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Ethnobotanicals [DMT Extraction Subthread] Phalaris Grass

Having high dmt/5-meo-dmt content is good, but please pay attention to my comment on Gramine. I know for a fact that it is a very toxic substance, but I am not sure exactly how so.
 
Gramine is technically not a tryptamine, but it's an indole alkaloid very similar to DMT with only one less carbon in its molecule, and yes it is very toxic to humans. (Edit: not sure about the exact mechanism of toxicity either, but I'd guess it has something to do with what it metabolizes into in the body)

Anyway, I tried to find some information regarding the alkaloid content of P. brachystachys and came up with nothing that mentions gramine. There doesn't seem to be much actual scientific data on this species (at least that I could find at the moment - gotta admit I'm sorta sleep deprived though).

According to Erowid:
Phalaris brachystachys

An extremely strong occurrence of DMT was reported, using HPLC, in material from Portugal. DMT was the sole alkaloid. Festi & Samorini 1994b

Strongly positive human bioassays have been reported using clones originating from both Algeria and Greece. DeKorne 1997.

30 grams of fresh foliage was reported to be too much by EH, MA (1997 Entheogen Review page 15)

Appleseed's assays detected 5-MeO-DMT in several strains obtained from the USDA GRIN; including P.I. 202676 & P.I. 231044 Greece. (The latter was found to be a spreading form with good biomass production.)

http://www.erowid.org/library/books_online/ayahuasca_apa/aya_sec3_part2_phalaris_strains.shtml
 
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brachystachys said:
delta, that link you provided appears to go to a closed and archived thread. i don't see a 'reply' option there.
Click to expand...

Oh my, I need to update that!

EDIT: Updated the Best of PD links. Now the DMT entry has an extra archived scraps link (like before), and also a link to the archived old incarnation of the B&D DMT thread.
 
Recept said:
30 grams of fresh foliage was reported to be too much by EH, MA (1997 Entheogen Review page 15)
Click to expand...

This is very strange that they only reported that little blurb from Entheogen Review. Here is the full report from "EH" :

EH, of MA made an ayahuasca brew using 30 gm of fresh P. brachystachys (grown from *** seeds) and 5 gm Peganum Harmala seeds. It came on within two hours and was pleasant for about an hour, but soon became extremely intense, with continuous diarrhea and vomiting, left side of body numb, racing thoughts, anxiety, etc. This went on for 36 hours! After coming down, some pleasant visuals returned to cycle in and out over a period of two days: "It even woke me out of sound sleep with strong sounds of weird things. I've never experienced this before, never wish to again. Either I'm very sensitive or this strain was kick ass."

Actually it seems VERY irresponsible of erowid not to mention the fact that EH was apparently tripping for three and a half days!

I just received seeds from a different source than is mentioned in the blurb and despite this report plan on investigating with caution.
 
If it turns out that this is the much dreamed of 'high yield, easy to extract & pretty much pure' source of DMT everybody here dreams about, I think this is a rare case of a greenlighter deserving several gold stars for their contribution =D
 
^ Sounds rather wonderful, the idea of people getting heavily into greenkeeping is somewhat appealing to me. :D



F & B never mind the gold stars , we could invent " Greenlighter" points ( as opposed to blue) and shower this username with synchronos multiples of 23 points at a time.;)

Sounds bloody great really:)
 
thanks for that, fastandbulbous and B9. i was just baffled that even years after the discovery and reporting of this species, it is still fairly unknown, or simply not believed possible. i think a lot of people wrote the Phalaris genus off entirely after attempting to work with P. aquatica and P. arundinacea and getting so fed up with it.
 
Seems like every year or so people get excited and start working on the Phalaris grasses. I have heard flaky rumors of success but all the reliable well-documented extractions seem to be failures.
Seems like they have inconsistent content and a lot of unknown toxic compounds coming out of them.
It would be way cool if this strand is different then the rest of the ones that were supposed to be the “one” but I’m not getting my hopes up until I start seeing some real reports of successful extractions.
 
With the phalaris species... you have to have the cutting of the right strain... as I recall, seeds don't actually carry the genetic "success factor" into the plants which grow from it.

I recently met someone who has worked with phalaris in europe and gotten results... and he is a real chem head who works in the industry professionally... for your average amateur person, phalaris is a big red herring I think.... and will generally take a lot of unfruitful work to get working. (if you are lucky enough to)

Even then, my friend said the nature of the tryptamines garned from phalaris is not pleasant and/or useful to him and he much prefers acacia tryptamines... probably due to the 5meo in the species he was working with.

This phalaris brachystachys may well be worth a shot if you want to put some work into it... I haven't heard success stories with it apart from here.... so I can't see how it is a "sure thing" that can be relied upon...

I once asked trout how many people he knew who had got phalaris working... he said one or two.... not one, not two - one or two. And I don't think he included himself in that!


Julian.
 
So far, of those actually working with brachystachys, every report I've read has been successful. There is also a huge difference between working with homegrown plants of known virtue and wild strains. The issue with seeds is the difficulty in controlling which plant pollinates since wild phalaris is everywhere.

There's also like 15 to 20 times more tryptamines n the PB being investigated and the phalaris previously investigated.
 
Wow, 36 hours of ayahuasca? Taking two hours to come on? That sounds ridiculous! In my experience it hits quite strong within 15-25 minutes and lasts approximately 3-4 hours. It sounds like a massive overdose to me.

Recently my completely bare back yard had grass sod laid down and I could help think what a waste it was. It would be great if some rogue psychonaut started a grass company and started supplying large amounts of DMT containing grasses to the urban market. Imagine being able to cut your lawn (or someone else's), and make DMT!

I think the juicing idea also has some merit. The juicer I have seems to reduce plant matter of any type to a very small amount of concentrated bitter liquid, which I would assume contains most of the active alkaloids.
 
What a nice thought: go mow the lawn put the clippings in to the juicer and go lay on the hammock while your wife brings you homemade DMT juice. That’s an American dream!

I say American dream because we all have hammocks, lawns and 2.3 kids
 
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This exact same thread was started in 3 different forums. I am thinking someone has some commercial interests in Phalaris brachystachys.
 
actually, it was a total of 7 different forums i posted to. here on bluelight has been one of the more active of those threads. as i've stated elsewhere, my interest is in seeing this species more widely cultivated, as well as adding my voice to those who consider it to be a useful plant.
 
My guess would be who ever started these threads are the same people who trying to sell brachystachys plants that they grew this summer before the weather gets to cold to ship them. Just more vendor spam in the world of ethnobotanicals.

“Tryptamine concentrations can be at least 2 to 3 times that of Mimosa hostilis” I call bullshit.
I’m sure everyone will get the usual pile of toxic goo like all the rest of the Phalaris.
 
squerll said:
My guess would be who ever started these threads are the same people who trying to sell brachystachys plants that they grew this summer before the weather gets to cold to ship them. Just more vendor spam in the world of ethnobotanicals.

“Tryptamine concentrations can be at least 2 to 3 times that of Mimosa hostilis” I call bullshit.
I’m sure everyone will get the usual pile of toxic goo like all the rest of the Phalaris.
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ok, i feel compelled to respond to this, as i am this "who ever" you're referring to. let me set the record straight. your guess is 100% wrong.

do i expect to gain from the cultivation of this species? yes, but not in the way you are assuming. you see, i believe humanity is in a desparate situation. i also believe this certain molecule can help us. now...if this molecule could be accessible to a larger section of the population by the research into new plant species, that would be a good thing.

i hope several people will get this species established in their gardens and then give seeds away for free to others. to be honest, i would say that a final verdict on the reliability of this species is still not reached, but the research is looking more and more valid as additional people work with p. brachystachys.

i do appreciate all the discussion, by the way. it is useful.
 
Laughable at best. Psychedelics can't save the world, nor can they change anyone. Change comes from within...and people have to want to change. it is not that I have lost any faith in the psychedelic experience....I haven't.

But it is very naive to believe that DMT is the magic key to saving humanity. Anyone remember the 60s? Has anything really changed?

brachystachys said:
ok, i feel compelled to respond to this, as i am this "who ever" you're referring to. let me set the record straight. your guess is 100% wrong.

do i expect to gain from the cultivation of this species? yes, but not in the way you are assuming. you see, i believe humanity is in a desparate situation. i also believe this certain molecule can help us. now...if this molecule could be accessible to a larger section of the population by the research into new plant species, that would be a good thing.

i hope several people will get this species established in their gardens and then give seeds away for free to others. to be honest, i would say that a final verdict on the reliability of this species is still not reached, but the research is looking more and more valid as additional people work with p. brachystachys.

i do appreciate all the discussion, by the way. it is useful.
Click to expand...
 
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