BirdOfPrey
Greenlighter
Okay, so here's my long story short...
Gender: Male
Age: 22
Let me start by saying that I never imagined I'd be here. I used to be horrified of opiates, and the progression of addiction is just astounding. Anyhow..... When I was around 16 years old, I began trading weed for Vicodin with a friend. Opioids and any form of "hard drug" scared the shit out of me. I placed the Vicodin lovingly in a corner of my drawer and never even considered taking it but figured I would sell it some day. One month later, I had a horrendous wisdom tooth extraction which I was completely awake for (the teeth were horribly impacted). Strangely enough, however, I was not in pain after the surgery. The doctor did not send me home with a script but instead said to "call if I needed a stronger med than ibuprofen". Here I was, thinking to myself: "Well, I guess I'm a little curious...it's a doctor giving it to me right?....I'm not really in pain but what the hell..". I picked up my cell phone and made that damning, life-changing phone call to the doctor. I was prescribed Tyenol 3s (Codeine 30mg/Acetaminophen). From the first pill my mother gave me, I was an instant opiate addict. I scrounged the kitchen that night in search of the bottle, and loved the subtle warm glow that seemed to increase with each pill. Long story short, my progression went something like this: I took codeine, why not the Vicodin in my drawer? I took Vicodin, why not a 5mg oxycodone? I took a 5mg oxyodone, why not start doing 30mg Roxicets/Oxycontins? Now I provide this background information just to let people know I am by NO means an opiate naive individual. Anyhow, the limited accessibility and my low income at that age prevented me from developing a full blown daily opiate habit, although I did obsess over opiates daily. In comes Kratom. When I first ordered a package of Kratom, I was unbelievably skeptical. I swallowed down around 6 grams of Bali leaf, and went downstairs. Thirty minutes later I felt a familiar sensation creep up on me; warmth in the face, itching, butterflies in my stomach. I felt as if I had discovered the light bulb. As an avid proponent of herbal medicines and natural living (ironic that I'm trying suboxone now eh...) I was so happy to finally not have to feel guilty about my pill habit and have this readily accessible leaf at my disposal whenever I wished for a minimal fee. Now I know all drugs affect people different, but TO ME, Kratom is more euphoric than any "real" opiate anywhere. The difference being that I believe, as others have noted, that Kratom has what I would call "emotional depth". To me, it feels (felt, past tense....) like an incredibly potent opiate nod coupled with an energizing and empathogenic euphoria characteristic of a low dose of MDMA (not quite, but this is the only way I can describe it). Anyhow, fast forward 5 years later, and I am going through 1000 grams a month. Yes, you read it correctly, a KILO a month. I do understand why people often do not believe kratom has a severe withdrawal; heck, even 2 years in I quit for 3 months cold turkey with no withdrawal in sight. But trust me, over time, it will hit you; cold sweats, restless legs, feelings of dispair, anxiety, hopelessness, lethargy...you name it. Anyhow, I am now 15 days "clean" from kratom, taking 16 milligrams of buprenorphine/naloxone daily. Don't get me wrong, I feel ups and downs, but for the most part I feel like I'm walking on sunshine. No more worrying about running out of kratom, no more need to redose due to buprenorphine's extremely long half-life, and no more "kratom crashes"(which only came about during the end of my use). During the end of my kratom use, I would simply get a "lift" for around 15 minutes ( even from fucking 6 grams of UEI!!!), followed by a feeling of apathy, dispair, and lethargy, which I would try to chase away with kratom all day; it is simply a different drug to me than when I started. I feel GREAT right now. I know suboxone is used in refractory deperession due to its kappa antagonism and partial mu-agonism, and I certainly feel these effects. Anyhow, after that lengthy novel, here is my question...
Has anyone who has been on Suboxone long term experienced a dip in this mood boost that suboxone initially gives? I am by NO means talking about a "high", as my opiate tolerence (yes, simply from kratom..) is so high that 16mg does not give me anything remotely close to an opiate high. I am simply talking about this mood boost the suboxone gives me where I feel "normal" (as if I never had an addiction to opiates) and can go about my day. I am hoping that I will continue to sustain this good mood, but was wondering if anyone out there has found that this fades and that suboxone simply becomes another opioid which causes depression and dependency. Anyone out there with some input?
By the way, I am really sorry for the lengthy story. That story was more so to warn others out there that although kratom is a beautiful and miraculous plant which should NEVER be made illegal and should be an option for pain patients using opioid painkillers, it is still a potent drug that is underestimated and deserves respect. Kratom's power really is horribly underestimated. Anyways, any responses to how suboxone feels in the long term would be awesome.
Much love,
BirdOfPrey
Gender: Male
Age: 22
Let me start by saying that I never imagined I'd be here. I used to be horrified of opiates, and the progression of addiction is just astounding. Anyhow..... When I was around 16 years old, I began trading weed for Vicodin with a friend. Opioids and any form of "hard drug" scared the shit out of me. I placed the Vicodin lovingly in a corner of my drawer and never even considered taking it but figured I would sell it some day. One month later, I had a horrendous wisdom tooth extraction which I was completely awake for (the teeth were horribly impacted). Strangely enough, however, I was not in pain after the surgery. The doctor did not send me home with a script but instead said to "call if I needed a stronger med than ibuprofen". Here I was, thinking to myself: "Well, I guess I'm a little curious...it's a doctor giving it to me right?....I'm not really in pain but what the hell..". I picked up my cell phone and made that damning, life-changing phone call to the doctor. I was prescribed Tyenol 3s (Codeine 30mg/Acetaminophen). From the first pill my mother gave me, I was an instant opiate addict. I scrounged the kitchen that night in search of the bottle, and loved the subtle warm glow that seemed to increase with each pill. Long story short, my progression went something like this: I took codeine, why not the Vicodin in my drawer? I took Vicodin, why not a 5mg oxycodone? I took a 5mg oxyodone, why not start doing 30mg Roxicets/Oxycontins? Now I provide this background information just to let people know I am by NO means an opiate naive individual. Anyhow, the limited accessibility and my low income at that age prevented me from developing a full blown daily opiate habit, although I did obsess over opiates daily. In comes Kratom. When I first ordered a package of Kratom, I was unbelievably skeptical. I swallowed down around 6 grams of Bali leaf, and went downstairs. Thirty minutes later I felt a familiar sensation creep up on me; warmth in the face, itching, butterflies in my stomach. I felt as if I had discovered the light bulb. As an avid proponent of herbal medicines and natural living (ironic that I'm trying suboxone now eh...) I was so happy to finally not have to feel guilty about my pill habit and have this readily accessible leaf at my disposal whenever I wished for a minimal fee. Now I know all drugs affect people different, but TO ME, Kratom is more euphoric than any "real" opiate anywhere. The difference being that I believe, as others have noted, that Kratom has what I would call "emotional depth". To me, it feels (felt, past tense....) like an incredibly potent opiate nod coupled with an energizing and empathogenic euphoria characteristic of a low dose of MDMA (not quite, but this is the only way I can describe it). Anyhow, fast forward 5 years later, and I am going through 1000 grams a month. Yes, you read it correctly, a KILO a month. I do understand why people often do not believe kratom has a severe withdrawal; heck, even 2 years in I quit for 3 months cold turkey with no withdrawal in sight. But trust me, over time, it will hit you; cold sweats, restless legs, feelings of dispair, anxiety, hopelessness, lethargy...you name it. Anyhow, I am now 15 days "clean" from kratom, taking 16 milligrams of buprenorphine/naloxone daily. Don't get me wrong, I feel ups and downs, but for the most part I feel like I'm walking on sunshine. No more worrying about running out of kratom, no more need to redose due to buprenorphine's extremely long half-life, and no more "kratom crashes"(which only came about during the end of my use). During the end of my kratom use, I would simply get a "lift" for around 15 minutes ( even from fucking 6 grams of UEI!!!), followed by a feeling of apathy, dispair, and lethargy, which I would try to chase away with kratom all day; it is simply a different drug to me than when I started. I feel GREAT right now. I know suboxone is used in refractory deperession due to its kappa antagonism and partial mu-agonism, and I certainly feel these effects. Anyhow, after that lengthy novel, here is my question...
Has anyone who has been on Suboxone long term experienced a dip in this mood boost that suboxone initially gives? I am by NO means talking about a "high", as my opiate tolerence (yes, simply from kratom..) is so high that 16mg does not give me anything remotely close to an opiate high. I am simply talking about this mood boost the suboxone gives me where I feel "normal" (as if I never had an addiction to opiates) and can go about my day. I am hoping that I will continue to sustain this good mood, but was wondering if anyone out there has found that this fades and that suboxone simply becomes another opioid which causes depression and dependency. Anyone out there with some input?
By the way, I am really sorry for the lengthy story. That story was more so to warn others out there that although kratom is a beautiful and miraculous plant which should NEVER be made illegal and should be an option for pain patients using opioid painkillers, it is still a potent drug that is underestimated and deserves respect. Kratom's power really is horribly underestimated. Anyways, any responses to how suboxone feels in the long term would be awesome.
Much love,
BirdOfPrey
Last edited:
. I really never knew how strong kratom could be. Yes, it did take MUCH longer to get this addicted to Kratom than it would with OCs. I mean shit, like I said, even after 2 years of daily kratom dosing I could still quit with just minor irritability. But after 5 years, just to show some out there how strong kratom is, 200mg of oxycodone won't even touch me (and I don't even do oxycodone! or any other prescription opiate for that matter! it was an experiment). Anyhow, yeah, I get nowhere near a high from the Suboxone. I do however notice that the "mood lift" dips later in the day and I get slightly depressed, but nothing that I can't cure with a bit of Holy Basil or Wild Lettuce Tea followed by a good meditation session burning some frankincense/myrhh 
