Stimulants freebase adderall extraction + smoking the freebase questions

[Jekyl Anhydride]

So whether it's Toluene, Dichloromethane, etc, it's the salting from freebase that's causing all the headaches? It's making the nebulizer sound better and better. I never realized Meth was so much more "cooker" friendly, without getting into any synth details anyways. I'll try to look for any odds & ends, but this seems like a toughie.

 

[Sertürner]

The nebulizer I can imagine would dry your throat out pretty well. All the amp vapor will constrict blood vessels in the mouth and nose and inhibit saliva production as well. Any salts left over from the extract will be vaporized too. So it might be a viable option but I personally would only do it if I had pharm grade pure d-amp.

 

[Jekyl Anhydride]

Even if you went the route of the Phosphate, it's a lot of work for the benefit of having a non Sulfate/non HCl Amph..

135 g (1 mol) of amphetamine freebase were stirred into 300ml of acetone in a 1000ml erlenmeyer flask. To the resultant solution there were slowly added under constant agitation 115.3 g of 85% phosphoric acid (containing 1 mol of H3PO4), care being taken to avoid any sudden rise in temperature or local overheating due to the considerable amount of heat that is evolved. During the addition of the phosphoric acid a fine, white, flocculent precipitate appears which becomes more and more dense and abundant, as the quantity of added acid increases.

When the entire quantity of the phosphoric acid has thus been added, agitation of the mixture is continued for about a half-hour or more to insure complete conversion. The precipitate is then allowed to settle, the supernatant liquid is drawn off, and the residue is filtered. The precipitate thus separated is washed with acetone and is then dried by evaporation to constant weight. It forms a fine, white, impalpable powder consisting of pure monobasic amphetamine phosphate.

 

[Sertürner]

Hey mate, what is your thoughts about the practical difficulties of making the HCl?

I dont think the time and and caution necessary to achieve the hcl is worth it in the end. At least, not when doing an extraction from adderall. The materials needed, the necessity for near 0 percent humidity once the salt as been evaporated, and the gassing make it too much work when other salts can be more easily achieved through the extraction such as the sulphate. As far as leaving it as freebase though, I would not like to have to handle the oil every time I wanted to dose, I can see people spilling it when trying to smoke it because they are too high haha. That is why I suggested the carbonate, it is still smokable and is a solid at room temp.

 

[Phobos]

That is why I suggested the carbonate, it is still smokable and is a solid at room temp.

So you can vape the Carbonate on glass and/or foil?
Does anyone see any difference in side effects between vaping and nebulizing?
I would think that by inhaling the same amount everything should be equivalent?

 

[Jekyl Anhydride]

I think vaping makes for a finer liquid/ particulate matter size with a little more surface area vs nebulizing which contains larger droplets, not that nebulizing isn't fine in comparison to the whole Sulfate conversion.

 

[Phobos]

Uh, ya makes sense for sure JA, smaller particles will form on the surface of the respiratory tract, and that would most likely make for faster absorption.

 

[Sertürner]

Also with nebulizing, you can make a liquid that is as strong or weak as you like (if you have those scripted albuterol nebulizers at least). Most of those hold 10ml I believe in the chamber so you could dissolve a relatively low amount and the side effects on the lungs *might* be lessened.
And I'll get back to you on that @Phobos Im pretty sure it is smokable but I'm not 100%.

 

[Sertürner]

Found very little info on the carbonate salt. It would also require a lot of work, not worth it for an adderall extraction in my opinion.
But for informations sake, it's possible to smoke it apparently off foil and with direct flame. I could fnt find any physical/chemical properties of it ANYWHERE though. It seems very little time has been put in to researching it. Probably because it's only useful as a drug of abuse.

 

[emkee_reinvented]

forsure however if i was gonna go with a dopamine reuptake inhibitor id go with good ol coca

Totally get where you are going, the Coca was very good. This is a gateway to the inland's, so when I was into that stuff it was top knotch. But I personally rank it just above Methylphenidate. But I rather have an Amphetamine, dextro currently.

Khat chewing, a mixture of Cathinone and Cathine stroke the right receptor's. Prefered that to the high quality Cocaine Hcl available. To bad the Somalian's and Eritrhrear's got fucked, they made Khat illegal.

The first evaluation's revealed the Khat problem was greatly solved, by illegalization. Imo it's as hard as Weed but hey!
A increase in other, more addicting drugs use was noticed among the specified group of people. Another problem was the rise in domestic problem's. The group of mostly unemployed immigrant's lost their no 1 social thing. Although the quarterfold increase in price of Catha Edulis played a large role also as stressing facto upon the family's.

Got good memory's on that. The atmosphere in the 'Khat house' Were I got it was that interesting that I regret not having stayed there for at least an hour. Only the first time I was there for 20 min max. Nice guy's, babbling unknown word's. Tribal music on, warm tea available. It was very open and welcoming.

But Khat over Coke, any time any form Zonxx

 

[Phobos]

The Khat plant got swept together with all the methcathinones and Pyrovalerones....
Didn't make sense to me I never heard it could be a precursor.

 

[Hodor]

Hey Hodor, as you seem more knowledgeable than me in organic chemistry, what do you think of the difficulty of making the HCl salt from freebase, seeing as I read reports that gaseous, strictly anhydrous HCl is needed if you don't wanna destroy your amps most of the time, with only a few attempts being successful and your Amph being destroyed when you fail.

From what I understand, the issue seems to be that amphetamine HCl is extremely hygroscopic, so yes, using dilute HCl (remember, pure HCl is a gas at room temperature; even "concentrated" liquid HCl is still only 37% HCl and 63% water) it would be extremely hard to make it into solid crystals that could be filtered off, my bad ?

And apparently dry HCl is much more aggressive, to the point where it actually destroys the amphetamine, though I am not sure about the exact mechanism. Then again, working with dry HCl is definitely not something I would ever have suggested someone attempt at home.

 

[Sertürner]

^ I think we have gone way past the point of home extraction by now. These last few pages would be a thread that is suitable for N&PD. But let's keep it here unless they want it. Has anybody found info on the carbonate? I have only found a few references to it but none of them give any physical properties such as melting point. It seems almost entirely theoretical except for a few who have made it.

 

[Zonxx]

From what I understand, the issue seems to be that amphetamine HCl is extremely hygroscopic, so yes, using dilute HCl (remember, pure HCl is a gas at room temperature; even "concentrated" liquid HCl is still only 37% HCl and 63% water) it would be extremely hard to make it into solid crystals that could be filtered off, my bad ?

And apparently dry HCl is much more aggressive, to the point where it actually destroys the amphetamine, though I am not sure about the exact mechanism. Then again, working with dry HCl is definitely not something I would ever have suggested someone attempt at home.

well i can literally buy 32% hcl easily at a store, which is why i asked and was planning on concentrating it the actual HCL is alittle harder to obtain

^ I think we have gone way past the point of home extraction by now. These last few pages would be a thread that is suitable for N&PD. But let's keep it here unless they want it. Has anybody found info on the carbonate? I have only found a few references to it but none of them give any physical properties such as melting point. It seems almost entirely theoretical except for a few who have made it.

perhaps we;ve elevated to lab levels to make it BUT it seems if you have the right ingredients, all it takes is the instruction and bam, you're good to go

 

[Zonxx]

Found very little info on the carbonate salt. It would also require a lot of work, not worth it for an adderall extraction in my opinion.
But for informations sake, it's possible to smoke it apparently off foil and with direct flame. I could fnt find any physical/chemical properties of it ANYWHERE though. It seems very little time has been put in to researching it. Probably because it's only useful as a drug of abuse.

attempted this BUT i believe it to be toxic, *i have the adderall XR beads, which are straight salts, not too many fillers* and even then i ACTUALLY saw it melt, same as you would heroin on foil, but i guess you need to master a certain technique with the flame BECAUSE i find it'll melt and then vaporize yes, but then suddenly if i keep the heat on , it'll quickly burn up and it's a NASTY smoke probs best to not inhale
yeah drug of 'abuse' HOWEVER not for one experienced wit hthe drug looking for alternative routes of action unfortunatly for myself !

so between the melt stage and burn stage is the main issue at the moment, i thought of literally getting a hotplate, putting alittle foil on that, and controlling the temp and seeing what happens then being able to use that? its alittle excessive when i can just sublingual adderall like i do, BUT it'd be a good way to experiment to see if that would be a better roa for myself, and if it did work, and gave a shorter duration of effects maintaining the potency of them, thats what i want, and if i really needed to extend them, sublingual effects are potent enough as it with the 'flash' effect i get when i put 30+ mg under my tongue i'm gonna fool around with just 5-10 more mg worth on a foil to see how it reacts to the flame the question is - to spread it out OR to just put it in one spot.

maybe there's somthing in adderally that makes this an impossibility? but i could be wrong. i'm just super against wasting drugs so im hesitate to just keep testing it out and seeing what happens (not smoking) but to see what happens on foil
i was thinking of Neutralizing it with a TINY bit of water on a spoon with bicarbonate, and trying to vaporize that, but i think that would kill the amp too, it's pretty complicated but im sure once the answer is found it'll be a 'woah it was that simple?' type of thing

there was some effect when i tried it, but like i said, there was burning 100% and it smelt and tasted toxic,stopped right away

 

[Hodor]

perhaps we;ve elevated to lab levels to make it BUT it seems if you have the right ingredients, all it takes is the instruction and bam, you're good to go

Hahaha NO. ? I mean, except for the "bam!" part - plenty of things that can go "bam!" or "BOOM!" in a lab.

Dry, 100% HCl is a highly corrosive gas; essentially a chemical weapon. Have you ever taken a whiff of the vapors from a container of 37% HCl (if you haven't: don't!)? Yeah, now imagine this stuff being released inside your kitchen/garage/whatever. These are not the kind of chemicals you handle without proper safety equipment, first and foremost a fume hood.
Also, many reactions are highly exothermic (meaning they release heat. Heat creates pressure, and pressure that can't be contained creates "boom!"). If you don't have the proper glassware, thermometers, magnetic stirrers, ice baths, etc., you can expect your reaction vessel to explode, splashing you with scalding hot chemicals and peppering you with glass shards.

 

[Phobos]

Hahaha NO. ? I mean, except for the "bam!" part - plenty of things that can go "bam!" or "BOOM!" in a lab.

Dry, 100% HCl is a highly corrosive gas; essentially a chemical weapon. Have you ever taken a whiff of the vapors from a container of 37% HCl (if you haven't: don't!)? Yeah, now imagine this stuff being released inside your kitchen/garage/whatever. These are not the kind of chemicals you handle without proper safety equipment, first and foremost a fume hood.
Also, many reactions are highly exothermic (meaning they release heat. Heat creates pressure, and pressure that can't be contained creates "boom!"). If you don't have the proper glassware, thermometers, magnetic stirrers, ice baths, etc., you can expect your reaction vessel to explode, splashing you with scalding hot chemicals and peppering you with glass shards.

And sometimes the scalding hot chemicals are also corrosive and/or highly flammable and/or poisonous.

 

[Hodor]

And sometimes the scalding hot chemicals are also corrosive and/or highly flammable and/or poisonous.

That too.

OP, just to give you an idea of the kind of chems you might be dealing with in organic chemistry:

* sulfuric acid: If you're wearing clothes made from synthetic fibers and you get this splashed onto them, it will lead to a highly exothermic reaction, resulting in melted polymer being burnt into your acid-burned skin.

* concentrated (fuming) nitric acid: the reaction with dry organic substances can be so exothermic that it can set them on fire. Will also form explosive compounds when accidentally mixed with alcohols. Oh, and it's pretty acidic, too. And it turns your fingers yellow.

* ethers: may oxidize over time, forming explosive peroxides.

* dimethyl sulphate: If this gets into your lungs, there will be a delayed reaction where it forms sulfuric acid and burns them. Oh, and it will at the same time alkylate your DNA, giving you cancer.

* sulfuryl chloride: a chlorinating agent that will react with water to form hydrochloric acid and chlorosulfuric acid, which will in turn react with another water molecule to form another molecule of hydrochloric acid as well as sulfuric acid.

* strong reducing agents (ex.: alkali metals, LiAlH4): Will explode upon contact with water.

* organolithium compounds, boranes: Will spontaneously ignite upon exposure to air.

* hydrofluoric acid (HF): as an acid, it is pathetically weak compared to its bigger brothers HCl and HBr. Unfortunately, this makes it even more dangerous, as the tiny molecule can diffuse through your skin and slowly release a toxic dose of fluoride inside your tissues.

 

[emkee_reinvented]

The Khat plant got swept together with all the methcathinones and Pyrovalerones....
Didn't make sense to me I never heard it could be a precursor.

It was to annoy minorty's because they can. And political pressure for sure. The were going at it if it was a big problem, like they even care. Only thing that was the aim, and that was accomplished, closing a main gateway to the inland's.

But fresh twigs are top knotch as far as recreational stim's go ime.

It was illegalized before the RC market started afaik over here pre interenet sort of.

 

[emkee_reinvented]

Zonxx you ever had any fresh Coca leaves at you disposal.

Looking at Khat as the best natural Amphetamine available. Let's assume I am correct in stating Ephedra is a step down.

Am I missing out on fresh Coca?