billions on weapons of mass destruction

Etc.
 
They've aligned themselves with the Tories (or vice-versa) for 20 years and more. Yet they're still not (quite) the Tories, and at a local level they can be very distant from the Tories.

Just hang that Saltire there, low down on the mast. We're taking on water already. ;)
 
StoneHappyMonday said:
Murdoch had to hold his nose while he let the Scottish Sun support the SNP. It wasn't because their agenda was his agenda. That's falling for Greenthumb's/Sammy's line that a vote for the SNP was a vote for the Tories. Up there ^ you criticized Greeny and Sammy for that. Now, essentially, you are saying a vote for the SNP indeed did help the Tory agenda.

A vote for the SNP helped the SNP agenda and, obviously, those who support Scottish separatism without necessarily being full blooded SNP supporters (like you and Ceres).

The Tories won because Labour were hopeless, not because the SNP were good (look at their failure to make inroads into Tory and Liberal seats). A vote for the SNP, as advocated by Murdoch for short-term commercial reasons, was a vote for independence, or for being fucked off with the manipulation of the devolution referendum, not a vote for a Tory government. We got a Tory government because of the inadequacies of Labour.
Click to expand...

Right.

It is Labour's fault for being so shit that they lost so much in Scotland and England.

It is true to say that every Labour seat lost in Scotland to the SNP helped the Tories win a majority across the UK.

Am I (and the rest of the Scotland) supposed to feel guilty about this? :D

I feel like I'm being accused of inconsistency, somehow, but I can't quite put my finger on why, exactly.
 
Sammy G said:
Not the whole of Scotland, no. Some people in Scotland care about us.
Click to expand...

That's an odd comment.

"Us"??

You appear to be implying (correct me if I'm wrong) that us lot (and by that, I mean me and what I think is a typical SNP voter) don't give a fuck about the working class in the rest of the UK. Nothing could be further from the truth.

It wasn't up to the people of Scotland to energise the English electorate to vote against the Tories. That was the the job of the Labour Party and all the rest of them.

The overall result is as disappointing to me as it is to you.
 
felix said:
Right.

It is Labour's fault for being so shit that they lost so much in Scotland and England.

It is true to say that every Labour seat lost in Scotland to the SNP helped the Tories win a majority across the UK.

Am I (and the rest of the Scotland) supposed to feel guilty about this? :D

I feel like I'm being accused of inconsistency, somehow, but I can't quite put my finger on why, exactly.
Click to expand...

My whole point is you are not supposed to feel guilty and that it is not the SNP voters fault. A vote for the SNP was not a vote for the Tories. An anti-Labour vote was a Labour problem, not a Tory conspiracy.
 
Sammy G said:
Not the whole of Scotland, no. Some people in Scotland care about us.
Click to expand...

Bit Anglo-centric no? What 'us'? Do the 'us' in England care about Scotland? It doesn't look like it from what you and others are expressing. You seem to think this 'nationwide' election revolves around England.
 
StoneHappyMonday said:
My whole point is you are not supposed to feel guilty and that it is not the SNP voters fault. A vote for the SNP was not a vote for the Tories. An anti-Labour vote was a Labour problem, not a Tory conspiracy.
Click to expand...

Well, thank fuck for that. Let's have a pint.
29.gif
:D

No guilt here whatsoever.
 
cant fucking believe they did it again. its gonna be a long 5 years. and i see sammys point and agree with him
 
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