Exorcism

[Maya]

I haven't actually seen an actual exorcism performed but have seen some documentaries regarding exorcism to drive out the devil out of a human body possessed by it. I am actually watching this atm on youtube:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MVc634VdkfM

The intellectual people on this forum can probably share thoughts on Exorcism, including beliefs and perception. My question is, how does the devil able to enter/inhabit the body of a human being without even using tools such as spirit boards? Can the person fight it off even without performing exorcism?

 

[Foreigner]

My understanding of possession from all of the ancient occult texts I've read is that the entity has to be very strong and close to the physical plane, and must be attempting to invade a body that is either incredibly weak (i.e. a major crack in the aura) or the person directly invites them in. The Catholic Church tends to describe the entities as demons, and particularly powerful ones, who prey on weak humans.

I don't really see what spirit boards have to do with it. A spirit board is just an intentional tool, no different than if you were sitting there inviting some force into you. Invocation is a fool's errand but some people enjoy living dangerously.

Having said all this, it's likely that nearly 100% of all historical possession cases were due to ignorance of mental illness. I still do believe that an extremely rare, less-than-one-percent of cases are the real deal.

 

[-=SS=-]

Firstly it's not the devil. The devil is a human created myth resulting from our linear thinking - If there is a god/heaven then there must be a devil/hell.

I see possession as the invasion of a foreign mentality into a person, but it doesn't happen all at once.. like all of a sudden *bam* you're possessed. I think there's certain things we do that expose us or make us vunerable to these mental parasites or entities, but it's only when say 90% of our actions are the result of this outside mentality that we become possessed and the mentality does with our body as it wishes. Up until that critical point we are hosting one or more entities, which try to exert pressure upon the mind of the person through thoughts and impressions in order to achieve a certain end, but we're still largely "us".

I believe a lot of serial killers, serial rapists, and those that go down that path are possessed. In Ted Bundy's final interview before execution he alludes to being possessed. I think there is a connection between sexual energy and energy released from killing someone that these entities are after.. like leeches all they want is a certain energy source, but rather than blood it's a more refined energy we have.

 

[HypGnosis]

I don't discount the possibility of possession, and I'd agree with Foreigner that pretty much all suspected cases of it are mis-diagnosed mental illness.

The archetypes which make up our mind can sometimes take on a life of themselves if they are not kept in check, and they can seem like an outside influence.

I think the best way to handle either possession, or archetypal manifestation, is to know yourself; know your mind, control your mind - this is not always easy, I know. Silence is golden..... But I think in both cases, it's better to start from the premise that ultimately, you can control this. Nothing is stronger than the source, and we are all inseparable from it. Draw from it, you can conquer anything.

 

[jpgrdnr]

Cultural relativistic answer:

how does the devil able to enter/inhabit the body of a human being without even using tools such as spirit boards?

Demons are quite capable of entering hosts without any sort of medium. There doesn't need to be a reason.

Can the person fight it off even without performing exorcism?

No.

.....

I've always wondered at the connection between psychosis and possession, and how deeply religious persons sort of become self-possessed. Or not deeply religious really. I mean in psychiatry there's a whole slew of disorders and labels that virtually mimic demonic possession. I think it does stem from a sort of cultural background where a person becomes fixated on the idea that they are possessed, ie mania. Its a neurological disconnect brought on by fever or acute psychosis. Even a traumatic brain injury can mimic symptoms of possession, or epilepsy.

Let's take a look at the symptoms:

erased memories or personalities - coping mechanism of trauma, avoidance behavior, PTSD, dissociation, common in victims of severe abuse
convulsions, “fits” and fainting as if one were dying - ? acute anxiety, insomnia, high fever, delerium brought on by illness
access to hidden knowledge (gnosis) and foreign languages (xenoglossia), - mania, prepsychotic behavior involving intense study of another language or related materials, even the study of demons, etc.
drastic changes in vocal intonation and facial structure, - psychosis with mania related to possession, self serving behavior
the sudden appearance of injuries (scratches, bite marks) or lesions - self harm, acute illness
superhuman strength - psychosis, fight or flight response, neurological injury, "fear" - possible panic disorder - anxiety

I think what's more at issue is the Catholic Church's borderline stone age perspective on these issues. They are operating very much on an old, historical method that is dangerously ignorant:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jeremy_Davies_(exorcist)

His book, Exorcism: Understanding Exorcism in Scripture and Practice was published in 2008 by the Catholic Truth Society. In the book he warns against the New Age, the occult, promiscuity, homosexuality and pornography saying that involvement in these things can lead to dire spiritual consequences.[2]

I mean really? Being gay is an invitation to demonic possession? Its like they are buying into their own bullshit.

 

[HypGnosis]

^So if you need an exorcism to rid yourself of a demon, but you reject the church's methods, how would you go about it?

 

[jpgrdnr]

^So if you need an exorcism to rid yourself of a demon, but you reject the church's methods, how would you go about it?

^ Well, demons exist cross culturally. They are prominent in Japan, aboriginal cultures, First Nations peoples, the Haitian zombie might be viewed as a form of demonic possession, etc. etc. If you look at The Exorcist, the film itself addresses that concern that you have to first identify the demon you are dealing with.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pazuzu

With an anthropological perspective Pazuzu actually exists. Meaning that for the Assyrians and Babylonians who believed in such a demon, he was a being to be feared:

bringing famine during dry seasons, and locusts during rainy seasons

. Yet to note as well:

Pazuzu was said to be invoked in amulets, which combat the powers of his rival,[1] the malicious goddess Lamashtu, who was believed to cause harm to mother and child during childbirth.

So more often than not demons serve a dual purpose, or many purposes. They are not inherrently "evil" in the Western view, or more specifically a Christian view.

I mean if you think of the very idea of Jesuit and Catholic priests trying to fight a demon possession by an old Assyrian demon... Well shit, that's just silly - its like fighting a forest fire with a cup of water. Its not very culturally relative. You would presumably have to use Babylonian methods not Christian ones.

All an exorcism is... is a rite or a series of rites that the possessed sees as valuable to the process of recovery. Think of it as an intense form of therapy. You're playing into that person's sense or idea of possession, whatever is of value to them.

how would you go about it?

For me? I would personally call the police, as that person is a danger to themselves or others.

 

[jpgrdnr]

Also as a valid point, there is a definite link between drug abuse and "demonic possession." More often than not I'm willing to bet, people at risk who use drugs have a higher likelihood of entering into some form of crisis.

 

[Ninae]

I kind of view it like this:

The physical world is the "floor" of the entire creation, or the lowest level. Above there are innumerable levels made of some form of energy. And although it's seen as an illusion, in the sense that all things are temporary and in a state of decay, it has a "realness" to it that the planes of energy lack (where things can be manipulated by your thought and in many places you can create any reality you wish for for yourself, like in a dream).

When something happens here it stays that way and can't just be changed the next moment, which makes it extra-special dramatic and exciting to watch, and there are many are watching us, like a recurring soap. Many would also like to be able to exert an influence on what happenes here, even if they don't have bodies, or to experience things that can only be experienced here, and attaching themselves to a soul in a living body seems to be a way of doing that.

So we are probably all influeneced by a number of entities, both posititive and negative, at all times. The old idea of an angel and devil fighting in your head is probably truer than most realise. Anyway, there's a difference between what could be called normal spirit-influence and possession. Both in the number of spirits, their reasons for it, and the control they get over your soul.

 

[HypGnosis]

jpgrdnr - I do see your point about entering into a series of rites that act as a form of therapy. Sometimes finding the silence is near impossible, so points of focus that take your thoughts to a better place, may be of better use in some instances.

 

[jpgrdnr]

Sometimes finding the silence is near impossible, so points of focus that take your thoughts to a better place, may be of better use in some instances.

All I'm alluding to is the simple act of entertaining the person's delusions. Its a basic premise in crisis intervention. I'm not going to contradict someone who believes they are possessed. I've heard of mock exorcisms being conducted as a form of therapy in inpatient settings. Whether that's rumor or not I don't know. I think trying to conduct any form of exorcism is illegal and most of all very unsafe for everyone involved. I'm not talking about meditation. Just to be clear.

Outside of Western medicine, and in 2nd world and 3rd world countries where medical care isn't available, I'm sure, and I know for a fact community members would conduct rituals based around demons and protection methods. This could be anything from cleansing the water, to protecting someone against spells involved in a fight, blessing the food, to someone who has a common cold. What we see as demons is hugely different from what some other culture sees. Heck, I'm sure in some cultures there are long ceremonies involved in welcoming demons, encouraging possession or working oneself into frenzied states, and some sort of cure or cleansing process. There's a huge gap between the cultural association Westerners have with demons and what someone else may have.

 

[HypGnosis]

All I'm alluding to is the simple act of entertaining the person's delusions. Its a basic premise in crisis intervention. I'm not going to contradict someone who believes they are possessed.

Going slightly off topic, but within the scope of your point; would you say it's right to entertain a person's delusions in all cases? E.G if a person believed their carer was not their carer, but possessed by an alien, should the carer take on the role of the alien, in order to placate the sufferer (if that makes sense?)?

 

[naughtynicknails]

Having said all this, it's likely that nearly 100% of all historical possession cases were due to ignorance of mental illness.

Fixed

Going slightly off topic, but within the scope of your point; would you say it's right to entertain a person's delusions in all cases? E.G if a person believed their carer was not their carer, but possessed by an alien, should the carer take on the role of the alien, in order to placate the sufferer (if that makes sense?)?

No. Confirming negative delusions will only make it worse.

 

[HypGnosis]

No. Confirming negative delusions will only make it worse.

^ That was how I instinctively felt when I saw it happening.

 

[Morphling]

Exorcism is just another form of evocation. All the rituals I've read more or less boil down to threatening the invading spirit with a stronger spirit, i.e. god or similar.

 

[Foreigner]

^ I thought evocation was summoning a spirit forth, whereas invocation is taking it into you. Correct me if I'm wrong.

 

[Morphling]

No, you are correct. In the case of exorcism, one would be evoking the spirit out of the human body. It's an oversimplified explanation, but accurate.

 

[Ninae]

Exorcism is just another form of evocation. All the rituals I've read more or less boil down to threatening the invading spirit with a stronger spirit, i.e. god or similar.

It's kind of like that too. I had an "Exorcism" performed once, though it was more like a New Age healing/channeling session than a classic Caholic exorcism with a cross, etc. She said Jesus Christ was standing in front of me and Archangel Michael at my back and was conferring with them throughout the sessions.

And you might say they are two stronger spirits. It took two sessions as they said only 150 or so could be safely removed the first time. Then the rest went the second. She said there were 500 in all. The last 5 were reluctant to leave and had to be persuadeded.

 

[T. Calderone]

I've never witnessed anyone possessed or have seen apparitions myself (touch wood) From my understanding, actual demonic possession cases are so rare. People may come across entities but for the most part they are human spirits. They could remain earthbound for unfinished business in life, not necessarily a certain location but could stay attached to a person.

Practicing with oujia boards, tarot cards, séances, etc. can be dangerous because you are in essence inviting ungodly spirits to enter your domain. They could be outside your home waiting for this invitation. That's all it takes for a demonic infestation or possession to occur. This is what I believe and have no proof of this phenomenon. I would advise people to keep away from these things though.

 

[Magickduck]

I was coming on here to make a post about a friend I believe may be possessed. Synchronicity?
http://www.bluelight.ru/vb/threads/683519-Evil-Spirits-Demonic-Possession