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  • EADD Moderators: Pissed_and_messed | Shinji Ikari

"Drugs are never going to lead to anything positive"

I've always had doubts about development of human sentience and psychedelics as the effects on one person are not inheritable by future generations unless psychedelics had some sort of mutagenic activity. That they might have given an already developing sense of awareness a tweak to encourage the development of religions and thoughts about the origin of the universe I'm in no doubt, but an actual role in the development of self awareness as an inheritable trait, I don't think so.

I didn't know Bill Hicks was a believer in Terrence McKenna's theories; I find it a bit of a shame as I've always liked Bill Hicks, but side with the people seeing Terrence McKenna as a bit of a self deluded individual - definitely so on the pharmacology of psychedelics, but also a bit of a flakey person otherwise in the same way some new age people are (or to put it in the vernacular, someone who never came down from orbit)
 
fastandbulbous said:
I've always had doubts about development of human sentience and psychedelics as the effects on one person are not inheritable by future generations unless psychedelics had some sort of mutagenic activity. That they might have given an already developing sense of awareness a tweak to encourage the development of religions and thoughts about the origin of the universe I'm in no doubt, but an actual role in the development of self awareness as an inheritable trait, I don't think so.
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I see it more as being an aspect of culture development. As certain cultures and ways of living evolved, certain drug use/rituals/ceremonies etc. would develop within some of these early tribes/societies and the acceptability and use of whatever psychoactive would be learned and handed down from generation to generation. Whether that be smoking tobacco, or taking stimulants for example, which one couldn't really claim is that mind expanding (although I suppose it's all relative, and we are all individuals) or taking hallucinogenic drugs, which in my opinion and probably most peoples, are the best sorts of drugs for self discovery, or communicating with the spirit world or the gods which is what a lot of tribes believe/believed they are/were doing (including tribes that take hallucinogens in that statement as well.)
 
^ Yeah, that I can see, their inmfluence on culture, but not the caveman eating mushrooms and suddenly developing self awareness stuff

Just you wait a couple more years...
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I'm quite happy to book a holiday foe 2013 and pay for it up front. All this 2012 hysteria has all the hallmarks of the millenium bug horror. People seem desparate to envisage the end of human society as we know it - look at how many 'end of the world cults' have ended up looking rather silly...(well at least the ones that don't end up topping all their members and making it look like suicide so that no one is around to be told,"we told you so" after the world doesn't end!)
 
fastandbulbous said:
I've always had doubts about development of human sentience and psychedelics as the effects on one person are not inheritable by future generations unless psychedelics had some sort of mutagenic activity. That they might have given an already developing sense of awareness a tweak to encourage the development of religions and thoughts about the origin of the universe I'm in no doubt, but an actual role in the development of self awareness as an inheritable trait, I don't think so.
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I think things that are not directly inheritable (through genetics) can still have an effect on human evolution.

The development of agriculture would be one example - sure you need to have a certain level of inteligence and manual dexterity before you can become a farmer but once the skills are in place they get taught from one generation to the next, it's not like you get little farmers born with the knowledge (unlike ants say).

Use of psychadelics could be another socially learned form of behaviour (like farming), so in this respect i can imagine it affecting the course of evolution.

Although the advantages to a society (in evolutionary terms at least) of taking psychadelics are a lot less obvious than the advantages of being good at farming. Having said that i'm doubtful that psychadelics represent a magic bullet for the development of self awareness. More likely just another small factor in our overall development.
 
Some ants 'farm' aphids for their sugary secretions. I always liked that..and throw it in the face of religious folk who use such an example as farming as a distinction between us and other creatures.
 
Drugs are an altered state,but if that state is more preferable to how you normally feel then at least temporarily it is positive.
I just wish I could find an anti-depressant that actually helped me instead of self-medicating with "drugs":(
 
^ After much searching, I found lofepramine did the trick better than most, but of course everybody is different. You have to just keep trying until you find the one that suits you

BTW Drugs led to Bluelight, which is responsible for hosting this question, so to make the original statement expressed in the thread title here is rather self defeating

One more thing, where else would I have the opportunity to express ideas like trolls line dancing to 'Hocus Pocus' by Focus? Of course drugs can lead to something positive!! =D=D=D
 
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