goodgirlie0103
Bluelighter
umm, to the first guy who opened this post, and to everyone just to be informed, 7 out of every million will die, those stats are for the UK, in america is is one out of every million.
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MDMA &
Empathogenic
Drugs
Welcome Guest! -
For every 1 million people who use ecstasy, only 7 people will die
- Thread starter Edvard Munch
- Start date
ucfhottie2001
Bluelighter
Originally posted by masheadatronic:
Does taking ecstasy make most of us immortal then?
Iyou! haha
goodgirlie0103
Bluelighter
what jonny boy said....really makes you think doesn't it??
akumachan
Bluelighter
ah yes... our hypocritical government. It disgusts me.
i think we all should just chill pestering the government will only take over energy away and they would not even give a rat ass about what we have to say. i think the things are better the way they are right now. 
the law is there and people are happy the drugs are there the users are happy the deals are happy and everyone is happy
pestering the government will only take over energy away and they would not even give a rat ass about what we have to say. i think the things are better the way they are right now. the law is there and people are happy the drugs are there the users are happy the deals are happy and everyone is happy Pill Monster
Bluelighter
INTERVIEW WITH THE MAN HIMSELF: Dr. Alexander Shulgin
__________________________________
Q. Are you aware of many deaths from MDMA?
A. Yes, although many of the deaths are almost incidental to the use of the drug. However because MDMA is present, it's blamed. Worldwide, there have been dozens of deaths associated with Ecstasy. However, probably only a dozen have actually been due to Ecstasy.
I was once asked this question in court in Madrid, where I was giving evidence. At the time, the authorities didn't know what to make of MDMA. I told them that perhaps half a dozen deaths were directly due to the drug. I also told them that in England, millions of people have used it and that any drug that causes one death in a million users is probably pretty safe. The prosecution didn't really want to hear this, but the magistrate nodded and seemed to understand. Like any drug, there have been deaths associated with Ecstasy. But is it a lethal risk to use it? No!
___________________________________
FULL LINK TO INTERVIEW : http://www.bluelight.ru/cgi/ultimatebb1.cgi?ubb=get_topic&f=32&t=000037&p=
___________________________________
Just to add my point how many lives are distroyed, familey torn apart, wives, Kids betten, and people killed on the roads due to that good taxable drug .. DRINK...
Sorry no matter what X does to me its own self harm and I have the right to do to myself as I please.
__________________________________
Q. Are you aware of many deaths from MDMA?
A. Yes, although many of the deaths are almost incidental to the use of the drug. However because MDMA is present, it's blamed. Worldwide, there have been dozens of deaths associated with Ecstasy. However, probably only a dozen have actually been due to Ecstasy.
I was once asked this question in court in Madrid, where I was giving evidence. At the time, the authorities didn't know what to make of MDMA. I told them that perhaps half a dozen deaths were directly due to the drug. I also told them that in England, millions of people have used it and that any drug that causes one death in a million users is probably pretty safe. The prosecution didn't really want to hear this, but the magistrate nodded and seemed to understand. Like any drug, there have been deaths associated with Ecstasy. But is it a lethal risk to use it? No!
___________________________________
FULL LINK TO INTERVIEW : http://www.bluelight.ru/cgi/ultimatebb1.cgi?ubb=get_topic&f=32&t=000037&p=
___________________________________
Just to add my point how many lives are distroyed, familey torn apart, wives, Kids betten, and people killed on the roads due to that good taxable drug .. DRINK...
Sorry no matter what X does to me its own self harm and I have the right to do to myself as I please.
Becoziwant2
Bluelighter
even if they put an age limit on e it wouldn't matter i have been smoking since i was 15 and just becoz i wasn't old enough to get them didn't stop me.
if a person wants to do drugs nothing will stop them.
if a person wants to do drugs nothing will stop them.
illimex
Bluelighter
I hate that it has come to this.
Look, to those of you who think you would die off of ten pharmeceutical grade pills of MDMA, here is a fact sheet from Erowid.
take a gander at the LD50 (this is the Lethal Dose at which 50% of the test subjects died...it's rather startling)
MDMA generally comes in the form of small tablets, capsules, or white powder. It is common when buying MDMA to get a combination of any of the following : MDMA, MDA, MDE, Caffeine, Dextromethorphan, Ephedrine, Glyceryl guaiacolate, and phenylpropanolamine. A chemical analysis of a variety of "hits" of MDMA found from 0 - 100 mg of MDMA as well as a variety of the above substances. Trying to calculate dosages from tablets containing unknown quantities of MDMA can be difficult, but a good quality tablet of street ecstasy generally contains an average of between 75 and 100 mg MDMA. The chart below shows dosages for pure MDMA, measured in milligrams (mg).
Threshhold 30 mg
Avg for small or sensitive people 50 - 75 mg
Avg for most people 75 - 125 mg
Avg for large or un-sensitive people 125 - 175 mg
Required by few (side effects increase) 200 + mg
LD50 (Lethal Dose*) 106 mg/kg or ~6,000 mg
Duration : 3-5 hours
Normal After Effects : up to 24 hours
* LD50 = dose which will kill 50% of the tested animals.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Overdose Effects:
Vomiting, headaches and dizziness may result from too high a dose of MDMA. Some people are considerably more sensitive to MDMA than others. Be careful if you are using MDMA for the first time or using material of an unknown purity and strength. Always start low.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
LD50 SOURCES
UNITED STATES DEPARTMENT OF JUSTICE - DEA
In The Matter Of MDMA SCHEDULING
FRANCIS L. YOUNG, Administrative Law Judge
[full text]
33. The estimated oral LD50 for MDMA in rats, as noted above, is 325 mg./kg., i.e., 325 mg. of MDMA per kilogram of weight of the rat. The effective oral human dose is 2 mg./kg. of weight. Thus there appears to be a comparatively large margin of safety in the use of MDMA in humans - the LD50 is 160 times the ED50 in humans.
29. Intraperitoneal LD50's for MDA and MDMA were determined in mice by Davis. The LD50's of MDMA and MDA were substantially the same with the LD50 for MDA equaling 90.0 mg./kg. and the LD50 for MDMA equaling 106.5 mg./kg. Dr. Hardman found the LD50 of MDA to be 92 mg./kg. Davis also found that both MDA and MDMA showed the amphetamine-like property of increased lethality under aggregated housing conditions compared to isolated housing conditions.
Look, to those of you who think you would die off of ten pharmeceutical grade pills of MDMA, here is a fact sheet from Erowid.
take a gander at the LD50 (this is the Lethal Dose at which 50% of the test subjects died...it's rather startling)
MDMA generally comes in the form of small tablets, capsules, or white powder. It is common when buying MDMA to get a combination of any of the following : MDMA, MDA, MDE, Caffeine, Dextromethorphan, Ephedrine, Glyceryl guaiacolate, and phenylpropanolamine. A chemical analysis of a variety of "hits" of MDMA found from 0 - 100 mg of MDMA as well as a variety of the above substances. Trying to calculate dosages from tablets containing unknown quantities of MDMA can be difficult, but a good quality tablet of street ecstasy generally contains an average of between 75 and 100 mg MDMA. The chart below shows dosages for pure MDMA, measured in milligrams (mg).
Threshhold 30 mg
Avg for small or sensitive people 50 - 75 mg
Avg for most people 75 - 125 mg
Avg for large or un-sensitive people 125 - 175 mg
Required by few (side effects increase) 200 + mg
LD50 (Lethal Dose*) 106 mg/kg or ~6,000 mg
Duration : 3-5 hours
Normal After Effects : up to 24 hours
* LD50 = dose which will kill 50% of the tested animals.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Overdose Effects:
Vomiting, headaches and dizziness may result from too high a dose of MDMA. Some people are considerably more sensitive to MDMA than others. Be careful if you are using MDMA for the first time or using material of an unknown purity and strength. Always start low.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
LD50 SOURCES
UNITED STATES DEPARTMENT OF JUSTICE - DEA
In The Matter Of MDMA SCHEDULING
FRANCIS L. YOUNG, Administrative Law Judge
[full text]
33. The estimated oral LD50 for MDMA in rats, as noted above, is 325 mg./kg., i.e., 325 mg. of MDMA per kilogram of weight of the rat. The effective oral human dose is 2 mg./kg. of weight. Thus there appears to be a comparatively large margin of safety in the use of MDMA in humans - the LD50 is 160 times the ED50 in humans.
29. Intraperitoneal LD50's for MDA and MDMA were determined in mice by Davis. The LD50's of MDMA and MDA were substantially the same with the LD50 for MDA equaling 90.0 mg./kg. and the LD50 for MDMA equaling 106.5 mg./kg. Dr. Hardman found the LD50 of MDA to be 92 mg./kg. Davis also found that both MDA and MDMA showed the amphetamine-like property of increased lethality under aggregated housing conditions compared to isolated housing conditions.
illimex
Bluelighter
To Johnny Boy.
The very reason you know people who have died form taking MDMA is because of the fact that your peer group consists of people who take, or have taken MDMA. If your peer group consisted of avid street crossers or gobstopper maniacs, I'm sure you'd be able to quote a couple deaths for us.
MDMA is not totally safe. By the same token, neither are pretzels (just ask George Bush).
But hey, here are some links... (Note that neither of the Gobstopper stories resulted in death, probably due to the fact that it's much easier to save a choker than someone whose brain is folding in on itself)
Boy almost died from Gobstopper
http://www.westernwheel.com/980916/news-choking.html
Toddler Chokes on Gobstopper
http://www.altavista.com/sites/search/web?q=choked+on+gobstopper&avkw=tgz&kl=XX
kid dies after choking on a balloon (not a gobstopper...but hey BALLOONS AREN'T EVEN SUPPOSED TO GO IN YOUR MOUTH!!!)
http://www.southbendtribune.com/99/jul/070399/obituary/201896.htm
And now for the street crossers.
http://lb.msnbc.com/local/KHQ/M206956.asp
http://www.cnn.com/WORLD/9710/20/romania.stunt.show/
http://onenews.nzoom.com/onenews_detail/0,1227,113475-1-7,00.html
http://www.ireland.com/newspaper/breaking/2001/0201/breaking13.htm
AND THAT'S only the first page of an altavista search, and I didn't even take all the links!!!!
To clarify though (this was mostly for humor), MDMA is NOT COMPLETELY SAFE. Sorry, but that's just how it goes...however, it's risks, when weighed against other things that are legal are not as prominant.
The only real answer is the answer we always get. Know your sources, test your pills, be safe.
The only use of any substance should be responsible use.
signing off
The very reason you know people who have died form taking MDMA is because of the fact that your peer group consists of people who take, or have taken MDMA. If your peer group consisted of avid street crossers or gobstopper maniacs, I'm sure you'd be able to quote a couple deaths for us.
MDMA is not totally safe. By the same token, neither are pretzels (just ask George Bush).
But hey, here are some links... (Note that neither of the Gobstopper stories resulted in death, probably due to the fact that it's much easier to save a choker than someone whose brain is folding in on itself)
Boy almost died from Gobstopper
http://www.westernwheel.com/980916/news-choking.html
Toddler Chokes on Gobstopper
http://www.altavista.com/sites/search/web?q=choked+on+gobstopper&avkw=tgz&kl=XX
kid dies after choking on a balloon (not a gobstopper...but hey BALLOONS AREN'T EVEN SUPPOSED TO GO IN YOUR MOUTH!!!)
http://www.southbendtribune.com/99/jul/070399/obituary/201896.htm
And now for the street crossers.
http://lb.msnbc.com/local/KHQ/M206956.asp
http://www.cnn.com/WORLD/9710/20/romania.stunt.show/
http://onenews.nzoom.com/onenews_detail/0,1227,113475-1-7,00.html
http://www.ireland.com/newspaper/breaking/2001/0201/breaking13.htm
AND THAT'S only the first page of an altavista search, and I didn't even take all the links!!!!
To clarify though (this was mostly for humor), MDMA is NOT COMPLETELY SAFE. Sorry, but that's just how it goes...however, it's risks, when weighed against other things that are legal are not as prominant.
The only real answer is the answer we always get. Know your sources, test your pills, be safe.
The only use of any substance should be responsible use.
signing off
Infinite Jest
Bluelight Crew
illimex
Bluelighter
I wasn't forgetting the other ways to die from MDMA...in fact their is a footnote regarding the "inside" and "outside" (for lack of a better term...example being doing it at a club and doing it at home) use of the drug and the rate being higher when done "outside". (or at a club)
That's why I posted the fact sheet. To give some concise information. No drug is completely safe.
Then again, No skateboard is either. And neither is any front door, or any car, or any electrical outlet... I believe the original poster is just trying to say that ecstasy is not as dangerous as the media portays it to be....but I am not saying that it can't be dangerous.
(my own footnote: inside (isolated housing conditions) outside (aggregated housing conditions)
[ 22 July 2002: Message edited by: illimex ]
[ 22 July 2002: Message edited by: illimex ]
That's why I posted the fact sheet. To give some concise information. No drug is completely safe.
Then again, No skateboard is either. And neither is any front door, or any car, or any electrical outlet... I believe the original poster is just trying to say that ecstasy is not as dangerous as the media portays it to be....but I am not saying that it can't be dangerous.
(my own footnote: inside (isolated housing conditions) outside (aggregated housing conditions)
[ 22 July 2002: Message edited by: illimex ]
[ 22 July 2002: Message edited by: illimex ]
Scatteredasfuck
Bluelighter
I feel that we must take an educated choice on what we do with our life.By trying to do these things that we choose in as safe a manner as possible.I look before I leap...& sometimes decide not to leap
Although just because something is legal or natural doesn't mean that we won't have a bad reaction to it now does it?
Ecstacy definitly isn't totally safe but not a lot in life that we do is...but ecstacy is probably more unpredictable than a fair few of the things we choose to do in life.Then again think about all the current medications for ADD they are currently under the spot light for possible short & longterm side effects that where unknown in clinical testing...maybe they got passed a bit too early.
There's a heap more medicines in many different cirles that have alot to answer for after their release into the mainstream.
I try to learn as much as possible about ANYTHING I put into my body or DO with my body.I think that's the best I can do in order to experience the most out of life while still trying to also die in my sleep but even that isn't guaranteed to happen either, no matter what I do.
I read up on the precriptions the doctors give me and talk to them about what I've read before I even take them,because I know they don't know it all & Neither do I.The doctors are always interested in the information I bring in from the internet from various medical sites that differs from or adds to their information/beliefs.
[ 23 July 2002: Message edited by: Scatteredasfuck ]
Although just because something is legal or natural doesn't mean that we won't have a bad reaction to it now does it?
Ecstacy definitly isn't totally safe but not a lot in life that we do is...but ecstacy is probably more unpredictable than a fair few of the things we choose to do in life.Then again think about all the current medications for ADD they are currently under the spot light for possible short & longterm side effects that where unknown in clinical testing...maybe they got passed a bit too early.
There's a heap more medicines in many different cirles that have alot to answer for after their release into the mainstream.
I try to learn as much as possible about ANYTHING I put into my body or DO with my body.I think that's the best I can do in order to experience the most out of life while still trying to also die in my sleep but even that isn't guaranteed to happen either, no matter what I do.
I read up on the precriptions the doctors give me and talk to them about what I've read before I even take them,because I know they don't know it all & Neither do I.The doctors are always interested in the information I bring in from the internet from various medical sites that differs from or adds to their information/beliefs.
[ 23 July 2002: Message edited by: Scatteredasfuck ]
Basicaly all I'm saying in this thread is use your brian, LD50 means shit, the figures are probably extrapolated from tests on mice and monkeys not humans.
Do you think they just round up a thousand inmates and dose them up on 5g MDMA and see how many die.
LD50 is the last of you're worries, especialy if you live in America where MDMA is so dam expensive.
All I'm asking is that you think about the risk you take for a few hours of artaficial fun.
I don't want to be a kiljoy and I'm certainly not a preacher but it annoys me so much when I see people fooling themself into a sense of security because they have read a few pages on erowid or bluelight, the same people who take pills every week but convince themselves their alright because their post loading with 5-htp.
Just know that MDMA is completley safe until it kills you
Do you think they just round up a thousand inmates and dose them up on 5g MDMA and see how many die.
LD50 is the last of you're worries, especialy if you live in America where MDMA is so dam expensive.
All I'm asking is that you think about the risk you take for a few hours of artaficial fun.
I don't want to be a kiljoy and I'm certainly not a preacher but it annoys me so much when I see people fooling themself into a sense of security because they have read a few pages on erowid or bluelight, the same people who take pills every week but convince themselves their alright because their post loading with 5-htp.
Just know that MDMA is completley safe until it kills you
illimex
thoses links are pathetic, of course people have died from that. But if you eat a gobstopper corectly you wouldn't die the chemicals inside wouldn't throw your brain chemistry so out of whack it kills you, MDMA used correctly could still kill you.
In the UK a 10 year old died not long ago taking 1 MDMA pill she found at home. No she didn't choke on a gobstopper instead she probaly had the worst few hours of her short life while her pulse hit 190 and bodied burned up. I'd rather choke.
thoses links are pathetic, of course people have died from that. But if you eat a gobstopper corectly you wouldn't die the chemicals inside wouldn't throw your brain chemistry so out of whack it kills you, MDMA used correctly could still kill you.
In the UK a 10 year old died not long ago taking 1 MDMA pill she found at home. No she didn't choke on a gobstopper instead she probaly had the worst few hours of her short life while her pulse hit 190 and bodied burned up. I'd rather choke.
illimex
Bluelighter
ten year old...i think you made the point yourself.
And nobodies saying MDMA is completely safe. The links are pathetic? They are only examples and it was a focking joke anyway so lighten up.
This is the problem with those who think people who advocate harm reduction are only "fooling themselves." Harm reduction is exactly what it claims to be...it is not a magic left hook into deaths jaw, knocking him unconscious until after your roll has faded away. It's a way of saying, "look, people are doing ecstasy, we should probably give them information that could save their lives instead of ruining it with jailtime." That's all.
I never once advocated fooling yourself into thinking ecstasy can never kill. But if it hasn't by now, it probably won't if you take precautions. Johnny Boy, the stance you take makes you sound like you should be on the DEA message board instead of bluelight.
I'm sorry a ten year old died in the UK from taking MDMA. Ten years olds die from taking too much OTC medication as well (stuff, left around for kids to eat, is the responsibility of the adult involved. You don't leave MDMA lying around, looking to a kid like a new type of childrens vitamin most likely, to be eaten.) All I have promoted here is responsibility. If you see something else, you're imagining it.
Not to be mean, but lighten up a bit.
(And don't think I don't understand the mentality that you speak of. Some people just spew forth statistics to suit their own purposes. I am not one of those people...I just say, if you're going to risk you're life, (which you do every day anyway just by waking up!) wear your god damned seat belt!)
And nobodies saying MDMA is completely safe. The links are pathetic? They are only examples and it was a focking joke anyway so lighten up.
This is the problem with those who think people who advocate harm reduction are only "fooling themselves." Harm reduction is exactly what it claims to be...it is not a magic left hook into deaths jaw, knocking him unconscious until after your roll has faded away. It's a way of saying, "look, people are doing ecstasy, we should probably give them information that could save their lives instead of ruining it with jailtime." That's all.
I never once advocated fooling yourself into thinking ecstasy can never kill. But if it hasn't by now, it probably won't if you take precautions. Johnny Boy, the stance you take makes you sound like you should be on the DEA message board instead of bluelight.
I'm sorry a ten year old died in the UK from taking MDMA. Ten years olds die from taking too much OTC medication as well (stuff, left around for kids to eat, is the responsibility of the adult involved. You don't leave MDMA lying around, looking to a kid like a new type of childrens vitamin most likely, to be eaten.) All I have promoted here is responsibility. If you see something else, you're imagining it.
Not to be mean, but lighten up a bit.
(And don't think I don't understand the mentality that you speak of. Some people just spew forth statistics to suit their own purposes. I am not one of those people...I just say, if you're going to risk you're life, (which you do every day anyway just by waking up!) wear your god damned seat belt!)
stardragon
Bluelighter
Scatteredasfuck
Bluelighter
I can see what very important points Johny Boy & illimex are trying to put across.Well worth both your efforts & most others...IMHO
Johny Boy doesn't want inexperienced people, who might be clicking through these pages/this site for the first time, to get dangerously wrong ideas from a quick read...might be a 10yr old or similar reading what you all just wrote!
Just remember that when wording your responses.Try to at least put out your opinion from a harm minimisation point of view.
Which a lot of the topic does
[ 24 July 2002: Message edited by: Scatteredasfuck ]
Johny Boy doesn't want inexperienced people, who might be clicking through these pages/this site for the first time, to get dangerously wrong ideas from a quick read...might be a 10yr old or similar reading what you all just wrote!
Just remember that when wording your responses.Try to at least put out your opinion from a harm minimisation point of view.
Which a lot of the topic does
[ 24 July 2002: Message edited by: Scatteredasfuck ]
brazilian vibe
Bluelighter
- Joined
- Jul 5, 2002
- Messages
- 202
I´ve read all posts in this topic and I agree with some, and disagree with some others..
I think I agree with ppl who try to get well informed before they even think about buying a pill of MDMA ... information is the power.. Also always try to see which information is real scientific fact and which one is just media crap...
Also u have to learn how to use drugs.. any drug.. even aspirine.. Most important thing about MDMA: the effect happens because of the serotonine you have inside your brain... Taking MDMA will cause it to release all at once ( not exactly this... all at a period of 3 hours,or so..) . Thats why u feel the way u fell when u'are on E. Serotonine takes up to 2 weeks to be re-produced by your brain.. SO...... Why taking 4 pills or 5 pills in a period of a week ?? Know how to use the drug....
thats my point, of course u can disagree with it!
feel free!
good rolling...
I think I agree with ppl who try to get well informed before they even think about buying a pill of MDMA ... information is the power.. Also always try to see which information is real scientific fact and which one is just media crap...
Also u have to learn how to use drugs.. any drug.. even aspirine.. Most important thing about MDMA: the effect happens because of the serotonine you have inside your brain... Taking MDMA will cause it to release all at once ( not exactly this... all at a period of 3 hours,or so..) . Thats why u feel the way u fell when u'are on E. Serotonine takes up to 2 weeks to be re-produced by your brain.. SO...... Why taking 4 pills or 5 pills in a period of a week ?? Know how to use the drug....
thats my point, of course u can disagree with it!
feel free!
good rolling...