Phenethylamines Do you consider MDMA a psychedelic?

[(V)enthol.]

Even though I wouldnt consider them Psychedelics(rather Methamphetamines)...Pure MDMA I've had, Gave me great visuals, but NOTHING like the MDA Ive had, White Doves & Yellow Ying Yangs back in 2003 made me hallucinate very strongly during the come up, for a good 20-30 min, then it was the super sllloowww faced feeling from MDA. Probably some of the most pleasant and strong visuals. Im no new-comer to Psychedelics & RC's either.

 

[WaseFraKa]

^^ try 2c-t-21 in higher dosage and it can get very visual and very spiritual...a wonderful tool (I don't comment on mdma as I'm still waiting for the good oportunity)

 

[cosmic charlie]

I voted yes because I use it for what psychedelic effects it has and its other perks it has . I only use it when i cant get Lsd or mushrooms though and thats pretty rare . So i guess i dont like it too much.

 

[poppinE]

yes, a high enough dose puts me in a trance where i can't talk to anyone. All I do is close my eyes and experience the most sharp & clear visuals I have had on any psychedelic, they all tend to involve rotating 2D jigsaws that feature colours in the blue / green area of the light spectrum.

Damn. I want that haha. I still see trails from my earlier thizzin times.

 

[LordKrishna]

yep. I still have a place in my heart for mdma.

haven't touched in over half a year. in 6 more months I think I will again.

 

[clash888]

I think MDMA is most definitely a psychedelic. It may not produce psychedelic effects every time it's consumed, especially when it is abused, but i have had several extremely profound and undoubtedly psychedelic and mind expanding experiences from it. I have even experienced what was essentially a bad trip, in the same way as you would have with say LSD. It was not as intense as bad LSD trips can be, but it was very constructive in the same way that bad trips produced by traditional psychedelics can be.

 

[Shambles]

I would say yes, albeit of a very different approach to other pschedelics. I've discovered many "truths" under the influence of MDMA - thoughts and feelings which linger long after the drug has faded and (to an extent) have changed my outlook, behaviour and understanding of others greatly and for the better.

Perhaps this isn't the same thing as a "true" psychedelic, but as far as my understanding and definition of the term goes, it is to me .

This is all in regards to crystal MDMA, incidentally - especially IV use at highish doses. Which I should also point out is probably not the healthiest of activities .

 

[danalprazolam]

Somone I know was close to one of the people who originally started getting this stuff out there. Anyways they always called it "yuppy acid". There really old school.

I consider it a psychedelic and a stimulant. I think the psychedlic properties in it are what made it a stimulant that doesn't cause people to get mad.

When I first took a really strong tab of mdma. I started getting that rush feeling then visualizing the exact screen were typing on now, thinking of everyone talking about drugs and what not. Also all this other really great stuff. I was also doing Nas at the same time.

When I drove home after the "roll ended" The street lights were still insaine. You couldn't help but look and stair at them. Like squid deep in the ocean that are attracted to the light

 

[bluedolphin]

It is a psychedelic in my book....assuming we use the definition of psychedelic as "mind expanding drug." For unlike Bluedolphin's experiences, MDMA has given me insights that make it indistinguishable in effect from LSD/mescaline-type psychedelics. These insights are not the type of effect I associate with ketamine-type high and I do not consider ketamine a psychedelic at all.

Hehe, I know this is one thing we have always disagreed on .. On almost any other subject I'd have to be a fool to disagree but I find it interesting that you don't consider Ketamine a psychedelic also!

I should clarify. MDMA has indeed given me some rather profound insights.

However, upon coming down from the drug, I find most of these "insights" to be rather shallow, overly positive and generally one-sided products of the pervasive euphoria. These insights have simply not enriched my life or helped me in any way. I feel that MDMA reveals truths in the moment. But not nescessarily objective truths.

If the definition of a psychedelic is a "mind expanding drug", I feel that MDMA walks a fine line. My opinion is that it doesn't really expand the mind universally, rather, it forces it in a temporarily positive direction. This is more of a "push" than "mind expansion" and therefore I liken it more to a euphoriant/stimulant.

Psychedelics are often associated with visuals, and most will cause visuals, but I agree this is not what we base the definition on.

Ketamine, on the other hand, I feel is incredibly psychedelic. It allows expansion of the mind in any direction, almost infinite possibilities abound. There is no emotional push... rather it has a neutralizing effect on emotion. Not to mention entity contact, deep revelations, and astounding fractal visuals. Not to mention Ketamine is an immense psychedelic catalyst...

Much like cannabis

 

[eye kant spehll]

MDA most definitely is psychedelic, and the psychedelic effects from MDMA are usually (at least, this is what I've heard) from high dosing and subsequent metabolisis of some fraction into an active quantity of MDA.

So direct cerebral administration of MDMA may not result in psychedelia, and as such MDMA may not be a psychedelic in and of itself (and interestingly I may have read of a study done on rats in which intracerebral administration of MDMA did not result in any neurotoxicity). But yes, the fact that one of its metabolites is psychedelic should qualify as a psychedelic attribute.

exactly what I was gonna say! MDA all the way. MDMA is eh

 

[butane]

MDMA has given me profound, life-changing insights that, in my mind, most certainly qualify it as a psychedelic. A non-traditional psychedelic no doubt, but a psychedelic nonetheless.

 

[<Third_Eye_Lasik>]

Chemist pending.

 

[Morninggloryseed]

Ketamine, on the other hand, I feel is incredibly psychedelic. It allows expansion of the mind in any direction, almost infinite possibilities abound. There is no emotional push... rather it has a neutralizing effect on emotion. Not to mention entity contact, deep revelations, and astounding fractal visuals. Not to mention Ketamine is an immense psychedelic catalyst...

Much like cannabis

Really, its semantics. Of course, I've had psychedelic-type experiences on ketamine, as I have on cannabis and even opiates. But the general ketamine experience is so far removed and different from a typical LSD/mescalin experience, I have to put it in a different catagory...where a night of MDMA tripping is not too distinguishable from a night of LSD tripping, if one were to observe my behavior actions. Id even suggest ketamine goes BEYOND a psychedelic experience...whatever you want to call it...but its still different enough in nature that I can't lump it (ketamine) with LSD and the others.

 

[eye kant spehll]

Pollified

To me, MDMA is most definitely not psychedelic, the same way Ketamine and C. indica are not psychedelic. I use the word "psychedelic" not for its literal meaning, but as a very strict classification of certain effect that some chemicals elicit (of which the measuring stick has been, traditionally, LSD (or DOI if you're a rat in certain labs). I think this is necessary, because taking drug classes for literal value and playing with that leads to disasters like "omgz! Ketamine are a horse tranquilizer".

On top of that, "empathogen" and "entactogen" to me are properties, not a class of drugs, because they tend to appear in several different classes. I don't think anyone can argue against the case that Heroin has entactogenic properties... but so does cocaine, and therefore you cannot really make that a class since both drugs already belong to well-established classes of their own (depressant and stimulant, respectively).

To clarify: let's take depressants for example. There are "classic" criteria for a drug to be called a "depressant", which generally conform to the qualities elicited by barbiturates. Now, I have personally experienced lethargia and "drowsiness" (and I know many of you know what I'm talking about) with meth. Does that mean that I can say that meth is a depressant? No. It may sometimes show depressant-like qualities, but it certainly isn't one. The same goes for drugs (like MDMA) that may "open your mind" (ie. mind-expanding) in certian sets and settings, but it cannot be classified as a psychedelic because it does not fit the criteria of which the precedent, as mentioned above, is LSD.

For me, MDMA (as well as Methylone (and analogues), and 4-FA) are simply stimulants that work on the emotions rather than on thought. I find that MDMA does to my feelings EXACTLY what amphetamines do to my intellect (and on a personal note, both end up with a feeling of being cheated, but thats another story).

On the other hand, AMT, MDA and (arguably) some of the 2Cs, although posessing empathogenic and entactogenic properties, are most definitely psychedelic.

So my answer is a solid ABSOLUTELY NOT.

EDIT: Re. MMDA and 2C-T-21

I never tried MMDA, but from its description it fits very well with the "emotional stimulant" category I class MDMA in. 2C-T-21 is a powerful psychedelic at high doses, but in lower doses it is not (the same way a low-dose of LSD is not psychedelic).

ketalar has made me tripp balls b4....like harder than some of my acid trips. so I'd say K is def a psychadelic.

 

[PumpkinSprouts]

Eh it is to a point. Enhances senses for me at least.

 

[Piper methysticum]

I replied to a thread with this same question before, and I have a completely different answer. It could have even been this thread actually, but I didn't take time to check.

However, it doesn't matter because my opinion has changed since. I used to think MDMA was merely an extremely euphoric stimulant labled an entactogen or empathogen until I tried MDA.

I had used MDMA three times before this experience, and I had also used Methylone a few times before I ever tried MDMA again. To get to the point, MDA opened a window in my mind and really showed me the value of these type of drugs.

I have used MDMA and Methylone (which I consider to be a compound that takes you very close to the same place in the mind as MDMA) plenty of times, and I've had wonderful connecting and bonding experiences. It has inspired me to draw, write, and use the creative aspects of my mind, hence I now say that it is psychedelic.

It certainly isn't a traditional type of psychedelic such as even some of Shulgin's Tryptamines and Phenethylamines can be labled since they are so close to the structures of their natural counterparts, but it is what I would consider a mild psychedelic, going beyond that of Cannabis for a good bit of people.

 

[Isolator]

If you've ever seen a lightshow on E and a lightshow sober, you'd know that MDMA definitely has psychedelic properties to it. As well as the afterglow and the change of perspective after rolling. That's a definite yes from me.

 

[rational_animal]

From my experience its hard to say one way or the other as the chemistry of most batches of bills differ - hence our loving referencing to whatever trip we had with what we recall were our favourite pillz.

Thinking about the caps of molly i have had I would not say that MDMA is psychedelic in the way that LSD-25 and shrooms and mescaline are - no full on turning reality inside out. What I felt was pure pleasure - as I would expect if I had deliberately flooded my brain with serotonin. No synaesthesia either on MDMA although I love what it does for music.

Also, I can sit out a whole session at home and never feel the urge to dance - unlike so many others I know.

 

[Syd_Barret]

Do I consider mdma a psychedelic? Up until recently I would have said no, but recently I had one night in which I dosed very high on mdma, (1.8 grams over the course of a night) and it was indeed psychedelic. Colors were shifting, shadows seemed to move, auditory hallucinations. At one point in the night, i went to the kitchen for a glass of water, and there across the room sitting in a chair was a pile of my friends laundry, I glanced at it, and i became overwhelmed with terror for about 3 seconds because I thought I was looking at an "evil" reflection of myself (it was very dark in the room). I even went so far as to call to it/him, "Hello, someone there?" Of course i quickly realized how silly this was, and saw it as a pile of laundry again.

Frightening for a second. Otherwise the visuals were nice though, i would have preferred to have someone there and perhaps some music on, but my friends were sleeping.. I think that would have helped a bit with the paranoia, which was pretty negligible anyways.

 

[sandy]

Yes, it is. And the effects depends on how much and how recently one has eaten. Normally it is said that MDMA takes 30-60 minutes and sometimes as long as 2 hours to take effect. But unlike many other psycho actives, the onset of MDMA is very quick.