Dealing with Addiction.

[killo]

Ok get this, I have smoked weed for about 1.5 years and I am on my 8th day of being sober.

The only shitty part was the first 2 days(because you mentally catch yourself thinking about it, after that I got into a regular schedule of just doing things not high. I do some of the same stuff, I even still sit here and zone out. After a few days I really haven't even thought about bud, I was even offered 5 times since I quit. I passed up a bowl 4 fucking times, good chronic....haha

I guess I'm just happy with life, so I don't NEED weed to add that sense of "new" to my perception.

I decided I wanted to quit 2 months after my last acid trip.

It's going great so far, I feel I've learned alot about myself just from doing this. It's very differnet.

Some things that are definetly true.

- Quiting weed makes you eat more than usual, normal eating patterns when sober.
- Sleep is not as easy to fall into.
- Dreams are so vivd and easy to remember now, while smokin bud I NEVER remembered dreams.
- I'm more alert and anxious/figity(this might do with my own body, I seem to have some sorta ADHD anyway, I never diagnosed by a doctor though.

Anyway so far so good, I'm looking forward to smoking my first bowl of kind bud after 2 months, it will be ridiculous having no mental tolerance lol.

Everyone should try it, you can always go back. Test yourself, quit 2 months!

 

[Khadijah]

I've quit cigg's, I've cut coke down to about once or twice every 2 weeks (from about 4-5 times a week), I roll about once a month now, after rolling about 2-3 times per 2 weeks for about 6 months...

I know these are kinda minor.. but while I could stop those and not let any habits get to out of control before I put a stop to it...

I have smoked weed everyday for about 3 years now.

Anyone who says weed isn't addictive just hasn't been addicted to it. There are millions of people (such as my self.. ), who are proof it is addictive.

How are you proof that its addictive? all you said is you smoke weed everyday for 3 years now. nothin more. So are you sayin that the reason you smoke everyday is cuz you addicted? by that reasoning then wouldnt all heavy smokers be"addicted" to it. if its like you say, and daily smokin for 3 years got you hooked....Well theres a whole bunch of us out there who are daily smokers, whats the difference. If you have a lil trouble sleeping when you aint got weed, is that addiction? What do you define it as?

I started smokin 6, 7 years ago, been usin daily for at the VERY least 3-4 years. And i feel no problems from not smokin weed w hen i stop. the other day i was real sick for 2 days and couldnt get out of bed so i didnt smoke for 2 days and it made no difference at all. Yea, everyone is different , but this is my point. Theres a huge amount of daily smokers. THeres a small amount, out of that large number, that say they are addicted. The rest dont seem to experience that.

I dont think it goes like that with heroin or meth. "I been usin daily for 3 years now, but i aint addicted" You wont find that like you will with weed. Using those drugs, by that time you are addicted. very few if any people could maintain a DAILY heroin habit for more than a couple months much less YEARS without inevitably becomin extremely physically addicted. You cant say the same thing for weed. Its in your head yo. If you been thru it, then tell me, buit i never heard of anyone goin thru agonizing pain, cold and hot sweats, every single thing in their body aching, wanting to die, throwing up, havin the shits so bad you worry your gonna shit your pants, from quitting marijuana.

I never said it aint addictive i said if you addicted to it, be happy, cuz it aint shit to become de-addicted from it and after a few days youll be just fine and dandy.

"Anyone who says it aint addictive never been addicted to it."

That statement should say "Anyone who says it aint that addictive is able to understand that it is not as much of a bad thing as other addictions, and is much easier to deal with and overcome."

 

[Khadijah]

Yo yo yo yo
Schizophrenia, how many of ya got it?
How many motherfuckers can say they psychotic?
How many motherfuckers can say they brain dry-rotted from pot?
You got it like I got it or not?
If you did, you would know just what Im talkin bout
When your tongues rottin out from cotton-mouth
When you end up becomin so dependent on weed
That you end up spendin a g in the vendin machine
You got the munchies, look at you, junk food junkie
Potato chips and lunch meat, up in the front seat
Sometimes you can get so paranoid from ganja
Thats it gotcha thinkin the whole world is watchin ya


some of us really do know just what he's talking about, my tongue even started to "rot out" towards the end from all the smoke coupled with lack of salvia. eminem wasn't joking when he wrote this.

Dude, i really dont think quoting Eminem lyrics is a good way to back up your point. did you forget the whole "eminem likes to rhyme about shit and exaggerate it to crazy levels when in the persona of slim shady" thing?

 

[the seeker]

i shouldn't even have to back it up, i have no reason to lie about this and i think its pretty obvious how heavy marijuana smoking could start to affect your tongue.. have none of you here ever experienced cottonmouth?

 

[the seeker]

How are you proof that its addictive? all you said is you smoke weed everyday for 3 years now. nothin more. So are you sayin that the reason you smoke everyday is cuz you addicted? by that reasoning then wouldnt all heavy smokers be"addicted" to it. if its like you say, and daily smokin for 3 years got you hooked....Well theres a whole bunch of us out there who are daily smokers, whats the difference. If you have a lil trouble sleeping when you aint got weed, is that addiction? What do you define it as?

I started smokin 6, 7 years ago, been usin daily for at the VERY least 3-4 years. And i feel no problems from not smokin weed w hen i stop. the other day i was real sick for 2 days and couldnt get out of bed so i didnt smoke for 2 days and it made no difference at all. Yea, everyone is different , but this is my point. Theres a huge amount of daily smokers. THeres a small amount, out of that large number, that say they are addicted. The rest dont seem to experience that.

I dont think it goes like that with heroin or meth. "I been usin daily for 3 years now, but i aint addicted" You wont find that like you will with weed. Using those drugs, by that time you are addicted. very few if any people could maintain a DAILY heroin habit for more than a couple months much less YEARS without inevitably becomin extremely physically addicted. You cant say the same thing for weed. Its in your head yo. If you been thru it, then tell me, buit i never heard of anyone goin thru agonizing pain, cold and hot sweats, every single thing in their body aching, wanting to die, throwing up, havin the shits so bad you worry your gonna shit your pants, from quitting marijuana.

stop comparring weed to heroin, as if heroin is the only addictive substance. no one denies that tobaccio is addictive and yet the study i posted earlier found the withdrawal symptoms of tobacco were similar in intensity and time course as those of marijuana.

I never said it aint addictive i said if you addicted to it, be happy, cuz it aint shit to become de-addicted from it and after a few days youll be just fine and dandy.

this isn't true. i wasn't fine and dandy just a few days after stopping. by your logic, cigarettes "aint shit" to become addicted to either and the addiction is "in your head" but why don't you tell that to all the people out there who can't stop smoking when their lives depend on it? the reality is that the place addictions occur is "in your head". the idea that addiction was a primarily physical illness has been debunked for ages. no matter how bad heroin withdrawal may be, many addicts still make it through. the fact that they often relapse months of even years later long past the initial withdrawal stages proves that their addiction is "in their head" too. in other words, addiction and physical dependency aren't the same thing (although they are interelated) and you are confusing them with eachother.

That statement should say "Anyone who says it aint that addictive is able to understand that it is not as much of a bad thing as other addictions, and is much easier to deal with and overcome."

this may be generally true but it says nothing about individual cases. you need to understand that everyone is different. for some people weed is no big deal to them at all, they cant for the life of them comprehend how it could be addictive or dangerous when compared to other drugs. then there are people who find it insanely difficult to control their cannabis usage while they may have little to no problem being an occasional user of other drugs. some people find the withdrawal from cannabis excruciating and feel they cannot live without it, other people stop one day and claim to not experience withdrawal. all the generalizations you are trying to make, dont hold true for all people and the bottom line is that marijuana is a substance that possesses addictive qualities. you can argue on and on that they are less severe than other drugs but i dont think anyone here is saying they arent. no one is saying theyd rather go through heroin withdrawal than weed withdrawal, theyre just saying weed is still addictive.

 

[Khadijah]

i shouldn't even have to back it up, i have no reason to lie about this and i think its pretty obvious how heavy marijuana smoking could start to affect your tongue.. have none of you here ever experienced cottonmouth?

Do you live in ethiopia or some shit? Cuz last time i checked theres this "store" type thing, where you go to purchase beverages. Thats like saying "My nose got so stuffy and runny and dripped snot everywhere." well get a damn tissue. cottonmouth + drink = no more cottonmouth. come on.

 

[the seeker]

Do you live in ethiopia or some shit? Cuz last time i checked theres this "store" type thing, where you go to purchase beverages. Thats like saying "My nose got so stuffy and runny and dripped snot everywhere." well get a damn tissue. cottonmouth + drink = no more cottonmouth. come on.

believe it or not, smoking weed affected my tongue.

 

[Blowmonkey]

Bullshit. A dry mouth is harmless. Your tongue won't rot away due to smoking weed. You might run into infections a little earlier due to a lack of saliva, but if you've got an infection you should see the doctor and not let your tongue rot away. If you've got a dry mouth you should drink, easy as pie, problem solved. It wasn't the weed that was the deciding factor here, but your; sorry for my french, ignorance and lack of health care.

 

[the seeker]

it wasn't an infection, it was like dead skin on the top of my tongue or something and it went away as soon as i stopped smoking weed. it wasn't only the dry mouth but the affect of smoking too. smoking isn't good for your mouth. this isn't rocket science. who are you to deny my experience?

i find it quite ironic that you make statements like "constructive replies only" and then reply with statements like "

"omfg

DARE has gotten to you.. I'm not gonna argue further, I wanna leave it at this, lol.."


hypocritical much? you can't prove that smoking cant have a negative affect on your tongue. all you can do is listen to my experience and choose to believe it not to believe it. i don't see why you find it necessary to be hostle about this. what kind of moderator are you anyway?

 

[shags2dope78]

Rather or not your tongue really was affected due to dry mouth is up to you. I know that I smoke weed and always get cottonmouth and have my tongue is just fine. Even when I was little before I started smoking weed, I would constantly have dry mouth because of the medicines I was on for ADD and all that.

As far as it being addictive, I have smoked marijuana for 3 years every single day and when I was arrested, I quit for 1 year due to probation. I felt no sort of withdrawal effects at all. Now, I am back smoking again and can go doing it nonstop for a week to not doing it all and still feel the same.

I'm not going to call anyone liars in here because I just don't know. All I really know is from my personal experience and from the experiences of friends.

 

[TheodoreRoosevelt]

Haha Marijuana is not an addictive substance... It can be, like any other activity, an addictive activity. But it is not an addictive substance at all.

Insomnia? Restlessness? Those are just symptoms of being BORED, which comes when you quit something that has become routine to you.

My, my.

 

[the seeker]

Haha Marijuana is not an addictive substance... It can be, like any other activity, an addictive activity. But it is not an addictive substance at all.

Insomnia? Restlessness? Those are just symptoms of being BORED, which comes when you quit something that has become routine to you.

My, my.

ignorance like this is why these threads always go so many pages. by your same logic, tobacco isn't an addictive substance either. of course the rest of the world knows differently.

 

[TheodoreRoosevelt]

If you actually read what I said, you'll notice I said substance. Marijuana is not an addictive substance. Cocaine, is not an addictive substance. Heroin, is an addictive substance. Lorazepam is an addictive substance. Phenobarbital is an addictive substance.

Sex, marijuana, cocaine, World of Warcraft - these are addictive activities. And psychological addiction is much harder, in my opinion, to overcome than physical. For example, if you blew smoke in someone's face every night, and then stopped after a month, they would be fine. If you shot up heroin in someone in their sleep every night for a month, at the end they would be sick as shit and needing a hit to function.

However, despite all this, I do think the notion of being addicted to marijuana is a little silly.

So get it through your skull that marijuana is not an addictive substance, you will not go into physical withdrawal and be kicking and screaming on the floor if you stop smoking (unless your pathetic). Heroin will do that to you. I am not trying to say marijuana cannot be addictive, the key to addiction is always pyschological.

As for what I said about insomnia and restlessness, when you quit a routine activity boredom becomes very serious. You get restless. Restlessness is one of the major causes for clinical chronic insomnia. So I am by no means trivializing that, but what I am saying is just because you are getting some short term insomnia does not mean you have sure-fire proof you were physically addicted.

I could give a rat's ass about the world's opinion. Iran is a member of the UN, the FDA prevents drugs from coming out which could help people (including marijuana), and slavery still exists in this world. So I could care less about world opinion, they hardly serve as any meter for truth or integrity.

I don't think your in any position to call me ignorant but I'm not going to go on and break a bunch of Bluelight rules here with you. However, I would like to see any sources you can provide that say marijuana can cause physical addiction. Or tobacco, for that matter.

 

[the seeker]

If you actually read what I said, you'll notice I said substance. Marijuana is not an addictive substance. Cocaine, is not an addictive substance. Heroin, is an addictive substance. Lorazepam is an addictive substance. Phenobarbital is an addictive substance.

Sex, marijuana, cocaine, World of Warcraft - these are addictive activities. And psychological addiction is much harder, in my opinion, to overcome than physical. For example, if you blew smoke in someone's face every night, and then stopped after a month, they would be fine. If you shot up heroin in someone in their sleep every night for a month, at the end they would be sick as shit and needing a hit to function.

However, despite all this, I do think the notion of being addicted to marijuana is a little silly.

So get it through your skull that marijuana is not an addictive substance, you will not go into physical withdrawal and be kicking and screaming on the floor if you stop smoking (unless your pathetic). Heroin will do that to you. I am not trying to say marijuana cannot be addictive, the key to addiction is always pyschological.

As for what I said about insomnia and restlessness, when you quit a routine activity boredom becomes very serious. You get restless. Restlessness is one of the major causes for clinical chronic insomnia. So I am by no means trivializing that, but what I am saying is just because you are getting some short term insomnia does not mean you have sure-fire proof you were physically addicted.

I could give a rat's ass about the world's opinion. Iran is a member of the UN, the FDA prevents drugs from coming out which could help people (including marijuana), and slavery still exists in this world. So I could care less about world opinion, they hardly serve as any meter for truth or integrity.

I don't think your in any position to call me ignorant but I'm not going to go on and break a bunch of Bluelight rules here with you. However, I would like to see any sources you can provide that say marijuana can cause physical addiction. Or tobacco, for that matter.

you are also confusing addiction with physical dependence and using a definition of addiction that is decades old and no longer accepted in the medical community. "physical addiction" is essentially now a defunked term. addiction is now defined simply as "uncontrolled, compulsive use" (according to wikipedia). for instance, your example of shooting someone up with heroin every night wouldn't constitute an addiction, it would simply be physical dependency and if that person were to taper down their heroin dosage as to not experience withdrawal and afterwards never craved the drug or desired to use it to get high, they would not be considered to have ever been addicted. as for evidence that marijuana and tobacco are capable of producing physical depedence, in addition to the study i posted earlier in this thread, here is another one:


“A large body of evidence now demonstrates that cannabis dependence, both behavioral and physical, does occur in about 7-10% of regular users”

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/...tool=iconabstr&query_hl=2&itool=pubmed_docsum

 

[TheodoreRoosevelt]

Okay. You link an article saying a large body of evidence says physical dependence occurs in users. Your link does not really show anything about the studies though. It's as vague as your former posts in regards to that subject.

If you want to argue semantics, we can go all day. I made it pretty clear that marijuana can be addictive. However, it is not an addictive substance in and of itself, meaning you cannot get a physical dependency to it. It can be addictive though, like I said many things can be.

So if you read my posts, you will see I've already said what your trying to correct me on - for the most part.

I do disagree about the physical dependency part, unless you can provide sources on that.

). for instance, your example of shooting someone up with heroin every night wouldn't constitute an addiction, it would simply be physical dependency and if that person were to taper down their heroin dosage as to not experience withdrawal and afterwards never craved the drug or desired to use it to get high, they would not be considered to have ever been addicted.

And if you cut them off cold turkey, their body would not function normally. Their body will have gained a physical dependence, and they would be addicted - as 'defunked' as it may be. This would not happen in the same case with marijuana. Are you so stupid that this doesn't make any sense to you? Do I need to draw this for you? Why are you even arguing this?

Also, take note that I never said addiction, although here you are harping on me for using the word. It's like your in a totally different world here, what is wrong with you? Do you read anything I say or do you just make shit up so you can argue with something imaginary to sound impressive?

 

[TheodoreRoosevelt]

And stop trying to make marijuana sound so damn dark and terrifying here. Just because you couldn't control yourself around it doesn't mean everyone else can't either.

Marijuana does not make your tongue rot off.

Marijuana can be an addictive activity, but the substance itself will not create physical dependency. It's all in your head, just like tobacco and crack cocaine and meth and sex and video games.

Heroin and Alcohol and Barbs and Benzos can cause physical addiction, and addiction to these substances is much harder and worse than a marijuana addiction will ever be. Marijuana addiction is a joke in comparison. Stop trying to sound like you've been through it all.

What your trying to argue is ridiculous. Rereading this thread just makes the topic seem more and more absurd.

 

[the seeker]

i already explained to you the term physical addiction is now defunked. what you are arguing is actually ridiculous in the sense that the consequences of methamphetamine or cocaine addiction can just as severe as those of heroin addiction. the level of physical depedency is only one aspect of addiction,

here are some of the studies which evaluate the cannabis withdrawal syndrome. in order to read the abstracts, youll have to search for them by name or author on pubmed.


Budney AJ, Hughes JR. Related Articles, Links
Abstract The cannabis withdrawal syndrome.
Curr Opin Psychiatry. 2006 May;19(3):233-8.
PMID: 16612207 [PubMed - in process]



Reilly D, Didcott P, Swift W, Hall W. Related Articles, Links
Abstract Long-term cannabis use: characteristics of users in an Australian rural area.
Addiction. 1998 Jun;93(6):837-46.
PMID: 9744119 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]

Crowley TJ, Macdonald MJ, Whitmore EA, Mikulich SK. Related Articles, Links
Abstract Cannabis dependence, withdrawal, and reinforcing effects among adolescents with conduct symptoms and substance use disorders.
Drug Alcohol Depend. 1998 Mar 1;50(1):27-37.
PMID: 9589270 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]


An evaluation of the history of a marijuana withdrawal syndrome in a large population

Authors: Wiesbeck G. A.; Schuckit M. A.; Kalmijn J. A.; Tipp J. E.; Bucholz K. K.; Smith T. L.

Source: Addiction, Volume 91, Number 10, 1 October 1996, pp. 1469-1478(10)


Aceto MD, Scates SM, Lowe JA, Martin BR. Related Articles, Links
Abstract Cannabinoid precipitated withdrawal by the selective cannabinoid receptor antagonist, SR 141716A.
Eur J Pharmacol. 1995 Aug 25;282(1-3):R1-2.
PMID: 7498260 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]


Abood ME, Sauss C, Fan F, Tilton CL, Martin BR. Related Articles, Links
Abstract Development of behavioral tolerance to delta 9-THC without alteration of cannabinoid receptor binding or mRNA levels in whole brain.
Pharmacol Biochem Behav. 1993 Nov;46(3):575-9.
PMID: 8278434 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]



Dependence on delta 9-tetrahydrocannabinol: studies on precipitated and abrupt withdrawal

MD Aceto, SM Scates, JA Lowe and BR Martin

Department of Pharmacology and Toxicology, Medical College of Virginia, Virginia Commonwealth University, Richmond, USA.



Budney AJ, Moore BA. Related Articles, Links
Abstract Development and consequences of cannabis dependence.
J Clin Pharmacol. 2002 Nov;42(11 Suppl):28S-33S. Review.
PMID: 12412833 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]


Vandrey R, Budney AJ, Kamon JL, Stanger C.
Abstract Cannabis withdrawal in adolescent treatment seekers.
Drug Alcohol Depend. 2005 May 9;78(2):205-10. Epub 2004 Dec 18.
PMID: 15845324 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]


Copersino ML, Boyd SJ, Tashkin DP, Huestis MA, Heishman SJ, Dermand JC, Simmons MS, Gorelick DA. Abstract Cannabis withdrawal among non-treatment-seeking adult cannabis users.
Am J Addict. 2006 Jan-Feb;15(1):8-14.
PMID: 16449088 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]


Wiesbeck GA, Schuckit MA, Kalmijn JA, Tipp JE, Bucholz KK, Smith TL. An evaluation of the history of a marijuana withdrawal syndrome in a large population.
Addiction. 1996 Oct;91(10):1469-78.
PMID: 8917915 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]



Vandrey RG, Budney AJ, Moore BA, Hughes JR. A cross-study comparison of cannabis and tobacco withdrawal.
Am J Addict. 2005 Jan-Feb;14(1):54-63.
PMID: 15804877 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]

 

[TheodoreRoosevelt]

Alright, so there are extremely weak physical withdrawal symptoms.

I would argue that these are just caused by the restlessness and boredom that comes from dropping such a time-consuming activity, but sure if you find sources I'm not going to sit here all day and say the sources are wrong or flawed.

My point still stands though. These aren't really physical symptoms so strong that would make you so sick you couldn't move for a brief period.

 

[the seeker]

Alright, so there are extremely weak physical withdrawal symptoms.

I would argue that these are just caused by the restlessness and boredom that comes from dropping such a time-consuming activity, but sure if you find sources I'm not going to sit here all day and say the sources are wrong or flawed.

My point still stands though. These aren't really physical symptoms so strong that would make you so sick you couldn't move for a brief period.

one of the major withdrawals symtoms experienced by heavy users is loss of apetite, inability to eat. there is a pharmacological reason for this, it is not simply a result of quitting a time consuming activity. and i never said the symptoms were so strong you cant move. the severity of the symptoms is enough that is speculated that the staving off of withdrawal may play at least a partial role in cannabis dependent individual's desire to use. this is all that is needed for marijuana to fit your criteria for an addictive substance. different substances produces different withdrawal syndromes and some are more severe than others. this doesnt mean we can completely ignore the ones which are generally less severe.

And stop trying to make marijuana sound so damn dark and terrifying here. Just because you couldn't control yourself around it doesn't mean everyone else can't either.

i said 7-10% of users become dependent, this is vastly different from everyone. please dont misrepresent my position in this way.

 

[TheodoreRoosevelt]

I doubt 7-10% become physically addicted to any serious degree besides a minor headache and a little loss of appetite.

I doubt marijuana withdrawal causes inability to eat. You can still shove food into that hole. As for loss of appetite, that's just a little shock from having marijuana increase your appetite. That's a little different, then say, DTs from alcohol withdrawal. It's not like you normally have them.

Marijuana physical dependency does not exist in any severe form. It is mild at worst. Marijuana addiction is entirely psychological. Benzo addiction is much more severe, in every way. Marijuana is not a particularly harmful drug.