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Enlightenment

Grampa Trigger...

More like GURU Trigger!

I dunno. Enlightenment is kind of an anecdote in and of itself. Can't prove or disprove, but there are some compelling things that suggest some have incredibly advanced sensory perception. Sometimes said to be attained through enlightenment.

Though I wouldn't call it evidence. Nor do I buy into or believe/disbelieve in heaven. But I think there is truth in mental enlightenment, the meditative practices of the buddhist monks, etc. Countless studies on meditation... hell, even useless prayer.
 
I'd get myself a Guru..... IF

IF S/He already knew S/He is
Whom S/He is
As we are
And could carry me Extra extra far.....

I'd get myself a Guru.

BUT, I doubt when they suddenly pout
When they angrily cast "them" out
When they ask about collecting:
Plates and shops and T shirts
If selling books
And ugly mugs
Badly done CDs of songs

I'd get myself a Guru
If I met one Probably
One owning own income
Independent outflow
Not needing me
Paradoxically
 
I've always felt that if you have to pay for a Guru then the odds aren't good. All spiritual instruction should be free imo. That's why I never charge.
 
I think "enlightenment" is a loaded and relative term. I think people can experience insight and objective viewpoints to varying levels of success, at various times. My idea of enlightenment is being able to be objective and balanced with your own analysis of yourself as much as possible, as well as towards others, and coming to a place where you are comfortable with what you believe, are consistent and are able to live a good life with it and be a good thing for other people. I think everyone's journey is different but a lot of people on every different path do not display these characteristics, and some do on every different path. It takes an infinity of experiences to make up the universe, and everyone's place is different. Sometimes discussion of enlightenment become a form of ego masturbation. Not saying you're doing that by the way Ninae, but it happens a lot. It's easy to start feeling superior when you know the One True Path(tm), but no path is right for everyone.

That said, I think mindfulness and self-analysis are extremely important to anyone, as is being around uplifting and like-minded people.
 
Ninae said:
Well, have you read any of the modern teachers on enlightenement? David Hawkins and Eckart Tolle were two great enlightened teachers who made it accessible to the general public. Or how much do you know about the modern enlightment seeking community?
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Yeah I have. I could write that shit and I'm not enlightened. Or am I? Look this is all rehashed shit. These guys are in the business of enlightenment. They are no more enlightened than you although they may be more intelligent.
 
It was supposed to be the opposite of ego-masturbation, LOL. Or just sharing what has worked for me without getting into any long discussions to justify or prove myself. But I guess it's possible to view everything negatively.
 
Everything Negatively? Come on get real please. I'm saying you don't know. How many dupes have worshiped this or that Guru /Master only to find at some point that they are stealing all the money or having sex with the women ect. Do you think they weren't sure in the same way you are sure? Think on these things.

If you don't want a critique of your ideas and methods maybe best not to post them. I'm not saying that to be mean. I'm saying that to save you some grief.
 
Ok, so I don't know. Because you say so. Fine by me, and let's leave it at that.

But I haven't been worshipping any gurus or master. That's all in your head, so why even bring it up? I've been studying the most traditional and acclaimed teachers for a while now (who you don't even seem familiar with, but still feel the need to have an opinion about). That is what would I call unfounded negativity.

Anyway, I think I'll just post quotes that have helped me from now, so it won't be so "ego-centric".
 
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"Joy, always joy."

"All sorrow finished," "The deep, deep ocean of joy within," "Being filled with joy," "Singing joy unending."

"I am satisfied — I see, dance, laugh, sing." "Wandering, amazed at my own lightness and glee." "O the joy of my spirit — it is uncaged— it darts like lightning."

"The ocean filled with joy — the atmosphere all joy! Joy, joy, in freedom, worship, love!"

"Joy in the ecstasy of life: Enough to merely be! Enough to breathe! Joy, Joy! All over joy!"

- Walt Whitman
 
Ninae: I just wanted to say that I wasn't trying to attack you at all, this thread just brought up the thoughts I posted. I like that you're so passionate about what you believe and that you are coming from a loving place.
 
Ninae said:
Ok, so I don't know. Because you say so. Fine by me, and let's leave it at that.

But I haven't been worshipping any gurus or master. That's all in your head, so why even bring it up? I've been studying the most traditional and acclaimed teachers for a while now (who you don't even seem familiar with, but still feel the need to have an opinion about). That is what would I call unfounded negativity.

Anyway, I think I'll just post quotes that have helped me from now, so it won't be so "ego-centric".
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I've looking into many of the writings of traditional teachings over more years then you likely have been alive. They say basically the same things and I'm not saying everything they say is false.
 
"Uncontional love is a practical, reasonable, and reachable goal in a human lifetime. From that level spiritual commitment and dedication evolves into states of esquisite joy - even ecstacy - and eventually reach the level of peace at 600, which is the beginning level of the mystic."

- David Hawkins
 
“I had a magical day during one Sunday when I walked out in nature.

On the outside this day only consisted of taking a walk out in the beautiful sunny weather and cleaning my apartment, but on the inside everything suddenly changed. When I walked out in nature in the sunny weather, a silent explosion suddenly happened within me and my whole perception of reality changed.

In a single moment, everything had changed, although nothing on the outside had really changed. Everything on the outside was exactly as before, but my way of seeing had changed. The difference was that before I did not see and now I could see. My eyes were open. Suddenly I was one with everything, one with the stones, one with the trees and one with the people that I meet on my walk. My heart danced with joy together with a feeling of: ”I am God”.

Not that I am the creator of everything, but that I am part of the Whole, part of the divine. It felt like coming home, that Existence is my home. I also saw that even if the people that I meet did not understand that they are a part of the Whole, they still are a part of the Whole. I felt the waves of Existence in my own heart and being and I felt like a small wave in a great ocean. It gave a taste of the eternal, a taste of the limitless and boundless source of creativity. In just a few moments, I learnt more than during 20 years in university.

Wisdom is basically the understanding that we all are part of the Whole. We are all small rivers moving towards the ocean. I laughed at the fact that enlightenment is really our innate birthright, and that small children already live in this mystical unity with the Whole.”

- Swami Dhyan Giten
 
One Thousand Words said:
As a rich white, male omnivore I have reached entitlement a long time ago
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One Thousand Words said:
The only check I need is the one for this grass fed steak
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yum.

Ninae said:
"Uncontional love is a practical, reasonable, and reachable goal in a human lifetime. From that level spiritual commitment and dedication evolves into states of esquisite joy - even ecstacy - and eventually reach the level of peace at 600, which is the beginning level of the mystic."

- David Hawkins
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Interesting. I've never heard of a level you reach in your training, other than 9000 of course ;) . Spiritual levels are compared in so many different ways. What's odd, though, is the simple fact that once those comparisons have left, all you have is ... well, your actions that you do each day. All anything becomes is actions once thoughts are taken away. We can compare and think we've accomplished something more than others or less than them. My question is how can anyone be sure that there is enlightenment? If all we become once our thoughts fall away is actions, can we think about enlightenment anymore?
 
When you really study all the accounts that have been left about it, it slowly starts to become more real for you. Not that many have really read the bible or the Eastern texts. It's more like they've heard of it.

Even Jesus travelled the world to study and learn before he started to have a good idea about it.
 
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